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Showed my iPhone to my friend that works for Microsoft.
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If Windows Mobile is so bad, why does Apple use it?
As in the Apple sales people that ring up your order on the floor of the Apple Stores. I understand that the handheld devices they are using are running Windows Mobile. It has been posted on this Forum so I know that's accurate info.
As in the Apple sales people that ring up your order on the floor of the Apple Stores. I understand that the handheld devices they are using are running Windows Mobile. It has been posted on this Forum so I know that's accurate info.
Sometimes I use a Casio calculator. Does that mean it's better than the iPhone?
To me, usability is key. That's not to say, however, the usability of everything on my iPhone is great or even good. There are many things I miss about my WM phones, but the net difference is the iPhone just plain works a lot better for me. Here are a few things I'm finding annoying on the iPhone and I'm hoping they get adjusted in future updates:
In the calendar, it takes way too much tapping and swiping to make a new event. And for crying out loud, why does the time default to the morning of the day I'm adding an event, especially when it's already after noon? I should be able to tap on the day view at the time I want (a la Outlook) and hit 'new' to make an event at that time. And let me set some default, will you? I always want a 15 minute reminder on new events and I shouldn't have to specify that every single time. Grrr. And why not let me drag an event to a different time? Currently, dragging causes it to scroll, which is great. How about letting me hold my finger on an event for a couple seconds to make it loose and movable? How about letting me specify an arbitrary number of minutes/hours/days I want in the reminder field instead of choosing presets from a list? WM does this, too, and I was hoping the iPhone was better than that.
I want more options in mail, too. I don't want to see the next message when I'm done with the current one, thankyouverymuch. Give me the option to return to the inbox after moving or deleting a message.
However, I should never have to edit a registry in a freaking phone. That's silly and usually requires me to do some research to find a good editor (hopefully free) and to figure out what stupid value needs to be tweaked so I can install my own applications or ringtones, for instance.
The WM browsers absolutely suck. On my Moto Q (3G, too), a site like this one would take nearly two minutes to render and it would look like ass. Moving the dumb directional pad was a frustrating exercise in getting it to select the link you want. It took strange combinations of left/right/up/down as it would often skip past the one you want.
Sometimes the left softkey was 'Done' and the right was 'Cancel.' Other times, it was the opposite. Nice touch, Microsoft, as that happened in MS apps. And copy/paste? Only a handful of apps I used supported it and none let me do it with text like this.
Some menu shortcuts were based on single letters while others were based on numbers. Google Maps used both and it got confused sometimes.
Another little bother was all the various text entry fields that should expect numeric inputs (such as a phone number), yet the keyboard mode is defaulting to alpha input. Talk about a bunch of useless keyboard mode swapping. In fact, text correction was so useless to me that I can already type far more quickly on my iPhone after a couple days of use than I could on my WM devices after a year of use.
I have never used MMS, but that doesn't mean others don't want or need it. I don't know how it would be used by business users, but it's also not something I pay much thought. Maybe such an app will show up in the app store some day.
I always hated having to use a task manager to quit apps when the phone chugged down, but I do wish the iPhone had some kind of indication of any apps currently running. I'd like something similar to the Dock in MacOS X where it could put a little blue dot in the corner of the icon for any currently-running app.
In the calendar, it takes way too much tapping and swiping to make a new event. And for crying out loud, why does the time default to the morning of the day I'm adding an event, especially when it's already after noon? I should be able to tap on the day view at the time I want (a la Outlook) and hit 'new' to make an event at that time. And let me set some default, will you? I always want a 15 minute reminder on new events and I shouldn't have to specify that every single time. Grrr. And why not let me drag an event to a different time? Currently, dragging causes it to scroll, which is great. How about letting me hold my finger on an event for a couple seconds to make it loose and movable? How about letting me specify an arbitrary number of minutes/hours/days I want in the reminder field instead of choosing presets from a list? WM does this, too, and I was hoping the iPhone was better than that.
I want more options in mail, too. I don't want to see the next message when I'm done with the current one, thankyouverymuch. Give me the option to return to the inbox after moving or deleting a message.
However, I should never have to edit a registry in a freaking phone. That's silly and usually requires me to do some research to find a good editor (hopefully free) and to figure out what stupid value needs to be tweaked so I can install my own applications or ringtones, for instance.
The WM browsers absolutely suck. On my Moto Q (3G, too), a site like this one would take nearly two minutes to render and it would look like ass. Moving the dumb directional pad was a frustrating exercise in getting it to select the link you want. It took strange combinations of left/right/up/down as it would often skip past the one you want.
Sometimes the left softkey was 'Done' and the right was 'Cancel.' Other times, it was the opposite. Nice touch, Microsoft, as that happened in MS apps. And copy/paste? Only a handful of apps I used supported it and none let me do it with text like this.
Some menu shortcuts were based on single letters while others were based on numbers. Google Maps used both and it got confused sometimes.
Another little bother was all the various text entry fields that should expect numeric inputs (such as a phone number), yet the keyboard mode is defaulting to alpha input. Talk about a bunch of useless keyboard mode swapping. In fact, text correction was so useless to me that I can already type far more quickly on my iPhone after a couple days of use than I could on my WM devices after a year of use.
I have never used MMS, but that doesn't mean others don't want or need it. I don't know how it would be used by business users, but it's also not something I pay much thought. Maybe such an app will show up in the app store some day.
I always hated having to use a task manager to quit apps when the phone chugged down, but I do wish the iPhone had some kind of indication of any apps currently running. I'd like something similar to the Dock in MacOS X where it could put a little blue dot in the corner of the icon for any currently-running app.
If your calculator works 100% accurately, then the answer to your question is obvious. But I guess that depends on whether or not we understand ALL the buttons. Especially since you infer that it doesn't operate as well as the iPhone.
I have heard that before and I'm not doubting it to be true. But I do notice that apps launch instantly when touched, but after I force one to quit, it always takes a moment to relaunch it...I figured that was because it wasn't in RAM any more.
Those are all excellent points. I mentioned something much like #8 in another thread. Let's hope Apple takes them seriously and makes some tweaks for us.
Geez... there is no end to the Apple is cooler than MS here...
First off any influential Microsoft employee worth his salt has looked at the iPhone. It is also no suprise that most of them would acknowledge that the iPhone has a good/better interface. Also, you could be showing it to the groundskeeper...
The WM interface truly is clunky, but it IS MORE CAPABLE for business needs. It has a better usability and more features for email, calendar, contacts, and tasks while connected to the most common business email system. It has cool features like "Ignore" an incoming call instead of having to listen to it ring which is the iPhone method and many others. Using the iPhone for email, meetings, and contacts isn't as easy as Windows Mobile.
Browsing the web, listening to music, and playing some games is worlds better on the iPhone.
So the fun/cool factor is way better on the iPhone (which I have) and business functionality and usability is better on the WM phones (which I have had several).
What I don't understand is why Apple doesn't look at WM objectively and copy those useful features, as well as why doesn't MS look and the iPhone objectively and copy the fun stuff.
What I do expect is a bunch of Mac fanboys, who don't have business experience, to trash MS.
First off any influential Microsoft employee worth his salt has looked at the iPhone. It is also no suprise that most of them would acknowledge that the iPhone has a good/better interface. Also, you could be showing it to the groundskeeper...
The WM interface truly is clunky, but it IS MORE CAPABLE for business needs. It has a better usability and more features for email, calendar, contacts, and tasks while connected to the most common business email system. It has cool features like "Ignore" an incoming call instead of having to listen to it ring which is the iPhone method and many others. Using the iPhone for email, meetings, and contacts isn't as easy as Windows Mobile.
Browsing the web, listening to music, and playing some games is worlds better on the iPhone.
So the fun/cool factor is way better on the iPhone (which I have) and business functionality and usability is better on the WM phones (which I have had several).
What I don't understand is why Apple doesn't look at WM objectively and copy those useful features, as well as why doesn't MS look and the iPhone objectively and copy the fun stuff.
What I do expect is a bunch of Mac fanboys, who don't have business experience, to trash MS.
Because there's nothing else available.
Trust me, anyone who has worked for Apple would tell you how unreliable EasyPay devices are to use..
There are other wireless devices to check out customers. Apple chose to use these devices because of versitility and programability. "Trust me" that Apple retail management system management aren't going to agree with you.
It seems that the "unreliability" in checkouts was related to the backend systems, connections to ATT, and heavy sales.
Another in the saga of if it's MS, it's not cool...
I think people are making good points-- but people also tend to forget what do people really do with a phone/smartphone.
The ONLY thing my large company uses the BB for is email, calendar, sametime for messaging, and well there is a pathetically awful google maps app and internal web browsing for our corporate sites. Everything else on the phone has been locked down.
I have a blackberry for work and an iPhone (had the 4gb now have the 16gb white). I hate the blackberry-- to me everything takes twice as long. Just getting the phone to vibrate is ridiculous. I LOATHE to use the BB for a conference call-- switching between speaker to handset to mute and unmute is crap.
The keyboard-- eh. for some reason it aggravates my carpal tunnel much worse than the iphone so I prefer to use the iphone touch-- I dont feel like having to put so much pressure just to type.
