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I know Apple fans are gonna dismiss this as not a big deal, but my phone scrolls smoother than this. It's simply not acceptable

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After buying magic mouse the situation has improved, but in chrome smooth scrolling still doesn't work

Safari runs smoothly, but Firefox is even smoother, I still don't understand how they let it happen.

Everything is running smoothly at the moment, except for chrome and some apps, so I think the problem is solved.

apple devices are really handy, especially the trackpad, but I found the mouse quite comfortable and functional, other mice will not work as stable and smoothly with mac os, just get over it, it's apple.
 
After buying magic mouse the situation has improved, but in chrome smooth scrolling still doesn't work

Safari runs smoothly, but Firefox is even smoother, I still don't understand how they let it happen.

Everything is running smoothly at the moment, except for chrome and some apps, so I think the problem is solved.

apple devices are really handy, especially the trackpad, but I found the mouse quite comfortable and functional, other mice will not work as stable and smoothly with mac os, just get over it, it's apple.

This happens if I either use an external mouse, the trackpad or arrow keys. It's tracking device agnostic.

I guess I'll install Firefox to test this out. But here's a video of me testing mousewheel (I'm using GitHub - noah-nuebling/mac-mouse-fix: Mac Mouse Fix for smooth scrolling instead of native OS disgusting stepped scrolling) the trackpad and arrow keys.

And it looks horrendous.

 
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Yes, Firefox gives the most buttery smooth scrolling 👍 Simply perfect scrolling! 👌 And this is despite the fact that it is a cross-platform web browser, unlike Safari! LOL!!! 🤣 This is why I use Firefox on a regular basis. Moreover, Firefox is not only 100500 times smoother than the Safari built into the operating system, but also much faster, no matter what Apple claims on its official website 🤷‍♂️
 
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After buying magic mouse the situation has improved…
I bought a Magic Mouse but didn't notice any improvement at all.
apple devices are really handy, especially the trackpad, but I found the mouse quite comfortable and functional, other mice will not work as stable and smoothly with mac os, just get over it, it's apple.
This is no excuse! Not everyone will find the Apple mouse or trackpad comfortable to use, so Apple needs to do something about it ASAP.
 
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I bought a Magic Mouse but didn't notice any improvement at all.

This is no excuse! Not everyone will find the Apple mouse or trackpad comfortable to use, so Apple needs to do something about it ASAP.


No need to say anything else.
 
Firefox is a clear example of how Safari and the entire macOS operating system should behave when scrolling.
 
Firefox is a clear example of how Safari and the entire macOS operating system should behave when scrolling.

I can confirm, Firefox performs 20000000x better than Safari, Arc, Chrome or Edge. It's actually insane. On everything.
 
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The stutter has been present since "retina" macs became a thing. Sadly after Jobs passed it was never gonna be a priority for Tim $$$$$$ to optimise any operating system.

When it comes to Mac's specifically, apple capitalised on the assertion that windows machines were slow and laggy, when in reality Windows was always faster if the machine was of equal spec to the Mac. As discussed here, it's also significantly smoother.

Sad that the situation hasn't improved since the thread was started, but it's not unexpected.

I know you asked of an example of iOS stutter, I'm sorry that I missed that. Even basic swiping between home screen pages is stuttery, and fittingly in Safari if you scroll quickly it stutters. iOS in general is just slow compared to Android, the stutters are inexcusable for £1000 devices.

I just got a new job in IT support and they have the option of MacBook, Chromebook, or an XPS with windows. The fact I'm considering a Chromebook over a MacBook says a lot.

I have no bias or affinity to any company or OS, I use what I perceive as having the best support and functionality. Chrome OS is unsurprisingly the smoothest, fastest, and most stable out of all three, as it's just Linux with Google tat skinned on top. People hate on Google, but the company I work for is a huge worldwide corporation that you'd instantly recognise, the fact I can support an entire global business with a Chromebook should say a lot about how far they've come.

