Is that what you said about the 1999 final, as well? The famous equalizer and winner were both scored by subs.
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The 2017-2018 Football Thread
- Thread starter Lord Blackadder
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Is that what you said about the 1999 final, as well? The famous equalizer and winner were both scored by subs.
Fabinho will be a good signing for Liverpool. With Keita coming in and now Fabinho, the Liverpool midfield is now looking like it has a bit more depth.
Well Liverpool themselves have had great substitutes in the past. Anyone remember this guy (supersub) ?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Fairclough
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Fairclough
I'm guessing with Keita and Fabinho in the squad, players like Milner and Wijnaldum will be part of the rotation and not automatic starters in the Liverpool lineup.
Liverpool's midfield already looks dramatically improved, and Fakir may yet still be on the way. If they can add a good keeper, then watch out, City.
Looks like City is going to finally add Mahrez. United have their work cut out to keep up with those two clubs. I guess adding Fred is a start, though I don't know much about him — seems more like an upgrade to Herrera or a replacement for Carrick or something like that. I'm ready for some more concrete news about other potential transfers.
Looks like City is going to finally add Mahrez. United have their work cut out to keep up with those two clubs. I guess adding Fred is a start, though I don't know much about him — seems more like an upgrade to Herrera or a replacement for Carrick or something like that. I'm ready for some more concrete news about other potential transfers.
I'm not a Real fan, in fact i find it entirely anti-climactic that they won. But Re- the Ramos/Salah thing. I don't think it was in anyway deliberate. Ramos is just a combative competitor who wants to win at any cost. Even in this pic you can see Salah was holding on to him. Seemed like a tussle where one beloved player came off worse.
Ultimately Liverpool lost the match because a) they're over-reliant on one player and b) they have a keeper who is arguably the worst in the top 6 in England c) Klopp doesn't have a plan B or squad depth.
Ultimately Liverpool lost the match because a) they're over-reliant on one player and b) they have a keeper who is arguably the worst in the top 6 in England c) Klopp doesn't have a plan B or squad depth.
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I'm not a Real fan, in fact i find it entirely anti-climactic that they won. But Re- the Ramos/Salah thing. I don't think it was in anyway deliberate. Ramos is just a combative competitor who wants to win at any cost. Even in this pic you can see Salah was holding on to him. Seemed like a tussle where one beloved player came off worse.
Ultimately Liverpool lost the match because a) they're over-reliant on one player and b) they have a keeper who is arguably the worst in the top 6 in England c) Klopp doesn't have a plan B or squad depth.
And this is why, to me, the whole UEFA cup thing is ridiculous to begin with. Two, or three, teams have the money and the where with all to field teams with super stars at all, or nearly all, the positions. Those same two or three teams seem to win it or be in the final year in and year out. What's the point? To remind them how good they are?
Look: Life is grey, rather than black and white.
I am prepared to concede that Real Madrid were the better team, but surely it should be possible to admit that the better team also played cynical and opportunistically nasty football? Ramos is a cynical, dirty player, possibly a filthy one - but in a world where winners are worshipped and losers despised, such individuals may find a role for themselves.
Over the course of his career, Ramos has received 24 red cards; such conduct is not an aberration in an otherwise blameless career - the man is the personification of a cynical and dirty skill set attired in stylish football kit. Moreover, this cynical foul on Salah - irrespective of whether it was intended to injure him - was certainly intended to neutralise him.
You know, it is possible in a complex world to admit that RM are a superb team as a collective, an extremely good team, while admitting that Ramos is a filthy and cynical player.
Now, I also believe that once Salah left the pitch, (injured in body and perhaps wounded in soul) things changed for Liverpool. That is not to say that they would have won - it is to say that they could have done so with the unpredictable gifted genius of Salah at their disposal.
Of course, the mistakes of Karius also cost them, (I hope Mr Klopp takes that lesson to heart and pays attention to the position between the posts when shopping for players this summer) and yes, Real Madrid were the better team - and Bale was outstanding - but to refuse to acknowledge that the outcome was not preordained is to do an injustice to what happened on the night.
I am prepared to concede that Real Madrid were the better team, but surely it should be possible to admit that the better team also played cynical and opportunistically nasty football? Ramos is a cynical, dirty player, possibly a filthy one - but in a world where winners are worshipped and losers despised, such individuals may find a role for themselves.
Over the course of his career, Ramos has received 24 red cards; such conduct is not an aberration in an otherwise blameless career - the man is the personification of a cynical and dirty skill set attired in stylish football kit. Moreover, this cynical foul on Salah - irrespective of whether it was intended to injure him - was certainly intended to neutralise him.
You know, it is possible in a complex world to admit that RM are a superb team as a collective, an extremely good team, while admitting that Ramos is a filthy and cynical player.
Now, I also believe that once Salah left the pitch, (injured in body and perhaps wounded in soul) things changed for Liverpool. That is not to say that they would have won - it is to say that they could have done so with the unpredictable gifted genius of Salah at their disposal.
