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The I'm waiting for the new 2013 Haswell models thread

What you want in the next generation rMBP.

I have a 2012 15" rMBP and we all know there has been some issues. It does preform much better now than the day I first bought it. However, there are some things I am hoping for in the next generation.

Processor: Haswell upgrade with HD 4600. I understand it uses significantly less power. Also I would like the 13" to be quad core if that is possible, it might be a heat issue though.

Ram: I have 16GB and it has been plenty and the 1600MHz DDR3L has been awesome. I would like the 13" to have a 16GB option.

Graphics: I feel that at least 2GB of video ram is needed for such a pixel dense screen. I can't say what series but I think a decent graphics boost is needed. Also, the 13" should have discrete graphics. Other 13" ultrabooks have it so why not this "pro" macbook line. It doesn't have to be the same chip found on the 15" but just something more than the onboard graphics.

SSD: Here I would just like a higher base capacity than 256GB.

Preview: It needs GPU accelerated scrolling. I am a product design student and I bought my rMBP to view and edit high fidelity images. Preview is extremely choppy. Just apply the same code that was added to Safari. I don't understand why it hasn't been done.

In general I want the 13" to be more in line with the 15" and the main difference between them being the screen size. I know they can't be exactly the same but I don't want Apple holding back on the 13" model.
 
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Ah, great thread.

I have a 2011 13in MBA and have been eyeing the 13in rMBP since the day it came out. I've almost bought one a few times (education discount, refurb, here on MacRumors, open-box at Best Buy, etc.)... but the truth is, I don't really need one right now, just would love to have one!

The 2nd gen should be sweet though and I can't wait 'til this summer when it (probably) lands. Gosh I hope I'm employed :p
 
jNSK said:
While I agree with that, this is a consumer society my friend. Yes, the newer ones are probably around the corner, but I bought one a few days ago anyway (still waiting for it to come in the mail).

If you spend your time waiting you may be disappointed that you didn't buy it earlier - the current rMBP's are by no means a product to be frowned upon, they are excellent machines and the lag issues are all software-based (software has been improving hence the lag has been improving).

Let's take the nVidia 700-series for example. For my desktop PC, I was going to wait until the middle of this year and get one. I bit the bullet early and got a GTX 680. I'm glad I did that now because they've announced the 700-series are now out in 2014. My point is - my philosophy is that you should buy what's out now and be happy with it (you will be happy with it). It's not going to suddenly be obsolete just because a model with a better processor gets released. Haswell gains are focused more on battery life than they are performance increases...apparently.
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+1. Ordered my 15" rMBP about a week ago. Still waiting for it and sure I won't be disappointed!
 
That's just crazy, unless you know that the GPU is going to be much better than the GT-650M then screw it.

The processor speed will still be only be marginally better, power consumption probably won't be noticeable either.

I got the 15 inch model with the hi-res antiglare screen 8gb RAM 2.7Ghz CPU with 8MB L3 cache and 1024GB GT-650M.

This thing acts as a desktop replacement for me.

If your going for the smaller 13 inch model, them it won't matey at all since your probably not going to use it for serious computing anyway, so the GPU issue is nonexistent.

What it comes down to is I buy stuff that works. I would just use Linux, but I don't want to recompile the kernel every 5 minutes to get support for a new device that I plug in.

So, the question is: Do you need a system, or do you need to show off your system to those cool people at Starbucks. There is a difference between being reasonable , for instance if you know for a fact in the system was coming out very shortly, or simply being a brainwashed sycophant.

Whatever it is, just buy whatever the heck freaking works for you.:cool:
 
shnn2011 said:
If your going for the smaller 13 inch model, them it won't matey at all since your probably not going to use it for serious computing anyway, so the GPU issue is nonexistent.
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This is the wrong way of thinking about it for some people. People like myself want a 13" screen, but with the power of the 15". If they boost the next 13" to somewhere closer to that of the current 15", I'll be getting one. I don't do seriously demanding tasks on my Macs, but I do on occasion - I can't help but feel the current 13" is nothing more than a typical £800 Samsung laptop in a shiny case and a doubled price tag. I realise that, to some extent, this is related to heat problems, etc., but I don't care why - I'm a consumer.

I'd pay full 15" price for the same spec with a 13" screen, without a second of hesitation. 15" is too big for a portable device, yet still too small to be used without an external display. I've had a 15" for nearly 4 years now (yes it's thicker, but that's not the issue).

I will be using a 27" Thunderbolt Display, I want the smallest possible laptop to go with it...and no, a Mini is not an option due to the lack of it being a standalone laptop when needed. At the moment I'm using my 15" with my 27" iMac in target display mode, and love the setup.

