The 2015-2016 Football Thread

[Lord Blackadder]

USA 4-0 Guatemala

Once again Columbus Crew Stadium proves to be the USA's fortress as they smash Guatemala in a must-win game. A loss tonight would have all but killed our chances of qualifying for the next World Cup...Klinsmann has survived but the Klinsmann-Out crowd is getting louder. I'm still behind him. He makes some puzzling player selection decisions, and he is not necessarily a technical mastermind but he is by far the most dynamic and positive manager USA have had in my lifetime...Bruce Arena was a safe pair of hands and Bob Bradley is competent, but with them you always knew there was a big glass ceiling beyond which we could never develop. Under Klinsmann I think there is more potential - but he does need to find more consistency.

As for England...didn't take long for the bubble to burst eh?

 

[pachyderm]

USA 4-0 Guatemala

Once again Columbus Crew Stadium proves to be the USA's fortress as they smash Guatemala in a must-win game. A loss tonight would have all but killed our chances of qualifying for the next World Cup...Klinsmann has survived but the Klinsmann-Out crowd is getting louder. I'm still behind him. He makes some puzzling player selection decisions, and he is not necessarily a technical mastermind but he is by far the most dynamic and positive manager USA have had in my lifetime...Bruce Arena was a safe pair of hands and Bob Bradley is competent, but with them you always knew there was a big glass ceiling beyond which we could never develop. Under Klinsmann I think there is more potential - but he does need to find more consistency.

As for England...didn't take long for the bubble to burst eh?

completely agreed.

 

[oscillatewildly]

...and Roy may go on endlessly about how he is captain, but does anyone think at this point that he should be a starter? With Kane and Vardy, England have two younger and more energetic strikers who can run at defenders (at least Kane can) and finish well, supported ably by Dele Alli. Not to mention that Rashford is showing great potential and Sturridge, on the rare occasion that he is fit, is capable of world-class forward play.

Rooney built his reputation partially by running at defenders himself, but he no longer has that turn of pace.

As I said, the defence - mind, you can add the midfield from yesterday.

Provided he has had 4 competitive games, I'd start Rooney in the first game - use Vardy off the bench for the first two - and take it from there. Rashford shouldn't be anywhere near the England squad - don't ruin him.

Cruyff; great kits of Ajax, FC Barcelona, and '70s Netherlands - tribute paid by that England schmutter and that Netherlands side.

Cheers,
OW

 

[twietee]

Manchester City’s Martin Demichelis has been charged for misconduct in relation to betting

Would explain some of his advanced "defending" - or at least one would hope so.

Didn't see the GER-ENG match except parts (great goals there!). Yesterday against Italy was looking good again, although I don't rate theses friendlies that high one way or the other.

There is a lot of talk about Götze leaving Bayern. One day it's basically a done deal with Dortmund, next one Pool are the frontrunners. Would like to see him play at Dortmund again tbh.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Provided he has had 4 competitive games, I'd start Rooney in the first game - use Vardy off the bench for the first two - and take it from there. Rashford shouldn't be anywhere near the England squad - don't ruin him.

One of Sturridge, Walcott, Welbeck, Kane and Vardy will surely be cut (possibly two if Roy only takes four strikers). It can't possibly be Kane or Vardy (barring injury)...of those three remaining, Sturridsge is the most skillful but least sturdy. Walcott is streaky and has also been in and out of Arsenal this season. Welbeck is versatile and works hard but also has some injury troubles.

Given that England can't defend, Roy's approach to the Euros should be to attack and outscore the opposition.

 

[oscillatewildly]

Would take Kane, Vardy, Rooney, Sturridge, and Welbeck over any of Walcott, Sterling, and Lallana - I'd leave the last 3, wouldn't want them when the going gets tough.

Cheers,
OW

 

[Centaurr]

World cup qualifiers**

My 2 favorite international teams, Colombia and USA did excellent yesterday, both were on fire. Colombia's new blood did 2 goals, looks like we have a good team for the future

Side note: the Colombia jersey for Copa america has been revealed

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Would take Kane, Vardy, Rooney, Sturridge, and Welbeck over any of Walcott, Sterling, and Lallana - I'd leave the last 3, wouldn't want them when the going gets tough.

