Steve Jobs on iOS Location Issue: 'We Don't Track Anyone'

[MacMan86]

Could people stop calling each other turds and trolls? Grow up.

Trolls get in the way of sensible debate. I don't know where you're getting 'turds' from

Maybe I'll get the cell next to Steve and I can get some inside info and post it here for you guys. And if you check out my posts in the other forums, you'll see that I'm not really a troll at all. I just find it amusing how so many here get all defensive about anything Apple does that is questionable.

It's worth questioning until a sensible answer is given, then it makes sense to stop. That answer has been given, by me and many others - referencing the Apple engineer involved.

I find it less amusing that the media and individuals make mountains out of molehills. The issue, however questionable has been blown out of all proportions. Other companies seem to be doing the same, with the only difference being the length of time the info is stored for. Their actions don't elicit the same response from the media because you don't get as many page views as you would with a story about Apple.

 

[LalexLinsay]

Well if he says Android does it as well then he is not being honest - so why trust anything else he says? (* You are specifically asked if you mind them collecting anonymous usage data, and you can say no)

 

[AppleScruff1]

Trolls get in the way of sensible debate. I don't know where you're getting 'turds' from




It's worth questioning until a sensible answer is given, then it makes sense to stop. That answer has been given, by me and many others - referencing the Apple engineer involved.

I find it less amusing that the media and individuals make mountains out of molehills. The issue, however questionable has been blown out of all proportions. Other companies seem to be doing the same, with the only difference being the length of time the info is stored for. Their actions don't elicit the same response from the media because you don't get as many page views as you would with a story about Apple.

I'll wait until Apple responds. Or maybe they will just ignore it and all will be forgotten, who knows for sure.

 

[kenliles]

now that I know how accurately iPhone can track it's location, I'm a definite buyer.

I wish they would keep a permanent history (not just one year); I can never remember where I've been...

by the way- aren't the phones required by law to do this for 911 service calls? I don't get the issue here...

ken

 

[AppleScruff1]

If they put Steve in prison, do you think he will still be against jailbreaking?

 

[archipellago]

Genuine question...

does anyone know of a question that Jobs has answered truthfully...?

 

[seedster2]

Hes not acting like a dick, he's just worried because of what hes heard.

I know your email to Steve would begin with "Your Royal Appleness" and end with "Your faithful Man-Servant"

The man has heard his phone is tracking his location, and is naturally, entitled to be worried.

So true. The zealots around here act like questioning any of apple's decisions is blasphemous. If it was as ridiculous as some of you make it out to be, he shouldn't have dignified it with a response.

News Flash:

He's a Liar.

I have witnessed him many times consciously omit details and give misleading answers. There are a great share of people who hate on him for no reason but there are a fair share of members here who will defend him regardless of what he does.

There could be a few reasons for the database.

iAds - while Apple don't receive any information now, who knows if they may have intended to down the road for targeted iAds based on location. This point is pure speculation and not accusation.

Device Upgrades - Have the database collect info on your current device, copy it to iTunes as part of the backup and dump it on a new device (Say you bought an iPhone 4 coming from a 3GS) Now the iPhone 4 knows what you're 3GS already did, so the new device is as 'smart' as the old one. Makes for a more seamless transition.

I can see that this data is being saved for iAds purposes. All the members pointing at Google pretend that Apple is not trying to profit from the same business.

It seems to me that the media and those sending steve email don't understand what it means when they say "Apple is tracking me".

I agree the behavior is being mislabeled to garner as much of an audience as possible.

You don't believe a company whose sole source of revenue is providing advertising and data search services cares about keeping an eye on you???

Ignorance truly is bliss.

iAds will be headed down the same path. Don't be naive.

Who cares about Android? Apple's alleged "tracking" of it's users is the issue at hand. Funny how Android is being used as a smoke screen to justify Apples actions or skirt the issue all together by pointing the finger at others.

So if this e-mail is legit, Steve managed once again to deflect the real issue. The real issue is not "Apple is tracking user!", it's that the file exists, contains full historical data, is backed up and restore to a new device if you opt to do that.
Thank you Steve for once again not addressing the issue and just trying to deflect it so that Apple doesn't have to deal with it.