I have NEVER edited a word doc or xls sheet with a bb--- the docs I have are typically so large and expansive I cant imagine or fathom trying to do this -- and why would I want to go more blind than I am trying to do so?
MMS? I am not a kid--
Copy and paste-- eh-- I have lived without it for years-- I dont care one way or the other about having it or not having it.
Today at the office I asked the bb users in my office what did they use their phone for and no one mentioned anything about editing docs, taking pictures (ha, our cameras are disabled anyhow), copy and paste-- everyone said they use it take calls and check email and check their calendar.
I guess I just dont know any "serious business folks" in the world who need those other things-- I guess my company's users (financial services corporation) is not "serious" enough. *LOL*
I realize you directed this at Gecko, but as I started that line of posting, I'll throw my $.02 in.
I don't think an "enthusiast group" equates with a pack of rabid fanboys. Do you? I came and joined this site to discuss my macbook pro, get some news, info, suggestions, etc etc. In fact, I'm on numerous enthusiast forums. It's an informative way to stay on top of products you own and love. I love my iphone and my macbook pro.
That said, what *I* find pathetic is the constant and pervasive need to diss "Micro$oft, Winblows, Windoze," and whatever else childish, un-funny crap people come up with. It's a waste of time. Can't we just discuss Apple products without the need for the pissing contest? You sound like morons, seriously. I feel bad for anyone who speaks and thinks with that level of impenetrable bias, because it's borderline lemming mentality.
Also, it makes me a tiny bit ashamed to own a mac and an iphone.
Right on Queen of Spades...
I started out with an Apple II. I think Apple make great products overall. It seems to me that Steve Jobs pretty much is in charge and makes good calls (MS seems to be design by commitee and this hurts them). MS could learn something from Apple no doubt.
I started reading this group when I converted to an iPhone from a Windows Mobile device that worked great, it's just that I liked the Apple design sensability and design is important to me. I have grown used to many of the features in WM that the iPhone, suprisingly, lacks. I would just like to have my opinions known so that Apple may decide to roll them into an update. One example is that the battery is lacking, but saying so on this board caused fanboys to initially react vehemently suggesting that we should put up or return our iPhones, but over time there were many helpful suggestions (thank you).
I don't need to have a bunch of narrow-minded individual attack any suggestion that Apple might have not be the far and away leader in ideas, so thank you to all of those of you who are here to be helpful and share their knowledge vs. their demagoguery.
I started out with an Apple II. I think Apple make great products overall. It seems to me that Steve Jobs pretty much is in charge and makes good calls (MS seems to be design by commitee and this hurts them). MS could learn something from Apple no doubt.
I started reading this group when I converted to an iPhone from a Windows Mobile device that worked great, it's just that I liked the Apple design sensability and design is important to me. I have grown used to many of the features in WM that the iPhone, suprisingly, lacks. I would just like to have my opinions known so that Apple may decide to roll them into an update. One example is that the battery is lacking, but saying so on this board caused fanboys to initially react vehemently suggesting that we should put up or return our iPhones, but over time there were many helpful suggestions (thank you).
I don't need to have a bunch of narrow-minded individual attack any suggestion that Apple might have not be the far and away leader in ideas, so thank you to all of those of you who are here to be helpful and share their knowledge vs. their demagoguery.
Again, some good posts.
I like to read the good stuff without the MS OR APPLE bashing. They both have great products! And as SJ said, one doesn't have to lose for the other to win. I've seen that statement posted many times on the forum but it doesn't seem to make any difference.
If we could just filter the bashing.
I like to read the good stuff without the MS OR APPLE bashing. They both have great products! And as SJ said, one doesn't have to lose for the other to win. I've seen that statement posted many times on the forum but it doesn't seem to make any difference.
If we could just filter the bashing.
I think enthusiast group applies very well to this forum but "rabid fanboys" certainly only applies to some of the people that post here. If I were you I wouldn't take offense to the Microsoft bashing unless you are responsible for the products they are bashing. The sibling rivalry between these two companies (and enthusiasts) is long standing and I would think anyone visiting these forums would be aware of it. If this makes you ashamed to choose the computer and phone that you prefer then your priorities are different then mine.
I don't take offense, I find it annoying. It rarely contributes to any sort of rational, intelligent discussion. I'm not a Microsoft apologist, the point is every company has its strengths and weaknesses. Pretending that one is entirely superior to another constantly and without provocation? Come on.
You misunderstand, what makes me ashamed is that the "some people" who are idiotic fanboys on this forum become the spokespeople for Apple customers. And that's aggravating, as not all of us are in the business of blind ballwashing. I don't want to be lumped in with that group.
I have found that, in general, the vocal minority exaggerates to the extremes and is quickest to react.
I agree entirely. And am quoting in its entirety just so some of these people will reread it.