So, you're basically stating that the MBA will be a great product in 3 years from now. Apple already had a similar problem when they produced the Apple Newton: Too early, too short.
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The real point of MacBook Air - and why everyone is missing it.
- Thread starter Stuart in Oz
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So, you're basically stating that the MBA will be a great product in 3 years from now. Apple already had a similar problem when they produced the Apple Newton: Too early, too short.
And an even more similar Mac was the cube.
Too early, too expensive...
In the end I think the cost will be what make or breaks this product...
The cube was THE Mac everyone desired, when they bought a PowerMac/iMac because of financial realities...
Until the mini came along at a much reduced price than the cube, the un-upgradable "beautifully small" thing never took off... It's a shame, but I think this Mac is just too much money... (For now! I still want one though
)We have wireless networks outside America you know.
. I think the people embarking on missions to countries where there isn't any any form of communication wont really be prioritizing incremental backup or watching a DVD.
The people that keep on posting that it's too expensive keep missing the point, and they don't look at the competitors, cause often their more expensive and offer less.
A wise man speaks of what he sees ( from AOE III)
I think it may be too niche. Even the people (like my mother) who buy gadgets on both looks 1st, portability 2nd and usability 3rd, still like to feel they're getting value for money.
3 Macbooks or 1 Macbook Air with a 64GB flash drive?
I think the wealthy elite is just a bit too niche, even for Apple. Then again so was a £300 music player... So could be wrong.
I think the Air primarily serves to show what great value the rest of their range is.
Questioning their laptop build quality - are you friggin' joking?!
Sorry for your loss. But even discussing a 17" desktop replacement at the same time we're actually discussing the MacBook Air screams silly to me.
And for build quality - I can personally attest to the impressive build quality of the PowerBook and Mac Book. Two recent events:
I have dropped a PowerBook G4 Aluminium whilst it slided out of my photobackpack - dropped over a meter in height onto solid concrete floor and then fell into a dusty plantation (this was in super-humid Fiji a week ago). I picked it up, and whilst it has a major dent inthe corner and the display is bout 1.5mm skewed, the laptop is 100% functional - reads and writes DVDs, NO color & pixel weirdness, harddrive as good as ever.
A colleague of mine was handling a phone conversation whilst carrying his Mac Book Pro down the stairs, slipped, and the MacBook Pro sailed about three meters down in height onto a tiled floor, landing on the opened display - think: /(
Guess what - the only damage (this fall would have disintegrated most laptops!) was the charging board - which was replaced for 110 GBP or so.
Another machine has been chucked out of a window onto a grass lawn during a hotel room fire on the Galapagos Islands (by the same person btw).
Don't say godawful build quality anywhere near me, these are the most robust machines this side of a ToughBook.
J.
Sorry for your loss. But even discussing a 17" desktop replacement at the same time we're actually discussing the MacBook Air screams silly to me.
And for build quality - I can personally attest to the impressive build quality of the PowerBook and Mac Book. Two recent events:
I have dropped a PowerBook G4 Aluminium whilst it slided out of my photobackpack - dropped over a meter in height onto solid concrete floor and then fell into a dusty plantation (this was in super-humid Fiji a week ago). I picked it up, and whilst it has a major dent inthe corner and the display is bout 1.5mm skewed, the laptop is 100% functional - reads and writes DVDs, NO color & pixel weirdness, harddrive as good as ever.
A colleague of mine was handling a phone conversation whilst carrying his Mac Book Pro down the stairs, slipped, and the MacBook Pro sailed about three meters down in height onto a tiled floor, landing on the opened display - think: /(
Guess what - the only damage (this fall would have disintegrated most laptops!) was the charging board - which was replaced for 110 GBP or so.
Another machine has been chucked out of a window onto a grass lawn during a hotel room fire on the Galapagos Islands (by the same person btw).
Don't say godawful build quality anywhere near me, these are the most robust machines this side of a ToughBook.
J.
If you don't like it, don't by it!
For all you naysayers, just remember, you are not required to buy the Air! Many people ARE excited about this machine and SOME will buy it! That's the nice thing about what Apple has done. They have given folks a new option and have continued to build their reputation as a company with vision. They create products for the here and now and for the future.
For all you naysayers, just remember, you are not required to buy the Air! Many people ARE excited about this machine and SOME will buy it! That's the nice thing about what Apple has done. They have given folks a new option and have continued to build their reputation as a company with vision. They create products for the here and now and for the future.
