Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
It isn't about trying to get rid of Spotify, I think majority of people here will agree with having competiton is good. The problem is Spotify trying to basically cut costs. Spotify and others think they shouldn't have to pay Apple for basically doing the work for them. Many companies have even put this cost on the consumer you can easily see it by looking at the price of say Youtube Premium on your web browser as opposed to the Youtube app so I really honestly don't understand the complaining these companies are doing. Apple is the one hosting the servers and has the fans that use the App Store, this same App Store posts the top 10 apps of various categories so basically if you app can make that it is free advertising and Spotify doesn't want to pay when every other store does this. The Playstore charges a percentage, PlayStation Store, Nintendo EShop, everyone does this, this is how stores make money either charge to be a "seller" on the store or charge a portion.

The consumer makes the decision on whether they would rather pay the "Apple Tax" or not. For instance myself, I don't mind paying the extra dollar or two that it costs to do a subscription through Apple, because guess what...when I want to cancel all I have to do is go to the App Store and go under my subscriptions tab and cancel.
Yet, Spotify wants to cut costs they don’t need. They already have all the infrastructure they need. They alreday have payments in place. They would opt out if Apple allowed them, but Apple do not.
For small developers, Apple’s model is great. For big players, not so much, as they have to pay a premium for stuff they don’t need and don’t want.
Nobody has commented about Shibsted signed the paper. That’s a huge olayer i media in Nordic countries.
 
Yet, Spotify wants to cut costs they don’t need. They already have all the infrastructure they need. They alreday have payments in place. They would opt out if Apple allowed them, but Apple do not.
For small developers, Apple’s model is great. For big players, not so much, as they have to pay a premium for stuff they don’t need and don’t want.
Nobody has commented about Shibsted signed the paper. That’s a huge olayer i media in Nordic countries.
You are correct in them being big and already having the ability to handle payments, host their servers of music, etc., but a BIG one is basically the free advertising on the App Store because they are the biggest music streaming platform and marketing is a huge money sink, now is it more than the 30% cut that Apple takes I am not sure as the amount that is spent on marketing varies company to company especially big companies. Also how many people specifically pay for Spotify because of the ability to have your payments through Apple? That is another metric that is difficult from an outside view to gauge what the potential loss would be.

Also in the event say a big lawsuit happens and say the courts worldwide say that Apple needs to allow the third party App Stores and the ability for companies to have their apps via other means say even just downloading the API from their website, in a case like this Apple could and probably would certainly make it so the only apps that can be on the App Store are the ones that pay the 30%. So in a case like this Spotify would win by being able to have 100% control, but how many iOS users of Spotify would continue using them while losing the reassurances that App Store gives? I am also not talking about security because I acknowledge that there are apps that get through Apples checks. Basically how many people would be willing to just stop what they are used to since the inception of the App Store all 1-a small handful of apps?
 
Yet, Spotify wants to cut costs they don’t need. They already have all the infrastructure they need. They alreday have payments in place. They would opt out if Apple allowed them, but Apple do not.
For small developers, Apple’s model is great. For big players, not so much, as they have to pay a premium for stuff they don’t need and don’t want.
Nobody has commented about Shibsted signed the paper. That’s a huge olayer i media in Nordic countries.
What costs are you talking about? Spotify pays Apple $99/year plus 15% on a few legacy subscriptions. They've already opted out.
 
Spotify isn't looking to cut costs, unless that cost is what it pays to Apple for using their infrastructure. If anything, they're looking to pocket that 30% as much as possible while still underpaying artists.

In all actuality, Apple should just boot them from the Store but allow them to keep installing on iOS, see how long they can do it on their own.
 
In spotifys case it appears the artists are being harmed by their low rates of pay. Maybe Spotify should leave the App Store. They can survive on their own, they are a household brand.
And if sideloading becomes a thing, as it looks like it will, I genuinely hope Apple twist the knife and make the Spotify's / Epics of the world to make a decision get in or get out of the app store. Ride the coat-tails or go it alone.
 
