Swiss Watchmakers Rebuff Apple's Partnership and Hiring Advances

[macs4nw]

Do you have any evidence to back up your claim that it's a shrinking market? Any facts and figures you can link to? Because I only see it increasing more then anything, even more outrageously luxurious and expensive timepieces are launched every year it seems. And Omega and Rolex et al haven't shrunk their model ranges.

By shrinking, I was referring to watches in general and not luxury timepieces in particular. The manufacturers of those units with price tags well into the stratosphere seem to be doing very well indeed, with robust profit figures.

The Swiss watch industry specifically, has made an impressive recovery after near extinction in the late seventies, by focussing on the ultra luxury analogue segment. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quartz_crisis

 

[bmt134]

Wow. Who knew watchmakers were dumber and bigger luddites than the RIAA! I personally enjoy a nice watch but I'm an aging Gen X. Let's face it Millennials, as a generation, have no respect for watches.

Swatches were super cool when I was in HS but they are pretty much a collector's niche today. I never see anyone in their stores (unless the Apple Store in the same mall) or notice anyone wearing them (unlike people using Apple products). A little Apple magic couldn't hurt Swatch.

As for high end swiss watches, I fully understand why they wouldn't want to mar their brand w/ Apple.

Do you realize that the Swatch Group is a major conglomerate made up with numerous watch brands? You definitely have seen a watch from this group and have not realized it. Ignorance is bliss I guess.

Quartz was a fad. Smartwacthes are a fad.

 

[Nevaborn]

Another day and another company worried about an Apple product. Swatch and alike are in so much trouble as they are refusing to move on with the world. They should def of partnered with Apple or Samsung and think about long term sustainability.

I dont think Apple need to buy in any more talent but having more never hurts and it could be that one person you didnt get that thinks of the next big thing.

 

[phoenixsan]

As you would expect.....

Swiss watchmakers are no gaining anything from a partnership with Apple. But Apple indeed does.

Swiss watchs come in wide range of price and features. They have the market and the knownledge. So why enhace a competitor offer?

 

[apolloa]

By shrinking, I was referring to watches in general and not luxury timepieces in particular. The manufacturers of those units with price tags well into the stratosphere seem to be doing very well indeed, with robust profit figures.

The Swiss watch industry specifically, has made an impressive recovery after near extinction in the late seventies, by focussing on the ultra luxury analogue segment. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quartz_crisis

If you are talking normal watches in general, then I guess you mean the sub £100 ones, again I don't know if that's true. The reason for this is the seemingly endless fashion brands that have now entered the market over the last few years, and we have advertised on TV very regularly an online watch store.

Yet as many say, not as many people wear watches these day's as used to. Personally I don't see these smart watches changing anything at all, if someone doesn't wear a watch and uses their phone, they will continue to do so, I think they will be even more put off with having to recharge it every week as they will just think I'll just use my phone, I charge that all the time.

In fact I would say for these people they would be far more interested in an iPhone then any iWatch.

 

[Colpeas]

Looks like another company that will regret holding on to the past instead of embracing the future.

Well, welcome to Switzeland. They don't give damn about the rest of the world.

 

[Dontazemebro]

Swiss Watchmakers Rebuff Apple's Partnership and Hiring Advances

Even if it's not with Apple, smartwatches are the future. These watch makers are going to get left in the dust when the smartwatch takes over the game

 

[tonyy]

I own an Omega and IWC replica watches from China. They are virtually identical to the originals. I think Apple will be just fine without the overpriced pretentious Swiss employees on board.

You're joking right?

Your comparison of fake Chinese watches to genuine Swiss watches is laughable. You might as well be using an iPhone clone running Android. Same comparison as your "watch."

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Even if it's not with Apple, smartwatches are the future. These watch makers are going to get left in the dust when the smartwatch takes over the game

People said the same thing with the Quartz revolution.