Of course, the mistakes of Karius also cost them, (I hope Mr Klopp takes that lesson to heart and pays attention to the position between the posts when shopping for players this summer) and yes, Real Madrid were the better team - and Bale was outstanding - but to refuse to acknowledge that the outcome was not preordained is to do an injustice to what happened on the night.
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I agree. He's a bit of a brute.
Yup. The complexion of the game was changed completely.
OK. Any speculation on where Zidane is going now that he has announced his departure from RM?
From what I have read, he will possibly take a complete break from football for a few months, if not a year; he sounds exhausted and I suspect that he feels the need to re-charge which would allow him to return, energised.
It also makes sense to go out on a high (which is what I have come to think Mr Wenger should have done last year) and, in truth, there is not an awful lot that Zidane could have achieved to top what he has already achieved with RM.
When you start - or stay - at the top, eventually, the only way is down.
I've cooled down since the final...mostly. Rough summer ahead, with Columbus' fate hanging in the air... I don't think I'm going to make it to a match this year due to my commitments in real life, so if this really is their last season, it's a bitter end to my US football league experience. We'll always have 2008...
I'm going to see a USL match this weekend, if I do keep watching soccer in the US it will be lower league play.
I would argue that there is not a binary scale of deliberate / not deliberate.
Deliberate is what Zidane did to Materazzi in the 2006 WC final. Then there is completely accidental, which could happen with anyone. But between those two is intentional recklessness: "I'm not trying to hurt this player - but I'm going in wild and hard and whatever happens, happens!" That's Ramos, and his disciplinary record speaks for itself.
It is possible to be a world-class player, an inspirational figure and club legend - and also be a really dirty player. That's Ramos.
There is a grain of truth to a) but no more than you could say about De Gea at Man Utd. I think it would be fairer to say that Salah gave us that little edge that helped us get a bit further, rather than looking at it as a weakness and a failing. Mane and Firmino plus any other good striker is still one of the most dangerous attacks in Europe.
b): Can't argue with it at this. I feel bad for Karius, but Klopp has given him more chances than most to succeed and he hasn't been able to reach the level Liverpool need from their keeper. Time to poach a top-level replacement.
As for c), I see squad depth as more of a problem than a lack of a plan B. Sometimes, too much focus on developing a mediocre plan B can interfere with plan A. Having more depth to execute plan A is a reasonable alternative.
I'm going to see a USL match this weekend, if I do keep watching soccer in the US it will be lower league play.
I would argue that there is not a binary scale of deliberate / not deliberate.
Deliberate is what Zidane did to Materazzi in the 2006 WC final. Then there is completely accidental, which could happen with anyone. But between those two is intentional recklessness: "I'm not trying to hurt this player - but I'm going in wild and hard and whatever happens, happens!" That's Ramos, and his disciplinary record speaks for itself.
It is possible to be a world-class player, an inspirational figure and club legend - and also be a really dirty player. That's Ramos.
There is a grain of truth to a) but no more than you could say about De Gea at Man Utd. I think it would be fairer to say that Salah gave us that little edge that helped us get a bit further, rather than looking at it as a weakness and a failing. Mane and Firmino plus any other good striker is still one of the most dangerous attacks in Europe.
b): Can't argue with it at this. I feel bad for Karius, but Klopp has given him more chances than most to succeed and he hasn't been able to reach the level Liverpool need from their keeper. Time to poach a top-level replacement.
As for c), I see squad depth as more of a problem than a lack of a plan B. Sometimes, too much focus on developing a mediocre plan B can interfere with plan A. Having more depth to execute plan A is a reasonable alternative.
I could only hope he could consider going to my Man U to replace you know who.
I have admitted that the game changed, but the Ramos thing. You and the rest of the people saying it was dirty are just stretching. Looking for something. Look at the post with the pictures. Salah grabbed him first.
Well, yes, I see your point, but I doubt that the Premiership would attract him.
Doesn't make it admirable or not worth contesting.
No, but I think it follows life. The rich get richer. I don’t know what you do about it. I mean American sports have salary caps in place, but still the same teams keep winning. Look at the Patriots in the NFL, the Warriors in the NBA. I don’t know what you do.
Zidane will end up in China for a season I think. Earn some big bucks. Then they will be calling for his return.
Whilst it's true when you are at the top the only way is down, it's also a nightmare if you've taken a team to the top, it's not an enviable task to be the next guy in the hot seat!
As soon as they don't win the CL, they'll be calling for their head. Unless they can win 4 on the bounce of course!
Whilst it's true when you are at the top the only way is down, it's also a nightmare if you've taken a team to the top, it's not an enviable task to be the next guy in the hot seat!
As soon as they don't win the CL, they'll be calling for their head. Unless they can win 4 on the bounce of course!
The only way we win 4 is if we knock this summer transfer season out the water, and we hire an amazing coach like Pochettino.
I genuinely think that Zidane may take some time off; other managers have done so, and returned with a fresh appetite to the fray.
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