Target Begins Apple Pay Rollout at Select Locations

Discussion in 'MacRumors.com News Discussion' started by MacRumors, Feb 4, 2019.

  1. Rigby macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2008
    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    #51
    True, but Target has no doubt negotiated a discounted card processing fee with the issuer of their store card, so the Apple fee will probably hurt them more than with regular cards.
    The token (virtual card number or DAN) is actually not a one-time number but stays constant (you can see the last 4 digits in the Wallet app). Only the additional security code changes for every transaction. This means Apple Pay transactions can actually be tracked and tied to a card across transactions. What's missing is the mapping of the card to a person (Apple Pay does not transmit the name or other identifying information to the merchant terminal like physical cards do). But given that Target closely cooperates with the bank that issues their store cards, I'm sure the bank will be happy to map the DAN to a customer ID for Target. So no, using the Red Card in Apple Pay will not improve customer privacy.
     
  2. lkrupp macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2004
    #52
    You say this but do you know that enabling NFC in the hardware that already exist increases cost to the merchant. I have a dear friend that ran an independent pharmacy. He told me that to turn on NFC would cost him an additional 2% in processing fees.
     
  3. ecschwarz macrumors 65816

    ecschwarz

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2010
    #53
    Home Depot ran into some issues with some Mastercards on Apple Pay and rather than fix the issue, turned it off (I suspect it was the magstripe emulation/EMV contactless thing). At the one near me, contactless cards don't work either, so I suspect they've disabled NFC entirely (same with Walmart).
     
  4. dontwalkhand macrumors 601

    dontwalkhand

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2007
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    #54
    It’s everywhere that takes Contactless payments. It’s these large stores that resisted it so long that there’s announcements like this.
     
  5. nsayer macrumors 6502a

    nsayer

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2003
    Location:
    Silicon Valley
    #55
    Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see how "___ is rolling out Apple Pay" is the correct headline. I always understood that all a merchant had to do was support NFC and Apple Pay would Just Work(tm).
    --- Post Merged, Feb 4, 2019 ---
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/kashmi...-pregnant-before-her-father-did/#38bddca16668
     
  6. ksec macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2015
    #56
    1. Where did I said Merchants paying, In the reply I was quoting and referring to Red Card, which is the Target Branded Credit Card. The Card Issuers will likely pass on any cost to Target, The 10 base point is actually 0.1%. Not 0.015%.

    2. The merchants get no data from Apple Pay, but the card issuers do.
     
  7. tmiw macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2007
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    #57
    In a country where Apple Pay was effectively the first contactless product most people have had experience with, I'd say so.
     
  8. mattster16 macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2004
    #58
    For the non credit card red card it is actually just linked to your checking account. Using the card simply authorizes an e-check transaction. I don't know how this all works, but it is possible the processing fee is extremely small or non-existent for this type of transaction.
     
  9. cub850G2 macrumors regular

    cub850G2

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2014
    Location:
    NE
    #59
    Well that picture is the final screen and many Targets currently as of two days ago show only the dots at the top and those dots will most likely go away once they roll out that updated theme to all stores.
     
  10. BuffaloTF macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2008
    #60
    We have the most credit card fraud because we have the most credit card usage in the world. Which is why Windows has the most computer fraud in the world. It has literally zero to do with a lack of security.

    And I don't know where you get your rant on SWIFT. As is the case the world over, regional banks don't have a presence. Domestic National Banks do. And international banks are on the board. So yeah, a small bank holds an account at a larger bank -- that's what an intermediary is -- and the payment goes through them on-behalf-of the beneficiary. And it works that way worldwide. Oh, and Chinese banks don't have a SWIFT presence whatsoever because all RMB payments require simplified Mandarin to be used so they have their own system (only international banks that are present in China on SWIFT are the ones that trade in USD, EUR, GBP, HKD, etc)... and SWIFT only supports "Latin" characters of A-Z (upper and lower case), 0-9 and / - ? : ( ) . , ' + .......

    SWIFT is losing its hold, and SWIFT MT messages are being replaced by ISO 20022 files and APIs, so they've become merely a delivery channel with FileAct.
     
  11. MisterSavage macrumors 6502

    MisterSavage

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2018
    #61
    It was only last year that we finally got the official announcement that signatures aren't required for credit card purchases at stores in the US (although I still go to plenty of places that ask for it). What a completely useless exercise writing my "signature" on a receipt was. The only restaurant I've been to recently that I can think of where I could digitally specify the tip amount was Chili's.
     
  12. parseckadet macrumors 65816

    parseckadet

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2010
    Location:
    Denver, CO
    #62
    I go to the same PetCo every two or three weeks and use ApplePay every time. I've been doing this for two years at this particular location, and yet every time the clerk is shocked and amazed. Even when it's the same clerk I've done this with before.
    Someone else linked this article already, but several years ago Target effectively outed a teenage girl as being pregnant to her parents. Through tracking her purchases they determined that she was pregnant and started sending her coupons for all kinds of baby stuff, like diapers.
    Every time one of these stories pops up all the Canadians and Europeans pop out of the woodwork acting amazed at the situation in the US. It's getting kind of old. These stories have been popping up multiple times a year since ApplePay was first introduced. We get it. Your system is better than ours. I doubt that when you guys first got tap to pay that it rolled out over night. Please stop acting amazed that it's not happening over night here.
    Don't get me started on Lowe's. At least the ones here have stickers on them saying to use chip for credit, and to swipe for debit. My card has both credit and debit, so I always have to do this dance where I insert, then it tells me to swipe, then it tells me to insert before it will finally work. And if I swipe it makes me go through the same stupid dance. I don't get why this is such and issue for them when every other retailer in the country has at least been able to implement chip & pin for debit cards (credit cards are still a different story).
     
