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The 2013-2014 Football Thread
- Thread starter Jaffa Cake
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Meanwhile, Norwich are frustrating Man City while Chelsea make quick work of Newcastle. Will Mourinho end up cruising majestically to the title? 
EDIT: Well done to Hull City. They benefitted from the early red card to Brown but they put their heads down, each new striker scored and job done.
Man City are held to a draw by Norwich. Big shuffle in the top three today.
EDIT: Well done to Hull City. They benefitted from the early red card to Brown but they put their heads down, each new striker scored and job done.
Man City are held to a draw by Norwich. Big shuffle in the top three today.
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If Mourinho wins the title then I'll lose all hope for the EPL and start watching lower league football. He's the ABSOLUTE LAST person I'd want to lift the trophy.
I'd have also lost all hope for Arsenal. It's looking like another flatter-to-deceive season for them. If they fail to win on Wed, then we know the capitulation has well and truly started.
I'd have also lost all hope for Arsenal. It's looking like another flatter-to-deceive season for them. If they fail to win on Wed, then we know the capitulation has well and truly started.
Well deserved victory for Sheffield Wednesday today, done the double over us now with an aggregate score of 7-2
Was quite a feisty match though - Pearce definitely deserved the red card, though the tackle wasn't dangerous, just stupid - but I have to say Wednesday seemed to enjoy limping and clutching their arms/face/legs for an extended period of time before sprinting back on afterwards...
Was quite a feisty match though - Pearce definitely deserved the red card, though the tackle wasn't dangerous, just stupid - but I have to say Wednesday seemed to enjoy limping and clutching their arms/face/legs for an extended period of time before sprinting back on afterwards...
The Massive Sheffield Wednesday win !
2013/2014: SWFC 7 - 2 reading FC
Dumbarton FC win! Our Scottish Cup run continues...
On a lesser note, EPL contenders HULL CITYAFC win also!
2013/2014: SWFC 7 - 2 reading FC
Dumbarton FC win! Our Scottish Cup run continues...
On a lesser note, EPL contenders HULL CITYAFC win also!
Worth noting that I had a Pound or two on Long as first goalscorer this afternoon.
Ker and, might I add, ching.
Ker and, might I add, ching.
Worth noting that I had a Pound or two on Long as first goalscorer this afternoon.
Ker and, might I add, ching.
Glad to see he's doing well at Hull.
My friend's dad met his cousin at some school talk he was doing the other day. Apparently, she's named Chaney Long...
Yes, but not hard for Bayern given how Frankfurt played the whole season. One could also say it is because Veh did not bring two of his standard players. (Actually good tactics: we can't win against Bayeern anyway, so I save my two yellow-card players for the Braunschweig match, where it is much more likely to get some points).
On the other hand Bayern has proved to do have problems with underdogs or much worse teams.
(Just like Dortmund had with Braunschweig lately, though one can count that under the not enough depth theme).
Bad loss for Everton against their closest opposition. It was a tight match though. But Everton seem to be slipping a bit.
I am of two minds on this. On the one hand, I completely understand the notion of sending out a B squad against Bayern, both as a way to rest key players for more important matches and as a protest against their absolute dominance of the Bundesliga. It would be satisfying to watch Bayern's title made meaningless as teams simply let them rack up huge scores against reserve squads.
But on the other hand, I feel that a manager should always want to go out and win matches, regardless of the odds. Teams should go out and show that Bayern can be beaten, even if it's a rare occurrence.
I am of two minds on this. On the one hand, I completely understand the notion of sending out a B squad against Bayern, both as a way to rest key players for more important matches and as a protest against their absolute dominance of the Bundesliga. It would be satisfying to watch Bayern's title made meaningless as teams simply let them rack up huge scores against reserve squads.
But on the other hand, I feel that a manager should always want to go out and win matches, regardless of the odds. Teams should go out and show that Bayern can be beaten, even if it's a rare occurrence.
First off congrats to both his Lordship and Mr Cake.
Im old enough to remember back in the late 70s and early 80s when Liverpools win would not have seemed out of place. Hull seem to be making a real impression on the mid table.