Sterling & Lallana would be battling it out with Alli, Barkley and probably Walcott for a spot as attacking midfielder I would think. Four of those five will likely be on the plane, again barring injury. Of those Barkley and Alli are the form players. Those two plus two more?

England should be worried about their center backs though...Stones and Cahlil are both playing in very leaky defenses right now. The Man Utd contingent have been part of a much tighter defense, though it has been error-prone at times. Will Phil Jones be match fit? (want him on the plane just for the faces he makes)

My 2 favorite international teams, Colombia and USA did excellent yesterday, both were on fire. Colombia's new blood did 2 goals, looks like we have a good team for the future.

USA U23s loss to Columbia means we miss the Olympics for the second time running - some believe this will set US soccer back for years as our best prospects are robbed of competitive tournament experience. A very worrying turn of events.

 

[oscillatewildly]

Sterling & Lallana would be battling it out with Alli, Barkley and probably Walcott for a spot as attacking midfielder I would think. Four of those five will likely be on the plane, again barring injury. Of those Barkley and Alli are the form players. Those two plus two more?

England should be worried about their center backs though...Stones and Cahlil are both playing in very leaky defenses right now. The Man Utd contingent have been part of a much tighter defense, though it has been error-prone at times. Will Phil Jones be match fit? (want him on the plane just for the faces he makes)

...

3 keepers, 5 forwards - Welbeck/Rooney can drop to wide/central midfield, leaving 15; 7/8 or 8/7 split midfield/defence - Dier can drop to defence. Taking 8 midfield and being Roy; Dier, Alli, Barkley, Wilshere , Henderson, Milner, Sterling, plus a Drinkwater type. Wave the white flag.

Phil Quagmire Jones has gone backwards. This season Smalling has been good for a period, then rubbish, currently a mix. Fingers crossed for Luke Shaw; Clyne, Walker, Smalling, Cahill, Stones, (Dier), Rose, Shaw - better attacking than defending.

Cheers,
OW

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Five members of the US Women's National Team have field a federal age discrimination lawsuit against US Soccer.

Good timing for the USWNT - they've recently won the World Cup, yet FIFA has temporarily gone down in flames, and they have been forced to play on artificial turf while the men rarely do. US Soccer's 2015 financial report shows that the USWNT actually generated more revenue than the men's team - yet received substantially less compensation.

I see the USWNT serving as the standard-bearers for women's soccer in many ways, and I hope they win this. They are an elite group and should be compensated at least an equal level to the men's team. This is particularly important when you recall that professional female soccer players make far less in terms of wages in their professional leagues, so the money they get from international duty is very important to them.

3 keepers, 5 forwards - Welbeck/Rooney can drop to wide/central midfield, leaving 15; 7/8 or 8/7 split midfield/defence - Dier can drop to defence. Taking 8 midfield and being Roy; Dier, Alli, Barkley, Wilshere , Henderson, Milner, Sterling, plus a Drinkwater type. Wave the white flag.

Phil Quagmire Jones has gone backwards. This season Smalling has been good for a period, then rubbish, currently a mix. Fingers crossed for Luke Shaw; Clyne, Walker, Smalling, Cahill, Stones, (Dier), Rose, Shaw - better attacking than defending.

Cheers,
OW

I was initially thinking 3 keepers, 6 defenders, 8 midfielders (4 attacking mids and 4 defensive/orthodox) and 5 forwards. On the other hand, that might leave you short of cover at fullback...assuming of course you have good options to choosde from to begin with. Stones always has a gigantic error in him, he remains raw. Smalling and Cahill seem to be Roy's go-to center back pairing, so to a certain extent as they go, so goes England.

I think all signs point to the need for an aggressive, pressing/attack-minded side - England will not be able to rely on their defense to hold teams off. Keep the ball high up the pitch. It means leaking goals to counterattacks, but if you can outscore the opposition...

Ferg calls for Man Utd fans to be patient, mentions injury crises - but not the money spent since he left...

 

[SactoGuy18]

Speaking of which, the next El Clásico is this coming Saturday. Will Real Madrid seek revenge for that blowout loss from earlier this season? And will there be a special moment of remembrance for Johan Cruyff, the man who established the modern version of FC Barcelona?

