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The "Waiting for Nehalem Mac Pros" thread
- Thread starter m1stake
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Seeing as this has absolutely nothing to do with the Mac Pro, I'll let you report your own post to the moderators.
I know, I know... buy it if you need it and try not to complain-- but I really want to be one of the truly lucky ones.
my Dual 2.5 PPC (June 04) completely died at the end of November-- the tech guys at school said at the time that "the logic board is toast" and that I was "lucky" to be able to pull anything off of my hard drives with it in that state. they went on to assure me that it was now a shiny aluminum paperweight, so I unloaded it on craigslist for parts and am now humbly using my roommate's old Acer Aspire 5670 laptop (XP) to finish my thesis and get on the web. i can't edit from my own apartment, but I have an internship at a leading post production facility where I can use the equipment if i need to.
thus, I do not "need" to buy a new computer until May, when I conclude my college career and will no longer be able to use this laptop... and with no guarantees of full time job in this economy, I will need my own workstation at home for freelancing.
I'm posting to ask if you guys and gals think that I should give up my dreams of a nehalem Mac Pro, on the assumption that they will not be out until June.
It was your musings about release dates that kept me from getting my hopes unrealistically high for this past Tuesday's keynote, but I'm not freelancing as an editor yet and right now $5k on a computer is a HUGE amount of money to me-- I'd like to to be able to invest in the next generation if possible-- if it's not possible I'd at least like to be able to enjoy a few months with my machine at school, so I don't get too out of practice with the programs that will be my means of making a living after graduation.
what are your thoughts?
my Dual 2.5 PPC (June 04) completely died at the end of November-- the tech guys at school said at the time that "the logic board is toast" and that I was "lucky" to be able to pull anything off of my hard drives with it in that state. they went on to assure me that it was now a shiny aluminum paperweight, so I unloaded it on craigslist for parts and am now humbly using my roommate's old Acer Aspire 5670 laptop (XP) to finish my thesis and get on the web. i can't edit from my own apartment, but I have an internship at a leading post production facility where I can use the equipment if i need to.
thus, I do not "need" to buy a new computer until May, when I conclude my college career and will no longer be able to use this laptop... and with no guarantees of full time job in this economy, I will need my own workstation at home for freelancing.
I'm posting to ask if you guys and gals think that I should give up my dreams of a nehalem Mac Pro, on the assumption that they will not be out until June.
It was your musings about release dates that kept me from getting my hopes unrealistically high for this past Tuesday's keynote, but I'm not freelancing as an editor yet and right now $5k on a computer is a HUGE amount of money to me-- I'd like to to be able to invest in the next generation if possible-- if it's not possible I'd at least like to be able to enjoy a few months with my machine at school, so I don't get too out of practice with the programs that will be my means of making a living after graduation.
what are your thoughts?
Buy a used one off eBay for $1500 or so, use it until the Nehalem MPs come out, and then eBay it again.
--Garrett
May or the beginning of June is looking realistic at this time. If Intel pulls off a miracle and ships before the end of March, we could see machines sooner than that. I wouldn't hold too much hope on this though. 
Given your budget, the current model would be an easier pill to swallow, especially if you can locate a base model refurb. Add whatever you need 3rd party, and you can get your system up and running for as little cash as possible.
If you happen to find a job between now and then, you can revise your priorities.
Good luck.
Given your budget, the current model would be an easier pill to swallow, especially if you can locate a base model refurb. Add whatever you need 3rd party, and you can get your system up and running for as little cash as possible.
If you happen to find a job between now and then, you can revise your priorities.
Good luck.
no can do-- i'm planning to finance through apple until i can cash in some certificates of deposit over the summer.
i can't afford to pay credit card interest on $1500 for three months in addition to taking a probable $300-400 hit on the resale of the used MP. If i had $300-400 of breathing room i would have just replaced the logic board.
thanks for the advice, though.
----
edit in light of Nanofrog's post:
if June is very likely, i would be willing to be without a computer for 3 weeks to a month-- who knows, I may even catch Snow Leopard and the new Final Cut Studio at that point. i'm smart, talented, and extremely hard working, so going without a computer for a month isn't necessarily too bad of a career decision especially if i can freelance or continue as an intern at a post facility in that time (where I would use equipment after hours). after all, the new york public library has free word processing and web access. it's just so far from ideal that i had previously thought that the end of May was my "need it" line in the sand.
intel dragging its feet, the market slowing down (and taking production schedules with it), and the recent remarks of the apple exec about the company marching to certain patterns of release dates have got me nervous about a later-than-june release. the only reason i thought that March-May was possible was that the mac pro generally isn't a student-geared product and could thus have little to nothing to do with the timing of new notebook releases for students.
the rumors will surely pick up between now and May at least enough to know whether we'll have to wait any longer than june, but what would really sting to me would be to go month or so without a computer (after being woefully macless since late November) only to find out that we'll have to wait until august-september or later. if you guys think that June is very realistically the latest i'll have to last, then i suppose it would make sense to do that. the performance increases for processor intensive and ram-hungry programs like the Final Cut Studio and the Adobe CS along with the possibility of an even more upgradable tower are just too tempting to ignore when i consider the cost of the machine and the likelihood that I won't be able to upgrade for 3+ years even if I do well professionally.
i seem to have made the case to myself that it's absolutely worth waiting if I can be relatively sure of a June release. Anybody here think that June is unlikely, unrealistic, naive, etc?