Indeed he appears to answer exactly what is asked especially when it skirts the real concern. He's a great salesman/politician

Oh yeah, I forgot, you're a troll. Only a troll would claim to know better than a guy with a CV/resume like this:

Nice resume by the way

 

[LagunaSol]

iAds will be headed down the same path. Don't be naive.

Advertising is a small side business for Apple, not the sole reason for its existence (read: Google).

 

[seedster2]

Advertising is a small side business for Apple, not the sole reason for its existence (read: Google).

They anticipate it growing into a significant part of their business otherwise they wouldnt bother with iAds at all.

 

[LagunaSol]

They anticipate it growing into a significant part of their business otherwise they wouldnt bother with iAds at all.

Good. Let's eliminate user tracking and targeted ads for both iOS and Android. I'm happy with that.

(Google wouldn't be.)

 

[MacMan86]

Nice resume by the way

Just feel I should point out in case it wasn't clear, that that resume isn't mine (sadly). That's Morgan Grainger, the lead Apple engineer responsible for the Core Location iOS framework. In case you missed it in earlier posts - this guy gave a presentation at WWDC last year and included information about how the iPhone keeps a record of nearby cell towers so the phone can find it's location quickly without turning on the GPS radio when it doesn't need to. A number of posters here reckoned they knew how the iPhone worked better than him, so I felt they should get an idea of who they were arguing with.

 

[KítscheñÇinqµe]

& maintain orbit on the 'hidden' side of a planet or sun

I don't get the big deal about it. If you want to be anonymous, get off fb, twitter, macrumors, etc. Then cancel all Internet plans you have and your cellular plan. Then no one will ever know where you are unless you tell them.

though you'll need to jam earth's governments' surveillance systems while you rocket (or teleport) to your hideaway)

 

[KítscheñÇinqµe]

gps this. (jam the db)

smokescreen entries...

i was in outer upper vandu only seconds ago.
now i'm in greenland.
in a few minutes, I'll be on Adrastea (where the cell reception souqs)

 

[KítscheñÇinqµe]

You're always being logged now a days. The folks with the tin foil may have been right in some way or another.

we'll just log them back! muahaha, hahahaaaa

haa?

('in soviet russia...')

 

[KítscheñÇinqµe]

I don't believe this, 18 pages of pure nonsense, people are either paranoid or have a phobia of a military-grade location protection. Grow up, every and each one of you is tracked everyday and on average you get caught on 300 different CCTV cameras.

my one-eyed laptop is watching me. http://news.cnet.com/8301-19518_3-10457737-238.html

If you want absolute privacy, go live in a bunker.

yeah, 34k hominids died in vehicle accidents in 2009. don't 'buckle up', be happy.

 

[KítscheñÇinqµe]

I guess if you are afraid of your wife finding it and discovering that you are hanging out at truck stops trading meth for certain favors then it could be an issue, but my wife already knows about this. In fact, she even comes along sometimes to take pictures.

that's just what she tells you she's doing. But actually, she's TSA NAKED SCANNING YOU!

 

[KítscheñÇinqµe]

Just because I don't want strangers to know when I leave my home to go to work, that doesn't mean I shouldn't go to work. Tell Eric Schmidt that I have all his transcripts right here - he will know what I mean.

'if you've done nothing wrong you have nothing to fear...' from that psycho stalker next door (or from epsilon)

 

[KítscheñÇinqµe]

Because Google does not yet have a program in place for targeted ads for "found" phones. Give them time.

"We've successfully located your phone!"

in a gay bathhouse internationally notorious for mob bareback action.

"Perhaps you would be interested in this book on asset management?"

or an iDownlojack subscription?

 

[Rodimus Prime]

Advertising is a small side business for Apple, not the sole reason for its existence (read: Google).

It being chump changed for Apple does not change the fact that Apple has shown itself in the past time and time again that it will look for any way to get more cash.

 

[AppleScruff1]

Trolls get in the way of sensible debate. I don't know where you're getting 'turds' from




It's worth questioning until a sensible answer is given, then it makes sense to stop. That answer has been given, by me and many others - referencing the Apple engineer involved.

I find it less amusing that the media and individuals make mountains out of molehills. The issue, however questionable has been blown out of all proportions. Other companies seem to be doing the same, with the only difference being the length of time the info is stored for. Their actions don't elicit the same response from the media because you don't get as many page views as you would with a story about Apple.

