There is NO reception issue. THE FACTS.

[drjsway]

Only Savage and Heineman can distinguish theses myths and 'FACTS' - I can see it now... Mythbusters: Apple Special...
Does the iPhone 4 have a signal issue?
Does saying 'i don't believe in Jobs' kill a fanboy somewhere in the world? (Peter pan joke - if you don't understand )
and does the iPad battery run on unicorn blood?

clown OP...

Anantech observed up to a 19.8db signal loss when holding the phone covering the bar. FACT.

This proves with a good signal, you will experience NO LOSS OF BARS. FACT.

I get over 5MB/s down when holding the phone naturally and 4MB/s doing the death grip. Observable, yes, but far from data grinding to a halt. My 3GS never got more than 3.5MB is the same location.

It's ridiculous that people still think this is a big issue.

 

[darngooddesign]

..I get over 5MB/s down when holding the phone naturally and 4MB/s doing the death grip. Observable, yes, but far from data grinding to a halt. My 3GS never got more than 3.5MB is the same location.

It's ridiculous that people still think this is a big issue.

I get 0MB/s when holding it and covering the bar. My 3GS got significantly more than that.

That is a big issue.

 

[drjsway]

I get 0MB/s when holding it and covering the bar. My 3GS got significantly more than that.

That is a big issue.

What do you get not covering the bar?

EDIT: Tested yesterday in NYC at lunchtime, using two different apps:

Not covering bar:

Death grip for 30 seconds:

I lost 1Mb, and the latency went up dramatically, but upload speed actually doubled.

 

[br0adband]

It's ridiculous that people still think this is a big issue.

When I hold my iPhone 4 in my hand normally as most of the rest of the cell phone owners on planet earth do, I will have serious difficulty making a call, and if I'm on a call I will either a) lose it b) get lots of digital noise/disruption c) audio/data streams will begin to buffer/drop/buffer/drop/etc and other issues.

If I happen to cover the seam bridging the two antennas at all I'll get a NO SERVICE indication in under 60 seconds.

It IS a big issue.

If you're one of the fortunate/lucky ones not having problems like these, do consider yourself fortunate and lucky and move along.

 

[darngooddesign]

What do you get not covering the bar?...

I get good speeds normally, but the exact amount is irrelevant. Covering the bar gives me 0. Its not even with some deathgrip, I just hold it tight enough so I don't drop it.

 

[jambobowron]

Anantech observed up to a 19.8db signal loss when holding the phone covering the bar. FACT.

This proves with a good signal, you will experience NO LOSS OF BARS. FACT.

I get over 5MB/s down when holding the phone naturally and 4MB/s doing the death grip. Observable, yes, but far from data grinding to a halt. My 3GS never got more than 3.5MB is the same location.

It's ridiculous that people still think this is a big issue.

you used to get dropped calls on AT&T, but why are you whining about them now (I agree it's an issue but why so much now?) blame your ****** provider - I've never had a dropped call on Orange or O2 in UK... I'm nit bragging but the total signal loss caused by holding Area 52 would not make an issue (like aandtech proved) if your signal is good

 

[drjsway]

I get good speeds normally, but the exact amount is irrelevant. Covering the bar gives me 0. Its not even with some deathgrip, I just hold it tight enough so I don't drop it.

It's relevant because if you drop from 5Mbit to 0, then that is a big issue. I don't deny people can drop from 5 bars to 1 bar/no service but this is under "worse case scenario" condition from Gizmodo's chart.

 

[br0adband]

"It's the phone, stupid."

Didn't you people get the press release? You did? Ok, then perhaps you just need it translated...

http://daringfireball.net/2010/07/translation_iphone_4

 

[dagomike]

you used to get dropped calls on AT&T, but why are you whining about them now (I agree it's an issue but why so much now?) blame your ****** provider - I've never had a dropped call on Orange or O2 in UK... I'm nit bragging but the total signal loss caused by holding Area 52 would not make an issue (like aandtech proved) if your signal is good

I rarely had drop calls either. Until I got the iPhone 4.

If the answer is that in order to use an iPhone you need 75% better signal than other phones... OK, but that's not on ATT.

