ssgbryan
macrumors 65816
Hard to do since Filemaker decided to whack Bento (the dumbed down version FileMaker).
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Some Power Users Are Unhappy With Lost Features in the New iWork
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Hard to do since Filemaker decided to whack Bento (the dumbed down version FileMaker).
peterdevries
macrumors 68040
It's a bit more nuanced. The reason why we haven't seen an update of iWorks for so long must surely be the rewrite. In addition a complete rewrite can only be an indication that they see the new versions as a base platform to build on for the coming years.
I don't defend the absence of missing features at all, but it is clear that we are following a similar path as FCP and that gives me the confidence that we will see a reintroduction of missing features over the coming time. And this time with shorter intervals.
blackhand1001
macrumors 68030
Yeah, the last two major reinventions in this industry that I think were successful and had major design changes were office 2003->2007 and android 2.3->4.0. They were big changes but drastic improvements and the UI itself had real usability improvements as well. iOS7, the new iWork, windows 8 to a degree (although 8.1 pretty much fixed everything that bothered me, it combined the start search like in windows 7, added an actual start button instead of forcing people into the confusing hot corner, lots of other tweaks) were a step in the wrong direction.
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Office 2007 was a complete rewrite of office yet wasn't missing features. In fact it added a lot of useful features including excellent templates especially compared to 2003.
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Consistent
This happens all the time with Apple, regardless of the type of update.
How many features in various apple apps and OS upgrades have I lost over time.
They always announce so many new improvements and neglect to tell us about all the steps backwards that they've taken. Even with Mavericks I've lost clearly useful functions. WHY! I don't understand this phenomenon. This is like announcing an upgrade to your new car, updated gearbox, Black and white seats, but they neglect to tell you that the fourth wheel is missing now and the exhaust empties into the cabin.
Honestly if I see Johnny Ive once more with this Uber DATED T-shirt, 3 day growth and white background talking pretentiously into the distance, whilst God knows what his hands are doing under the camera's frame.. I will stop buying their products on principle.
This happens all the time with Apple, regardless of the type of update.
How many features in various apple apps and OS upgrades have I lost over time.
They always announce so many new improvements and neglect to tell us about all the steps backwards that they've taken. Even with Mavericks I've lost clearly useful functions. WHY! I don't understand this phenomenon. This is like announcing an upgrade to your new car, updated gearbox, Black and white seats, but they neglect to tell you that the fourth wheel is missing now and the exhaust empties into the cabin.
Honestly if I see Johnny Ive once more with this Uber DATED T-shirt, 3 day growth and white background talking pretentiously into the distance, whilst God knows what his hands are doing under the camera's frame.. I will stop buying their products on principle.
Tysknaden
macrumors regular
I don't know. I've never used this feature 🙂
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The part about your impressions in things Ive, I love! I think, he is caressing an iPhone C 😛
But I see a reason for Apples tendency of removing features. Microsoft's software is a nightmare to it's users, because it drowns them with a flood of features. One has to work a way through a jungle for finding the setting momentarily needed. Apple tries to keep everything simple and clean. What is needed, is a Pro version for iWork. (Me would stay with the dumbed down versions, which do meet my needs. I am one of the people, who once became traumatized by the Microsoft way of presenting software, which is only useable, after one did invest a few days in learning how it works.)
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The part about your impressions in things Ive, I love! I think, he is caressing an iPhone C 😛
But I see a reason for Apples tendency of removing features. Microsoft's software is a nightmare to it's users, because it drowns them with a flood of features. One has to work a way through a jungle for finding the setting momentarily needed. Apple tries to keep everything simple and clean. What is needed, is a Pro version for iWork. (Me would stay with the dumbed down versions, which do meet my needs. I am one of the people, who once became traumatized by the Microsoft way of presenting software, which is only useable, after one did invest a few days in learning how it works.)
Reducing the complaints to "Some Power Users" is just ridiculous. People across all skill levels are complaining, and this, because so many important features have been removed.
Remember, the suite is called i_Work_ which clearly implies that it's a software to _work_ with, and not just to write predefined fun cards for birthday parties.
What happened for example with Pages? There's an app called TextEdit, which was perfect for those "Non-Power-Users" that just wanted to type some basic texts. Now Pages is more on par with this, instead getting more on par with Word.
Removing mail merge, address fields, images in header/footer and tables, word-by-word languages, the format bar, guidelines, vertical ruler, backwards compatibility and many more from Pages is a disaster not only for "power users", but for all of those who used Pages to create documents at work.
I'm speaking about teachers, architects, students, lawyers, freelancer, engineers, artisans, and so on. I know quiet a few of them that bought a mac just because of iWork as a great and enjoyable alternative to Microsoft Office. Most of them won't complain in forums as they are not "Power-Users" knowing where to complain, or have no time to do it. They just give up and buy MS Office.
The header of this article should thus be renamed in "Average Users can't use iWork anymore for their daily tasks".
Remember, the suite is called i_Work_ which clearly implies that it's a software to _work_ with, and not just to write predefined fun cards for birthday parties.
