The EU Wants All Phones to Work With Interoperable Chargers, Here’s What That Means for Apple's Lightning Port

[Luke MacWalker]

USB-C is so simple: power cable only, data cable only, power+data cable… all looking exactly the same (except good quality high power capable cables that are thicker and harder to curb… perfect for a phone!). If nothing change, I’m afraid the “significant issues" faced by “almost a fifth of people” will be different but as significant or more (it’s “painfully funny” to read reviews of USB-C monitors: many people sent back their monitors because it didn’t show any image… because it was connected with a USB-C PD only cable)

I’m also pretty sure the sale prices of phones will not change, every manufacturer will just pocket the $5-10 cost of cables and chargers, and sell both separately for $10 and $20-$50. This will be good for the customers! 😄

 

[Ronlap]

And the EU wonders why Brexit happened? Proof right here. Suppress freedom and innovation one rule at a time.

 

[xalea]

And to reduce clutter & waste..
Everyone should drink the same beer and eat the same chips and drive the same car & ride the same bike and live in identical houses and have 1.2 children - Where does it stop?

They don't want it to stop. They know better than you, thus you need to buy the products they deem appropriate, take the classes they want you to take, and so on. This is what communism amounts to and what many in the US want because they feel themselves to be superior to the rest of us.

 

[cmaier]

You are aware that without the government, companies will end up hurting workers, the environment and customers? They’re only in the game to make a profit.

And nobody in government wants to make a profit

 

[deeddawg]

There’s nothing stupid about this. Companies shouldn’t create new plugs just to sell more chargers.

What if a company wants to create a new plug to provide better/enhanced capabilities as a competitive advantage and thereby draw more consumers? Say it's a upstart company with some really clever ideas?

How does that work in such a framework? It doesn't.

 

[chucker23n1]

These EU lawmakers aren't Millennials.

The average MEP is 49.5, so quite a few probably are.

 

[deeddawg]

And nobody in government wants to make a profit

Of course not. They're there for the lobbying money.

 

[chucker23n1]

I’ve been using lightning cables since iPhone 5, never seen a spark, ever!

nice photo editing, almost looks real

Edit:BTW pin 4 is the identification/control pinout

It’s pin 5, and it is indeed often burnt.
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Ah, the government. Rather than let consumers decide, we just call in Big Brother to handle it for us. Good for us, because you know everything the government gets involved in turns out to be cutting edge!

If you think this is a good decision, please read Basic Economics by Thomas Sowell:

“Sowell has compared Barack Obama to Adolf Hitler, saying that the similarities were obvious when Barack Obama created a relief fund for the BP oil spill.”

OK, heard enough about this dude.

 

[theluggage]

when the EU first proposed this, it would’ve been micro-USB.

They did. It was... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_external_power_supply#History
...and it had an expiry date, which was extended twice. It ran out in 2014.

The detailed legislation for the new initiative hasn't been written yet, but if it's sane it will again have an expiry date. The problem is, this time around, they're showing signs of wanting to bash Apple rather than being sensible.

it will have zero impact in e-waste as more and more cables will continue to be thrown away due to wear and tear this is unavoidable.

...but it is better than the bad old days when every phone came with a proprietary cable (often unique to that model let alone brand) permanently attached to the power brick, so the whole adapter was landfill. Today, most phone/tablet adapters have a USB-A socket so only the cable needs changing... which is what the EU should have been insisting on all along rather than focussing on the phone end of the connection.

Not sure if the EU isn't spitting in the ocean and taking credit for the tide here, though - once smartphones started being full-blown pocket computers rather than, well, just phones, it started making sense to give them USB - and if you put a USB socket in the charger then you only have to ship one cable for both charging and hooking to a computer...


The other missed step is to stop chargers (with the minimum power capacity they can get away with) being bundled with the phones. Instead, you'd just buy one or two high-power chargers that worked with all your devices.

I've sometimes travelled with an iPad, a Kindle and a phone (so, shoot me) and its great just to be able to take the iPad adapter (the most powerful) and two cables rather than three adapters... If those devices hadn't come with their own just-good-enough power bricks, I'd have removed a whole little toe from my carbon footprint and the planet would be saved and we could all eat as much meat as we wanted... maybe
:->

different AC Adaptors will continue as no one can do them all, all devices have different power requirements and making all be rated to the max so they can be used on all is just wasteful as this would require more materials to be used as AC Adaptors giving out less power are smaller for that reason.

The hidden advantage of forcing USB-C would come by making everything conform to the USB-C power delivery spec: so you could plug any device into any PSU with the confidence that the device would negotiate the voltage/current with the power supply and, at worst, nothing would get damaged. MicroUSB was partly there but I think a lot of chargers failed to meet the then USB battery charging spec and only charged at low current.

the Raspberry Pi used micro USB yet I had to buy a Power Supply design for it not use my existing one as it was no good

Raspberry Pi is not a phone - it can need every drop of the max 2.5A that vanilla MicroUSB can deliver, and if it doesn't get it, things stop working (whereas a phone would still charge slowly). Version 4 with USB-C charging should have been better except they stuffed up the design and it didn't work properly with higher-power chargers (fixed in the latest revisions, I believe). Also, the Pi is very aggressively "built down" to that $35 price by leaving no corner uncut - so I'd cut it a few more breaks than a $1000 phone.

also UK plugs are different to the US and do on.

Not a bad idea when UK plugs are carrying twice the voltage and a different AC frequency, plus they are individually fused and have a safer socket design with shutters over live/neutral that only open when the earth pin is pushed in. I think the reason that the EU never tried to impose a standard mains socket is that the UK one would have won any rational contest for the safest design, and we can't have that. Anyway, most IT devices have a standard IEC socket of some sort on the other end. Note that, unlike USB-C, these are all dumb connectors where the wrong voltage/current/polarity can be dangerous, so different shaped connectors serve a purpose.

 

[deeddawg]

“Sowell has compared Barack Obama to Adolf Hitler, saying that the similarities were obvious when Barack Obama created a relief fund for the BP oil spill.”

OK, heard enough about this dude.

It is not uncommon for critics of an author to vastly exaggerate some minor reference in an article that was the articles point.

I suggest folks read the original article before just blindly drawing judgement on the author's entire body of work. Find which specific line "compared Barack Obama to Adolf Hitler". As that is tangential to this thread, I'll just suggest it as homework to do on one's own rather than creating a new line of debate.

 

[Steve63]

It is simple.

If Apple changes their port, accessories have to be replaced.

You want to use your new iPhone in your car? Nope, because the EU banned the lightning port.

Apple users have plenty of lightning cables and the Eu forcing us to switch will cause a huge waste of cables.

Hypocrites.

Fully agree. As i said before, what might help a bit is that Apples does deliver devices with chargers & cables (i have many of them now from old devices that are not in use anymore...). If people replace their iPhones they can use their old charging stuff ...

 

[cmaier]

It is not uncommon for critics of an author to vastly exaggerate some minor reference in an article that was the articles point.

I suggest folks read the original article before just blindly drawing judgement on the author's entire body of work. Find which specific line "compared Barack Obama to Adolf Hitler". As that is tangential to this thread, I'll just suggest it as homework to do on one's own rather than creating a new line of debate.

The dude compares a cleanup fund to destroying our democracy. He’s nuts.

 

[lordofthereef]

I've been asking for this for years lol. As it stands we just have the stupid lightning for our iPhones. Everything else in the house that takes a charge is usb c.

Unfortunately, at this point, it will be a couple years until we upgrade. But in all for it.

 

[deeddawg]

The dude compares a cleanup fund to destroying our democracy. He’s nuts.

Where does he do that? Please cite the passage.

 

[cmaier]

I've been asking for this for years lol. As it stands we just have the stupid lightning for our iPhones. Everything else in the house that takes a charge is usb c.

Unfortunately, at this point, it will be a couple years until we upgrade. But in all for it.

Except for your electric shaver. And your toaster. And your curling iron. And every other electrical appliance that requires a different wall cord depending on which country you are in in the EU (and sometimes which town you are in in that country).

 

[chucker23n1]

It is not uncommon for critics of an author to vastly exaggerate some minor reference in an article that was the articles point.

I suggest folks read the original article before just blindly drawing judgement on the author's entire body of work. Find which specific line "compared Barack Obama to Adolf Hitler". As that is tangential to this thread, I'll just suggest it as homework to do on one's own rather than creating a new line of debate.

So you’re saying “he didn’t literally compare Hitler and Obama; he only used a Hitler analogy to make a point about Obama”.
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Where does he do that? Please cite the passage.

That’s the premise of the entire article: that government using large amounts of tax money is bad regardless of whether it’s to clean an oil spill or to murder millions.

 

[magbarn]

All my usb c ports on my MacBooks get loose over time and now pop out easily despite new cables while my iPhone 8 which has had much more charging cycles still feels new. I’m surprised not that many people notice this...