The MacBook would actually be at the bottom of the list when it comes to my picks, mainly because I just can't be bothered with the stutter, despite how lovely the hardware is. I'd rather take the problems that come with using a Dell laptop over Apple's lack of care.
 
The stutter has been present since "retina" macs became a thing. Sadly after Jobs passed it was never gonna be a priority for Tim $$$$$$ to optimise any operating system.

When it comes to Mac's specifically, apple capitalised on the assertion that windows machines were slow and laggy, when in reality Windows was always faster if the machine was of equal spec to the Mac. As discussed here, it's also significantly smoother.

Sad that the situation hasn't improved since the thread was started, but it's not unexpected.

I know you asked of an example of iOS stutter, I'm sorry that I missed that. Even basic swiping between home screen pages is stuttery, and fittingly in Safari if you scroll quickly it stutters. iOS in general is just slow compared to Android, the stutters are inexcusable for £1000 devices.

I just got a new job in IT support and they have the option of MacBook, Chromebook, or an XPS with windows. The fact I'm considering a Chromebook over a MacBook says a lot.

I have no bias or affinity to any company or OS, I use what I perceive as having the best support and functionality. Chrome OS is unsurprisingly the smoothest, fastest, and most stable out of all three, as it's just Linux with Google tat skinned on top. People hate on Google, but the company I work for is a huge worldwide corporation that you'd instantly recognise, the fact I can support an entire global business with a Chromebook should say a lot about how far they've come.

The MacBook would actually be at the bottom of the list when it comes to my picks, mainly because I just can't be bothered with the stutter, despite how lovely the hardware is. I'd rather take the problems that come with using a Dell laptop over Apple's lack of care.

Was "retina" introduced with Intel CPUs still?

I agreed wholeheartedly with you. The software is absolutely bloated beyond recognition now. MacOS is the only OS in 2024 that can't UI scale properly on external monitors, has the worst scrolling, snappiness, smoothness, frame drops constantly etc.

I actually find it unbelievable this is the case still and I'm 100% sure Sequoia will fix 0 of these things. Just more garbage features like mirroring an iPhone. Yay. Apple's priorities took a 180 since Job's passing.

When it comes to Mac's specifically, apple capitalised on the assertion that windows machines were slow and laggy, when in reality Windows was always faster if the machine was of equal spec to the Mac. As discussed here, it's also significantly smoother.

I don't even fully agree with this, there's not even a need to have on-par hardware. Apple just capitalised on normies that buy laptops with 200 preloaded bloatware, have no idea how to format or do a clean install, that's what Apple capitalises on. With Windows 10 and mainly Windows 11, MS has been at the forefront of performance, not even in the same stratosphere of comparison. Even if the hardware is a bit slower than a M-chip mac the drastic difference in performance is ghastly.
 
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Was "retina" introduced with Intel CPUs still?

I agreed wholeheartedly with you. The software is absolutely bloated beyond recognition now. MacOS is the only OS in 2024 that can't UI scale properly on external monitors, has the worst scrolling, snappiness, smoothness, frame drops constantly etc.

I actually find it unbelievable this is the case still and I'm 100% sure Sequoia will fix 0 of these things. Just more garbage features like mirroring an iPhone. Yay. Apple's priorities took a 180 since Job's passing.



I don't even fully agree with this, there's not even a need to have on-par hardware. Apple just capitalised on normies that buy laptops with 200 preloaded bloatware, have no idea how to format or do a clean install, that's what Apple capitalises on. With Windows 10 and mainly Windows 11, MS has been at the forefront of performance, not even in the same stratosphere of comparison. Even if the hardware is a bit slower than a M-chip mac the drastic difference in performance is ghastly.
Completely agree, you don't even need a recent CPU for Windows to be faster, all it needs is a decent SSD and 16GB RAM, both costing 1/10th of what apple charges for an upgrade.
 