What happened for example with Pages? There's an app called TextEdit, which was perfect for those "Non-Power-Users" that just wanted to type some basic texts. Now Pages is more on par with this, instead getting more on par with Word.
Removing mail merge, address fields, images in header/footer and tables, word-by-word languages, the format bar, guidelines, vertical ruler, backwards compatibility and many more from Pages is a disaster not only for "power users", but for all of those who used Pages to create documents at work.
I'm speaking about teachers, architects, students, lawyers, freelancer, engineers, artisans, and so on. I know quiet a few of them that bought a mac just because of iWork as a great and enjoyable alternative to Microsoft Office. Most of them won't complain in forums as they are not "Power-Users" knowing where to complain, or have no time to do it. They just give up and buy MS Office.
The header of this article should thus be renamed in "Average Users can't use iWork anymore for their daily tasks".
not dumber, just different, and definitely easier to use
most of the menus are now contextual so it is a little bit difficult to really see what total features are actually missing or not.
what's not to like?
1/ apple did us all a great favour by preserving our iWork 09 apps in a safe folder to use if we still want. why complain? you didn't loose anything.
2/ the new versions are absolutely great: i have been hesitating for years about making iWork a requirement for persons at my company. now i can do it since the learning curve is so low that anybody can do what they want on these apps really quickly.
3/ what no one is talking about is the additional way to share: by link not by file. sending pages or numbers versions to anyone, including windows only people /companies is now so easy. pages/numbers/keynote documents look so much better than their windows equivalents. now you can share the original document.
for such a long thread i have yet to see anyone post a comprehensive list of feature that are missing.
does anyone know where we can see a features comparison between 09 and 14?
thanks
most of the menus are now contextual so it is a little bit difficult to really see what total features are actually missing or not.
what's not to like?
1/ apple did us all a great favour by preserving our iWork 09 apps in a safe folder to use if we still want. why complain? you didn't loose anything.
2/ the new versions are absolutely great: i have been hesitating for years about making iWork a requirement for persons at my company. now i can do it since the learning curve is so low that anybody can do what they want on these apps really quickly.
3/ what no one is talking about is the additional way to share: by link not by file. sending pages or numbers versions to anyone, including windows only people /companies is now so easy. pages/numbers/keynote documents look so much better than their windows equivalents. now you can share the original document.
for such a long thread i have yet to see anyone post a comprehensive list of feature that are missing.
does anyone know where we can see a features comparison between 09 and 14?
thanks
Maybe we are not talking about sharing capabilities because we don't need it
And if you want a comprehensive list look this one:
Added
+ Right to Left text
+ Single model templates. No More Word Processing/Layout templates
+ Share outside iCloud
+ Phonetic Guide for Chinese & Japanese
+ Template names can be changed inside the Template Chooser
+ Text language is detected automatically
Removed
Copy and paste attributes
Select non-contiguous text
Outline view
Customizable Toolbar
135 templates
Capture pages/sections
Drag reorganize pages
Duplicate pages
Delete page
Manage Pages
Subscript/superscript buttons
Select all instances of a Style
Retain zoom level of document
Facing pages
Endnotes
Media Inspector links to iPhoto library on external drive
Alignment Guides
Styles Drawer
Merge Fields
Default Start Up page
Vertical Ruler
Style Function key shortcuts
Bookmarks and Links
Images within Tables
Import Styles
Clean Import of older .pages formatting
User Guide
Search Sidebar
Open Type features
Textbox linking
Word export to iCloud
Multiple Comments view
T.O.C. clean numbering
Altered
↪ Pages '09 files previewed on iPad via iCloud are irrevocably converted
↪ Update is missing for older installations, Apple is reportedly working on a solution via a redeemable code or update on their Support Download site
↪ Wrap methods have been cut back severely
↪ Documents reconverted back to Pages '09 lose all template information
↪ Language set under Edit > Spelling and Grammar > Show Spelling and Grammar now document wide
↪ Subscript/superscript text is now a convoluted route Gear > Advanced options > Baseline > Subscript/Superscript
↪ Header appears to be multi-column
↪ New file format (but still .pages?) not backwardly compatible
↪ Page numbering method changed
↪ Template file storage location moved …somewhere?
it's not mine: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5468056?start=45&tstart=0
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That is not the issue. Apple software used to be developed using one of two programming languages, Carbon and Cocoa. Carbon was a legacy programming language, and many Apple programs that have been around a while used it, including iWork apps. Apple several years ago under Jobs stopped supporting Carbon. This meant new versions of software written with Carbon had to be rewritten with Cocoa. The change caused delays in the development cycle for apps made by lots of companies, such as Adobe and Microsoft. They had to rework all their big apps line by line. Microsoft got some flax for killing cross platform scripting support on the next version of Office it released. Microsoft pointed to Apple's change from supporting just the newer Cocoa development language. I do not know if Microsoft has added the scripting support back in yet.
So I would guess Apple is also rewriting these apps from the ground up as well. Like when it first released OSX, it stripped some features found in OS 9. It eventually added many of the missing features back. Apple has also taken the time to rethink some of the apps. With iWork, I suspect the ability to work on the same document across OSX, ios, and iCloud is a major design decision.
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Not true. Microsoft did away with cross platform scripting support. This was a huge deal especially with people who relied on complex Excel scripts. Prior to the 2007 rewrite, you could open an Excel file on both a Mac and Windows PC and the scripts created on both platforms would work on either. Power users could not upgrade due to this shortcoming, and there were lots of complaints. Microsoft eventually was forced to say it left the scripting out due to the forced rewrite and would add the scripting back in with the next major release.
jeroenpaco
macrumors newbie
Keynote: The Good, The Bad & The Ugly
I'm foremost a power user of Keynote. And I think Apple should focus on that app. They don't use Numbers internally themselves ('nuff said). And I don't use Pages because I can do everything in Keynote.
I think Apple should reinvent de concept of productivity today, and don't divide it in to Keynote/PowerPoint, Pages/Word & Numbers/Excel.
Read my review on Keynote, the features and the concept.
I'm foremost a power user of Keynote. And I think Apple should focus on that app. They don't use Numbers internally themselves ('nuff said). And I don't use Pages because I can do everything in Keynote.
I think Apple should reinvent de concept of productivity today, and don't divide it in to Keynote/PowerPoint, Pages/Word & Numbers/Excel.
Read my review on Keynote, the features and the concept.
Chlloret
macrumors 6502
You are right. On the other hand, it never wanted to be. Iwork is a consumer product, and a very good one at that.
Since when do you earn your living with freeware? "Pro" Office users use exactly that, office.
Chlloret
macrumors 6502
Why would they buy MS Office? Why do they not simply continue using there old pages? It works exactly like before, so what ist lost here?
I used pages now for a few hours on my iPad and must say, it is brilliant. I have on my Win7 Computer Office 10 to compare but could do everything I wanted now on the iPad. Faster, more beautiful und much much easier.
No templates? I got dozens, why do people say there are no more templates? I can print the documents out and send them as pdf, perfect.
Best 9 Euros I spend.
69650
Suspended
Guess I'll have to stick with Office which is a real shame as it's the only Microsoft product I use now. I was really hoping that Apple would see the opportunity to create a pro version of iWork so I could finally make the jump but as usual Apple doesn't care about software. They never have it's just a tool to sell more hardware. I'm sure they think that some Apple users simply sit back and admire their beautiful design rather than actually use their products for something productive like work.
roadbloc
macrumors G3
It's just a good job I mostly use Office. But personally, I feel it is a damn shame Apple hasn't tried to impress power users. Pages has the potential to be an awesome word processor, but is crippled with its lack of ability to handle large documents and its lack of proofing and organisation tools that Office sports.
And I came to that conclusion after I finally managed to get it to work and update under Mavericks without being pointed to buy a new copy from the Mac App Store.
And I came to that conclusion after I finally managed to get it to work and update under Mavericks without being pointed to buy a new copy from the Mac App Store.
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my friend peter.
you cant be this much of an apologist?
you dont think the same thing is going to happen with office apps (libreoffice and google docs are improving as opposed to regressing) as happened with fcp and the customers go elsewhere?
they got all this money and all this revenue yet they can only release half baked solutions? come on.
when people get set in that workflow they dont just jump right back on apple behest.
apple has pretty much destroyed imovie since its 06 version and plugin support
simonmet
Cancelled
BornAgainMac
macrumors 604
I was originally angry that these apps were watered down but after using them, I understand now. Pages and Numbers will never be able to compete with features compared to Word and Excel anyways so why bother. I think Apple did the right thing by just making them easy and streamline. The advantages are now that my iPad will use the same file format and have the same features as my Mac and I can use the apps across devices better now.
Very sad to see how disconnected from the pro consumer Apple is nowadays. Very hard to use any software developed by Apple in a professional way. Every single one. Now even the word processor one is utter crap!
pubwvj
macrumors 68000
many of the missing features were likely never used by the majority of Apple's customers
That is an example of poor thinking. Just because <50% of the users use a feature does not mean that the feature is unworthy. There are lots of features I don't use in any particular program but that does not necessarily mesh with the features you us or the next person uses. Applications should not be limited to only the features used by the majority.
That is an example of poor thinking. Just because <50% of the users use a feature does not mean that the feature is unworthy. There are lots of features I don't use in any particular program but that does not necessarily mesh with the features you us or the next person uses. Applications should not be limited to only the features used by the majority.
Gutwrench
Suspended
brianvictor7
macrumors 65816
MS Office is cluttered and it takes me time to find the feature I want to use.
On the other hand, at least it has the features I want to use. This is a shame to me because I wanted to move to the cleaner look that Pages offers. 🙄
I like most of what Apple produces. I understand that they want to make a decent word/spreadsheet/presentation suite accessible to everyone without the steep learning curve of MS Office. Why it is, however, that they don't add an "Advanced" menu with the power features that more indepth work requires is frustrating to me.