 

[darngooddesign]

It's relevant because if you drop from 5Mbit to 0, then that is a big issue. I don't deny people can drop from 5 bars to 1 bar/no service but this is under "worse case scenario" condition from Gizmodo's chart.

Just ran the SpeedTest app and I dropped from 3104 kps to 0 kps.

 

[Geckotek]

It's relevant because if you drop from 5Mbit to 0, then that is a big issue. I don't deny people can drop from 5 bars to 1 bar/no service but this is under "worse case scenario" condition from Gizmodo's chart.

"Worst Case Scenario" does not mean "Least Likely Scenario". It's very possible that the worst case scenario is being experienced by a majority of the people. It could be only 25%. Who knows. But it's significant enough to get TONS of attention.

Anantech observed up to a 19.8db signal loss when holding the phone covering the bar. FACT.


This proves with a good signal, you will experience NO LOSS OF BARS. FACT.

I get over 5MB/s down when holding the phone naturally and 4MB/s doing the death grip. Observable, yes, but far from data grinding to a halt. My 3GS never got more than 3.5MB is the same location.

It's ridiculous that people still think this is a big issue.

You're looking at this from the wrong perspective. People who get great signal will not be affected....this is true.

However, you are ignoring a VERY large part of AT&Ts customer base that doesn't get optimal signal. Heck, even the ones that do occasionally travel to areas of town or parts of a building where the signal is weak. THIS is the issue. In our building where both a 5 year old razor and an iPhone 3G can make a call without issue, the iPhone 4 is unable to if you touch the "magic spot".

That my friend is a FACT that proves there is a reception issue. The chart you posted above refutes your own argument.

YOU ARE IGNORING THE FACTS.​

 

[drjsway]

The chart you posted above refutes your own argument.

YOU ARE IGNORING THE FACTS.​

How does it refute my argument? People keep writing that I'm "in denial" when even in my original post, I said that it is true that iPhone 4 suffers greater signal loss than other phones and quite possibly just a poor phone for making calls.

My argument is that Apple has denied the issue, specifically designed the phone this way, and now have issued a statement announcing a fix that only changes the way bars are displayed. They will not fix this and if you are not satisfied, you can always just return the phone.

It amazes me how I write "iPhone is a poor phone and you should return it" and people can interpret this as "APPLE FANBOY DRINKING THE KOOL-AID!"

 

[big0mar]

How does it refute my argument? People keep writing that I'm "in denial" when even in my original post, I said that it is true that iPhone 4 suffers greater signal loss than other phones and quite possibly just a poor phone for making calls.

My argument is that Apple has denied the issue, specifically designed the phone this way, and now have issued a statement announcing a fix that only changes the way bars are displayed. They will not fix this and if you are not satisfied, you can always just return the phone.

It amazes me how I write "iPhone is a poor phone and you should return it" and people can interpret this as "APPLE FANBOY DRINKING THE KOOL-AID!"

Seriously, its like these people are expecting Steve Jobs to come to their house with some new hardware and fellate them.

The iPhone provides ****** phone service for some people. Accept it and move on!

 

[dagomike]

Seriously, its like these people are expecting Steve Jobs to come to their house with some new hardware and fellate them.

The iPhone provides ****** phone service for some people. Accept it and move on!

At least we're making progress around here. The progression in the past week:

- You people are crazy there's nothing wrong
- This happens to all phones, you must be doing something wrong
- It's a bad design and if you don't like it shut up and return it.

 

[big0mar]

At least we're making progress around here. The progression in the past week:

- You people are crazy there's nothing wrong
- This happens to all phones, you must be doing something wrong
- It's a bad design and if you don't like it shut up and return it.

It does happen to all phones. There are plenty of instances where I dropped calls with my 3GS. My 3GS certainly dropped a hell of a lot more calls than my old Samsung phone. Thats the reality of cell phones. If everyone who dropped a call, or had decreased antenna strength claimed they had a defective phone, nobody would own a cell phone.

 

[drjsway]

At least we're making progress around here. The progression in the past week:

- You people are crazy there's nothing wrong
- This happens to all phones, you must be doing something wrong
- It's a bad design and if you don't like it shut up and return it.

