The 2022-2023 Football Thread

[Lord Blackadder]

Mbappe has an attitude problem. This is becoming endemic with young superstars. The money involved in the game is so extreme that it's virtually impossible for players not to become distracted by commercial and media matters. It's not entirely their fault, but it is painful to watch a generational talent be wasted at sportswashing projects like PSG and potentially Saudi Arabia.

Neymar is more brand than player now. And Mbappe is in danger of heading down the same path.

 

[Apple fanboy]

In other news, Shaka Hislop our former goalkeeper has collapsed and taken to hospital during a broadcast. Only 54.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

In other news, Shaka Hislop our former goalkeeper has collapsed and taken to hospital during a broadcast. Only 54.

He was said to be conscious and talking later, so hopefully it is nothing serious. A scary moment.

 

[Apple fanboy]

He was said to be conscious and talking later, so hopefully it is nothing serious. A scary moment.

Indeed. 54 doesn’t sound all that old to be having those sorts of issues.

 

[Rafterman]

Mbappe has an attitude problem. This is becoming endemic with young superstars. The money involved in the game is so extreme that it's virtually impossible for players not to become distracted by commercial and media matters. It's not entirely their fault, but it is painful to watch a generational talent be wasted at sportswashing projects like PSG and potentially Saudi Arabia.

Neymar is more brand than player now. And Mbappe is in danger of heading down the same path.

Mbappe had the good sense to turn down the Saudi offer. Which, at over $330 million, shows some emotional maturity.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Mbappe had the good sense to turn down the Saudi offer. Which, at over $330 million, shows some emotional maturity.

I don't think he's turned down the offer so much as the offer failed to dissuade him from his desire to go to Real Madrid.

He'd probably have already left for Madrid if he wasn't available on a free next season. PSG will be desperate to get a fee for him now but Real can get him for free by literally doing nothing till next spring...so that's probably what will happen. If he stays at PSG he will earn massive wages. If he goes to Saudi Arabia he will earn massive wages. If he goes to Madrid he will earn massive wages...AND ALSO probably win the Champions League three or four times.

So I think his destination is pretty obvious.

 

[Apple fanboy]

Mbappe had the good sense to turn down the Saudi offer. Which, at over $330 million, shows some emotional maturity.

Hopefully that and not just holding out for more money!
But if true, good on him.

 

[daneoni]

Mbappe had the good sense to turn down the Saudi offer. Which, at over $330 million, shows some emotional maturity.

I think its more he wants to play UCL football and go to Madrid rather than emotional maturity.

And denying PSG €300m can't be too bad a motivator

 

[Lord Blackadder]

I think Mbappe is much less of a player than he could be. It's obvious that PSG is a vanity/sportswashing project, but unlike Man City's sportswashing project they have not taken the football side 100% seriously - or at least they have approached it with a fair degree of incompetence allied with a lot of money. It's a Galacticos 1.0 model - unbalanced squad, random ensemble/rotating cast of managers and interference from the ownership.

Mbappe doesn't work for the team because he doesn't have to. He didn't really work for the team when he was in a France shirt either, despite his individual heroics. Even at Real Madrid I think he'll have to be more of a team player than he is now. But he still probably won't track back.

I admit I was excited when there was talk of him going to Liverpool three years ago, though I was (rightly) very skeptical of the finances ever lining up. And in retrospect, he'd be a terrible fit for a Klopp team - very talented and a fearsome attacker but also very selfish, surrounded by a huge entourage, and never too far away from a sulk. Attitude wise he is the anti-James Milner. 🤣

 

[HandsomeDanNZ]

Bargain. I would hate to think what the wages are!

I've read it's in excess of $12 an hour

 

[laptech]

Mbappe has a year left of his contract (i think) and Kane has a year left of his contract. It appears PSG want rid of Mbappe and we've seen recently in the news that Spurs owner wants Kane sold rather than lose him for a free. The question is, can a club force a player out of the club so they can get transfer money for them or does employment laws mean it's tough luck on the club if the player wants to see out their contract and leave on a free? because more so than Kane, PSG would be mightily angry and annoyed if Mbappe see's out his contract and leaves on a free.

 

[daneoni]

Don't think they can legally force them to join another club. But they can exclude them from the squad. Then its up to the player to either sit without football or move elsewhere for game time.

EDIT: Chelsea reject West Ham's £40m bid for Gallagher, i'm guessing they value him around the £105m mark.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Don't think they can legally force them to join another club. But they can exclude them from the squad. Then its up to the player to either sit without football or move elsewhere for game time.

