MP All Models So long, old friend.

[SDAVE]

OK, but they still haven't supported it for over 15 years.

Apple had a falling out with NVIDIA a long time ago due to faulty GPUs in the MacBook Pro's in the mid 2010s. Can't blame them. NVIDIA is a bad partner, they did the same with Nintendo and the Switch.

Also Apple has completely changed the GPU architecture now that they're on ARM chips, I don't see them ever using another GPU provider since they're all on SoC.

 

[Ctrlos]

Apple Silicon isn’t as capable as Intel. And now Intel has matched it for performance per watt. PCs run circles around MacBooks for battery life and have better performance to boot. Steve Jobs would never have abandoned Intel or the Mac Pro. But at least Apple has a $600 toy with 8GB RAM for professionals.

But you also have to endure Windows 11. This is a pain that isn't worth any amount of performance increase.

 

[Mac3Duser]

I'm not happy about the discontinuation of the Mac Pro. If it was to abandon the 2019 tower form factor adapted for the MX, then yes, Apple was right, but abandoning the "Mac Pro" name is a mistake.

Also, I really hope that Apple will release a new Mac Pro in a few months or next year with a new design, something good.

In the meantime, I found something great with Minisforum MS-02 Ultra, which has the advantage of being inexpensive and upgradeable since you can install a professional graphics card and do high-performance things with Linux. And it has the advantage of having the power supply integrated into the chassis, which is good for its size.

Regarding laptops, I'll stick with Mac; iPad Pros are fine, and iphones too. At one point, I thought about changing my 2019 Mac Pro and my Dell Precision with current DDR4 for a Thinkstation P8 but I will have to wait until the end of the RAM crisis, especially DDR5 ECC, and for now it's still okay.

 

[JeffPerrin]

Things I miss since retiring my 5,1 for a Mac Studio last year;

1. Expandable storage drive options without all the cable mess.
2. Better dual monitor support (Mixing HDMI and monitors over Thunderbolt bus results in a very slow, "janky" wake from sleep. I really miss being able to instantly wake the monitors up with a tap on the keyboard.)
3. Being able to open the case to easily clean out dust.
4. Being able to open the case to easily replace or upgrade parts.

Of course the Mac Studio is great, but there are definite cons to a small form factor when it comes to storage and servicing options.

 

[vanishing]

Macintosh
PowerMac
Mac Pro

These are iconic and have a rich history in Apple folklore.

The iPhone maker doesn’t care for tradition, it wants an all-in-one machine to run the all-in-one app which is what the current macOS is. Apple Silicon architecture was designed to facilitate this.

Meanwhile there’s the sham of the 50th anniversary celebrations.

 

[Onlyuseapple]

Mac is not a serious platform for computing. Never has been. It’s always been a toy. Nobody uses a Mac for real work. That’s why they are more excited about releasing an underpowered Neo than a real PC.

85% of my emergency management agency uses Mac daily. All of us in the severe weather section use Mac and iPads only. Windows is just not reliable enough.

 

[EpicBro101]

It existed as a serious product line for 6 years. It’s been a joke since 2013.

Excluding the 2019 which was "only" sold for ~1273 days, seems like it was so much longer for the OG designs considering how beloved they were. I DO like the design of the 2013 but Apple should be ashamed for letting just rot. Just one refresh with 2011-3 CPUs and GCN 4.0 / 5.0 graphics would have been praised.

 

[MisterAndrew]

It existed as a serious product line for 6 years. It’s been a joke since 2013.

I’ve loved every Mac Pro, including the 2013 model, but I haven’t tried the 2023 model. I’ll probably get one as prices come down. Keeping my 2019.

Also, the people voting yes are trolls.

 

[Basic75]

The M5 literally beats all CPUs in the world (including Shintel) in single core performance and the Max version even in Multicore.

Are you trying to say the M5 Max beats all CPUs in the world in multicore performance? As amazing as the M5 Max is, that's obviously not true. But it does beat everything close to its market segment in probably every metric except expandability. If you need the fastest networking or the fastest graphics then Apple's mobile-first consumer/prosumer approach isn't right for you. So yes, after all the nerfing the Mac Pro has gone through it was the right move to retire it.

 

[zephonic]

Also, the people voting yes are trolls.

Why?

I voted yes, because I believe it has no reason to exist in Apple Silicon world. AS is all about integrated design, expandable desktop towers are the exact opposite of that.

 

[Basic75]

I voted yes, because I believe it has no reason to exist in Apple Silicon world. AS is all about integrated design, expandable desktop towers are the exact opposite of that.

Apple could have made a true Mac Pro based on Apple Silicon. Add an I/O chiplet with RAM and PCIe interfaces to an M5 Ultra. Use the RAM on the SoC as cache for the RAM modules. Throw in some NVMe slots. Bam, you've solved the RAM and SSD limitations. Keep some PCIe slots for fast networking and whatever the heck the music pros need.

 

[zephonic]

Apple could have made a true Mac Pro based on Apple Silicon. Add an I/O chiplet with RAM and PCIe interfaces to an M5 Ultra. Use the RAM on the SoC as cache for the RAM modules. Throw in some NVMe slots. Bam, you've solved the RAM and SSD limitations. Keep some PCIe slots for fast networking and whatever the heck the music pros need.

I understand the way you think, but I also understand the way Apple thinks. The cost of R&D for a vanishingly small segment of the Mac market, the business case wasn't there anymore.

And honestly, I think what you're proposing would have been too Frankenstein-ish, RAM on the SoC as cache for external RAM modules, that is antithetical to Apple's design ethos.

 

[Basic75]

I understand the way you think, but I also understand the way Apple thinks. The cost of R&D for a vanishingly small segment of the Mac market, the business case wasn't there anymore.