  • Like
Reactions: wbeasley and I7guy
Spotify isn't looking to cut costs, unless that cost is what it pays to Apple for using their infrastructure. If anything, they're looking to pocket that 30% as much as possible while still underpaying artists.

In all actuality, Apple should just boot them from the Store but allow them to keep installing on iOS, see how long they can do it on their own.
Again, Spotify isn't paying the 30% except on a few legacy subscriptions. They stopped allowing IAP several years ago. They aren't paying Apple a significant amount of money.
 
  • Like
Reactions: wbeasley
don't deserve to be called out on it.
There are a thousand things one could go after Apple over. I’m trying to think of anything less critical than protecting the ability of another unethical megacorp to score even more cash off its business model of selling other peoples products it grossly underpays for. It’s a crap business model that doesn’t deserve the money it already gets.
 
All of these people need to get over themselves. You try to run a business and provide the credit card service costs, the sales tax collection, the marketing costs, the advertising costs, and the website costs, along with the cost of downloading the app. Oh and you provide over a billion customers for the service. And after you do all that, let’s look at what it costs you. I guarantee that it is more than 30 percent of the cost.
People are always free to complain. Apple has done no shortage of that whenever legal cases don't go their way [shrug]
 
Two big companies fighting over money. Very exciting.
But one of those companies only packages up other peoples products, pays them little for it, AND wants all the benefits to come their way. And wont even update their music to hires or fix their apps in car to be more usable. That's all they actually have to deliver. The apps.

So while they might both turn over large sums of money, one is just a little company with small thinking who sook about access fees. Imagine if they had to pay physical shop markups. 30% for what they get is good value.
 
What's going to hurt Spotify more in the long run is the lack of hi-res music options.

Dragging theirs and making empty unmet promises will force customers who want better quality to look elsewhere and take their subscription money from Spotify.

Spotify is convenient and works well.
But lots of other products have been in exactly the same position to have newcomers steal their customers with better options while they sat on their hands.

Currently trialing Apple Music again to see if I can make it behave more like Spotify and if I can import playlists.
If that was easy, customer churn would happen and who knows what would happen to Spotify...
 
And if sideloading becomes a thing, as it looks like it will, I genuinely hope Apple twist the knife and make the Spotify's / Epics of the world to make a decision get in or get out of the app store. Ride the coat-tails or go it alone.
If Apple are forced to allow sideloading and other stores, I hope they make it a one way decision... choose another store and you no longer have access to the regular store. See how tempting it is then. Use security to justify it. If you want access to whatever you like then we will let you BUT you dont get to do whatever you want without a cost and we wont let you install apps that could compromise security of the Apple Store only users.
 
IMO, Apple + Spotify is better than Apple + Apple Music.

Just work together and find profitability for both companies.

Silly...
 
  • Like
Reactions: IlluminatedSage
I think that many people here don't understand that the 15-30% fees that Apple charges to APP developers and platforms cause the products to cost more to end users.

Reality is... if the fees were mandated to come down. or dare I say it... the walled garden is opened by regulators so people who buy phones can install what they want without Apple surcharge or censorship... well iPhone and iPad owners would be able to get lots more things done and cheaper.
 
I think that many people here don't understand that the 15-30% fees that Apple charges to APP developers and platforms cause the products to cost more to end users.

Reality is... if the fees were mandated to come down. or dare I say it... the walled garden is opened by regulators so people who buy phones can install what they want without Apple surcharge or censorship... well iPhone and iPad owners would be able to get lots more things done and cheaper.
That's not reality. That's speculation. There's no reason to think a significant number of prices will come down. They're already low. Prices are based on what consumers are willing to pay, not developer costs.
 
  • Like
Reactions: EntropyQ3
Funny how musicians would say the exact same thing about Spotify.

