He's probably underrated because Liverpool are not very good right now. But from what I've seen he is an excellent player, as long as Rogers plays him in his favored position.
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The 2015-2016 Football Thread
- Thread starter Lord Blackadder
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He's probably underrated because Liverpool are not very good right now. But from what I've seen he is an excellent player, as long as Rogers plays him in his favored position.
The Germans made pretty heavy work of it but were the better team and got the job done.
It will be interesting to see which of Scotland or Republic of Ireland will snag the third spot in Group D. Ireland look to have the advantage despite losing to Scotland - Scotland's loss to Georgia could be the decider.
It will be interesting to see which of Scotland or Republic of Ireland will snag the third spot in Group D. Ireland look to have the advantage despite losing to Scotland - Scotland's loss to Georgia could be the decider.
Population of Gibraltar: 30,001 (2012)
Official capacity of National Stadium, Warsaw: 58,145
Official capacity of National Stadium, Warsaw: 58,145
revenche is a dish best served cold
sweden just got finished off 1-4 by Austria... sweet,sweet payback for the last qualification where we lost the deciding game there
now this result could mean that they stay at home
Austria is already qualified now (the first time since 1998!!) and will finished in the first place... as an Austrian this is one for the history books. Can't wait for the tournament.
sweden just got finished off 1-4 by Austria... sweet,sweet payback for the last qualification where we lost the deciding game there
now this result could mean that they stay at home
Austria is already qualified now (the first time since 1998!!) and will finished in the first place... as an Austrian this is one for the history books. Can't wait for the tournament.
Christ on a bike, Brazil made USA look like a pub team. People might say "yeah, but it's Brazil..." but USA played terribly tonight. Aside from Danny Williams' goal, nothing positive and we have a big match against Mexico in a month.
Incidentally, some people are saying that Brazil under Dunga are a major threat once again. I'm not convinced. Given all the talent Brazil have at their disposal, anything less than victory in tournaments is failure. And so far all Dunga has managed to do is fail to win a tournament.
USA were too poor to put them under pressure but even tonight on a couple of occasions you could see that Brazil's defense is their weak point.
Incidentally, some people are saying that Brazil under Dunga are a major threat once again. I'm not convinced. Given all the talent Brazil have at their disposal, anything less than victory in tournaments is failure. And so far all Dunga has managed to do is fail to win a tournament.
USA were too poor to put them under pressure but even tonight on a couple of occasions you could see that Brazil's defense is their weak point.
**International**
hmmm, USA played bad tonight. dont know why if they did great with Peru on friday? oh well, everybody has a bad day sometimes. the new brazil coach is horrible. Brazil's legacy is over, there are alot of good International teams nowadays. time for new blood to be World Champions...keep in mind also that Germany is just 1 world cup away with tying with Brazil with WC wins, just saying.
hmmm, USA played bad tonight. dont know why if they did great with Peru on friday? oh well, everybody has a bad day sometimes. the new brazil coach is horrible. Brazil's legacy is over, there are alot of good International teams nowadays. time for new blood to be World Champions...keep in mind also that Germany is just 1 world cup away with tying with Brazil with WC wins, just saying.
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Going by a certain site - Bobby Charlton:
Scotland 5, Northern Ireland 6, Wales 5, Portugal 5, Soviet Union 2, Italy 1, USA 4, Sweden 2, Luxembourg 5, Mexico 4, Argentina 1, Czechoslovakia 1, East Germany 1, Switzerland 3, Austria 1, Yugoslavia 1, Spain 1, Colombia 1.
Football and the World have changed.
Cheers,
OW
Scotland 5, Northern Ireland 6, Wales 5, Portugal 5, Soviet Union 2, Italy 1, USA 4, Sweden 2, Luxembourg 5, Mexico 4, Argentina 1, Czechoslovakia 1, East Germany 1, Switzerland 3, Austria 1, Yugoslavia 1, Spain 1, Colombia 1.
Football and the World have changed.
Cheers,
OW
Nah, it's simply that Rooney's not as good, having never scored against East Germany or Yugoslavia
Or even Czechoslovakia FWIW.Nah, it's simply that Rooney's not as good, having never scored against East Germany or Yugoslavia
B
So Sir Robert picked up 11 of his goals in Home Internationals against (I'm guessing) poor Welsh and Nirish teams. That does a lot to offset Rooney's soft goals against teams comprised of tax inspectors and the weird Soviet/Balkan splinter states.
Doesn't make him any less loathsome, obviously
Doesn't make him any less loathsome, obviously
*fires up Wikipedia*
Charlton's first Home Championship fixture in 1958, and his last was 1970. Looking elsewhere it appears he played in 31 of a possible 39 matches during that period. Therefore 16 in 31, which is marginally better than his '49 in 106' overall record. England won, or shared the win in those pre-GD days, ten of the thirteen Home Championships he played in, but skimming the tournament results it doesn't look as if Wales and Northern Ireland were complete whipping boys.
What's interesting is how few competitive, non 'domestic' matches he played in:
• 50 friendlies
• 4 World Cup qualifiers (1962: group of three with Portugal and Luxembourg)
• 14 World Cup proper (four in 1962, six in 1966, four in 1970)
• 9 European Championship qualifiers (six of which were the 1967/68 Home Championships; others were home/away against Spain in 1968, and a single appearance in a two legged tie against France in 1964)
• 2 European Championship proper (1968, which was a four team, semi > classification match affair)
• 25 Home Championship matches (excluding the six above)
• 2 'other tournaments', which appears to be the 1964 Taça das Nações (as I like to call it)
EDIT: that doesn't add up to 106, does it?