These are not comparable for several reasons. One is that the Cube was released at exactly the time of the dot-com crash. There was plenty of money around when the Cube was designed, and a lot lot less when it was delivered. The Cube wasn't too early. Six months earlier, and Apple would have sold lots of them.
The other reason is that the Cube didn't have any real advantage in usability. It was a bit smaller and looked nice. But for a desktop machine, being small and looking nice is _some_ advantage, but not that big an advantage. There are very few people to whom the smallness of the Cube would have been worth a few hundred dollars. That is different with the MBA. There are _many_ people to whom two pounds less in weight is worth a lot of money.
And if Apple sold a Cube today, upgraded to the state of the art, they would sell lots. 8" by 8" by 8" gives you space plenty for a quad core processor, 1 TB hard disk, DVD writer, 8GB RAM, decent graphics card. People would probably complain that it is too big.
in response to gnasher...
i wonder if the mini is the new cube.
and in response to the qc posts, i had a run of 3 ibooks in a row that kept
being sent back for repair. i won't bore you with the details. but a huge list
of failed components.
My last one has been great, however, even though i dropped it from a height
of 2 feet and the top is bent at a frightening angle.
i wonder if the mini is the new cube.
and in response to the qc posts, i had a run of 3 ibooks in a row that kept
being sent back for repair. i won't bore you with the details. but a huge list
of failed components.
My last one has been great, however, even though i dropped it from a height
of 2 feet and the top is bent at a frightening angle.
Don't forget that there's also a student discount available on the MacBook Air, which brings it down $100 cheaper than the cheapest discounted MacBook Pro.
Not really... although the G4 towers were still the real powerhouses when compared to the G4 cube, the Mac Mini is really crippled. Much slower processor, much less RAM capacity, no dedicated graphics... it's in a totally different world than the Mac Pro.
wait
Not having a quickly removable battery doesn't mean the battery is non-replaceable. In fact the battery replacement protocol has already been well documented. Research before throwing missives, my friend.
Not having a quickly removable battery doesn't mean the battery is non-replaceable. In fact the battery replacement protocol has already been well documented. Research before throwing missives, my friend.
Yeah, I said the same thing about the iPod in 2001 - it's another Newton, no one is gonna want one of those expensive things. See how right I was.
The MBA is a very intriguing product. It is on the high-end of price and the feature set seems a little short in some areas (hard drive space!) But it really has some interesting characteristics:
1. SSD "hard drive" - I think this is the future for laptops and Apple is the first major brand to introduce it. Haven't seen anything about its impact on battery life though, that would be VERY interesting. Like the iMac without the floppy disk drive, I think that this is where computers are going and Apple is leading the way.
2. The whole "Air" thing. Apple has put a lot into wireless. They were first out with the Airport - that led to the mainstreaming of home wireless. I still remember Jobs saying it could handle a 10,000 sq/ft house - fine for most people who are not Bill Gates. Now look at 802.11n and entire product lines built on wireless home networking (Apple alone has AppleTV, iPhone, Airport Extreme, Time Capsule, iTouch, plus Airport in all shipping Macs). The things are everywhere. I used to think about how to wire just a couple rooms in my house. I'm not really thinking about that anymore. Go to Starbucks and many airports in the US and you have Wifi connectivity. I think that is the future.
3. Lack of a DVD drive. Very interesting. I think you will still want access to such a device, but hey, Apple is letting you share other computers drives in addition to having a small portable one. I happen to think CD/DVD are good for things like backups and sharing photos with family, so they might not entirely die (maybe replaced with follow-on technology). Apple would say that they have several products that fill those gaps (Time Capsule being the most obvious). Still, how many people actually use the drives while on the road? I suspect not all that many. Hence, you can save the space and have it as an accessory.
4. Battery - I think, like with the iPod, the battery issue was more a design decision than anything else. They couldn't easily make it removable, so they didn't. Plus, the thing is 5 hours. Maybe not quite enough for transatlantic, but still pretty good. I think the point about future batteries is well taken - if you get 20 hours on the battery, who needs to swap? How many people carry spare batteries as it is? I thought that was more a relic of the time when batteries lasted only 2 hours.
5. Weight - as long as the thing fits in a standard carryon, then weight becomes the big issue. This thing is light and that is important. I agree with the earlier comments that Apple is defining the category by weight and not footprint. I wonder if consumers will think the same way?