My point is, it's not "pointless" to be waiting for the "Haswell" update if you are looking at getting a 13" rMBP. I say "Haswell" because, honestly, it's just the next generation of the 13" rMBP that may be worth waiting for, not just the Haswell architecture specifically.

Fully agree with you RE Linux. I just wish Samsung would adopt Ubuntu and start banging out some high-quality, fully-compatible hardware.
 
Gene8 said:
So I purchased a retina 13" MacBook Pro about a week ago an decided I better wait for a few months for the new haswell rmp's to arrive,And I returned my retina today and am anticipating a day one purchase of the new haswell chip MacBook Pro with retina display..I guess that's with this thread is for, people that are holding off for the 2013 refresh. Anyone doing the same , vent!
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I'm waiting until late-2014 (3 year turnaround for me), but will keep an eye out for any new models and responses from customers on build quality (actual or perceived).

I'd probably get a 15" version, as a desktop replacement, especially if the cooling allows heavy CPU use and with a sufficiently sized AC power supply.

I won't buy Retina unless I've no other option. There is nothing wrong at 72PPI from 20 inches away and network bandwidth and storage issues are greatly reduced with standard screen sizes. More interestingly, the closer one looks at a screen only causes myopia anyway (articles existed on this in the 1980s regarding kids playing video games while staring too lose at the screen for extended periods of time). Who needs to stare at a 200+PPI screen for 8 hours a day, never mind back and neck problems that would invariably develop?
 
andy9l said:
This is the wrong way of thinking about it for some people. People like myself want a 13" screen, but with the power of the 15". If they boost the next 13" to somewhere closer to that of the current 15", I'll be getting one. I don't do seriously demanding tasks on my Macs, but I do on occasion - I can't help but feel the current 13" is nothing more than a typical £800 Samsung laptop in a shiny case and a doubled price tag. I realise that, to some extent, this is related to heat problems, etc., but I don't care why - I'm a consumer.
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There are some Ivy Bridge quad-core chips (well, only 2 to be more precise) that may have fit into the rMBP 13", but yet Apple decided not to include them.

Reason? They cost $150 extra over the low-end options (and by "low-end", I mean over the $1699 option), and a healthy $50 extra over the highest-end processor (a 2.9GHz dual-core i7) you can configure. And that's for OEM pricing. If Apple were to factor in their regular profit margin, the rMBP 13" with the quad-core chip would end up costing almomst the same or even more than the 15".

And that's not to mention per-core performance wouldn't be as good (2.9GHz nominal for the top-end dual-core vs 2.2GHz for said quad-core chip).

For $100 more, you'd get a faster quad-core chip, a higher resolution screen, more speakers, and discrete graphics chip with the 15".

So pricing-wise, it doesn't make any sense. It makes even less sense if Apple decides to drop the prices of the 15" rMBP, or introduce a cheaper 15" that doesn't have discrete graphics.

Specs-wise, the quad-core chip would push out more heat than the dual-core chip, so unless Apple does something drastic to the rMBP 13" cooling system, it won't be able to do much. They had to increase its thickness over the 15" version just to keep thermals in check with the dual-core chip.

And your last problem is that Haswell heat output seems to have gone up despite power consumption going down... thanks to Intel integrating the voltage regulator directly into the CPU.
 
donster28 said:
The Haswell upgrade is considered a significant upgrade if you look at Apple's and Intel's upgrade history included in this article:

http:///gigaom.com/2013/02/16/tick-tock-why-timing-your-mac-hardware-upgrades-makes-good-sense/
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Uh... no. I think that article came out before Tom's Hardware benchmarked the first desktop Haswell sample and crushed expectations.

Haswell is only 5-10% performance gain processor-wise from Ivy Bridge.
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-4770k-haswell-performance,3461-4.html

The only thing left that Haswell has going for itself is the graphics performance.
 
bill-p said:
Haswell is only 5-10% performance gain processor-wise from Ivy Bridge.
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-4770k-haswell-performance,3461-4.html

The only thing left that Haswell has going for itself is the graphics performance.
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And battery life, supposedly. But the 5-10% processor boost is pretty disappointing. Intel is resting on its laurels. They have no competition aside from ARM's dominance in mobile, which is why the only thing they've really focused on lately is GFX and power consumption for ultrabooks and the like.
 
bill-p said:
For $100 more, you'd get a faster quad-core chip, a higher resolution screen, more speakers, and discrete graphics chip with the 15".

So pricing-wise, it doesn't make any sense. It makes even less sense if Apple decides to drop the prices of the 15" rMBP, or introduce a cheaper 15" that doesn't have discrete graphics.
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Good post, some interesting info! :)

Pricing is not an issue, though. I would pay full 15" pricing for a 13" screen, if it offered the same specs. I don't want to lug around an extra 2" of laptop if I don't need to.