The stutter has been present since "retina" macs became a thing. Sadly after Jobs passed it was never gonna be a priority for Tim $$$$$$ to optimise any operating system.
Tim Cook is the CEO of Apple. Tim Cook is not responsible for macOS, but Craig Federighi. Info from Wiki: Craig Federighi (born 1968 or 1969) is an American engineer and business executive who is the senior vice president (SVP) of software engineering at Apple Inc. He oversees the development of Apple's operating systems. His teams are responsible for delivering the software of Apple's products, including the user interface, applications, and frameworks.

Moreover, he returned to Apple in 2009 at the invitation of Steve Jobs himself, in order to lead the Mac OS X operating system development group under the direct supervision of Bertrand Serlet.

On March 23, 2011, Federighi took over the duties of Bertrand Serlet, who left the company, and on August 27, 2012, he was finally confirmed as Apple's senior vice president of Mac software.

Since October 30, 2012, after the announcement of Scott Forstall's departure from Apple, his area of responsibility as a leader has expanded, and he became simultaneously responsible for the development of both Apple operating systems — both OS X and iOS.
 
I know you asked of an example of iOS stutter, I'm sorry that I missed that. Even basic swiping between home screen pages is stuttery, and fittingly in Safari if you scroll quickly it stutters. iOS in general is just slow compared to Android, the stutters are inexcusable for £1000 devices.
Can I see visual confirmation of these words?
 
You might want to upgrade your computer to restore a truly buttery-smooth experience. M1 is getting old now and won't be supported forever.
Apparently, this is what the cunning guys from Apple are counting on. But the funny thing is that the M1 chip is more than powerful enough for the OS interface and all other software, including the Safari web browser, to work as smoothly and seamlessly as possible. It is enough to look at how super-smoothly and quickly Firefox works on this chip to immediately understand that the problem is not in the chip itself, but in the optimization of the software for it. Moreover, I find messages on the Internet that similar problems are encountered not only by owners of Macs on the M1 chip, but even by owners of Macs on the M3 chip! Therefore, it is obvious that the problem is not in the M1 chip.
 
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Chrome OS is unsurprisingly the smoothest, fastest, and most stable out of all three, as it's just Linux with Google tat skinned on top.
I haven't used ChromeOS, but given that it uses Google's Chrome web browser as its principal user interface, I can imagine that there's no way to expect smooth scrolling of any content. Because Google's web browser is extremely unstable across all operating systems when it comes to smooth scrolling 👎

A long time ago, I had a pretty powerful Windows 7 desktop PC that wasn't cheap, around $2,000, and Chrome on that computer was pretty lousy when it came to smooth scrolling. Then I had another modern, powerful, and expensive gaming nettop called the Intel NUC Hades Canyon (the top model in the line with the HVK index) running Windows 10 that cost around $1,000. But even on that, Chrome was pretty bad when it came to scrolling any content, even on fairly simple sites like Wikipedia. On a relatively new and pretty powerful Mac mini with an M1 chip, the situation with Google's web browser is more or less the same 🤷‍♂️ The funny thing is that Chrome has always been the fastest, but it's never been the smoothest.
 
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The funny thing is that Chrome has always been the fastest, but it's never been the smoothest.
The smoothest is Firefox, especially after Mozilla programmers have done a simply titanic job in this direction.
 
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The MacBook would actually be at the bottom of the list when it comes to my picks, mainly because I just can't be bothered with the stutter, despite how lovely the hardware is. I'd rather take the problems that come with using a Dell laptop over Apple's lack of care.
🤦‍♂️

On the contrary, I will never go back to a regular Windows-based PC, even if Windows ever becomes 100,500 times faster and smoother than macOS. It is better to have a gorgeous Apple operating system, which is damn convenient, functional, beautiful, safe and thought out in detail, than a Microsoft piece of crap, which literally imitates the Apple system in everything, constantly copying/stealing something from it 😆 Windows 11 is generally some kind of pathetic parody of macOS, which, in addition, literally slows down everywhere. Even the panel with symbols and emoji terribly slows down during scrolling, demonstrating not a slide show, but a freeze frame during scrolling! 🥶 Therefore, there is no need to fantasize about how Windows is smooth and fast. Only Windows 8 was truly fast and smooth, but that is all in the past. Windows 11 is a slow and stuttering piece of crap even on powerful and modern hardware 💩

I consider Microsoft operating system to be the WORST desktop operating system IN THE WORLD and simply the WORST product IN THE WORLD created by human hand. And I am not the only one who thinks so 😉 If you do not agree with me, then what are you doing here, on a forum about Apple products? 🤨 Then sell your Macs and iPhones and use PCs based on Windows, Linux or ChromeOS and smartphones based on Android.