As a watchmaker for a high end brand, we see and accept that there is a market for smart watches but mechanical watches will be here for a long time. And yes, even after that circuit board or battery leak destroys the entire movement - my mechanical will keep on ticking away.

 

[drlacus]

This is stupid

I was a lurker on this site for almost two years now, but this article made me register. Do you really think that something like the Swatch Group would consider to partner with an American tech company? This is an organization which includes the biggest names of all that is watchmaking. These guys were making watches for almost a century or more. This group includes for example Omega, Glashütte, Longines, and Tissot. Why would they even care. Something such as a smart watch cannot be compared with a mechanical Glashütte or an Omega. It is some cheap joke for them. Watches are here to stay and they will coexist with modern technology. A watch is not for anyone. It is a jewelry not something that is only used for checking the time. Anyone who used it only for the latter is using a smartphone now and does not wear a watch. But who thinks that someone will be using a smartwatch instead a e.g. Nomos Tangante is insane.

 

[Arran]

Wonder if Swatch Group are thinking Apple would cheapen their brand?

Or "devalue" all the watches their customers currently own.

 

[tonyy]

Wonder if IWC are thinking Apple would cheapen their brand?

Or "devalue" all the watches their customers currently own.

IWC is not part of Swatch but I can see why Apple contacted Swatch. Rolex, Patek, etc. would never consider partnering up but Swatch has lines of watches that range from $200-$10k+, mechanical and quartz.

I think Swatch has room to incorporate a smart watch in their lower end price spectrum. Lange, Patek, and the likes of those would definitely be cheapening their brand.

 

[SeanR1]

Image​

That's an awesome looking watch!!

 

[jimbobb24]

Still don't get it

First saw the iPod - I thought it was awesome. Same for iPhone and iPad.

Completely flummoxed about the purpose of a smart watch. I have an iPhone - why do I need a watch? What does it offer me.

Is there a huge demand for medical info on a constant basis. Thats not even useful information except to (as someone said) diabetics and maybe people with advanced heart failure or malignant hypertension. For the rest of us - who cares?

 

[Avatar74]

There is an odd undercurrent to these statements, although it may just be my perspective.

It doesn't come across do much as they being unwilling to partner, although I am sure that is part of it, as it does a group of people trying to huddle in and convince themselves and the rest of the world that the status quo will be maintained.

That's not so much the issue. iWatches, or any other technology, are not going to threaten the market for Swiss chronometers that range anywhere from $2500 for an Omega to $670,000 for the Patek Phiippe Grande Complication and upwards of there for estate pieces.

About twenty years ago, there was an interview in the Harvard Business Review with Swatch magnate Nicholas Hayek. He was the guy who turned around Omega, a subsidiary, which at one point had ballooned to dozens of different models ranging in price from $200 to $20,000. It diluted their brand in the sense that nobody really had one concise image of what Omega stood for.

Take out all the dynamics of classism and what have you, and you can see that Steve Jobs probably studied that very case closely when he came back to Apple and in 97 told at least 90 percent of the project managers in a single 30 minute meeting that he was killing almost every project and reducing Apple to three models of desktop, three models of laptop... and the rest is history. Apple came back from within 90 days of bankruptcy because of Jobs' acute grasp of the importance of clear, concise branding.

Again, 100 years from now there'll still be a market for Swiss Chronometers which are less accurate than the cheapest electronic quartz movements today... it's a completely different animal. This is not what people like Hayek are worried about. What they're worried about is diluting their core brand in the same way that Apple will never want to be the Radio Shack of consumer electronics... nor do they want to be Loewe.

Granted, Swatch Group has other lines that resolve the branding problem but I think they realize that their durable competitive advantage is in sticking to the chronometer market and not getting into the world of smart watches which are a completely different paradigm from the realm of the analog timepiece which is more of a jewelry market than a mobile computing platform market.

 

[kdarling]

But who thinks that someone will be using a smartwatch instead a e.g. Nomos Tangante is insane.

Sure, they wouldn't be using a cheap smartwatch in place of such a nice wristwatch.

