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Steve Jobs on Lack of Firewire in MacBooks

Help your friend out.

Order a battery kit off eBay for $10. Includes battery, tool, instructions. The battery may then be longer-lived than when the iPod Photo was new.



albusseverus said:
I have a friend with (coincidentally) an iPod Photo with battery in such poor condition it can only be kept alive by a FireWire cable (12V), as USB (5V) just doesn't provide sufficient power. What's disturbing is Apple dropping FireWire, which was very quick to sync and a major selling point of the original iPod. As iPod and iPhone capacities increase, we'll be wishing we had FireWire back again.

Apple seems to have learned their lesson on MacBooks (or have they?). One FireWire port is the minimum, but who wants the minimum from Apple? For example, a musician might want a FireWire interface and a fast FireWire hard drive to capture the recordings. This works much better with 2 FireWire ports than chaining the interface and the hard drive (the less hubs the better).

Dropping FireWire from iMacs is the next worry. The latest rev went from 2 FireWire ports down to 1. Even on my modest setup, I really need 3 FireWire ports and struggle with 2 (plugging & unplugging on a daily basis). One FireWire just wouldn't be suitable and concerns me what will be left in the way of interfaces on my next iMac.

I'm sure the next rev of iMacs will be quad cores (or i7s?) and FW 1600 and 3200, won't they Apple?
Click to expand...
 
FireWire is dead. They only have themselves to blame.

Apple has never been a company to look back and get all nostalgic - they accept that FW is dead.

If you need it, get a USB FW converter. USB may not be the best technology ever but it by and large works, and it's ubiquitous.

The arrival of USB 3.0 is imminent too. USB 3.0 will kill FW deader than dead because then the last advantage FW still had will be gone.

R.I.P. FireWire.
 
Amusing. Firewire is not dead. 1394 is not dead.
My PC at works has 1394 or Firewire. Lost have Firewire.
Most Macs have Firewire.

USB 3 is not here yet. It looks like 2010.

It looks like USB 3 has the speed edge over Firewire for cables < 3 meters in length. Although USB is here yet, so can't really compare yet.
For cables > 3 meters, anyway you look at it Firewire 400 or 800 wins.
So Firewire isn't dead.
USB hasn't been born yet. Its a pregnancy issue. Hopefully it wont be still born.
 
orthorim said:
FireWire is dead. They only have themselves to blame.

Apple has never been a company to look back and get all nostalgic - they accept that FW is dead.

If you need it, get a USB FW converter. USB may not be the best technology ever but it by and large works, and it's ubiquitous.

The arrival of USB 3.0 is imminent too. USB 3.0 will kill FW deader than dead because then the last advantage FW still had will be gone.

R.I.P. FireWire.
Click to expand...

Wow. Trying to get a rise?
You do realize that FW800 is now present in all Macs after the recent updates...

USB is much slower than Firewire 400. Using an adapter to USB won't speed it up. Its unfortunate that folks get sold on a number, 480 vs. 400 thinking that USB is as fast or faster, when in practice its often 1/2 the speed.

If you want something that "by and large works, and is ubiquitous", get the $298 laptop at Walmart running Vista :) .
 
NoSmokingBandit said:
Why is it so damn difficult for someone to explain this?
Click to expand...
In very brief terms. Generally, the larger volume the battery has, the more power it can have.

A non-replaceable battery can take advantage of the space gained by not having the removable battery slot, connection, cover, let alone the battery itself is contained in a cover which wastes space. Plus a non-removable battery can be of any shape that is advantageous where as a removable battery must be in a case strong enough for it to be removed by the user.

orthorim said:
R.I.P. FireWire.
Click to expand...
A bit premature I would think.
 
orthorim said:
FireWire is dead. They only have themselves to blame.

Apple has never been a company to look back and get all nostalgic - they accept that FW is dead.

If you need it, get a USB FW converter. USB may not be the best technology ever but it by and large works, and it's ubiquitous.

The arrival of USB 3.0 is imminent too. USB 3.0 will kill FW deader than dead because then the last advantage FW still had will be gone.

R.I.P. FireWire.
Click to expand...

Good luck retrofitting everyone with USB 3 adaptors, at least FW 1600 & 3200 use the FW 800 connector. Unfortunately, I think we're waiting for USB 3 to ship (any year now) before FW 1600 & 3200 ships.

USB is unreliable technology, requiring CPU time, instead of dedicated chips like FireWire. USB 3 is likely held up trying to get promised throughput (which it never does in practice) with current CPUs. FireWire on the other hand gets better continuous throughput than SATA in practice, I'm told.