P.S. And yes, I am not an Apple fan at all (I do not have any favorite company whose products I prefer), I just try to look at things objectively and impartially.
 
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It's also funny to read when someone writes that Windows is a very smooth and fast system 🤣 🤣 🤣 The default web browser in Windows is Edge, which is based on Chromium. That is, there can be no talk of any smooth scrolling in this browser, especially on heavy sites like YouTube. Chrome, Edge, Opera, Vivaldi and any other web browser based on Chromium noticeably slows down, lags and stutters during scrolling of ANY sites, even fairly simple ones! This is first. Secondly, many applications do not have smooth scrolling at all, and instead use stepped scrolling. Thirdly, the implementation of the scrolling itself varies greatly from application to application. That is, there is no standardization, like in macOS (with Apple's Magic Mouse, Magic Trackpad, the built-in trackpad in a MacBook, or a regular mouse with a scroll wheel and the Mac Mouse Fix app). Animations in Windows 11 can also slow down in different situations. So I have no idea why you think that this disgusting Microsoft OS is so smooth, fast and responsive 🤷‍♂️

I no longer wish to discuss here this rarest wretchedness called Windows 🤢 🤮 I would not wish this filth to be used even by my most sworn enemy. It is even disgusting to remember this abomination 😏 Such a disgusting in every sense desktop operating system can only be dreamed of in a nightmare 😴 😲 😱

I'm done here! :)
 
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🤦‍♂️

On the contrary, I will never go back to a regular Windows-based PC, even if Windows ever becomes 100,500 times faster and smoother than macOS. It is better to have a gorgeous Apple operating system, which is damn convenient, functional, beautiful, safe and thought out in detail, than a Microsoft piece of crap, which literally imitates the Apple system in everything, constantly copying/stealing something from it 😆 Windows 11 is generally some kind of pathetic parody of macOS, which, in addition, literally slows down everywhere. Even the panel with symbols and emoji terribly slows down during scrolling, demonstrating not a slide show, but a freeze frame during scrolling! 🥶 Therefore, there is no need to fantasize about how Windows is smooth and fast. Only Windows 8 was truly fast and smooth, but that is all in the past. Windows 11 is a slow and stuttering piece of crap even on powerful and modern hardware 💩

I consider Microsoft operating system to be the WORST desktop operating system IN THE WORLD and simply the WORST product IN THE WORLD created by human hand. And I am not the only one who thinks so 😉 If you do not agree with me, then what are you doing here, on a forum about Apple products? 🤨 Then sell your Macs and iPhones and use PCs based on Windows, Linux or ChromeOS and smartphones based on Android.

P.S. And yes, I am not an Apple fan at all (I do not have any favorite company whose products I prefer), I just try to look at things objectively and impartially.

There's absolutely nothing true in this post regarding Windows 11. But if it feels nice for you to believe that then so be it. Truth is, Win11 is the most performant OS of the two. There's no comparison. I like Apple products, that's why I'm here. That's why I bought a M3 MBP and that's why I'm contemplating switching to an iPhone from Android after 20 years.

With that being said, I have an Asus laptop and a custom built Desktop PC and Win11 beats MacOS by every metric when it comes to performance, smoothness, snappiness etc. There's literally no comparison.

Is macOS the most elegant of the two? Of course it is. But when I plug it to my ultrawide screen or 4K screen and have to use a paid 3rd party app to even be able to properly scale the UI when Win11 does proper true pixel perfect scaling on any resolution, then something's very wrong.
 