The MBA is a very interesting product. I think that, like the iPod, the second and third versions are going to be much more popular than the first one. With refinements and upgrades at the same price point, I think in 18 months you are going to be quite pleased with Apple's laptop offerings. The question I have is the extent to which MBA will take away from either the high-end offerings or bump people up into the new MBA-realm from the iBook arena in the low $1,000 range. Apple is interested as well. If they push people up from the low-end, then they will make a lot of money. Not sure about the high-end shift to the middle though. Perhaps that is why the feature set is a little limited? They don't want to cannibalize the high-end, they want to move people from the consumer range.
You wrote what I was thinking in my head when it was unveiled. You read my mind. The Macbook air is a showcase of technology. It is spit in the face of the bureaucratic mainstream. Way to go Apple
Umm, I ordered an Air with the SSD.
And for that price I could have bought 2 to 2.5 Macbooks (with normal drives), depending on configuration.
But what on earth would I have done with 2 or 3 Macbooks? How would I even fit those in my bag?
I'm sure many of you have already read this article, but just thought I might bring it up: http://www.appleinsider.com/article...s_up_against_other_ultra_light_notebooks.html
I agree with both sides, I think they released the MBA a little earlier than they could have, which is why it's pricey and lacks some features.
Will it fail? No. I personally do everything wireless on my MacBook Pro. I have a Airport Extreme, external hard drive (where all my music and movies reside, I mean I've already used 450 GB of music and movies) and my 17" MBP. I stream all my music and movies to my MBP so I don't waste HD space and can keep it for applications, photos, and graphic design. So I already am a user that the MBA is aimed at, I just won't get right now... I may never get once, may just stick with another 17" MBP.
However, people should realize that this ultra-portable compares very well to similar offerings by Sony, Toshiba, IBM, Fujitsu, etc. Apple did not go into this without doing research.
I agree with both sides, I think they released the MBA a little earlier than they could have, which is why it's pricey and lacks some features.
Will it fail? No. I personally do everything wireless on my MacBook Pro. I have a Airport Extreme, external hard drive (where all my music and movies reside, I mean I've already used 450 GB of music and movies) and my 17" MBP. I stream all my music and movies to my MBP so I don't waste HD space and can keep it for applications, photos, and graphic design. So I already am a user that the MBA is aimed at, I just won't get right now... I may never get once, may just stick with another 17" MBP.
However, people should realize that this ultra-portable compares very well to similar offerings by Sony, Toshiba, IBM, Fujitsu, etc. Apple did not go into this without doing research.
Brain not found....
I'd be afraid of "Brain-to-Brain" (B2B) wireless. My system would keep coming up with "No Brains found within range"
One little note to comment on some of the (ODG so many) posts...the HW _IS_ different on the Macbook Air...it is NOT "just a bunch of SW updates"...and while I won't go into it (I know, I know..why should you believe ME (nothing I say or do would change most of the "brains" here anyway..so just accept or reject the statement as you wish)) here, let me say that the HW in the current MB and MBP's will NOT support multi-touch as implemented in the Air. The trackpads in the Air are physically different in order to be able to support multi-touch, and no SW update will make the current systems multi-touch capable...you'll need to wait on the HW to ripple into the next gen products. 'nuff said.
~tarl
I'd be afraid of "Brain-to-Brain" (B2B) wireless. My system would keep coming up with "No Brains found within range"
One little note to comment on some of the (ODG so many) posts...the HW _IS_ different on the Macbook Air...it is NOT "just a bunch of SW updates"...and while I won't go into it (I know, I know..why should you believe ME (nothing I say or do would change most of the "brains" here anyway..so just accept or reject the statement as you wish)) here, let me say that the HW in the current MB and MBP's will NOT support multi-touch as implemented in the Air. The trackpads in the Air are physically different in order to be able to support multi-touch, and no SW update will make the current systems multi-touch capable...you'll need to wait on the HW to ripple into the next gen products
. 'nuff said.~tarl
Getting publicity on a dogma changing product is great. Users are more malleable to change by seeing a product as visually stunning as it, and seeing it's dogma challenging concepts that can be trickled down and enhanced upwards amongst the different Apple lineups. The big thing for me? Having the status quo changed on views about personal computers.
