Some Apple Park Employees Said to Be Dissatisfied With Open Office Design

[thekeyring]

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Because, like I said in the rest of the post, a lot of changes have been made in that time, by the ‘new Apple’. This appears to be one of those changes.

Can you link to any original plans that suggest this wasn't always open plan? Or is this the classic MacRumors "let's make our theory that Apple is failing fit, whatever the evidence is"?

 

[Frenchiex]

There's always a certain amount of people who act like spoiled brats every time there's change. Suck it up. I've been at my company (a hospital) for 20 years and they've crammed us into all sorts of environments. I sat in the basement by the morgue, with no windows, for a few years so excuse me if I don't have sympathy for people moving into the nicest building on the planet.

If you aren't an engineer then you should **** because your opinion doesn't matter. You have zero understanding of the situation and the implications of an open office on an engineer.

 

[DeepIn2U]

Let me guess: you're a manager.

lmao riiiight. Nope just a hard worker tired of hearing whiners for sensless and needless things is all lol.

 

[BaldiMac]

Neuroticism is, according to Dr. Jordan B Peterson (psychology department, University of Toronto) the technical term used in personality literature to refer to higher anxiety and lower stress tolerance. A better term according to Peterson would be "negative emotion". It is the case that women in general suffer more than men in this area.

The "problem" with Damores paper is that it's very well researched and based on what is accepted mainstream. So there is not much use of arguing with the thesis, it's pretty much the current state in this field of psychology as Peterson put it.

You should listen to this, it's really good. Two very smart people talking. If you just want Petersons analysis of the academic validity of what Damore wrote, go to 25.00 and on.

You don't have to search very far to find information on Peterson's agenda.

 

[Neepman]

ProTip:

Sarcasm, sheesh.

I love my work, the environment comes with the job. Tens of thousands of people get to work because of my work. My $325 per hour billing rate works for me too…

325 an hour! Wow. You must be one of those workplace consultants that ruin workers lives by talking their CFO's and CEO's into adopting open-office plans!

 

[Appleaker]

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Can you link to any original plans that suggest this wasn't always open plan? Or is this the classic MacRumors "let's make our theory that Apple is failing fit, whatever the evidence is"?

Who said Apple is failing?
You know very well that there would not be any public plans on such a scale to show the offices before the death of Steve Jobs. Like I said, it is not something any of us can know for certain, but it does appear like it would be a ‘new Apple’ thing to do. It could not be, but either way it is not what all employees want.

 

[kdarling]

lmao riiiight. Nope just a hard worker tired of hearing whiners for sensless and needless things is all lol.

Dare I ask what you do for work? And how long you've been doing it?

Because I've been working for almost a half century, and I wouldn't begrudge anyone who felt like complaining about poor working conditions.

I agree about senseless and needless things, but IMO this is not one of them, at least when it comes to software and hardware development. Apparently VPs at Apple agree, because they put the ARM group and Services groups elsewhere.

Of course, this all depends on Apple actually making every group's office like that photo. It's quite possible that that's just their favorite publicity shot. You know, because it looks modern

 

[benthewraith]

There's always a certain amount of people who act like spoiled brats every time there's change. Suck it up. I've been at my company (a hospital) for 20 years and they've crammed us into all sorts of environments. I sat in the basement by the morgue, with no windows, for a few years so excuse me if I don't have sympathy for people moving into the nicest building on the planet.

That's some awesome gatekeeping on your part right there. No one can complain about their office situation because you had it rough. Maybe you wouldn't have had to sit down in the basement by the morgue if you had spoken up.

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

I don't understand this push towards open floor plan offices.

You think THAT is bad? Try having the new OPEN BATHROOM DIVERSITY concept thrown at you! Everyone all sitting on the toilet staring at each other since walls drive "division" between employees and make some people think they're better than others if they have their own private stall! There's no privacy when it comes to teamwork! We're all in this together! We work together, eat together and crap together! That's a REAL team baby!

Do you guys think Tim Cook is going to sit at a long open table every day with other employees??? Somehow, I FLIPPING DOUBT IT! You can be sure Tim Cook and Jony Ive will have awesome private offices with every comfort in them while the lesser employees will be forced to sit next to someone farting away as they eat from a bag of Cheetos!

Microsoft here I come! (Oh wait, they're laying off)


Let's all sing now! Remember, it's the PC version (how ironic, eh? Sorry Macs):

"Kumbaya my higher power! (or nothingness or whatever doesn't offend anything, anyone or the possibility of having to smell stinky cheese farts!) Kumbaya!"

First off, it's pretty sad to see people complain about something like this. The campus looks amazing and most people on the outside looking in would probably say it's an incredible design and a great place to be.

I think it's sad to see someone who clearly doesn't have to work there (with no air conditioning and a guy next to you farting Cheetos!) talk about those that do based on how the OUTSIDE of the building looks!

 

[fatboyslick]

I worked in two organisations that transitioned to compact office space to open plan
Open plan works much better for me

The grumblings pretty much all came from Gen Xs who hated change....we still get it now, 5 years on. We have hot desking in "home zones" but if someone sits at the desk they want, boy oh boy do they kick up a fuss.....its a clear desk policy so there's NOTHING on the desks for them to get tetchy about

 

[throAU]

I’m not surprised, the whole ‘open and collaborative work space’ stuff can go to far, and it’s become a joke. They should be building it around employee needs.

Hmm. Open work spaces encourage collaboration and teamwork.

Some people just don't like it because it's a lot harder to goof off and waste time when you're in the same area as others.

 

[Lone Deranger]

I don't mean the random cough or sneeze, but those who do it habitually. Nervous coughing, frequent throat clearing, those who sniffle for hours instead of just blowing their nose. You know what I mean.

Agreed. That is damn annoying indeed.

 

[Appleaker]

Hmm. Open work spaces encourage collaboration and teamwork.

Some people just don't like it because it's a lot harder to goof off and waste time when you're in the same area as others.

Wow, you truly think that’s the reason people don’t like it? You’re wrong.

 

[recoil80]

I usually do my best when I work from home.
I hate working in an open space, too distracting and too hard to focus on your job. It may work for some people, not for software developers.

 

[ipedro]

Anyone working on a secret project can't do that. Moreover, Apple is more known for its requirement to stick to your desk for ten hours a day.

The park in the middle of the space ship is private. It can only be accessed by Apple employees.

Top secret projects that can only be seen by a small subset of employees wouldn’t be able to be housed in the shared spaces in the building anyway. There are separate buildings for Jony Ive’s lab and for the chip team outside of the main building on campus.

 

[DeepIn2U]

Dare I ask what you do for work? And how long you've been doing it?

Because I've been working for almost a half century, and I wouldn't begrudge anyone who felt like complaining about poor working conditions.

I agree about senseless and needless things, but IMO this is not one of them, at least when it comes to software and hardware development. Apparently VPs at Apple agree, because they put the ARM group and Services groups elsewhere.

Of course, this all depends on Apple actually making every group's office like that photo. It's quite possible that that's just their favorite publicity shot. You know, because it looks modern

15yrs Service Desk and Lv2.5 IT work.

Nothing in this articles states 'Poor working conditions' ... just a rant and rave from a manager that choose NOT to go wtih what was determined by design. Nothing stated by the manager of why it was not acceptable just a rant. Don't look further into what was provided in the article.

 

[LethalOptical]

I'm with this guy... 'F--- that, f--- you, f--- this, this is bulls---.'

F--- You, f--- You, f--- You, You're cool, and f--- You, I'm out!

 

[dancj]

I'm really surprised by this article. I thought pretty much all offices were open these days and closed offices died out in the 80s.

Personally I think open is great. Yes, you get distracted - but that's generally by someone who wants help doing their job - and you get to speak to other people when you need help doing your job.

If you really find the distractions too much, pop some headphones on and go into the zone.

 

[iLLUMI]

You’ll never please all of the people all of the time with any design. Not surprising.

No, you don't get it. I also work in an open plan office. No one likes it because of the noise levels.
Too many people in an open space means the noise levels keep going up and up.
My team all wear headphones most of the time during the day now.
The noise is distracting.
It reduces your ability to concentrate and remain focused.
It reduces your productivity.

The open plan is only suited to certain teams, where constant collaboration and discussion is common place or rather where it is integral to their role.
But for teams that need to be focused on analysis and development, they need secluded areas with minimal distraction.

Apple should have created separate zones, both open plan and secluded zones. I guess they can still do this by adding sound proof partitions.

But at least Apple discussed the plans with the team/division leaders.
I would be rapt if my IT company built us our own building... ... that would be awesome!!

 

[latweek]

Hi Mr. Cook, I love our new building (nice work) but when I go to work, I lose all concentration. It appears to be a common issue. Any plans to fix this?

Just avoid thinking that way.

 

[Anuba]

No, you don't get it. I also work in an open plan office. No one likes it because of the noise levels.
Too many people in an open space means the noise levels keep going up and up.
My team all wear headphones most of the time during the day now.
The noise is distracting.
It reduces your ability to concentrate and remain focused.
It reduces your productivity.

Totally. It's OK to have compartmentalized semi-open spaces where teams are separated, provided that all members have enough discipline to shut the hell up. But then you get the middle men, project leaders and such, who strut around and babble endlessly and loudly, sometimes on the phone, sometimes with team members, and the only way to not eavesdrop is to put headphones on and listen to music. Doesn't really work for me. Some people thrive in the vacuum of noise-cancelling headphones... I only get paranoid and lose even more concentration than if I just put up with the noise. Conversely, you avoid starting conversations you would've had in a more closed setting, and save them for lunch or whatever, in order to avoid disturbing those not immediately involved.

Open floors is such a top-down idea, based on executives' assumptions about collaborative spirit, but tellingly they never want to be part of it themselves. They have their corner offices as usual. "Please, come in, and shut the door". Yeah, exactly. Door.
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There's always a certain amount of people who act like spoiled brats every time there's change. Suck it up. I've been at my company (a hospital) for 20 years and they've crammed us into all sorts of environments. I sat in the basement by the morgue, with no windows, for a few years so excuse me if I don't have sympathy for people moving into the nicest building on the planet.

Yeah, um, ever been around software engineers? In that case you've probably noticed they aren't exactly a bunch of Craig Federighi's or similar open, social and jovial guys. It's more like an Asperger's convention. We're not talking about spoiled millennial snowflakes but simply about people to whom noise and crowds are like kryptonite because of how they're wired. They just cease to function. They're the last to make a fuzz about it, so you won't really notice anything until you start looking at numbers and realize that productivity has dropped to 45%.

 

[Pilgrim1099]

The park in the middle of the space ship is private. It can only be accessed by Apple employees.

Top secret projects that can only be seen by a small subset of employees wouldn’t be able to be housed in the shared spaces in the building anyway. There are separate buildings for Jony Ive’s lab and for the chip team outside of the main building on campus.

A private park that happens to be outdoors and can be subject to corporate espionage. Drones are one thing to spy on the workers' project. But a spy satellite from another country is another thing that Apple can't have the excuse to say it's a "classified" location and pull an "Area 51" to block it.

That's why you do not simply stroll into the park outdoors with your work or TALK about it. It's called:

Compartmentalization.

And if you think spy satellites can't pick up a conversation from a distance or drones equipped with similar tech, you're deluded. The park is NOT designed to be utilized for workers to sit around on the grass like college students on campus by the tree and do the work. They can stroll around and take a breather, or have lunch which I'm sure it's allowed.

But to do the work? Hell to the NO.

Going to work on Apple Park is NOT the same thing as going to a college campus.

 

[throAU]

Wow, you truly think that’s the reason people don’t like it? You’re wrong.

I didn't say it's the only reason people might not like it.

But it is certainly A reason that people often don't want to give up their own office.


Edit
No I am not suggesting cubicles are for everyone. And most certainly some jobs demand a more isolated quiet location away from the rest.

My own work demands that from time to time, being a network engineer / end of the line for enterprise network troubleshooting at my company.

Also. Open plan doesn't mean you put sales next to coders.

But putting a bunch of coders together can perhaps help cross team collaboration.

 

[Septembersrain]

I can understand this. Some people work better when they aren't distracted. Say one employee chews on their lip but another has misophonia. That would be pretty uncomfortable for the one with misophonia right?

 

[barmann]

You’ll never please all of the people all of the time with any design. Not surprising.

Actually, you can .

Give all office employees their own room, , with solid walls, a window and a door, and all of them will be pleased with that solution .
No, really, every single one of them .