I pray to Jobs that Apple is still putting plenty of FireWire ports in all Macs when the bright 1600/3200 future arrives.
 
USB 3 will be backwards compatible with 1 and 2 - why change a winning strategy?

I won't forgive FW that they changed the connector for FW 800. That was just beyond dumb it's almost suicidal. At the moment this became public FW was dead.

I know USB is inferior when it comes to data transfer. But if you consider the upsides, if you look at the big picture, it's arguably better. Do my mouse and 3G modem run over USB? No. In laptops, space is at a premium and versatility might be valued higher than raw performance. USB 3 will close the performance gap. I think it is held up for that reason too. After all the new standard will run external SSDs and that puts way more data on the wire than HDs ever could.

FW was great once but I feel like it's just not worth getting nostalgic feelings about technology. Let's move on.
 
If Firewire was dead, then why are video cameras still being made with firewire? huh?

enough of the silly rubbish!
 
Target362 said:
If Firewire was dead, then why are video cameras still being made with firewire? huh?

enough of the silly rubbish!
Click to expand...

Well let me rephrase - FireWire is not dead, it just has become a niche product.

It's not going to compete with USB 3.0. It's going to be in the same category as SCSI drives. A good technology that hasn't caught on for various reasons.
 
orthorim said:
Well let me rephrase - FireWire is not dead, it just has become a niche product.

It's not going to compete with USB 3.0. It's going to be in the same category as SCSI drives. A good technology that hasn't caught on for various reasons.
Click to expand...

Thats future and not what this thread was about.
USB3.0 isn't shipping yet. FW800 is.
Hopefully USB3.0 fixes the limitations of USB2.0 that make it vastly inferior to FW800, but from what I've read about it, it sounds like they're still up to their trickery. Stating super high burst speeds while delivering actual throughput that is substantially below that of FW3200.
 
Just wanted to shout out to all the tons of people who voted to bring back firewire... hats off to you :) We got our firewire back!!! Woo HOo!! I got the new fw800 macbook and am loving it.

So thanks everyone!
 
Firewire IS dead, it just doesn't know it yet. Apple is moving towards Intel's Light fiber technololgy. That will replace BOTH Firewire AND USB together in one very thin fiber, maybe the video connector too.
 
I remember when I first read this, couldn't believe what I was reading. First you have to know that any computer you buy never seems to have enough USB ports or FW so to do away with any port on a computer is just mad. If anything we need computer makers to add a port or two.

Now I know many readers will disagree and say that is what they made USB or FW Hubs for but I don't want extra wires etc. hanging from out of my computer. Never the less outright doing away with it. Most of the equipment I use connects with FW, as a matter of fact that was why I purchased it in the first place. Speed & ease of use. So to just forget about us who really rely on FW is an outright slap on the face and I mean really hard.
 
MacDSmith2 said:
Firewire IS dead, it just doesn't know it yet. Apple is moving towards Intel's Light fiber technololgy. That will replace BOTH Firewire AND USB together in one very thin fiber, maybe the video connector too.
Click to expand...
Future technologies are just that. Who knows what we'll be using 5 years down the road.

Currently I have the option of USB2.0, eSATA, FW400 and FW800. Of these, I would definitely choose FW800.

In fact I have two FW800 external 2.5 inch HDs connected to my MBP15 with just two short FW800 cables. No power cables required. Easy to mount and dismount the images. Can boot from either. Very easy to pack up and go. Just one simple cable. Sweet.

The nice thing about FW, is that the connector for 1600 and 3200 is the same. Very convenient.

Many said SCSI would die, but it's still around for those who need it. My guess is that FW will probably be the same. FWIW, in my local electronics shop lately I've seen more FW peripherals (external HDs, PCI Cards, etc.) which is surprising.
 
MacDSmith2 said:
Firewire IS dead, it just doesn't know it yet. Apple is moving towards Intel's Light fiber technololgy. That will replace BOTH Firewire AND USB together in one very thin fiber, maybe the video connector too.
Click to expand...

I hope Light Peak moves fast enough onto market that it obsoletes USB3. I don't want another CPU hogging peripheral. USB is nice for mice, scanner, keyboard, whatever, but for audio interfaces, video, and hard drives, I like FW800. And soon hopefully, Light Peak.
 
The only way I'll consider a data connection to be replacement for firewire is if the new system supports target disk mode.
 
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