  13. nsayer macrumors 6502a

    nsayer

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2003
    Location:
    Silicon Valley
    #63
    The signature on the receipt was never intended as a security thing. Originally (and still in some cases) the wording right above the line is "I agree to pay the above amount in accordance with my cardholder agreement" - in other words, the signature is you agreeing to pay, much like the signature on a check.

    All they've done now is rewrite the agreements so that your agreement is *implied* but subject to the same dispute resolution that's been there for yeas.
     
  14. dontwalkhand macrumors 601

    dontwalkhand

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2007
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    #64
    I am in the US, rarely if ever swipe a card. Don’t know where you’re from.
     
  15. nsayer macrumors 6502a

    nsayer

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2003
    Location:
    Silicon Valley
    #65
    "You're right that the sky is blue, but did you realize that looking at the sun directly can cause blindness?"
     
  16. trip1ex macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2008
    #66
    not going to pay ~5% extra to use Apple Pay at Target.
     
  17. dontwalkhand macrumors 601

    dontwalkhand

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2007
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    #67
    Who is he processing through? This sounds completely false as a person who has installed many of these things for people.
     
  18. trip1ex macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2008
    #68
    You need to get out of your basement once in awhile lol.
     
  19. rugmankc macrumors 68000

    rugmankc

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2014
    #69
    I must be getting really old. The only turn of the century that even registered with me was from the 1800's to 1900's. :)
     
  20. mwd25 macrumors regular

    mwd25

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2012
    Location:
    Tempe
    #70
    Well, I live in Tempe and I am constantly going into stores where the chip reader is "broke" and Im required to swipe. In fact, since you live in Phoenix, you need only go to McKellips and Hayden, walk in and buy something. I use Apple pay at that location........and they still make me sign receipt!!!!!! I want to say, "you know, this is the whole point of Apple Pay, not sure who trained you but a signature isnt even required anymore with a credit card. Let alone Apple Pay."
    QT is like one of the only places that you have a nice clean transaction with clerks that know how to use it. Walgreens as well. Now, if we can get Frys to accept it and build it into their new scan and go system I will be all set. Its sad, Im constantly ending up behind people in self checkout that are standing at the terminal, staring at it forever, with a stupid confused look on their face. Please people.....if you dont know WTF your doing, stay out of self checkout!!!!!
    Thats a whole other issue.
     
  21. notabadname macrumors 65816

    notabadname

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2010
    Location:
    Detroit Suburbs
    #71
    Great. I love when I don’t have to take my card out of my wallet, regardless of the mobile tech that permits it. But I do have a higher degree of trust for Apple’s implementation.
     
  22. MadeTheSwitch macrumors 6502a

    MadeTheSwitch

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2009
    #72
    That is so true. Companies do not train their employees properly, or at all on this issue. I go to a yogurt shop called yogurtland who has their own app that you can load money on and then their scannerrs scan a barcode displayed on your phone. They do this for loyalty rewards too. The employees understand this for the royalty rewards, but are absolutely perplexed that you can pay that way too. Possibly because it stupidly takes a second scan rather then show them a balance available on their side of the register, but still, train your employees! Especially when it is your own app not a third party solution! Geez!

    Since all of that they have got on board and added their card to Wallet, which the employees seem to understand a bit better but I will need more research data (i.e. yogurt) to confirm. I should try with my watch next time. That will REALLY blow their minds and confuse them...lol. :)

    Strangely during Black Friday I was able to purchase THOUSANDS of dollars of appliances at JCPenny with no pin or signature. I guess they had my signature on the delivery agreement though it felt odd walking out of there having spent so much with so little verification.
     
  23. Small White Car macrumors G4

    Small White Car

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2006
    Location:
    Washington DC
    #73
    I honest-to-god haven't used Apple Pay in almost 2 years (except for vending machines) because I got sick of having to have a conversation about it with the clerk every single time.

    I keep expecting it to get better (I only started using my phone for airplane tickets once I saw roughly 1/4 of other passengers doing it) but I've yet to see a single person use ANY kind of NFC payment in front of me in those entire 2 years.
     
  24. EricLA2NYC macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2011
    #74
    Was in Target on Friday here in LA and thought I’d try Apple Pay, even though there was no Apple Pay sticker on their device. It worked fine. That leaves really only the Ralph’s (aka Kroger) grocery chain as the last holdout of the most frequent stores I shop at. I can use Apple Pay at Petco for my dog supplies, but not for groceries at Ralph’s. I’ve emailed feedback to them that they need to catch up with the times.
     
  25. Switched2aMac macrumors member

    Switched2aMac

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2006
    Location:
    Somewhere in Wisconsin
    #75
    Since all of that they have got on board and added their card to Wallet, which the employees seem to understand a bit better but I will need more research data (i.e. yogurt) to confirm. I should try with my watch next time. That will REALLY blow their minds and confuse them...lol. :)

    I used watch the other day and they were amazed. It was kinda funny. I usually get the response, "That's so cool."
    --- Post Merged, Feb 4, 2019 ---
    I used my watch the other day and the cashier was amazed, "That's so cool." Kinda funny.
     

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