And sometimes, the club is able to terminate the contract.

Both Spurs and PSG face a dilemma, or, are on the horns of a dilemma: Sell the player now, and receive something for him, - in fact, compel a sale - or suffer the player seeing out his contract and strolling away next summer (while openly negotiating during the winter transfer window, when clubs are legally allowed to approach the player) on a free transfer which means the club receives nothing.

If the player remains, and plays, reluctantly, this must serve to undermine squad solidarity; if the player remains, but is exiled from the squad, yet still receiving obscenely bloated wages, this must also serve to destabilise the team.

 

[laptech]

And sometimes, the club is able to terminate the contract.

Both Spurs and PSG face a dilemma, or, are on the horns of a dilemma: Sell the player now, and receive something for him, - in fact, compel a sale - or suffer the player seeing out his contract and strolling away next summer (while openly negotiating during the winter transfer window, when clubs are legally allowed to approach the player) on a free transfer which means the club receives nothing.

If the player remains, and plays, reluctantly, this must serve to undermine squad solidarity; if the player remains, but is exiled from the squad, yet still receiving obscenely bloated wages, this must also serve to destabilise the team.

I was reading an article about Mbappe and it stated that if Mbappe see's out the rest of his contract with PSG, he get's a huge loyalty bonus. There is also another aspect that Mbappe has to consider, if he was to join the Saudi club, what if he was to get injured and is out for a few months or even the rest of the year, would there be clauses in his contract that would excluded him from getting his full wage if he is out injured? Would an injury put Real Madrid off from having him? Why take such a big risk? He could see out the last year of his contract, be a bench player or even be put in the reserves, thereby taking it easy for the last year of his contract, get his huge weekly wages then a loyalty bonus as clause in his contract and the with a bank full of money, move to Real Madrid on a free. PSG fans would probably hate him for taking that route (if he did) because as you said, his continued presence could be upsetting for the rest of the players in the team and could destabilize the team with Mbappe sticking two fingers up to the team and the fans saying 'I am doing what is best for ME'.

 

[laptech]

This came out of the blue, well i think it did because not heard of United going for this player.

Sofyan Amrabat REJECTS Liverpool & agrees personal terms with Manchester United

He's made a decision.

metro.co.uk

It could seriously back fire on the player if the story is true and United are after him because United are still looking for a striker and they do not have enough money in the pot to buy a striker and another midfielder. United would have to sell at least 3 to 4 players and if they don't, turning down Liverpool could be a mistake.

 

[daneoni]

Amrabat is on Utd's list after a striker. Casemiro needs help and Eriksen is ageing.

Amrabat probably feels ETH's style is more suited to him and his position in the starting 11 would be guaranteed vs Liverpool who already have two new midfielders and are look set for Lavia too.

Utd can afford £25m even if they miss out on Hojlund.

 

[laptech]

Amrabat is on Utd's list after a striker. Casemiro needs help and Eriksen is ageing.

Amrabat probably feels ETH's style is more suited to him and his position the starting 11 would be guaranteed vs Liverpool who already have two new midfielders and are look set for Lavia too.

Utd can afford £25m even if they miss out on Hojlund.

Question is, will ETH do what all his predecessors have done, highlighted a specific weakness in the team but gone for players in other positions instead. How many years have United managers been saying they needed a quality CDM and for years never getting one, always getting other midfielders, wingers and defenders.

 

[daneoni]

To be fair the striker market is painful to shop in currently. Everyone wants £150-£259m for the top forwards. I'm sure Utd would love Harry Kane or Osimehn but their clubs are virtually impossible to deal with.

Even those that can afford it are still having problems (Saudi/Mbappe). And Chelsea had to get creative and gamble on Jackson

 

[laptech]

More gossip about ETH and players he wants/looking at

Ten Hag raves about Chelsea & Arsenal target to Man Utd staff and could swoop in

The Dutch coach remains a massive fan of his former charge.

metro.co.uk

If this continues the United squad will be full of players that ETH has had previous direct connections with.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

More gossip about ETH and players he wants/looking at

Ten Hag raves about Chelsea & Arsenal target to Man Utd staff and could swoop in

The Dutch coach remains a massive fan of his former charge.

metro.co.uk

If this continues the United squad will be full of players that ETH has had previous direct connections with.

Whyever not?

At least he already knows them, and has some idea of their character, whether he can work with them and whether they have a decent work ethic, and whether they wish to evolve and develop and grow as footballers.

 

[it wasnt me]

Neymar is more brand than player now.