Football took a back seat here in the Netherlands as our skaters won gold at the Olympics. 4,500,000, viewers watched, not bad for a population of 16,000,000
Football from the Eredivisie.
Feyenoord destroyed NEC to move into third place.
PEC held Ajax to a draw, Ajax were te better footballing team but PEC used what chances they had far better.
PSV won a thriller against Twente, and are now fifth. This win was very important, as a loss and they would have been 14 pts behind.
Ajax 48pts
Twente 43pts
Feyenoord 43pts
Vitesse 43pts
PSV 35pts
Im old enough to remember back in the late 70s and early 80s when Liverpools win would not have seemed out of place. Hull seem to be making a real impression on the mid table.
Football took a back seat here in the Netherlands as our skaters won gold at the Olympics. 4,500,000, viewers watched, not bad for a population of 16,000,000
Football from the Eredivisie.
Feyenoord destroyed NEC to move into third place.
PEC held Ajax to a draw, Ajax were te better footballing team but PEC used what chances they had far better.
PSV won a thriller against Twente, and are now fifth. This win was very important, as a loss and they would have been 14 pts behind.
Ajax 48pts
Twente 43pts
Feyenoord 43pts
Vitesse 43pts
PSV 35pts
Fulham are awful. Just awful. They played almost the entire match against Man Utd within 20 yards of their own goal. However, contrary to recent weeks's performances Fulham worked really hard the entire match and were rewarded with a last-gasp equalizer.
They barely had two chances the whole match and scored both of them. Scenes.
The thing about this season is that Fulham may still be safe. Lots of points left to play for and a couple wins could see them jump to 17th. Still, they are going to need a bit of luck to stay up. Moyes, for his part, is in a bit of a pickle. 9 points from fourth is a biggish gap - though there are still a lot of points left to play for. Nobody is secure at the moment.
United had 75% possession and made 81 crosses.
They barely had two chances the whole match and scored both of them. Scenes.
The thing about this season is that Fulham may still be safe. Lots of points left to play for and a couple wins could see them jump to 17th. Still, they are going to need a bit of luck to stay up. Moyes, for his part, is in a bit of a pickle. 9 points from fourth is a biggish gap - though there are still a lot of points left to play for. Nobody is secure at the moment.
United had 75% possession and made 81 crosses.
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I guess the same can be said for ManUtd. 81 crosses, but only 18 of them find United players. Fulham should have scored twice in the first half, but Richardson couldn't get his shot on net. Great point for Fulham.
Still searching for rock bottom. Surely there is more to come from Moyes until the board puts him out of our misery. The squad has serious problems, but any competent manager should have them in fourth, or close to it. This stone age football with 80+ crosses fruitlessly lumped in the mixer, it's painful to watch.
I'm actually hoping Arsenal dismantle us midweek so there's no choice but to fire him.
I'm actually hoping Arsenal dismantle us midweek so there's no choice but to fire him.
Crossing hell. Insanity. So, Wednesday, Improved Arsenal v Tribute to sht Arsenal in the form of Manchester United; just replace going through the 'D' with crossing. Kagawa, Mata, Januzaj, Rooney, and RVP in the squad; just lump the ball in lads, don't try mixing it up. How long was it before they even tried a low cross?
Changed my mind; if within the next 5 games Moyes doesn't show he has learnt from Crossapalooza, get rid.
At least the Winter Olympics is on.
Cheers,
OW
t Arsenal in the form of Manchester United; just replace going through the 'D' with crossing. Kagawa, Mata, Januzaj, Rooney, and RVP in the squad; just lump the ball in lads, don't try mixing it up. How long was it before they even tried a low cross?Changed my mind; if within the next 5 games Moyes doesn't show he has learnt from Crossapalooza, get rid.
At least the Winter Olympics is on.
Cheers,
OW
It would be public about-face for the club suits to fire him and a slap in Fergie's face for his chosen successor to be gotten rid of so quickly.
I thought Liverpool sacked Roy Hodgson too fast, and probably held on to Dalglish too long. In retrospect though, I don't see either one getting us to where we are now. Most of their signings are gone now as well, with a couple notable exceptions.