Mac pro
I already have a Power Mac quad 2.5ghz g5 that is approaching 3 years old and I'm about due for a new replacement (Mac Pro). so i can run all the latest intel only apps such as CS4 and Maya 2009.
I would have purchased the current model but the 8800 graphics card is a little outdated now, If they upped a new graphics card and gave it a 4GB (2x2) standard ram I'm sure more people would make the purchase rather than wait.
so... I'm patiently waiting...
I already have a Power Mac quad 2.5ghz g5 that is approaching 3 years old and I'm about due for a new replacement (Mac Pro). so i can run all the latest intel only apps such as CS4 and Maya 2009.
I would have purchased the current model but the 8800 graphics card is a little outdated now, If they upped a new graphics card and gave it a 4GB (2x2) standard ram I'm sure more people would make the purchase rather than wait.
so... I'm patiently waiting...
Not likely. The last Mac Pro before the "Early 2008" Mac Pro languished with the same hardware and outdated ATI x1900xt. This Mac Pro is languishing as well, at about a year now with no updates. It will be interesting to see what kind of video card options they offer, and how they manage to make it so existing Early 2008 Mac Pro owners can't use the new cards.
Top-End Nvidia Card Slated for Nehalem Mac Pro Config
http://www.pcper.com/article.php?aid=654
"The main difference between what we will see with new 28" iMac and the upgrade Mac Pro is in the graphics solution offered: my information shows that the GT200 graphics core, first used in the GeForce GTX 200-series of parts this past June, will be the heart of the Mac Pro's graphics system."
Rumors. But one can hope!
http://www.pcper.com/article.php?aid=654
"The main difference between what we will see with new 28" iMac and the upgrade Mac Pro is in the graphics solution offered: my information shows that the GT200 graphics core, first used in the GeForce GTX 200-series of parts this past June, will be the heart of the Mac Pro's graphics system."
Rumors. But one can hope!
http://www.pcper.com/article.php?aid=654
"The main difference between what we will see with new 28" iMac and the upgrade Mac Pro is in the graphics solution offered: my information shows that the GT200 graphics core, first used in the GeForce GTX 200-series of parts this past June, will be the heart of the Mac Pro's graphics system."
Rumors. But one can hope!
If they were to release Mac Pros tomorrow the GTX 260 and FX 4800 or FX 5800 would be likely candidates for the Mac Pro (all GT200 core), sadly the GTX 260 may also be the candidate come revision time 4 months from now when better options are available on other platforms. I think that the graphics card choices the next Mac Pros have won't be much to get excited about.
Listen, if we are only lagging 4- to 6-months behind the high-end video card product cycle, instead of the usual 1- to 2-years, I'll be a very happy puppy. And it would be great to have the choice of Nvidia GTX 280 or ATI 4870 1GB+ cards, especially with Snow Leopard / OpenCL for scientific Unix computing.
Few choices
Apple is at it again. 9-18 month product refresh of what is an extremely limited range of desktop choices. Articles are already indicating Apple's loss of market share to companies like Dell. Very sad indeed.
Apple continues to ignore the enterprise with no significant server refreshes and serious OS backbone support. For that matter there are no real enterprise products. Apple seems to be stuck in its "small" minded graphic designer (Mac Pro), home user (iMac) and the gadget enthusiast (Mac mini). All dated, all underperforming compared to equivalent PC offerings. NO sub $2k expandable minitower for the bulk of the desktop market.
I for one will wait for the long overdue hardware refresh and further details on Snow Leopard. However, if the latest MacBook Pro is any indication of what is to come, sadly this will be my choice going forward:
http://www.macintouch.com/reviews/efix/
An excellent choice at that. Sleep well Apple and keep on dreaming.
Apple is at it again. 9-18 month product refresh of what is an extremely limited range of desktop choices. Articles are already indicating Apple's loss of market share to companies like Dell. Very sad indeed.
Apple continues to ignore the enterprise with no significant server refreshes and serious OS backbone support. For that matter there are no real enterprise products. Apple seems to be stuck in its "small" minded graphic designer (Mac Pro), home user (iMac) and the gadget enthusiast (Mac mini). All dated, all underperforming compared to equivalent PC offerings. NO sub $2k expandable minitower for the bulk of the desktop market.