Part of the reason the business case isn't there anymore is probably because the high-end left the Mac in 2013. The other reason is that the small machines have become very powerful. My last Mac Pro was a Power Mac G5, after the Intel switch I could easily make do with MacBook Pros. Not many people need 128 CPU cores and 2TB of RAM on their desk.

And honestly, I think what you're proposing would have been too Frankenstein-ish, RAM on the SoC as cache for external RAM modules, that is antithetical to Apple's design ethos.

Yes, it doesn't fit with Apple's mobile-first consumer strategy. My point was that a true Mac Pro does not have to go against Apple Silicon's design principles. And with chiplets it's more viable than before. But not viable enough for them to build it. A real shame, how cool it would be to have an Apple Silicon Mac Pro with RAM and NVMe slots? Or NVLink?

 

[OS6-OSX]

 

[mode11]

I hope that somehow the community finds ways to extend the 7,1 as they did the 5,1.

Use Tahoe as long as you like, or just move to Windows.

 

[mode11]

Everything you see and hear (Movies, music, etc) is basically made on a Mac.

Hear, sure. Editing and colour grading, yes. CGI? Not so much.

 

[mode11]

What do you actually want them to do? The M5 Max and future M5 Ultra is far more capable than anything that's gone in any Mac Pro. Thunderbolt is fine for expansion.

Um, stick M5 Max / Ultra in a tower case, with support for multiple Nvidia GPUs? It's not that deep. But obviously, that's not a use case that fits with Apple's business model, so here we are.

Thunderbolt solutions are fine for outboard interfaces and storage, but not for GPUs.

 

[mode11]

But you also have to endure Windows 11. This is a pain that isn't worth any amount of performance increase.

Hyperbolic drivel. Windows 11 Pro is fine. Run O&O Shutup on 1-click default settings and forget about telemetry (if that's the issue).

When I switched to PC, I wasn't concerned about the hardware, but was worried I might really miss macOS (I'd been using it since 1998). To my surprise, I don't miss it at all. Took a bit of time to get things tweaked, alternative apps found etc., but my macOS install wasn't stock, either.

 

[mode11]

I DO like the design of the 2013 but Apple should be ashamed for letting just rot. Just one refresh with 2011-3 CPUs and GCN 4.0 / 5.0 graphics would have been praised.

How many times do Apple have to give Mac Pro users the finger before they get the message? At least now, any ambiguity has finally been removed.

 

[teh_hunterer]

Um, stick M5 Max / Ultra in a tower case, with support for multiple Nvidia GPUs? It's not that deep.

As I said, the next Mac Studio is going to be far more capable than the Mac Pro that just got dropped. That didn't have GPU support.

But obviously, that's not a use case that fits with Apple's business model, so here we are.

Thunderbolt solutions are fine for outboard interfaces and storage, but not for GPUs.

The current Mac Pro didn't support that anyway.

At this point, would Apple supporting it even matter? AMD and NVIDIA and Intel aren't going to create functioning macOS drivers for GPUs that people could potentially put in a Mac Pro that almost nobody buys in the first place. Games aren't going to work on that anyway because devs would have to account for that scenario and they won't.

 

[mode11]

As I said, the next Mac Studio is going to be far more capable than the Mac Pro that just got dropped. That didn't have GPU support.

Clearly, the M5 Max (and Ultra, if they do one this time), will be more powerful than the M2 Ultra. But the M2 Mac Pro was mostly criticised for not supporting PCIe GPUs. I agree the Studio makes a lot more sense than a neutered Mac Pro, but some were hoping for a return to form.

At this point, would Apple supporting it even matter? AMD and NVIDIA and Intel aren't going to create functioning macOS drivers for GPUs that people could potentially put in a Mac Pro that almost nobody buys in the first place. Games aren't going to work on that anyway because devs would have to account for that scenario and they won't.

Sure, no disagreement there. I switched to Windows within days of the M2 Mac Pro announcement. My decision was way overdue, but I'd held out to see if the AS MP would hold any surprises.

 

[eyoungren]

I voted yes. But only because I can see the writing on the wall (IMO). The trend seems to be for smaller, more powerful systems. I don't know if I agree with that, but that seems to be where Apple is headed. In the long run a boon to me when those really, really expensive MPs with their ultra-expensive Studio Displays come down into my price range.

In any case, I'll raise a glass (of French Vanilla Dark Roast coffee) to the Mac Pro. You kept food on my table for many years.

This post typed in on a 2009 Mac Pro 4,1 (upgraded to 5,1) with 56GB ram and 6 drives (24TB of storage) running Sonoma (OCLP). Connected to 10 displays (5 of which are 30" Cinema Displays) via three NVIDIA GPUs.

 

[Ctrlos]

Hyperbolic drivel. Windows 11 Pro is fine. Run O&O Shutup on 1-click default settings and forget about telemetry (if that's the issue).

When I switched to PC, I wasn't concerned about the hardware, but was worried I might really miss macOS (I'd been using it since 1998). To my surprise, I don't miss it at all. Took a bit of time to get things tweaked, alternative apps found etc., but my macOS install wasn't stock, either.

Windows 7 was just right. Windows 10 is fine and just gets out of the way. It still has enough of Metro, something I dearly miss.

Windows 11 requires a debloat script to be remotely useable otherwise it’s just a hog on the system. The amount of bloatware is rather staggering and the background telemetry not exactly opaque. Co-pilot can also do one.

 

[Charlie Bonesx]

yes,

for better or worse it's pointless now

 

[boswald]

I'd love to take a tour of a major movie studio or some other place where the Mac Pro sees heavy use. Real world use, not just running things in the corner. Always wanted one so I want to see what they're capable of.