As a German, I should probably hold back a bit when it comes to evaluating football players. However, I cannot leave this sentence entirely uncommented on if I want to sleep peacefully tonight, and so I comment on it as follows:

If you want footballers to devote themselves primarily to the sport and not to marketing, you should campaign vigorously for those who pay footballers their salaries to stop spending obscene amounts of money on them. There is no reason, even remotely considered reasonable, to pay a guy who kicks a ball around a few times a year on a full-time basis a hundred times more than a gardener. Gardeners are at least useful and not merely entertaining.

 

[laptech]

Whyever not?

At least he already knows them, and has some idea of their character, whether he can work with them and whether they have a decent work ethic, and whether they wish to evolve and develop and grow as footballers.

If he takes players he already knows then to me it shows the manager is not a good manager because they are not willing to take on an unknown and work with them to make them a very good player. A manager should have all the know how and experience to take on any player and be able to work with them. To my knowledge, every player that have been currently linked to United is someone who has either directly previously worked with ETH or someone he knows from his time in the Dutch league.

Whilst some past United managers have taken on some players they have known through previous clubs, it has never been on the level we are seeing with ETH.

 

[daneoni]

A good video explaining how the EPL arose, and is now slowly killing European football.

More gossip about ETH and players he wants/looking at

Ten Hag raves about Chelsea & Arsenal target to Man Utd staff and could swoop in

The Dutch coach remains a massive fan of his former charge.

metro.co.uk

If this continues the United squad will be full of players that ETH has had previous direct connections with.

Eh Louis Van Gaal did similar. Dutch managers love to poach from Ajax.

But there managers who class certain players as effectively their own and bring them wherever they go where possible.

Mourinho and Matic/Smalling.
Emery and Pau Torres.
Arteta and City players
Moyes and Fellaini

As a German, I should probably hold back a bit when it comes to evaluating football players. However, I cannot leave this sentence entirely uncommented on if I want to sleep peacefully tonight, and so I comment on it as follows:

If you want footballers to devote themselves primarily to the sport and not to marketing, you should campaign vigorously for those who pay footballers their salaries to stop spending obscene amounts of money on them. There is no reason, even remotely considered reasonable, to pay a guy who kicks a ball around a few times a year on a full-time basis a hundred times more than a gardener. Gardeners are at least useful and not merely entertaining.

TV rights money -> pays to attract and pay the best players -> generates more viewership -> generates more TV rights/sponsorship money.

Rinse and repeat cycle. No incentive to stop.

 

[laptech]

As a German, I should probably hold back a bit when it comes to evaluating football players. However, I cannot leave this sentence entirely uncommented on if I want to sleep peacefully tonight, and so I comment on it as follows:

If you want footballers to devote themselves primarily to the sport and not to marketing, you should campaign vigorously for those who pay footballers their salaries to stop spending obscene amounts of money on them. There is no reason, even remotely considered reasonable, to pay a guy who kicks a ball around a few times a year on a full-time basis a hundred times more than a gardener. Gardeners are at least useful and not merely entertaining.

I have no doubt PSG fans have been complaining bitterly to the club about prices of everything due to the club buying Messi, Neymar and Mbappe and yet they still failed to win the Champions League.

As for wages, I have a number of old Match of the Day videos from the 70's and 80's and oh my gawd the difference to the prima dona's of today is startling. Playing in ANY weather, tackles going in hard, pitches drenched in rain or just mud baths and yet the players got on with it because they saw it as their job. No different to the tough conditions of miners, miners saw it as their job so they got on with it. Now with today's footballers, they complain if the pitch is not 100% perfect because otherwise they might hurt themselves. They complain if they get a slight kick or knock from a tackle. They complain if it's raining or snowing all the whilst wanting over £100,000 a week. It makes me sick when you see the footballing skills of Pele, Cryuff, Best, Maradona, playing in bad weather, on terrible pitches, getting persistently hacked down and yet still able to show off their talents.

Players should get a fair wage for the work they do but not at the obscene amounts they get currently.

 

[Silencio]

Amrabat would be a very useful player for United. Casemiro needs rotation, and was a bit too prone to cards and suspension at the hands of English refs last season. The two can play together for those big matches where they need more steel and defensive ability in midfield without giving up too much creativity.

His purchase would limit opportunities for Kobbie Mainoo, but the lad is only 18 and shouldn't be thrust totally in the deep end. If all goes well, he could have a Garnacho-like impact.

Anthony Elanga is off to Forest, a club that is at about his level. Best of luck, lad. Hope there are more sales coming soon: probably two out of three of Fred, McTominay, and van der Beek.