This was my though process going in as well. I also show work on my iPad, so based on h00ligan's findings, the Mini Retina is now off the table. I will make a definite decision in store, but I am 90 percent certain that my purchase will be the Air. Luckily, it is light enough that I am not giving up portability in going that route.
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All iPads The Color Gamut Thread
- Thread starter comatose81
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This was my though process going in as well. I also show work on my iPad, so based on h00ligan's findings, the Mini Retina is now off the table. I will make a definite decision in store, but I am 90 percent certain that my purchase will be the Air. Luckily, it is light enough that I am not giving up portability in going that route.
I am not a photographer or graphic designer but I am really picky when it comes to colors-saturation on my devices maybe my Dell U2711 can get over saturated if I go over 60% on digital vibrancy yes but I love to play games that way
yes my note 3 is over saturated and looks like the icons are popping out of the screen but I love it when it comes to watch movies I have to change the screen mode to standard or movie because if not the film looks like a cartoon
when it comes to my ipad air everything is balanced watching movies is amazing the colors are beautiful and playing games is awesome why? because I think the air has the perfect color gamut and saturation to achieve that contrary to my wife's mini that looks dull and hardly enjoyable like my son's ipod 4th but heck they don't care right ? well that's because they don't know better and again I am not a professional photographer or nothing like that
I was going to exchange my air when the mini showed but now no thanks just based on my personal preference I am keeping the ipad air.
yes my note 3 is over saturated and looks like the icons are popping out of the screen but I love it when it comes to watch movies I have to change the screen mode to standard or movie because if not the film looks like a cartoon
when it comes to my ipad air everything is balanced watching movies is amazing the colors are beautiful and playing games is awesome why? because I think the air has the perfect color gamut and saturation to achieve that contrary to my wife's mini that looks dull and hardly enjoyable like my son's ipod 4th but heck they don't care right ? well that's because they don't know better and again I am not a professional photographer or nothing like that
I was going to exchange my air when the mini showed but now no thanks just based on my personal preference I am keeping the ipad air.
I'm not a display engineer, but here's my explanation in laymen's terms.
Color gamut is essentially the range of colors available in a profile/color space. There's sRGB and then there's Adobe RGB or wide gamut. Both sRGB and Adobe RGB/wide gamut have the same amount of data, the difference is that wide gamut stretches out each color further.
What does this mean? Wide gamut will appear duller in sRGB environments such as the web because it can't display certain colors from Wide Gamut. So now you're asking why would anyone want wide gamut? Well because wide gamut offers a wider range of colors and photographers are able to get certain super saturated colors that aren't available in sRGB.
So you got color profiles, next you need a display that can actually display those colors. This is where all the gamut rating percentages come into play.
Still don't get it? Just make sure your device is close to 100% sRGB as possible.
Color gamut is essentially the range of colors available in a profile/color space. There's sRGB and then there's Adobe RGB or wide gamut. Both sRGB and Adobe RGB/wide gamut have the same amount of data, the difference is that wide gamut stretches out each color further.
What does this mean? Wide gamut will appear duller in sRGB environments such as the web because it can't display certain colors from Wide Gamut. So now you're asking why would anyone want wide gamut? Well because wide gamut offers a wider range of colors and photographers are able to get certain super saturated colors that aren't available in sRGB.
So you got color profiles, next you need a display that can actually display those colors. This is where all the gamut rating percentages come into play.
Still don't get it? Just make sure your device is close to 100% sRGB as possible.
The Color Gamut Thread
There's an app that allows external calibrations on the ipad?
Interesting. I didn't realize there was a spyder companion for ipad. I'll try it today.
Yup. Just ran it and when viewing images via that app it matches perfectly. So as expected. It's a calibration issue.
Also as stated above wide gamut is great. But the bottom line is while you can use an app to display color accurate portfolios, thanks for letting me know about that., it doesn't help if you're using photo smith in your workflow or other tools which manipulate color. While the air does have some added correction from the data color app, it's very very minor compared to the retina mini.
So if you want a portfolio shower and ow a. Spyder, it's fine if you don't care about the odd colors on pages like fredmiranda, if you care about colors in native apps the air, at least betweent eh air and mini retina I have is a better choice.
I would love apple to allow photographers to set color profiles.
Also wide gamut is great for your work and showing it off. But print is a whole different story and web presentation is practically impossible to ensure proper colors to an entire audience.
If data color built in a web browser that would be mint.
There's an app that allows external calibrations on the ipad?
Interesting. I didn't realize there was a spyder companion for ipad. I'll try it today.
Yup. Just ran it and when viewing images via that app it matches perfectly. So as expected. It's a calibration issue.
Also as stated above wide gamut is great. But the bottom line is while you can use an app to display color accurate portfolios, thanks for letting me know about that., it doesn't help if you're using photo smith in your workflow or other tools which manipulate color. While the air does have some added correction from the data color app, it's very very minor compared to the retina mini.
So if you want a portfolio shower and ow a. Spyder, it's fine if you don't care about the odd colors on pages like fredmiranda, if you care about colors in native apps the air, at least betweent eh air and mini retina I have is a better choice.
I would love apple to allow photographers to set color profiles.
Also wide gamut is great for your work and showing it off. But print is a whole different story and web presentation is practically impossible to ensure proper colors to an entire audience.
If data color built in a web browser that would be mint.
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Blues look blue to me on the mini. Maybe I'm not cultured enough to know what colors are supposed to look like, but they look just fine to me.
The Color Gamut Thread
Or you could have a different display manufacturer. I can post an image of the default difference in calibration but it's really difficult to capture and especially not going to happen with an iPhone.
For photographers working with a spyder portfolio showing works great via the data color app. I'm not sure how I never saw that app before.
Or you could have a different display manufacturer. I can post an image of the default difference in calibration but it's really difficult to capture and especially not going to happen with an iPhone.
For photographers working with a spyder portfolio showing works great via the data color app. I'm not sure how I never saw that app before.
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I can't seem to find a portion of the app either on the desktop side or ipad side which specifies gamut percentage unfortunately. It's not as robust as the Mac version clearly but it would be nice to see the measurements. Maybe I'm just missing it and it's there.
So wait....this app allows you to calibrate the iPad screen but only for that app?
What did you calibrate? The Air or the rMini?
-Kevin
The Color Gamut Thread
Yah so basically it's a portfolio app that works in concert with your spyder calibrator. I calibrated both the rmini and the air. The air difference was nominal. The rmini difference was very clear. Blue is particularly bad this quick snap shows
So if I wanted to show a portfolio to a client I'd open the data color app and access that gallery from within there, it has used the hardware calibrator to write a profile into its own app.
What this shows is again, it's not a gamut issue, the rmini has bad color calibration. Frankly it's something they could probably roll an update out for - I'm sure there are some frameworks for display calibration.
Anyway. Here is an iPhone shot of a picture of my car, the top is much closer. Now, this shot shows about half the real difference. In real life the mini looks almost surf blue.
I will get a real camera and grey card out with a neutral separator at some point to better illustrate what I mean. But just think. The rmini, the car is nearly Laguna seca blue(smurf blue) this iPhone snap shows very little of the issue, but it's a beginning. It was shot in a pitch black room, so it looks a lot closer than it really is.
I will do so,etching that better shows the difference Than this but it's not gamut. It's calibration.
Air
Rmini
Yah so basically it's a portfolio app that works in concert with your spyder calibrator. I calibrated both the rmini and the air. The air difference was nominal. The rmini difference was very clear. Blue is particularly bad this quick snap shows
So if I wanted to show a portfolio to a client I'd open the data color app and access that gallery from within there, it has used the hardware calibrator to write a profile into its own app.
What this shows is again, it's not a gamut issue, the rmini has bad color calibration. Frankly it's something they could probably roll an update out for - I'm sure there are some frameworks for display calibration.
Anyway. Here is an iPhone shot of a picture of my car, the top is much closer. Now, this shot shows about half the real difference. In real life the mini looks almost surf blue.
I will get a real camera and grey card out with a neutral separator at some point to better illustrate what I mean. But just think. The rmini, the car is nearly Laguna seca blue(smurf blue) this iPhone snap shows very little of the issue, but it's a beginning. It was shot in a pitch black room, so it looks a lot closer than it really is.
I will do so,etching that better shows the difference Than this but it's not gamut. It's calibration.
Air
Rmini
Interesting stuff....thanks for taking the time.
