I just wished Safari on the iPP would run Google Apps like they run on the Chromebook...
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Surface is a LAPTOP & iPad Pro is a TABLET. PERIOD
- Thread starter seasurfer
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
I just wished Safari on the iPP would run Google Apps like they run on the Chromebook...
I wonder how many people use the Surface Pro without the keyboard and kickstand or in portrait orientation. My guess is hardly anyone. Just like I'll bet hardly anyone detaches the screen on the Surface Book. Both devices are used as laptops running desktop (i.e. mouse and keyboard) software.
I agree with the statement. Surface Pro is a laptop (where you have to pay extra for the keyboard), and the iPad Pro is a tablet.
However... (paraphrasing what the companies are saying)
Microsoft: "Surface Pro is the tablet that can replace your laptop."
Apple: "The iPad Pro is a replacement for a notebook or desktop for many people."
No wonder everybody is confused.
However... (paraphrasing what the companies are saying)
Microsoft: "Surface Pro is the tablet that can replace your laptop."
Apple: "The iPad Pro is a replacement for a notebook or desktop for many people."
No wonder everybody is confused.
Your multitasking requirements are....unique. I think it's fair to point out that just because you can do something doesn't necessarily mean that you will or should do something. I was hesitant about not carrying my rMBP around with me (a device superior to the SP4 in just about every area you mentioned as being important to you) because I was concerned that I would lose some of the capabilities of my full and powerful laptop. Then I realized that I didn't use it for any of the things I thought I might want when on the road' it usually just sat in my hotel room or stayed in my bag while on the move. In other words, it was extra weight I didn't need to lug around if I didn't need to play three videos simultaneously, which I...never do.
Sometimes simplification and parsing extra features is okay in the quest to enhance the user experience. What's "better" for you might be needlessly complicated for someone else.
The entire premise is flawed because it assumes that tablets and laptops have standard definitions and that there is no overlap in function/capabilities. I get it though, it needs to degenerate into a schoolyard debate like XBox vs Playstation, or Marvel vs DC.
If we were to combine our apples and oranges, we would have fruit salad. There, that settles it.
I use it that way frequently - both to browse the Internet and to take notes. I suspect that the many students who have adopted the Surface devices do the same thing when taking notes in class. It's that flexibility between user modes that has finally sold me on the Surface Pro.
Fixed it for you - "I wonder how many people use the Surface Pro without any mouse, keyboard and Surface Pen. My guess is hardly anyone would be able to live with a Surface with touch input only forever, like an iPad."
It seems that your anger is clouding you from seeing the biggest similarity between tablets and laptops and apples and oranges.
THEY ALL COST MONEY
If everything is free then sure, you grab the product that fits the single task you need to do right now. But since these all cost a whole lot of money then you slow down to consider use scenarios, list out specs, imagine real world application and then try to determine which device is worth your hard earned $1000.
This is what being a smart consumer is all about. Spending money wisely by comparing products pre and post sale. So If you are finding the purchase process of strangers to be personally infuriating then my assumption is that you aren't actually making money yet.
Assumption confirmed.
Yes. Everyone needs to stop comparing $1200 tablets with $1400 laptops and just buy both. Mom and Dad totally have more money than they need.
Last edited:
I think that is a fair assumption. Microsoft themselves avoid showcasing the Surface Pro as a standalone tablet. Every Surface Pro ad has the TypeCover prominently displayed and used. There isn't a Surface ad that doesn't have the TypeCover. A company wants their ads to show their products at their best... for the Surface Pro, that is as a notebook, not a tablet.
Why would I want to use without kickstand? I can't live without it now! It's built-in and much more stable than the smart cover on my ipad air.
Wrong. That's like saying car brand A convertible and brand B convertible aren't convertibles. Both cars fall into convertible form factor but where they differ are performance and capabilities. For tablet use which is primarily web surfing and media consumption I find the SP4 better and more capable than my Android then iPad tablets due to better multitasking, full desktop Chrome browser with plugins, ability to easily have four or more windowed Chrome browsers opened, play three if not more videos simultaneously vs one, adjustable kickstand, non-distorting front facing speakers at near to max volume, superior keyboard/trackpad/fingerprint cover, flexibility with playing media sources from not only internet streaming but also internal storage, SD card, USB flash or WIFI network storage and productivity is unmatched due to professional software availability.
SP4 multitasking three simultaneous YouTube, Twitch.tv and movie videos and virtually unlimited windowed Chrome browsers.
TouchWiz/Android multitasking a close 2nd limited to two simultaneous Twitch.tv and movie videos and two mobile Chrome browsers.
I used to love to do stuff like this. Then I realized that I can't actually watch five videos at the same time while browsing three websites and writing a paper. Seeing those screens makes me wonder how you can focus. Glad it works for you. I have found the simplicity of the iPad to be a much more enjoyable experience for me. On the occasion I need multi tasking I can do side by side and hell even throw pip to be truly ADD.
That's because you are not using the Pen to draw and write?