"Tragedy Is What Happens To Me, Comedy Is What Happens To You"
 
  • Like
Reactions: genovelle
What nobody talks about here is that Apple Music does not need to pay the "Apple Tax" and therefore have an edge on all competitors.
Apple is so big now that they can swoop in on any market and with the power of owning both the platform and the store, just price anyone else out of business.
At what point will that be a problem for people here? Never? No?
Why is everyone acting like they don’t have alternatives? They can always re-direct customers to their web app. They can then use their own payment processing, etc. on the iPhone.

There are alternative available. They don’t like them because they prefer the OS and native experience. AKA Apple’s intellectual property for which they’re in business to provide.

Build a better service and people will switch 🤷🏻‍♂️.

SDK’s are expensive to build and maintain. Those SDK’s are required to build the app to run natively on a device.

I want free lunch too but then I remember that I live in reality.
 
Apple does no wrong! Do not accuse Apple of wrongdoing EVER!
Why is it these complaints are aimed at Apple and not Google who has a far larger share and same requirements in general? It’s because apple users are more valuable
 
What costs are you talking about? Spotify pays Apple $99/year plus 15% on a few legacy subscriptions. They've already opted out.

Again, Spotify isn't paying the 30% except on a few legacy subscriptions. They stopped allowing IAP several years ago. They aren't paying Apple a significant amount of money.

Exactly.

You cannot sign up for Spotify Premium inside the app. You must go to their website. Therefore Spotify is not losing 30% to Apple for the majority of iPhone users.

Now we could argue that Apple's rules saying that a developer can't put a link to their website is wrong... and I tend to agree.

But right now... other than a small amount of pre-2016 legacy subscribers... Spotify has figured out how to not pay the 30% to Apple. And they're doing it. Every dollar Spotify receives from their website is theirs. It bypasses Apple and the App Store entirely.

And let's not forget that Spotify is the largest music streaming service in the world today. No one else is even close. So I'm having a hard time feeling sorry for Spotify.


2023-01-202.jpg
 
I loved & paid for Spotify for many many years. But I dropped them and switched to Apple Music when the whole Apple Watch debacle happened.

Spotify let everyone think that Apple was the one preventing them from making an AW app. But then a 3rd party dev made one and it was glorious. Right on the verge of wide public release, Spotify bought said app and scooped up the Dev. We thought they were just going to tweak it a little and release it. Hooray! But nope. They killed the app. Straight up lied to everyone. And it was how many years before they finally released the AW app that exists today.

So yeah. I switched to Apple Music.
 
Someone please explain to me how they accuse Apple of having a monopoly within their own hardware/software platform when consumers can choose an Android phone if they don’t like it. Seems to me they would have the right to shut down their App Store and boot all third party apps off iPhones if they wanted.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ac1d 8urn
T
I am curious as to what exactly they want the EU to do, since the letter is vague on specifics in that regard.

It increasingly sounds like these companies want all the advantages of the App Store (it allows them instant access to Apple's user base), without having to contribute a single cent to help upkeep the App Store. I would compare this as being akin to jumping over the turnstile at the train station. Want to take the metro, but don't want to pay the fare.

And finally, I will argue that the App Store policies are what result in the greatest benefit for the greatest number of users. If you poll users, I am willing to bet that the majority do not exactly hate closed ecosystems, and have little interest in the sort of change these companies are trying to usher in.

Make no mistake. Remember the names of each and every one of these companies and their CEOs. They are not doing this for the benefit or empowerment of users. They simply want more power, and they will happily burn the App Store model to the ground to get it.
That’s essentially what they and companies like Epic want. They want a free ride. They aren’t even arguing about unfair prices. They just don’t want to pay. They should focus on improving their service and stop with all the free trials. How do they expect to make money if they are giving it away for free.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ac1d 8urn
I ultimately see it as a red herring when iOS doesn’t even have majority market share. The number of iPhone users still using iTunes is likely in the minority. If Spotify isn’t profitable at this point, their financial situation isn’t going to improve whatever happens with the App Store.

Spotify sounds more and more desperate by the day. Won’t be surprised if they end up being acquired by another tech giant in the near future.
 
  • Like
Reactions: I7guy
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.