I don't have an Air.....and generally only use the rMini exclusively, so none of this is really an issue with me.
-Kevin
Outside of photographers, I can't see his being a deal breaker for most people. I'll do a properly calibrated and neutrally balanced shot from a real photo displayed on both a bit later. It will really illustrate it.
Most photographers that would care enough about this already own a calibration tool of some kind. So the net result not his panel is, if I watch a movie the blue skies look more teal than they are. If you aren't worrying about icc profiles and embedding, none of this should matter. If you are and want a mini. Use the data color app.
Yeah there are ways to test color gamut. How do you think displays are tested and calibrated? Maybe this will shut you up since you have been trolling all these threads spewing nonsense. Here are some facts.
http://www.displaymate.com/iPad_ShootOut_1.htm
http://www.displaymate.com/Gamut_9.html
It's worth noting that the iPad air isn't necessarily a good reference point, as it produces 108% of the sRGB color gamut (there's that word that many here don't understand!), according to displaymate.
So even a display that reproduces a perfect 100% of the sRGB color gamut will look "slightly washed out" compared to the iPad Air.
So even a display that reproduces a perfect 100% of the sRGB color gamut will look "slightly washed out" compared to the iPad Air.
Wow. Those pixels on the non-retina look awful. Amazing what the camera captures that regular eyesight missed sometimes.
Gotta say.....the more pictures I see, regardless of whether it's "correct" or not, to me the iPad Air is almost always looking OVER-saturated to me.
I will say that at times for some things the rMini does look a tad UNDER-saturated....but honestly to my eye, the rMini looks more natural.
And please realize, to me and to lots of people, this is going to be a personal preference....right or wrong people will either like it or not. If you don't, return it and move on. If you do like it....then be happy.
-Kevin
Really? What nonsense is that, exactly? I read those links and it hardly seems these folks used their eyeballs to measure the gamut.
Gamut. Gamut. Gamut.
What exactly is that is bothering you so much that you'd be so hostile?
I don't mean any offense, but I find it completely hilarious that you apparently 'missed' the obvious shortcomings of the original mini, yet all over the forums you are crying foul on those who are perceptive enough to detect display issues.
That picture didn't show me anything that I wasn't able to immediately detect with the naked eye.
I didn't "miss" anything. It just didn't look THAT obvious when handling them myself vs. looking at the picture. Or are you going to tell me the camera/pictures captures exactly what a human would see?
I am not crying foul. You must have me confused with someone else. I seldom cry. What I am sometimes amazed by is the super human eyesight capabilities of some posters.
I didn't "miss" anything. It just didn't look THAT obvious when handling them myself vs. looking at the picture. Or are you going to tell me the camera/pictures captures exactly what a human would see?
I am not crying foul. You must have me confused with someone else. I seldom cry. What I am sometimes amazed by is the super human eyesight capabilities of some posters.
It's not superhuman to see the color disparity between the Air and rMini. Colors are way more vibrant on the former, sadly, and look rather dull on the latter. In isolation, though, the rMini stills looks good, and is a big stride over the original in sharpness, though only sharpness alone.
From what I have seen the Mini looks more real to me. It's no surprise people are calling it washed out because most people love saturated displays (AMOLED) and are used to those unrealistic colors. I have never been a fan of those displays and have always found I liked the duller looking ones better.For instance, I thought the Nexus 4 display was great and the Moto X display was garbage. The HTC One display is great, while all Samsung screens are garbage. I don't think I will have a problem with the Mini screen.
Really? What nonsense is that, exactly? I read those links and it hardly seems these folks used their eyeballs to measure the gamut.
Gamut. Gamut. Gamut.
What exactly is that is bothering you so much that you'd be so hostile?
If you act like a child you will be treated as such. I refer to all the posts you say gamut gamut gamut and make light of the actual topic at hand.
Considering the gamut of the devices is almost 40 percent less that means it's perfectly visible to the human eye. Take any photo and reduce the saturation. If it doesn't look less saturated then you need some serious eye surgery. Just because you may not see it doesn't mean others don't , hence all the people here that do see it and are posting here!
If you wish to contribute something meaningful to the conversation do so, otherwise you are just trolling. Maybe you need to look that word up to understand as well.