I do not use the kickstand when I am not in front of a desk, also whenever I write with my Pen, which is arguably the one important feature that set the Surface apart from other touch screen laptop.
Well...both Apple and Microsoft would love to play in the other's turf.
Funny thing is, they're both right. IPP can replace a laptop for many people - big processor, decent storage. And SP is a tablet that can replace your laptop (it that case, because at it's heart, it really is a laptop, perhaps more than it is a tablet!)
My point is it seems most people are using the Surface more like a laptop than a tablet. Nothing wrong with that, just an observation.
It seems to me the Microsoft is moving more towards laptop than tablet with the Surface lines. Even so I still think their marketing is a bit confused. One minute the 'enemy' is the iPad, the next it's a MacBook Air. Also if the Surface Pro can replace your laptop what's the point of the Surface Book? Some say Apple is confused but iPP and MacBook run two different operating systems. Surface Pro and Book so not. That to me seems more confusing.
More often than not especially when lying on back on sofa or bed surfing in portrait or watching a movie in landscape with it resting on my chest with type cover flipped back so the keys aren't exposed (type cover can be flipped back two ways) or removed. Something you can't comfortably do with even an ultrabook laptop since the keyboard is sticking in your throat and the kickstand is handy if you don't want to hold it for a few hours. Even for productivity without type cover it has a full on-screen keyboard option with function, control, alternate and windows keys. It's like the reverse gear on the car. You might not use it often but you sure as heck can't live without it.
The Surface Pro is the best modern and versatile form factor. I'd like to see two type cover options, one with extended battery which existed before as a ~1.1# Surface Power Cover for traveling without easy access to outlet and a second with extended battery and discrete GPU for compute processing or gaming. And, since the CPU is in the tablet and the dGPU is in the keyboard the heat is spread out instead of localized in one hot spot.
I think MS already created that device in the Surface book, so I doubt they will be upgrading the type covers. That would be too much overlap in the product lines I would imagine.
I expect that if the Book survives it's teething problems and becomes a full up line, we will eventually see better battery life in the tablet in future generations.
I don't know if this has been stated in this thread but I feel that the Surface is a laptop. That can replace a tablet. The iPad Pro is a tablet that can replace your laptop. At least for me it has. The surface pro is not great at being a tablet. With the weight , low battery life and lack of apps. The iPad Pro is a better choice for me. Because if I really need a laptop. I would buy a real laptop. Not a convertible. It's like buying a car that can be a truck. A Chevy 1500 will never be a Chevy Camaro. Buy what you like.
I think Surface is more diverse than MR posters think. Firstly--the main feature of the product is the pen so a large percentage of users will be using the Surface as a pen enabled tablet with oneNote or art apps. Also, Surface has a great touch browser and I use mine as a tablet for internet browsing quite a bit. There is just something in thing in this forum that cannot understand "hybrid"
What I have realized since having owned the surface and now the iPad pro , they both weigh in at around 1.1 kg. That is laptop territory, this is with KB attached . In some ways you might as well carry a 13 MBA, better machine than both. Don't forget the iPad Air 2 is around 440grams. A very good reason to own a tablet.
The more I think about it, the 12 retina MacBook is such a good product in terms of weight and capability. And is winning me over compared to surface/ipp
The more I think about it, the 12 retina MacBook is such a good product in terms of weight and capability. And is winning me over compared to surface/ipp
That is the orientation that makes most sense when I used it. For the surface. Hardly ever did I use it without the KB.
Though I have the opposite problem with the IPP, I like to use the pro in portrait with the KB folded behind the iPad , but due to the design of it, with 1/2 being thicker due to the KB, the left half of the Smart Cover has a big gap to the iPad pro, and it just feels wrong when I hold it. It does not sit flat like the iPad Air Smart Cover. Very annoying and very surprised apple designed it like that. So I am forced to remove my ipp keyboard cover 1/2 the time. Now I know why the surface has the kick stand.
I can post a picture if that does not make sense
Tried the Surface Book but it's not for me. Seems like the design was compromised to appease laptop people who aren't going to buy it anyway. It's like trying to get people still stuck on horse and carriage to convert to car. The clamshell laptop form factor is old and tired and hasn't changed much since my Sony VAIO from like 2001. The Lenovo Yoga hinge is better since it folds flat, it's missing the kickstand and 3 hr battery life in tablet mode is inadequate. Surface Pro will be superior with dGPU and extended battery option. If I'm going deal with the old clamshell I'd go with something like the upcoming Thinkpad P50 that's a mobile server/workstation for heavy processing and virtualization with Xeon class CPU, 64GB DRAM and dGPU.
Last edited:
MBA has a crappy display and the 12" rMB has a crappy keyboard that's almost as bad as the smart keyboard, you can't use either as a tablet without keyboard attached and Safari scrolling is laggy where even Edge browser on the entry level Surface 3 on sale for $479 with type cover is faster than Safari on the high end rMBP.
Last edited: