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The absolute WORST keyboard EVER
- Thread starter prism
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They did with most of the other issues. The 2011 GPU problem was not fixed, they just replaced with refurbished or new boards having the same issue.
Well, it rather depends if there is an easy solution that doesn't involve substantially re-designing the laptop. Root problem seems to be that the keyboard has been made too thin to ever be reliable, compounded by the fact that it can't be replaced without also replacing the entire top case assembly. Maybe they could revise the top case design to accommodate a thicker keyboard or, at least, make the keyboard replaceable to reduce the costs of repeat repairs - but that would involve substantial re-tooling. Might be easier to just eat the repair costs...
The $64,000 question is whether they're going to (a) accept that the 2016 design was a lemon and produce a better (=thicker) design for 2018/2019, (b) ignore the problem rely on charging ever increasing mark-ups to a dwindling core of die-hard MacOS users or, (c), did I hear someone say that they don't understand why someone would want anything other than an iPad Pro...?
On the other hand, wasn't there a story that the 2016 design was a kludge because of hitches with the advanced battery - presumably a 'terraced' design like the MacBook? Maybe we'll get a new 'tapered' design that looks ultra-slim because of the 3mm edges but still has a sensible internal volume.
The Air's GPU is underpowered, at best. You might consider a 2015 era 15'' MacBook Pro with the Radeon Pro graphics, which should be more than ample power for your needs.
RETURN it. You would rather be stuck with a defective computer because your 'tired'? WTF reality is this?
The first return was because you had buyer's remorse, it's not even like you keep getting defective units. Defects happen... which is part of the reason the return policy exists. The Air is quite a bit slower at this point, especially given the refresh that happened today..
The important fact I think is that Apple won’t carry over that issue into their new quad core and hex core designed MBPs. Even in the above example of the 2011 GPU issue, Apple redesigned the internals of 2012 and later models so that this issue didn’t exist anymore. Sure it was still a problem for those with that specific model year, but anyone buying a newer version of the machine wouldn’t have the issues.
Now that Apple has responded with a repair program for the keyboard, I would fully expect them to have a “fix” to the issue on the new releases.
Naw brah. Of course its going back. Since she is a beginner in doing video editing, she's trying to figure out which laptop to get now since the 2016 model we bought from the store are all sold out. Yea, I seen the refresh models that dropped today. Since her budget is between $1200-$1300. Might wait for refurb 2017's models to pop up.
It remains to be proven whether the keyboard on the just-released 2018 MBPro's will be much different or "improved". Only time and "usage in the field" will yield the answers to that.
I believe the root of the problems is in the design concept itself. That is, "too thin to be robust enough for the rigors of day-to-day usage". But again, we'll have to wait for reports of failures with the latest design, as they come in.
I'd like to see Apple release a "MacBook Pro-retro" -- an improved motherboard in the 2015-style case with legacy ports. I'll bet that such an item would sell quite well.
Just dreamin', though. I doubt it could ever happen.
I believe the root of the problems is in the design concept itself. That is, "too thin to be robust enough for the rigors of day-to-day usage". But again, we'll have to wait for reports of failures with the latest design, as they come in.
I'd like to see Apple release a "MacBook Pro-retro" -- an improved motherboard in the 2015-style case with legacy ports. I'll bet that such an item would sell quite well.
Just dreamin', though. I doubt it could ever happen.
Well, that wasn't entirely clear in your first post bro. Maybe you wouldn't get confusing responses to confusing posts...
Save up. $400 more and you get a significantly faster machine.
Unfortunately I think you’ll be kept dreaming for some time my friend! You know how often Apple reverses their mind and re-releases one of the “retro” designs... never!
Also, I’m going to caution that even on these forums, it’ll be hard to gauge if there is an issue with the keyboards themselves on 2018 models. Even old gen (2015 and older) keyboards did have failures, and because this is already a huge issue on the current 2016-17 lineup, you know every post of a keyboard issue on a 2018 MBP will be overblown and it will be hard to judge the scale of the issue.
IMPORTANT: Please note that I am not saying there won’t be an issue, I am just going to be exercising caution on anyone claiming that their 2018 model MacBook Pro has a keyboard failure and Apple hasn’t fixed the issue.
I personally think it’s something Apple can (and may already have) fix on the new models... there are other keyboard in the market place that are shallow and thin like on the 2016-18 MBP (albeit crappy ones), and to my knowledge they don’t all have this kind of issue.
Well, that wasn't entirely clear in your first post bro. Maybe you wouldn't get confusing responses to confusing posts...
Save up. $400 more and you get a significantly faster machine.
I feel you green. Thanks for the advice.
I had a sticking and sporadically inop CAPS LOCK key on my 2016 tbMBP. Brought it in to be repaired on July 4th. Despite bringing it in on a holiday, they turned it around in 5 days, and was ready Monday at noon for pickup.
Now of course being without your machine for a period of days can be inconvenient. I managed with my iPad.
But, there is a huge upside to the repair aside from the new keyboard. they have to swap out the logic board and, more importantly, the battery. So after leaving my laptop for 5 days, I essentially have a new machine in the old chassis. For me it was worth the inconvenience.
The one thing I would like to know-are the keyboards replaced as part of the repair program the last gen, or the latest gen that is part of the refresh launching today?
They may as well have thrown away the old laptop and given you a new one, since only the display and bottom cover didn't get replaced. Saving those is hardly worth the repair cost to Apple let alone the downtime to you.
Thicker is not better. Going back to thicker would be a downgrade - they need to make it reliable with the same level of thickness.
I completely agree. It was a torture to use on lap and while traveling. I had been using on desk with Magic Keyboard 99% time though. Even MacBook 12 2015 keyboard is much better in comparison. Waiting to get the replaced topcase of the MBP 2016. Let's see which keyboard they replace it with...
Thickness is absolutely the problem: thinner components have tighter engineering tolerances and are inherently more susceptible to dust, thermal distortion etc. and thinner key caps are more susceptible to breaking if you remove them for cleaning. Permanently attaching the keyboard to the top case is all about reducing thickness, too.
Then there's all of the people who prefer a keyboard with a bit of key travel. Yes, its subjective: some people don't like the feel of the new keyboard, others do (when it works) but the previous 2010 keyboard was a really, really good compromise between key travel and thinness: after the initial OMG! Its a PC Jr/PET 2001 chiclet keyboard!!! shock had worn off I don't recall anybody here begging Apple for a better keyboard (at least, in terms of feel).
You don't get to choose the keyboard in a laptop: its not the place for a "Marmite" (people either love it or loathe it) keyboard.
Its as if they really, really want a near-solid-state, touch sensitive 'haptic' keyboard (which would have huge reliability and dust-tolerance advantages to offset any limitations in the 'feel') but haven't invented one yet so they're floundering around to try and make something that looks the part (see also the silly 'oops we haven't invented thru-display selfie cameras yet' iPhone notch).
I'm happy that some people enjoy the 2016-2018 keyboards..
I just doesn't work for me.
To me it's a horrific experience that totally lacks feel and softness and doesn't allow my fingers to exact any subtlety and variation in my typing flow, which is well ingrained in me after all these decades.
There's a sort of "thinking through my fingers" that can only happen when I have a certain amount of key travel to work with and partially to fully depress as I go, and I really really love a softer bottom out (it still happens to me occasionally - the bottom out) for comfort on longer form writing and hashing out ideas and when things get furiously fast and flowy.
The Magic Keyboard is about my limit on "low travel" honestly. I do like that keyboard quite a bit, but even it isn't nearly as comfortable to me as the 2015 (and earlier) MBP keyboards, and certainly not even close to something like a Topre, AEK or even Model M
I just doesn't work for me.
To me it's a horrific experience that totally lacks feel and softness and doesn't allow my fingers to exact any subtlety and variation in my typing flow, which is well ingrained in me after all these decades.
There's a sort of "thinking through my fingers" that can only happen when I have a certain amount of key travel to work with and partially to fully depress as I go, and I really really love a softer bottom out (it still happens to me occasionally - the bottom out) for comfort on longer form writing and hashing out ideas and when things get furiously fast and flowy.
The Magic Keyboard is about my limit on "low travel" honestly. I do like that keyboard quite a bit, but even it isn't nearly as comfortable to me as the 2015 (and earlier) MBP keyboards, and certainly not even close to something like a Topre, AEK or even Model M
Having such a different keyboard on my laptop and a different type on my imac makes it very difficult to work productively on either of them.
Cleaning the laptop is a problem. The chassis inevitably gets dust in between the keys. I am afraid to clean it properly since I may damage the delicate keys.
Cleaning the laptop is a problem. The chassis inevitably gets dust in between the keys. I am afraid to clean it properly since I may damage the delicate keys.
The membrane on the new MacBook Pro keyboard does not fix the fundamental problem, which is, there is INSUFFICIENT KEY TRAVEL to provide a satisfying typing experience. It feels like pushing buttons rather than keys. There is no tactile response.
These shallow MacBook keyboards may be fine for producing short blogs or posting on social media, but not for writing longer works - such as articles, scripts or books. (I suspect that the people who designed this keyboard never write anything longer than a two-page email).
Apple used to make the best – most responsive - keyboards in the business. Their obsession with ‘thin-ness’ has blinded them to the pitfalls of shallow key travel.
I'm holding on to my old 2015 MacBook until Apple increases the amount of key travel. If they don't, then I will (reluctantly) move to an IBM Thinkpad which offers a proper keyboard.
These shallow MacBook keyboards may be fine for producing short blogs or posting on social media, but not for writing longer works - such as articles, scripts or books. (I suspect that the people who designed this keyboard never write anything longer than a two-page email).
Apple used to make the best – most responsive - keyboards in the business. Their obsession with ‘thin-ness’ has blinded them to the pitfalls of shallow key travel.
I'm holding on to my old 2015 MacBook until Apple increases the amount of key travel. If they don't, then I will (reluctantly) move to an IBM Thinkpad which offers a proper keyboard.
I totally agree.
We can buy $300 computers with a more reliable keyboard. This is a problem. Apple needs to feel it in the pocket book or they will never change. I am a hobbyist iOS developer so I need a Mac. Truth be told I like OSX better than Windows but their HW division I am not pleased with.
Reminds me of that "rock-star" developer who develops an awesome website that works for 90% but the old website it replaced worked 100% of the time.
Style over substance.
They need to come out with a "Classic" laptop series.
Nothing crazy, but normal keyboard, bigger battery and replaceable SSD and memory by bottom cover. I bet it would sell through the roof. But of course Timmy knows best......
The 2016 MBP's keyboard is absolute garbage. And Apple has denied the problem for almost 2 years