 

[macuser27]

Speaking of which, the next El Clásico is this coming Saturday. Will Real Madrid seek revenge for that blowout loss from earlier this season? And will there be a special moment of remembrance for Johan Cruyff, the man who established the modern version of FC Barcelona?

Good few hours of football on for me sat with the Spurs game and this

 

[617aircav]

Ban all soccer until women players have equal pay.

 

[oscillatewildly]

Five members of the US Women's National Team have field a federal age discrimination lawsuit against US Soccer.

Good timing for the USWNT - they've recently won the World Cup, yet FIFA has temporarily gone down in flames, and they have been forced to play on artificial turf while the men rarely do. US Soccer's 2015 financial report shows that the USWNT actually generated more revenue than the men's team - yet received substantially less compensation.

I see the USWNT serving as the standard-bearers for women's soccer in many ways, and I hope they win this. They are an elite group and should be compensated at least an equal level to the men's team. This is particularly important when you recall that professional female soccer players make far less in terms of wages in their professional leagues, so the money they get from international duty is very important to them.

...

Ferg calls for Man Utd fans to be patient, mentions injury crises - but not the money spent since he left...

By 617airca #1388 Ban all soccer until women players have equal pay

Picking and choosing equality where it suits; like tennis and many other sports, it isn't equal work. I'm for equality: one tennis, one football etc. - all players together finding their level and being paid in the ball park of that level; there are examples of inequality re performance and pay within the Premier League. Of course, for different reasons, there will be both men and women who resist the all together. With regard to the case of the USWNT, is the pay reasonable taking into account the competition standard and the distance travelled? The reported gap seems excessive.

Ferg, injury, money:

If when driving home from the showroom in your new USD 100,000 car a truck puts it into the shop for 2 months - waiting on insurance and repairs, the price paid for the car doesn't matter; you can't use it. They may offer you a loaner, but it won't be as good - probably a Hyundai.

Cheers,
OW

 

[Lord Blackadder]

By 617airca #1388 Ban all soccer until women players have equal pay

Picking and choosing equality where it suits; like tennis and many other sports, it isn't equal work. I'm for equality: one tennis, one football etc. - all players together finding their level and being paid in the ball park of that level; there are examples of inequality re performance and pay within the Premier League. Of course, for different reasons, there will be both men and women who resist the all together. With regard to the case of the USWNT, is the pay reasonable taking into account the competition standard and the distance travelled? The reported gap seems excessive.

The current situation in women's sports versus men's sports is one of vast and arbitrary financial inequality - particularly in the professional realm. It's is the tip of a massive socio-political iceberg that we couldn't even begin to tackle here. But, suffice it to say, I think the international realm is the place where pay gaps in football could and should be addressed much more aggressively in the short term; the professional game is far more complicated and will require different solutions.

Ferg, injury, money:

If when driving home from the showroom in your new USD 100,000 car a truck puts it into the shop for 2 months - waiting on insurance and repairs, the price paid for the car doesn't matter; you can't use it. They may offer you a loaner, but it won't be as good - probably a Hyundai.

Cheers,
OW

When your $100k car was crocked before the truck smashed it though, the injury obscures larger problems with different causes. A lot has gone wrong for Man Utd this season, and there certainly isn't one cause. Ferg is 100% correct when he implies that the team would be in better shape barring jnjuries (probably a comfortable top 4 finish).

On the other hand, this is a club that has such spending power that anything lower than a league title should be a massive disappointment - I don't believe in the divine right of clubs to win trophies or that the "Man Utd Way" (or any other club culture) means the club deserves anything in terms of competitive success.

But I do think that the amount of money spent gives bigger clubs much less excuse to fail. Why are Liverpool in 9th place after spending so much money? Why are United, with their claimed half a billion paying fans in Asia or whatever, struggling mightily to finish on the top four when no player in the world is out of their financial reach? Perhaps even more damningly, why are Man City doing so little (competitively) with so much in terms of resources?

 

[oscillatewildly]

The current situation in women's sports versus men's sports is one of vast and arbitrary financial inequality - particularly in the professional realm...

Ferg, injury, money:

...