But the same media gives Apple plenty of good publicity and free advertising when they show the long lines at the Apple Store with people waiting for a new iPad, iPhone, etc. The same media reports Apple's record profits and stock price. I've never heard anyone complain about that. It's not like the media is anti Apple. The media helps fuel the fire and Apple knows it gets lots of very good free publicity from it. Remember the lost iPhone 4? That did wonders for Apple and they didn't spend a dime. Maybe the leak was even planned?

 

[KítscheñÇinqµe]

Good one. Like anyone on MR goes to the gym!

the only way to know for sure, is to ask steve.. or sergie.. or steve..

Pshh!

 

[MacMan86]

But the same media gives Apple plenty of good publicity and free advertising when they show the long lines at the Apple Store with people waiting for a new iPad, iPhone, etc. The same media reports Apple's record profits and stock price. I've never heard anyone complain about that. It's not like the media is anti Apple. The media helps fuel the fire and Apple knows it gets lots of very good free publicity from it. Remember the lost iPhone 4? That did wonders for Apple and they didn't spend a dime. Maybe the leak was even planned?

So because the media are sometimes glowing about Apple, Apple deserves to get a few sensationalist, damaging stories written about them too?

Some of the ways this story has been portrayed are ridiculous - taking huge, unsubstantiated leaps, reporting that Apple is keeping an eye on where you're going. They don't have the time to be following 160 million people as they go about their mundane lives.

Have you ever considered why the media often gives Apple so much free PR? It's not out of the goodness of their hearts now is it . It costs them money to produce the content after all. The media need hits, page views and viewing figures - their advertising revenue is dependent upon it. They know that Apple stories are popular and guarantee lots of page views. More page views equals more ad revenue. If you can give a story a headline like "Apple Is Tracking Your Every Move" that scaremongering gets you more page views.

The media's desperate attempts to get you to read their content are not worth defending in my book.

 

[Tech198]

Tracking

Is this the same as the hidden file coped over when the user sync's their Iphone up to their computer?

In any case, my stand on this, is i have mine disabled, but this exact reason.

But its no worse to other mobiles with intergrated GPS. Location Services reminds me of A-GPS (Assistant GPS), used on other mobile phones (eg Nokia)

The only difference I can see is the non-Apple phone helps with the GPS signal (quicker loacton access), while the Location service (on the IPhone) needs the help of a remote server. But both basically do the same job.

 

[chris7777]

My problem is that apple goes all big brother, when they have an employee loose a test mule, going so far as to have a mans home ransacked, who to the best of my recollection claimed he bought the device.(and while yes that is a messed up situation in itself) But for Steve to act like oh we collect this data to help you the end user, if you loose your i product or have it stolen to help recover it. and in the same breath act like thats not tracking anyone, well, I the intrest of openness, I suggest he post a way for anyone to access and read his own personal data from the system. Which like credit bureaus, and other data accumulation agencies excell at accumulating data for their own gain, but fail to share it without getting a cut from the very people they spy on.

Unfortunately they were smart( or devious) enough to make it "cultural" and hip to have credit, and iphones, and gps, the problem lies where one party has exclusive access to said data, and they themselves are untouchable, but you or I are fair game.

 

[MacMan86]

My problem is that apple goes all big brother, when they have an employee loose a test mule, going so far as to have a mans home ransacked, who to the best of my recollection claimed he bought the device.

I don't see how their response to a product leak (proportionate or not) is relevant to this situation? They didn't go 'Big Brother', they got the law very heavily involved. If he bought the device knowing it was stolen (as is alleged) then that is a crime.

But for Steve to act like oh we collect this data to help you the end user, if you loose your i product or have it stolen to help recover it.

No one, not least Steve has ever said the data is collected to help recover your iPhone. This data could never be used to help you recover your device, because the data stays on the device. If you have access to the data (putting aside iTunes backups), you have already found your phone.

I the intrest of openness, I suggest he post a way for anyone to access and read his own personal data from the system.

Steve doesn't have any means to know where you, Chris are, so why should he give you a way to know where he is? There is a big difference between anonymous and non-anonymous data. You're asking for non-anonymous data in return for anonymous data - that's not a fair exchange