A 15" screen is too small to do any proper work on, so there should be the option to buy the same specs with a 13" screen for those who use a laptop for portability and Thunderbolt Display docking.

This is my subjective opinion on the matter:

15" laptop on your lap? Awkward.
15" laptop on a bed? Awkward.
15" laptop at a desk for serious work? Too small - use external display.

13" laptop on your lap? Very comfortable.
13" laptop on a bed? Much less awkward.
13" laptop at a desk for serious work? Doesn't happen - use external display.

Design-wise, the 13" offers more as a portable device...just lacks specs - and I fully appreciate your post describing why this is so. I'm essentially searching for the indisputably effective portability of the Air, with the specs of a 15" Pro. Naturally, I never expect this, but I would pay full 15" rMBP price if it did exist.

I stress that this preference is very subjective, so others may decide that 15" is big enough for serious work - that's also a valid opinion.
 
luffytubby said:
802.11ac has been so long overdue is that in quite a few circumstances it's actually worse than n draft? (shorter range mainly). ac is not new. It's been around for a while, they just haven't been able to fix it.
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Shorter range is irrelevant to me, as I mostly use wireless as a way to reduce wire clutter, however, 802.11n is just insufficient for my needs.

As I said before, if they include 802.11ac and update Apple Extreme routers, it is an instant buy for me, otherwise, I'm happy with what I have.
 
hkim1983 said:
Shorter range is irrelevant to me, as I mostly use wireless as a way to reduce wire clutter, however, 802.11n is just insufficient for my needs.

As I said before, if they include 802.11ac and update Apple Extreme routers, it is an instant buy for me, otherwise, I'm happy with what I have.
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They will definitely include ac because it is already included in the 10.8.4 beta.
 
unobtainium said:
And battery life, supposedly. But the 5-10% processor boost is pretty disappointing. Intel is resting on its laurels. They have no competition aside from ARM's dominance in mobile, which is why the only thing they've really focused on lately is GFX and power consumption for ultrabooks and the like.
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Battery life may or may not see a significant boost (or any boost at all) because Intel is also increasing CPU and GPU clock speed slightly. It's not like they just simply made the new tech more efficient while keeping everything else the same.

You can either have more performance or battery life, but not both, and IMO, it's probably neither based on what we have seen with past computers.

Case in point: Sandy Bridge was an architectural jump to a 32nm manufacturing process, but it didn't improve that much in battery life over Nehalem, which was on 45nm...

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4205/the-macbook-pro-review-13-and-15-inch-2011-brings-sandy-bridge/15

Plus, Haswell is on the same 22nm as Ivy Bridge. There's not much magic Intel can do to make it significantly better than Ivy.

I think people are just expecting too much.

andy9l said:
Pricing is not an issue, though. I would pay full 15" pricing for a 13" screen, if it offered the same specs. I don't want to lug around an extra 2" of laptop if I don't need to.
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I'm not saying your preference has any problem. The problem is with reality. What you want may not happen based on numerous factors.

That's not to say a quad-core rMBP 13" won't happen, but I think the chances of that happening this year is quite slim. It may be possible next year when Intel introduces Broadwell, which is a die shrink.

And die shrinks have been known to cause magic to happen... or at least more so than staying on the same architecture (Ivy and Haswell are both based on 22nm manufacturing process).
 
I really want Haswell but I might have to succumb to a refurbished Ivy Bridge if the price is right. I want at least 1440 x 900 for the display and I am still using my optical drive.

USB 3.0, SATA III, and 802.11ac are priorities though.
 
So based on what the rumors says, there will be no design changes, we are suspecting to get like ipad line 10h of usage and like they start with the iphone 5/ipad and now with imac to turn down the heat of this aluminium bodies.
 
TRAV9614 said:
I know that's not how it works. With the haswell update we will get most of those things, but these things will not be that much better than the current MBP. I just don't think it is worth it to wait several months for these things since it won't make a huge difference for the average user. BTW The ghosting issue and IR issue were fixed in the last spec bump in February.
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It's a pretty big increase in GPU power. I think it will be a big boost for gaming and just for running the retina screen.

Plus the battery will probably increase by 1-2 hours.

Pretty, pretty, pretty good... pretty good. I'm waiting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36BvyC_ODRM
 
nukiduz said:
do you see a 16gb ram option on the 13" possible?
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I love the 13" form factor, but the 8GB RAM limit is the only thing making me consider the 15", which I feel is too big.

Even 16GB with the amount of VMs I need to run is pushing it.
 
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