If Liverpool's recent history is any guide, it may take 2-3 seasons to rebuild the squad if Moyes is replaced with a superior manager. The big worry has to be the ownership though - will the Glazers be willing to spend big to rebuild the squad? If not, will they accept a drop in status? Will they sell? They've already missed their chance to cash in for maximum profit. They should have sold before Ferg retired.
i watched those guys win.
i hate the olympics but got a kick out of watching them dominate...
Twitter hasn't disappointed in its reaction to today's match
Man Utd's tactics board today...
...and match summary
I actually don't really think Moyes is the main problem. The players are, they don't seem to have recovered from SAF's exit, nor have they wrapped their heads around the idea of Moyes as the new boss. They seem reluctant to readjust to that new reality.
If you have Mata, RVP, Rooney, and later on, Januzaj in the team and you still draw against the bottom club then the players have to look at themselves. Although Moyes isn't helping with his insistence on 4-4-2 and playing Young and Cleverly. Should play 4-2-3-1. Fletcher/Carrick in front of the back 4, and Januzaj/Mata/Rooney interchanging in front of them with RVP up front. Fabio/Evra provide the width. But what do i know...
Its increasingly looking unlikely for 4th now especially with Liverpool and Spurs finding form. Plus United still have to play some of the 'big boys'...away.
Many clubs have gone/are going through transitions. United just happen to be one of the latest clubs.
That said, full credit to Meulensteen for willing to try something new and bold today. Got his reward and could've walked away with all 3 pts with some better finishing.
Man Utd's tactics board today...
...and match summary
I actually don't really think Moyes is the main problem. The players are, they don't seem to have recovered from SAF's exit, nor have they wrapped their heads around the idea of Moyes as the new boss. They seem reluctant to readjust to that new reality.
If you have Mata, RVP, Rooney, and later on, Januzaj in the team and you still draw against the bottom club then the players have to look at themselves. Although Moyes isn't helping with his insistence on 4-4-2 and playing Young and Cleverly. Should play 4-2-3-1. Fletcher/Carrick in front of the back 4, and Januzaj/Mata/Rooney interchanging in front of them with RVP up front. Fabio/Evra provide the width. But what do i know...
Its increasingly looking unlikely for 4th now especially with Liverpool and Spurs finding form. Plus United still have to play some of the 'big boys'...away.
Many clubs have gone/are going through transitions. United just happen to be one of the latest clubs.
That said, full credit to Meulensteen for willing to try something new and bold today. Got his reward and could've walked away with all 3 pts with some better finishing.
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In some players' eyes it may be impossible to truly respect and play for a manager who isn't Ferguson. If so, those players need to have their attitude adjusted or be moved on.
Think it is a mix:
Too many players putting in below par performances/switching off, years of failing to sort the midfield exacerbated by injuries, unsettled defence caused by age, injury, and playing a centre back in midfield, then there is Moyes; hopefully he shows he has learnt from yesterday - if it isn't working, it isn't working, no amount of history will change that. Also worrying no one in his coaching team had a word.
Other news; Yaya gets away with another of his regular 'kick the opponent after the tackle', and the Netherlands continues to do well in the speed skating - 1,2,3 in the Men's 500m.
Cheers,
OW
Too many players putting in below par performances/switching off, years of failing to sort the midfield exacerbated by injuries, unsettled defence caused by age, injury, and playing a centre back in midfield, then there is Moyes; hopefully he shows he has learnt from yesterday - if it isn't working, it isn't working, no amount of history will change that. Also worrying no one in his coaching team had a word.
Other news; Yaya gets away with another of his regular 'kick the opponent after the tackle', and the Netherlands continues to do well in the speed skating - 1,2,3 in the Men's 500m.
Cheers,
OW
Didn't it take Fergie about 3 season to start to become Fergie...?
p.s. that would be awesome to have them suck for three seasons straight.
p.s. that would be awesome to have them suck for three seasons straight.
Agreed the club squad isn't the strongest it could be, it hasn't been since CR7 left. But it doesn't mean they're all of a sudden a 7th place team. There are other clubs that have chased top 4 with less accomplished players.