Never said it was a bad design, just a different one with certain trade-offs. The reason this thread is titled "There is NO reception issue" is because an issue implies that Apple screwed up as opposed to an intentional design decision.

Issue:
Apple didn't field test it properly and released the phone without discovering this problem - IMPOSSIBLE if you realize how extensive these things are tested.

Design choice:
Apple realized this new antenna would provide better reception, hold on better to weak signals, and provide faster downloads and uploads. The trade-off is that there is a sensitive area on the phone, perhaps even where a large number of people might touch while holding the phone naturally to them.

In the end, Apple said it's worth it to have this new antenna on the phone. While many people have an issue with their design choice, the phone itself has no issue.

 

[twigg]

1. Every phone with an internal antenna will experience signal loss when held.
Not to the extent that the iPhone 4 does. The amount of signal degreation is greater than just about every phone out there.
2. Every phone is legally required to put their antenna on the bottom of the phone because of laws concerning radiation. Therefore, cupping the bottom of any phone IS NOT the right way to hold it, regardless of how natural it feels.
The antenna on the iPhone 4 is around the phone (the stainless steel band). You are making no sense. And the correct way to hold the phone is the way I want to hold it.
3. Does the iPhone 4 experience MORE signal loss than other phones when held in this manner? According to Anandtech, definitely more than the 3GS and Nexus One. But since there is no set standard on how much signal loss is acceptable and no laws regarding this, it is NOT an issue legally and therefore, Apple is not legally required to fix it (they can if they want to).
Just because the there is no set standard for cell phone reception that doesn't mean that Apple can't be held liable for deliberatly shipping a phone with a defect that makes the phone unusable under "normal" and expected circumstances. Oh, and thanks for admitting that the iPhone 4 has a reception problem.
4. The phone DOES NOT drop calls regardless of how you hold it if you have a strong enough signal.
This is true, but the problem is that you can't gt a strong signal due to th reception/antenna problem.
5. Does this make the iPhone 4 a poor phone for making calls? If you prefer to hold the phone this way, then yes. However, it is not defective, only poor and companies are legally allowed to release poor products. If you are dissatisfied, please return the phone and get another one.
It's a design defect that impedes it's expected function, a phone. Now don't tell me that if a car company made a car designed in such a way that the car repeatedly stalls that the company would not be liable. And the "just return it" comment is just plain stupid. If I buy a product and it doesn't work the I have the right to voice what I feel and demand that the issue be fixed. No other company has fanboys that will defend it even when it is surely wrong, if Microsoft did something like this people would be going insane, and MS would actually try to fix the problem. Not just BS it's customers. It's weird that this "software problem" degrades my data speed and call reliability. If I have 5 bars and 2 Mbps down and touch the gap, I get 0.5 Mbps. Yep, it's just a problem with how the bars are displayed and touching the gap changes the hardware.
6. But my store has a restocking fee! Then it is your mistake for buying it on launch day. Most people wouldn't think about buying anything else (phones, computers, TVs, cars, etc.) wouldn't first reading a few reviews but for Apple products, they get sucked in by the mania. That's nobody's fault but your own.
I think you should be able to return defective products for a full refund. If it was not working as advertised/expected when I got it why should I have to pay a restocking fee?

.

 

[dagomike]

It does happen to all phones. There are plenty of instances where I dropped calls with my 3GS. My 3GS certainly dropped a hell of a lot more calls than my old Samsung phone. Thats the reality of cell phones. If everyone who dropped a call, or had decreased antenna strength claimed they had a defective phone, nobody would own a cell phone.

But we all agree that the iPhone 4 is worse than the 3GS? At least I can complete a call while holding the 3GS in my hand...

Never said it was a bad design, just a different one with certain trade-offs. The reason this thread is titled "There is NO reception issue" is because an issue implies that Apple screwed up as opposed to an intentional design decision.

Issue:
Apple didn't field test it properly and released the phone without discovering this problem - IMPOSSIBLE if you realize how extensive these things are tested.

Design choice:
Apple realized this new antenna would provide better reception, hold on better to weak signals, and provide faster downloads and uploads. The trade-off is that there is a sensitive area on the phone, perhaps even where a large number of people might touch while holding the phone naturally to them.

In the end, Apple said it's worth it to have this new antenna on the phone. While many people have an issue with their design choice, the phone itself has no issue.

Just because you do something on purpose doesn't make it a good decision.

Perhaps another choice would have been to make the band out something non-conductive like plastic... But that's not shiny, so...

 

[-aggie-]

.

You’ve got to be kidding with the green text. No one can read that crap.

 

[joeybuckets]

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

 

[twigg]

The reason this thread is titled "There is NO reception issue" is because an issue implies that Apple screwed up as opposed to an intentional design decision.

There can be unintended issue with the phone. Ex: light leaking, etc. So you saying that the phone does have an issue with reception but that Apple may have choosen this. So either Apple created an intentional flaw or by accident, either way they did it and they should own up to it.

Btw sorry if I come off as angry, I'm not lol.

 

[big0mar]

But we all agree that the iPhone 4 is worse than the 3GS? At least I can complete a call while holding the 3GS in my hand...



Just because you do something on purpose doesn't make it a good decision.

Perhaps another choice would have been to make the band out something non-conductive like plastic... But that's not shiny, so...

No. My iPhone 4 is significantly better as a phone than my 3GS. That doesn't mean it is for everyone though. A lot depends on how strong your signal is.

The rest of your complaints are really things that should ahve informed your decision to purchase the phone. You don't go buy a Hyundai and act surprised that its not a Pontiac. The external antenna has its advantages and disadvantages. It works better for some, and worse for others. This is a fact with all devices.

 

[drjsway]

Just because you do something on purpose doesn't make it a good decision.

Whether it's a good decision or not is subjective. Personally, I think the trade off is worth it. However, I do not touch the sensitive spot.

You may think the trade-off is not worth it and that's perfectly valid. But REFUSING to even consider the solutions? Personally, I think adjusting the way you hold it or buying a bumper is not too much to ask.

I understand your points. Why should you change the way you hold phones? Why should you buy a $29 accessory? Well, like it or not, those are your solutions. So you won't consider your options and you don't want to return the phone.

So what do you expect from Apple? You're gonna force them to redesign the phone?

In the end, the new iPhone is not perfect but it is what it is. If you can live with it, great. If not, Apple is offering a full refund. But just accept the fact the this "issue" will likely never go away.

 

[nippyjun]

Anantech observed up to a 19.8db signal loss when holding the phone covering the bar. FACT.

This proves with a good signal, you will experience NO LOSS OF BARS. FACT.

I get over 5MB/s down when holding the phone naturally and 4MB/s doing the death grip. Observable, yes, but far from data grinding to a halt. My 3GS never got more than 3.5MB is the same location.

It's ridiculous that people still think this is a big issue.

Excellent post.

 

[drjsway]

The antenna on the iPhone 4 is around the phone (the stainless steel band). You are making no sense. And the correct way to hold the phone is the way I want to hold it.

Yes, I know the antenna is around the phone but the sensitive area is on the bottom, the same spot where the antenna of most phones are.

It's a design defect that impedes it's expected function, a phone. Now don't tell me that if a car company made a car designed in such a way that the car repeatedly stalls that the company would not be liable. And the "just return it" comment is just plain stupid. If I buy a product and it doesn't work the I have the right to voice what I feel and demand that the issue be fixed. No other company has fanboys that will defend it even when it is surely wrong, if Microsoft did something like this people would be going insane, and MS would actually try to fix the problem. Not just BS it's customers. It's weird that this "software problem" degrades my data speed and call reliability. If I have 5 bars and 2 Mbps down and touch the gap, I get 0.5 Mbps. Yep, it's just a problem with how the bars are displayed and touching the gap changes the hardware.

Never said it was a software problem and pretty sure it's not. Your car analogy makes no sense since a lot of people are not experiencing the stalls. Also, if the car company says "if you don't touch the gap, there will be no stalls or you can put a $29 case over the gap if you insist on touching it", there wouldn't be a problem.

I think you should be able to return defective products for a full refund. If it was not working as advertised/expected when I got it why should I have to pay a restocking fee?

Apple is offering a full refund.