However, I would think that there is a market for those who want _both_ a luxury timepiece and some smartwatch capabilities.

E.g. if the dial face itself was a display that could subtly show who was calling. Or even something on the watch band.

Although I assume these combinations have been tried before? (Probably years ago with a tiny rectangular LCD display at the bottom of the face. Ugh. I mean something much more modern.)

 

[Dontazemebro]

I was a lurker on this site for almost two years now, but this article made me register. Do you really think that something like the Swatch Group would consider to partner with an American tech company? This is an organization which includes the biggest names of all that is watchmaking. These guys were making watches for almost a century or more. This group includes for example Omega, Glashütte, Longines, and Tissot. Why would they even care. Something such as a smart watch cannot be compared with a mechanical Glashütte or an Omega. It is some cheap joke for them. Watches are here to stay and they will coexist with modern technology. A watch is not for anyone. It is a jewelry not something that is only used for checking the time. Anyone who used it only for the latter is using a smartphone now and does not wear a watch. But who thinks that someone will be using a smartwatch instead a e.g. Nomos Tangante is insane.

Image​

That watch is fugly. I would never wear that.

 

[fortysomegeek]

A few comments:
Baselworld is happening this week. Hence, this is why any of this news is getting any play.
Swatch is a huge conglomerate of brands from low (Tissot) to Medium (Omega) to ultra high-end (Breguet/Blancpain).
More importantly, Swatch owns most of all the vertical manufacturing that goes into every watch - case making, movemement manufacture (ETA/Valjoux), the screws, parts, hands, etc. Even the little buckles on the straps are made by some company owned by SWATCH.

Other conglomerate LMVH who competes w/ Swatch even uses or employs SWATCH parts (e.g. ETA movements). Even the indepedent like Patek or Lange employ or buy parts from Swatch like a hair-spring or even rotor hands.
You simply can't get pass Swatch. They're like the Delco ro Bosh of automotive part equivalent.

The only company that is trying to be wholly 100% independent is Rolex as they have their own movements, case manufacturing, even buying up 3rd party screw and companies that make/design/patent their own oil lubrication.


Apple knows SWATCH has some key competencies they don't have in-house. Specifically, not related to design but in terms of manufacturing.
The Swiss have expertise in metallurgy, sapphire crystals, etc. The Swiss knows the difference between 316L and 904L grade steel. The difference may be in fact determining factor whether an end-user will develop an allergic rash to wearing a high watch or not. The whole "uni-body" construction of the Macbook laptops pale in comparison to some of the uni-body case construction of some watch makers; casting entire cases out of single block of steel that can witsthand 1G shocks and depth ratings of 4400 feet.

The high end Swiss brands have nothing to fear from the iWatch/Smart watch group. High end buyers like myself buy for emotional, irrational reasons, and look for long-term investment and heirloom qualities.

A smartwatch or electronic piece of wearable won't make up for it. a Watch made in 2014 would look as archaic as a Casio calculator watch in 2044.
On the other hand, a Swiss watch design endures decades of continuity and lineage.A Submariner from 1954, a Speedmaster from 1957 still look modern and timeless 50-60 years later.
The same can't be said for electronic/computing devices.

When I drop 5 grand on a watch, I expect to get some use from it - Longevity, potential increase re-sale, lineage, and a little exclusivity.

The two markets are completely non-competing with each other.
The $200-$700 (smart watch/ quartz watch) do not overlap with the $2,000 to $2 million dollar group.

A Porsche GT3 buyer will not cross-shop a VW Golf. They may have a VW as a weekend beater but it won't replace the Porsche.

 

[rhett7660]

https://www.google.ca/search?q=apple+copies+swiss+clock

I am aware of that... However for this instance, I feel this is more about the talent.