But I do think that the amount of money spent gives bigger clubs much less excuse to fail. Why are Liverpool in 9th place after spending so much money? Why are United, with their claimed half a billion paying fans in Asia or whatever, struggling mightily to finish on the top four when no player in the world is out of their financial reach? Perhaps even more damningly, why are Man City doing so little (competitively) with so much in terms of resources?

Women's sports versus men's sports; that's the problem, combine them - no place to hide for all concerned.

Money:

The more money a buyer has, the more money the owner wants; likely they will end up paying more for the same player - which adds to the pressure to succeed. On financial reach, Premier League clubs don't have a free run - Bayern Munich, PSG, FC Barcelona, and Real Madrid. Why are clubs not performing? Trying to overcome general scouting/recruitment errors, sticking with a set of players one season beyond expiry, and clearing those players but still trying to form a new team are some reasons.

Cheers,
OW

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Women's sports versus men's sports; that's the problem, combine them - no place to hide for all concerned.

Perhaps that is the ultimate long-term solution. There are, however, other things we can do in the shorter term to improve women's sporting opportunities.

The more money a buyer has, the more money the owner wants; likely they will end up paying more for the same player - which adds to the pressure to succeed. On financial reach, Premier League clubs don't have a free run - Bayern Munich, PSG, FC Barcelona, and Real Madrid. Why are clubs not performing? Trying to overcome general scouting/recruitment errors, sticking with a set of players one season beyond expiry, and clearing those players but still trying to form a new team are some reasons.

Rich clubs may hog the honors, but they are actually bad value for money if you look at achievements per dollars/pounds/euros spent. We are currently at a point where there is so much money sloshing around the game that the limiting factor is now not funds but talent and skill - whether that be ownership, management or actual playing talent.

 

[617aircav]

“They are talking about performing substantially equal work,” said Castro, who chaired the EEOC under Presidents Bill Clinton and George W. Bush. “They are both soccer teams, right? There is no significant difference between the soccer games that I can see. If they have met all that and can show their male counterparts do not have substantially additional duties --- which based on what I’ve seen they don’t have -- it will be difficult for the employer to justify the differential in pay.”

The above is such a stupid logic. If all athletes did the same job the Lebron would make the same as Love.

 

[balamw]

The above is such a stupid logic. If all athletes did the same job the Lebron would make the same as Love.

Of course, in this case the USWNT is LeBron, but paid like Kevin Love.

EDIT: probably a bad analogy since their salaries are actually close at $24M and $21M according to Google. You'd have to find a $5M player to compare to.

B

 

[Lord Blackadder]

A pretty even match at Anfield today - could have gone either way, though a draw was probably fair. Leicester now have another big opportunity to build their lead in the table.

Barca beaten by Real in a game where Sergio Ramos should have been sent off several times as usual (he did finally get his red card in the end). It's a moral victory for Real but meaningless in terms of the title race.

 

[edvj]

1 year ago today.

 

[oscillatewildly]

Of course, in this case the USWNT is LeBron, but paid like Kevin Love.

EDIT: probably a bad analogy since their salaries are actually close at $24M and $21M according to Google. You'd have to find a $5M player to compare to.

B

Play the men over 5 games, then we can talk.

If the pay gap is deemed excessive after considering the requirements to achieve in the men's game v women's game and performances within each, reduce it until it's reasonable. But equal? No; German MNT v USWNT.

Lord Blackadder - long term; women want equal pay now. Fine, they can compete against men now.

Cheers,
OW

 

[balamw]

Play the men over 5 games, then we can talk.

I'd watch that!

The issue here for me is a business one. If the WNT brings in more money to US Soccer they should take out a closer share, otherwise it's the women subsidizing the men.

If they can't make the bucks, by all means pay them less!

B

 

[617aircav]

Of course, in this case the USWNT is LeBron, but paid like Kevin Love.

EDIT: probably a bad analogy since their salaries are actually close at $24M and $21M according to Google. You'd have to find a $5M player to compare to.

B

They can't be Lebron, since the men are better soccer players. The women win because they play against inferior opponents. The men play against the best in the world.

 

[617aircav]

I'd watch that!

The issue here for me is a business one. If the WNT brings in more money to US Soccer they should take out a closer share, otherwise it's the women subsidizing the men.

If they can't make the bucks, by all means pay them less!

B

They don't bring in more money.