He was obviously something of a bully against dross, with early career hat tricks against the USA (8–1), Luxembourg (9–0), Mexico (8–0), and Switzerland (8–1). His scoring rate tailed off dramatically when Sir Alf turned him into a midfielder: 24 goals in his first 30 appearances, just 8 in his last 30.
I'm not quite sure what the above proves, other than that Wayne Rooney is a repulsive granny-shagging Scouse git.
Charlton's first Home Championship fixture in 1958, and his last was 1970. Looking elsewhere it appears he played in 31 of a possible 39 matches during that period. Therefore 16 in 31, which is marginally better than his '49 in 106' overall record. England won, or shared the win in those pre-GD days, ten of the thirteen Home Championships he played in, but skimming the tournament results it doesn't look as if Wales and Northern Ireland were complete whipping boys.
What's interesting is how few competitive, non 'domestic' matches he played in:
• 50 friendlies
• 4 World Cup qualifiers (1962: group of three with Portugal and Luxembourg)
• 14 World Cup proper (four in 1962, six in 1966, four in 1970)
• 9 European Championship qualifiers (six of which were the 1967/68 Home Championships; others were home/away against Spain in 1968, and a single appearance in a two legged tie against France in 1964)
• 2 European Championship proper (1968, which was a four team, semi > classification match affair)
• 25 Home Championship matches (excluding the six above)
• 2 'other tournaments', which appears to be the 1964 Taça das Nações (as I like to call it)
EDIT: that doesn't add up to 106, does it?
He was obviously something of a bully against dross, with early career hat tricks against the USA (8–1), Luxembourg (9–0), Mexico (8–0), and Switzerland (8–1). His scoring rate tailed off dramatically when Sir Alf turned him into a midfielder: 24 goals in his first 30 appearances, just 8 in his last 30.
I'm not quite sure what the above proves, other than that Wayne Rooney is a repulsive granny-shagging Scouse git.
and maybe, just maybe, rooney is really, really good too?
i have nothing agianst him and i do believe that he has played against some very good teams that would probably compare favorably to any that mr charlton played against.
i have nothing agianst him and i do believe that he has played against some very good teams that would probably compare favorably to any that mr charlton played against.
The bottom line is, it's Apples to Oranges. Charlton never had the benefit of the insane amounts of sports science currently being applied to football, while Rooney is subject to levels of public pressure and media intrusion that just didn't exist in the 60s. Also, the teams, systems, and opponents were all different.
It is absolutely true that Rooney has scored more goals than any other England player. Whether that makes him England's "best" striker by any other metric is not objectively answerable.
**MLS news**
David Beckham has finally found a site for the new stadium, good news for me cause i live in the area
http://www.goal.com/en/news/1884/no...rce=FB&utm_medium=en&utm_campaign=Beckham_MLS
David Beckham has finally found a site for the new stadium, good news for me cause i live in the area
http://www.goal.com/en/news/1884/no...rce=FB&utm_medium=en&utm_campaign=Beckham_MLS
IMHO Rooney had the potential 10 years ago to become the defining player for England for a whole decade but couldn't quite deliver in the big games since 2004. His record has very likely to do more with there not being a similar striker of his caliber available as an alternative when not in form.(similar to Podolski with his statistics) He isn't as dynamic on the pitch as he was 6-7 years ago...
Also in national squad part of the problem always were huge tactical naiveté from england coaches.
Rooney was always best as the single lone striker where he is the target of countless passes and thus can/could create one "dangerous" situation after the next. Which obviously was ignored and 4-4-2 was played with some 3-rate 2nd striker wasting chances.
On the other side he is an excellent league striker and will go down as a club legend at manchester IMHO rightly so.
Comparing players from the 60/70 with todays players is obviously doubled edged: Would sending back today's trained Messi or Ronaldo back to with a time machine be just like a grown man punching a baby ? Of course because the intensity over 90 minutes was much lower
Would the stars from back then with todays training be stars today ? Very likely so:
Everybodies favorite prisoner Uli Hoeneß himself could sprint the 100 meter in 11.0 seconds flat during his active career in the 70ties. With today's sport science he very likely would be comparable to high speed players like Bale/Walcott/Robben.
While Gerd Müller is always joked about being short and fat, he actually had a enormous ability to accelerate over short distances, turn in tight spots, ambidextrous shooting skills and an incredible jumping ability. He wasn't the "all instincts player" which he is often made out today. He also had the physical skills,game intelligence and reflexes which made those instincts matter on the pitch
Similar with Pelé... he is remembered for his brilliant technique (being a brazilian and all that) but he also was an incredibly physical strong player which was difficult to challenge, was among the fastest strikers in his younger years and also had a great heading/aerial game which somehow everybody forgets today.
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Good points takao.
I would add that if Messi and Ronaldo or even Rooney were transported back the 70s, the very first thing that would happen to them would be having their leg snapped in two by the kind of tackle that was legal 40 years ago but has long since been a straight red offense. Most modern players (especially fast, technical players) would struggle to adapt to the physicality of the historical game. If you watch old matches from that time you see lots of shoving, stomping, hacking and rugby tackles - nowadays if you displace even a single strand of (heavily gelled) hair on Ronaldo's head you get carded.
I would add that if Messi and Ronaldo or even Rooney were transported back the 70s, the very first thing that would happen to them would be having their leg snapped in two by the kind of tackle that was legal 40 years ago but has long since been a straight red offense. Most modern players (especially fast, technical players) would struggle to adapt to the physicality of the historical game. If you watch old matches from that time you see lots of shoving, stomping, hacking and rugby tackles - nowadays if you displace even a single strand of (heavily gelled) hair on Ronaldo's head you get carded.