There's absolutely nothing true in this post regarding Windows 11. But if it feels nice for you to believe that then so be it.
My brother has a regular 2020 Intel nettop with a Core i5 (the series is called "NUC"), on which he recently installed Windows 11, completely formatting the SSD drive. It works noticeably worse than the previous polished Windows 10 in terms of performance. For example, if you open 20-30 applications and press Win + Tab, the animation will noticeably slow down. And this is despite the fact that he has a monitor with a Full HD resolution (1920 x 1080) and a screen refresh rate of 60 Hz 😁 If you open 20-30 applications in macOS and press Ctrl + ↑ to bring up Mission Control, or Ctrl + ↓ to show a preview of all windows of the current application, the animation will not slow down. Everything animates as smoothly and beautifully as possible, unlike the 11th version of Windows. I already wrote here about the terribly lagging panel with symbols and emojis during scrolling. And these are just a few examples. So these are not my fantasies, but the most objective reality 🤷‍♂️ Everything I wrote here about the crookedly implemented scrolling of various applications in Windows is also true, whether you like it or not. And in general, it looks like you are an ardent fan of Windows, not Mac, since you so zealously defend this garbage 🤔
With that being said, I have an Asus laptop and a custom built Desktop PC and Win11 beats MacOS by every metric when it comes to performance, smoothness, snappiness etc. There's literally no comparison.
When I switched from a modern, powerful, expensive, gaming Intel NUC Hades Canyon to a Mac mini on the M1 chip, I did not feel that macOS was inferior to Windows 10 in terms of performance. On the contrary, the Apple operating system boots noticeably faster (I do not even see a black screen with the Apple logo), plus it became possible to watch 4K videos with 60 frames per second on YouTube in Firefox and Safari, using a monitor with a 4K resolution (I have an LG 27UP650-W). That is, such heavy videos are played on my Mac mini very smoothly, without any noticeable jerks. When I connected this monitor to the Intel NUC Hades Canyon, such videos (4K60P) were noticeably jerky both in Firefox and Chrome, losing a decent number of frames (you can see it in "Stats for nerds" by right-clicking on any video on YouTube).
Is macOS the most elegant of the two? Of course it is. But when I plug it to my ultrawide screen or 4K screen and have to use a paid 3rd party app to even be able to properly scale the UI when Win11 does proper true pixel perfect scaling on any resolution, then something's very wrong.
Windows has never been able to scale the interface properly! Don't mislead people. I remember very well when I encountered this when I bought a Dell U2520D monitor with a 25-inch diagonal and a Quad HD resolution (2560 x 1440). Windows offers fractional scaling factors, which cause a lot of problems with the UI of both the system itself and various applications, including Firefox and Chrome. That is, between 100% and 200%, Windows offers me 125%, 150% and 175%. Only scaling at 200% looked more or less normal, and all fractional factors gave a lot of visual glitches both in the system itself and in third-party software. Specifically, on the Dell U2520D monitor, the original scale of 100% did not work, because everything was too small 🧐 At 200% scale, on the contrary, everything became too big 👀 Therefore, I had to use 150%, which caused a lot of problems with the interface of the system itself and various software.

Here is one of my bug reports about the problems that arise when setting fractional scaling factors in Windows: "At a fractional scale of 150%, there are problems with displaying many sites, but everything is fine in Firefox"

I am currently using a 27-inch LG 27UP650-W monitor with a 4K resolution. macOS itself automatically divides this resolution in half, setting Full HD resolution (HiDPI, of course). Everything looks just great! 👍 No need to use any third-party paid software.
 
I am currently using a 27-inch LG 27UP650-W monitor with a 4K resolution. macOS itself automatically divides this resolution in half, setting Full HD resolution (HiDPI, of course). Everything looks just great! 👍 No need to use any third-party paid software.

And don't you end up with a gigantic UI because of that?
 
No, the interface size on such a diagonal is optimal 👌 Although there is still quite small text in some places of the system and applications. That is, if the resolution were higher, it would be even more difficult to read such text 🧐
 
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