 

[cmaier]

All my usb c ports on my MacBooks get loose over time and now pop out easily despite new cables while my iPhone 8 which has had much more charging cycles still feels new. I’m surprised not that many people notice this...

I sure noticed it - I commented on it above. If i even move my MBP a little bit, the power cord loses contact, in all 4 of the ports.

 

[kmann1983]

Sometimes companies, like Apple in this case, need to be forced to play well with others.
It's kind of ridiculous Apple just cheesed the rules and didn't care about the consumer.
Imagine it like this. You have 15 standards. You get most companies to cooperate and one company (Apple, in this case) barely cooperates but still keeps their own going. So now you still have 2 standards. That's not entirely fair to the others that cooperated.

Plus Apple hasn't really shown what specific innovation would be inhibited. Clearly Apple itself hasn't innovated much since it's still using the same Lightning port. It concerns me that Apple is on the board for USB-C and Apple won't jump to USB-C. It makes me question if they are sabotaging it or simply inept in the power and data field.

Apple had a solid position to help guide an open standard but decided to stand firm on it's money making proprietary standard.

Further, the only people to complain about USB-C are talking about poor implementations. So far all of Apple's (which are few) implementations have been fairly solid so there's no reason to think they can't do it.

Perhaps the shareholder is more important than e-waste and the consumer. At which point we need government to step in and force Apple to cooperate or suffer penalties which outweigh shareholder benefits.

Finally, the EU isn't saying you can't innovate anymore. They are saying if you're going to bring something to the table -- then bring it to the table. So far all they see is fear mongering and nothing, NOTHING, of substance from any company.

Clearly we migrated from mini to micro to USB-C -- so transitions ARE allowed -- so more fear mongering exists via the fear of "never" changing.

So we see no reason to trust Apple in this specific regard because Apple is failing to cooperate or when they do it's as minimal as possible and without much justification.

 

[cmaier]

It's kind of ridiculous Apple just cheesed the rules and didn't care about the consumer.

What imaginary rules are those?

 

[Neepman]

If ever there was a company that should be able to tell the EU thugs to stick it, it should be apple. But they cave and we are stuck with a bad solution.

 

[Juicy Box]

I am surprised with the amount of posts that are okay with this overreaching of government.

 

[cmaier]

I am surprised with the amount of posts that are okay with this overreaching of government.

Many people are only concerned with the short term benefit to them, instead of the long term detriment to everyone else (or even the long term detriment to themselves).

 

[iliria]

I'd start by avoiding bundling cables and wall plugs with the smartphones.
I have plenty of lighting cables, don't need a new one each time I buy an iPhone. That would reduce waste.
I'd also avoid shipping earphones, a lot of people end up using bluetooth accessories so it is another waste of plastic and wires.
If you really need the cable you can purchase it separately, but the majority of customers would just use the stuff they have at home.

So, what would new customers who have never used the particular brand of phone do? As far as lightning cables go they are not unbreakable. I have had to throw away plenty that have broken down.

As for earphones, there are plenty of people that do not want to use Bluetooth. However, I do agree with you that manufacturers can get rid of the earphones that come in the box. People often end up buying better quality ones.

Please explain. I have Huawei P20 Pro which I have sometimes charged with my son's Samsung charger/cable and he has done the opposite. That is the benefit of having USB-C connection on both phones.

Out of personal choice, I never have and never will consider Huawei (although plenty of people like them). If they have adopted the same system as Samsung then that's good news. My comment was aimed more towards Apple and any other manufacturer that haven't.

The point I'm trying to make is that the sooner companies adopt a universal charging system, the better. What that universal system is should be decided by all companies together. If they can't decide then lawmakers should intervene.

Some people try to downplay this as just a stupid decision or something trivial. In reality this is a small step towards reducing waste. Small or big does not matter. What matters is that we are starting somewhere.

 

[chucker23n1]

Sometimes companies, like Apple in this case, need to be forced to play well with others.

Yep.

Plus Apple hasn't really shown what specific innovation would be inhibited.

Yes they did. When this legislation started, it wanted to mandate micro-USB. Apple showed that Lightning is better in several ways (such as being reversible).

If you're arguing that Apple should change ports faster, they don't want to and shouldn't. The Dock connector lasted for eight years. Lightning is now eight years old. Maybe we'll get something different soon anyway. Maybe USB-C. Maybe they'll phase out physical connection altogether.

But Apple does have a point regarding innovation.
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The point I'm trying to make is that the sooner companies adopt a universal charging system, the better.

It really isn't that simple, though. IT is a fast-moving industry. Imagine if the EU mandated that all websites use a version of HTML frozen in time today.