I do agree that they left it too late to plug that gaping hole in midfield because Fergie was still peppering the cracks for them. Then there's the summer fiasco and Eddy's gung ho attitude about transfers didn't help either.
But at the end of the day, players have been woeful, and whats more surprising is that this hasn't been a chronic deterioration, its been acute. And for that, they have to take the blame. They're professionals who should be able to adapt to differing conditions. Chelsea have changed managers like toilet paper but they've only missed out on the top 4 once, and they compensated for that by winning the mother of all trophies.
Fergie struggled initially, but he didn't have Mata, Rooney, RVP, Januzaj, plus a remnant squad that has won a big chunk of trophies over the years.
The solution is simple really. Either Moyes leaves, or there's a massive clear-out of those who are still in Fergie limbo in summer. And we all know which one will happen since even the Captain has led by example on that front.
Problem is, without UCL football (and Fergie) on offer, they will struggle to attract top talent. In other words, they'll have to rebuild from scratch like LFC and the rest have done.
I do agree that they left it too late to plug that gaping hole in midfield because Fergie was still peppering the cracks for them. Then there's the summer fiasco and Eddy's gung ho attitude about transfers didn't help either.
But at the end of the day, players have been woeful, and whats more surprising is that this hasn't been a chronic deterioration, its been acute. And for that, they have to take the blame. They're professionals who should be able to adapt to differing conditions. Chelsea have changed managers like toilet paper but they've only missed out on the top 4 once, and they compensated for that by winning the mother of all trophies.
Fergie struggled initially, but he didn't have Mata, Rooney, RVP, Januzaj, plus a remnant squad that has won a big chunk of trophies over the years.
The solution is simple really. Either Moyes leaves, or there's a massive clear-out of those who are still in Fergie limbo in summer. And we all know which one will happen since even the Captain has led by example on that front.
Problem is, without UCL football (and Fergie) on offer, they will struggle to attract top talent. In other words, they'll have to rebuild from scratch like LFC and the rest have done.
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One difference - They are still owned by the Glazers. Liverpool had to live through the Hicks & Gillette era before FSG showed up, so we really suffered through three rebuildings, the first two being false dawns. I wonder whether the Glazers are prepared for a rebuilding project.
Moyes came onboard into a no-win scenario. Unfortunately for him, club owners are less patient than they were when Ferguson began his Man Utd career.
You need at least one working system, Chelsea and the other clubs had that. Criticism of the crossing isn't new, dissatisfaction with the style has been growing all season; Sunday was the last straw.
Robson, Moses, McGrath, Whiteside, Strachan, and Stapleton weren't too shabby. They were a good cup team under Atkinson but didn't have the staying power for the League title - still a top four side. Ferguson got rid of the drinking and gambling culture and added the belief plus the quality in all positions; Mourinho did the same at Chelsea - a cup team finishing in a high league position when he arrived.
A start is for Moyes to cut out the reliance on crossing. When Kagawa and RVP joined they linked up well, offering an alternative to playing from wide. The available front line can interchange and has the quality required in tight spaces. Moyes needs to get the movement going. Crossing is still part of the mix, otherwise you become Rubbish Arsenal and opponents just defend the 'D'. Unless you can put in a pinpoint cross every time, you need to stack the numbers in your favour; Manchester United aren't doing that. Both high and low crosses are required, not just high - a low cross into a packed box can cause chaos. Also when crossing, they need someone attacking the 'D' to penalty spot - Robson, Scholes, Lampard etc. All this and the concentration issue is down to Moyes and his coaching staff working with the players.
One season without Champions League football is doable. If necessary, the transfer targets are offered monetary compensation for the year and buyout clauses relating to qualification at the end of their first season. I think the owners spending above average for two years isn't out.
If Moyes doesn't learn - within a reasonable time, he has to go.
Cheers,
OW
I think Moyes' challenge is to find a way to play Rooney, Kagawa, Mata and RVP effectively in the same side - or at least three of those four on a consistent basis. Kagawa may be a lost cause since Moyes won't play him.
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