Swatch's advancements in ergonomic design, longevity and battery life

 

[IbisDoc]

A few comments:
Baselworld is happening this week. Hence, this is why any of this news is getting any play.
Swatch is a huge conglomerate of brands from low (Tissot) to Medium (Omega) to ultra high-end (Breguet/Blancpain).
More importantly, Swatch owns most of all the vertical manufacturing that goes into every watch - case making, movemement manufacture (ETA/Valjoux), the screws, parts, hands, etc. Even the little buckles on the straps are made by some company owned by SWATCH.

Other conglomerate LMVH who competes w/ Swatch even uses or employs SWATCH parts (e.g. ETA movements). Even the indepedent like Patek or Lange employ or buy parts from Swatch like a hair-spring or even rotor hands.
You simply can't get pass Swatch. They're like the Delco ro Bosh of automotive part equivalent.

The only company that is trying to be wholly 100% independent is Rolex as they have their own movements, case manufacturing, even buying up 3rd party screw and companies that make/design/patent their own oil lubrication.


Apple knows SWATCH has some key competencies they don't have in-house. Specifically, not related to design but in terms of manufacturing.
The Swiss have expertise in metallurgy, sapphire crystals, etc. The Swiss knows the difference between 316L and 904L grade steel. The difference may be in fact determining factor whether an end-user will develop an allergic rash to wearing a high watch or not. The whole "uni-body" construction of the Macbook laptops pale in comparison to some of the uni-body case construction of some watch makers; casting entire cases out of single block of steel that can witsthand 1G shocks and depth ratings of 4400 feet.

The high end Swiss brands have nothing to fear from the iWatch/Smart watch group. High end buyers like myself buy for emotional, irrational reasons, and look for long-term investment and heirloom qualities.

A smartwatch or electronic piece of wearable won't make up for it. a Watch made in 2014 would look as archaic as a Casio calculator watch in 2044.
On the other hand, a Swiss watch design endures decades of continuity and lineage.A Submariner from 1954, a Speedmaster from 1957 still look modern and timeless 50-60 years later.
The same can't be said for electronic/computing devices.

When I drop 5 grand on a watch, I expect to get some use from it - Longevity, potential increase re-sale, lineage, and a little exclusivity.

The two markets are completely non-competing with each other.
The $200-$700 (smart watch/ quartz watch) do not overlap with the $2,000 to $2 million dollar group.

A Porsche GT3 buyer will not cross-shop a VW Golf. They may have a VW as a weekend beater but it won't replace the Porsche.

That's the big issue that people seem to be missing. The number of people wearing wristwatches in this group is decreasing. As mentioned multiple times in this thread, those people just use their phones to check time. Unlike the cellphone (which everyone wants to use as a comparison of how Apple is going to dominate), Apple will need to create a market that just isn't there anymore.

As for the high-end watch wearers, LOL at the idea that they will be slumming with an iWatch.

 

[Arran]

As for the high-end watch wearers, LOL at the idea that they will be slumming with an iWatch.

Maybe they'll wear it round their ankle - out of sight

They'll still benefit from the biometrics and stuff - just nobody will know. Seriously, I quite like the idea of the thing being invisible.

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That's an awesome looking watch!!

Yes it is.

 

[GoodWatch]

That watch is fugly. I would never wear that.

Great argument

 

[Dontazemebro]

Great argument

Too plain jane for my taste, if I'm going all in on an expensive time piece, it definitely won't be some grandpa Eddy looking watch.

 

[sixrom]

Do you realize that the Swatch Group is a major conglomerate made up with numerous watch brands? You definitely have seen a watch from this group and have not realized it. Ignorance is bliss I guess.

Quartz was a fad. Smartwacthes are a fad.

Excellent post, you've summed it up very nicely!

 

[GoodWatch]

Too plain jane for my taste, if I'm going all in on an expensive time piece, it definitely won't be some grandpa Eddy looking watch.

Is is not expensive but mid-range and plain Jane can be beautiful:

 

[Dontazemebro]

Is is not expensive but mid-range and plain Jane can be beautiful:

Image

Yeah that's a little better