I for one will wait for the long overdue hardware refresh and further details on Snow Leopard. However, if the latest MacBook Pro is any indication of what is to come, sadly this will be my choice going forward:
http://www.macintouch.com/reviews/efix/
An excellent choice at that. Sleep well Apple and keep on dreaming.
How, again, is the Mac Pro underperforming?
And no one cares about your xMac. The xMac is what would bankrupt Apple a second time, NOT keeping to their current plan.
Hello. Did you read the linked review? No one is saying anything about xMac, my complaining is about the hardware offerings.
I think that's a bit extreme. You do not know that this lower specced tower would bankrupt apple. It might just as easily be what breaks them into a large new market. Maybe, maybe not. To say either way with such certainty just screams bullshlt to me.
I'll quote it again:
xMac. That is your complaint; you want an xMac.
The xMac of reality, if there ever is one, could not be what everyone "wants." The xMac of reality would be a Mac Mini that uses low-end desktop processors, a 3.5" HDD, and has a crapola dedicated GPU. There would be no PCIe slot and it wouldn't be a tower.
Something like THAT is possible, but a Psystaresque tower is not.
xMac. That is your complaint; you want an xMac.
The xMac of reality, if there ever is one, could not be what everyone "wants." The xMac of reality would be a Mac Mini that uses low-end desktop processors, a 3.5" HDD, and has a crapola dedicated GPU. There would be no PCIe slot and it wouldn't be a tower.
Something like THAT is possible, but a Psystaresque tower is not.
I apologize, my bad. Yes I do want one. You fail to comment however on the lack of product offerings, performance and price.
Again, did you read the review?
will the new mac pros be worth the price premium?
I've been holding out on the mac pros, waiting for the xeon 5500 versions to arrive. However a cursory glance at memory prices is making me rethink this. I believe a lot of ram is basically required to get the most out of these machines and was planning on using 16GB (I use 8 GB in my vista 64 box and it absolutely flies) but the price different on memory for the current mac pro and the upcoming mac pro is astounding. 16GB for the current mac pro runs roughly 500 dollars. 16GB of ECC DDR3 is around 2 grand.
Has anyone found any cheaper DDR3? My assumption would be no. Considering the cost of just the machine will likely be higher as well, we are looking at a significant price increase on the new mac pros. The current machines are already quite speedy, if you're not doing hardcore 3D rendering or constant video exports, I wonder if the new machines would be genuinely worth the price premium?
I've been holding out on the mac pros, waiting for the xeon 5500 versions to arrive. However a cursory glance at memory prices is making me rethink this. I believe a lot of ram is basically required to get the most out of these machines and was planning on using 16GB (I use 8 GB in my vista 64 box and it absolutely flies) but the price different on memory for the current mac pro and the upcoming mac pro is astounding. 16GB for the current mac pro runs roughly 500 dollars. 16GB of ECC DDR3 is around 2 grand.
Has anyone found any cheaper DDR3? My assumption would be no. Considering the cost of just the machine will likely be higher as well, we are looking at a significant price increase on the new mac pros. The current machines are already quite speedy, if you're not doing hardcore 3D rendering or constant video exports, I wonder if the new machines would be genuinely worth the price premium?
Why on earth would a good product in that range bankrupt apple? So overpriced laptops and all in one's are a good strategy but an overpriced "normal" desktop is not? I bet people would flock to a model such as that.
Because I personally don't think that there is a gap in their line. Either buy a Mac Mini cheap, a Mac Pro for power, or go buy a PC if you don't like the iMac. Apple. Doesn't. Care. About the mid-tower market, and nothing will happen to them because they don't care, so they don't have to.
Why? What is the point you are making? It's faster than last year's Mac Pro? Then buy a PC tower, as I said.
Yes? They can't make the margins they do on the iMac, Mac Mini, and Mac Pro as they would on a tower with full expansion.
I respect that you don't think there is a product gap, I and many others (MacIntouch, Macworld and may other expert publications) beg to differ.
Actually, in some tasks it is faster than the current (1 year old) Mac Pro, only much, much cheaper and far more expandable.
With $24+ Billion in the bank and no debt, how much is enough? If an off the shelf PC can perform so well against a Mac Pro, what am I paying a premium for? With economies of scale Apple should be able to build and sell a tower for less and at a higher profit margin.
One thing is profit, another is to take advantage of your core customers. Regardless, Apple will not increase its market share and stay viable as an option long term.
In reality, if you're not performing tasks regularly like video rendering, a MacPro (not just the Nehalem model) is probably overkill anyway.
As far as RAM goes, the cost will probably be high when the new MacPro is released. I figure I can live with the stock RAM until prices come down, which they undoubtedly will.
Why not? Mac pros are expandable. Do you have a real reason other than you say it's so? I would gladly pay the same premium on an "xMac" that I paid on my laptop and plan to pay on the mac pro.
I do everything, software development, video rendering, flash, web dev, music, windows usage, CG rendering etc etc. If my choices for this kind of work are an iMac or the mac pro, a mac pro is far more suitable.