Examples of dogmas affected:
- SSD use in a laptop/desktop. Now an option in a mainstream laptop
- Multitouch touchpad. Coming to MBPs, MBs & huge UI shift potential
- Use of 1 USB port as a gateway to other ports (One Kensington docking box later, and that 1 USB port can link to lots of peripherals)
- (Pulldown access to ports)
- No optical drive/ wireless optical drive use, slaving pcs/macs around you to use their optical drive
- (Keyboard style)
- Motherboard/chip sizes
- Battery style. Seen elsewhere. Integrated = space saver. If they could work on making it an in house while you wait option, i think less would grumble.
View it as a laptop demonstrating concepts, and a damn fine ultralightweight/ultraslim laptop.
Examples of dogmas affected:
- SSD use in a laptop/desktop. Now an option in a mainstream laptop
- Multitouch touchpad. Coming to MBPs, MBs & huge UI shift potential
- Use of 1 USB port as a gateway to other ports (One Kensington docking box later, and that 1 USB port can link to lots of peripherals)
- (Pulldown access to ports)
- No optical drive/ wireless optical drive use, slaving pcs/macs around you to use their optical drive
- (Keyboard style)
- Motherboard/chip sizes
- Battery style. Seen elsewhere. Integrated = space saver. If they could work on making it an in house while you wait option, i think less would grumble.
View it as a laptop demonstrating concepts, and a damn fine ultralightweight/ultraslim laptop.
Air
Jobs overshot the puck on this one.[/QUOTE]
Ethernet? I've not hooked up a computer to an actual modem via ethernet in 5 years! Isn't that what a wireless connection is for? The name of the thing is the Macbook Air, right? I think it lives up to its name. The complaints of the Air will be gone by 2010 and the nay sayers will have something new to complain about, but I guess that is called progress. Apple has changed the hearts and minds of a lot of PC users. People that have never taken a look at apple before (like myself only 6 mo. ago) are going crazy about their innovations now, and tell me that when their current laptop is obsolete, they're going to a Mac. That alone tells me Jobs knows what he is doing. If anything is being overshot, it's the competition.
Jobs overshot the puck on this one.[/QUOTE]
Ethernet? I've not hooked up a computer to an actual modem via ethernet in 5 years! Isn't that what a wireless connection is for? The name of the thing is the Macbook Air, right? I think it lives up to its name. The complaints of the Air will be gone by 2010 and the nay sayers will have something new to complain about, but I guess that is called progress. Apple has changed the hearts and minds of a lot of PC users. People that have never taken a look at apple before (like myself only 6 mo. ago) are going crazy about their innovations now, and tell me that when their current laptop is obsolete, they're going to a Mac. That alone tells me Jobs knows what he is doing. If anything is being overshot, it's the competition.
I wouldn't dispute that it's an amazing move by Apple though personally I can't stand that awful tapered design that looks like the worst Toshiba imaginable.
And that juvenile "world's thinnest laptop" as if it were SOOO important to have the thinnest. Sorry but that's pathetic.
It's also the battery issue - when Apple says 5 hours that means 5 hours with all the lights on dim, no airport, bluetooth etc. so let's call it 3 hrs 30.
Then there's the whole issue with wireless - I've had to use ethernet on many many occasions since upgrading to Leopard like many thousands of others due to airport issues - so I wonder how this is going to sit with the MBA when its only link is on then it's off ... then it's on ... then it's off...
Perhaps they'll make the MB thinner and have rounded edges instead of the wrist shredders currently used, but until then it's iMac/Powerbook for me.
And that juvenile "world's thinnest laptop" as if it were SOOO important to have the thinnest. Sorry but that's pathetic.
It's also the battery issue - when Apple says 5 hours that means 5 hours with all the lights on dim, no airport, bluetooth etc. so let's call it 3 hrs 30.
Then there's the whole issue with wireless - I've had to use ethernet on many many occasions since upgrading to Leopard like many thousands of others due to airport issues - so I wonder how this is going to sit with the MBA when its only link is on then it's off ... then it's on ... then it's off...
Perhaps they'll make the MB thinner and have rounded edges instead of the wrist shredders currently used, but until then it's iMac/Powerbook for me.
ilfyya,
While I agree with you in principle that WiFi is the way to go...
Unfortunately, at least for me, there are times when
A) I'm in a location where there's no WiFi available, but ethernet is....
and
B) The organization that I work for doesn't allow WiFi in our offices for security reasons right now, although that may change in the future. This means I need to use ethernet during the day at work whether I want to or not...
So, it's not always a simple choice of saying I'll just use WiFi...but again hopefully, this won't be case at some future date....