I can never fathom college without a laptop, right now if I didn't have my macbook I would be extremely pissed off because its finals and everyone is in here trying to use the schools computers in the library. During this time of year if I can find an open dell that is working I might as well buy a lotto ticket. I started my freshmen year with a hand-me-down IBM thinkpad, it worked for what it was but it had a horrible battery life and my hate for windows only continued to grow that year. I got fed up with the thinkpad took all my savings and bought myself a macbook. Two years later I am still enjoying great battery life and the stability of mac osx. Some may see a laptop as a luxury in college, but it just adds to my mobility and productivity making it well worth it IMO.
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Thinking of Mac over HP, why? Battery life. Important for college?
- Thread starter Ryuukumori
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Thats not true.
OS X needs just as much maintenance as Windows and you will end up having to reinstall OS X just as often as you would Windows. OS X gets just as "bogged down" with time as well, thanks to the fact that it doesn't have a true uninstaller and even programs like AppZap and AppDelete will leave a bunch of files behind.
Whats BS? My REAL EXPERIENCE with HP products? You know thats what I was talking about, right?
In response to both gotzaiPhone and Ryuukumori, let me tell you my experience with Apple products.
My first MacBook had a bad DVD writer out of the box and the plastic started to yellow and crack within weeks of owning it. I had to send it out to Apple. It was sent back to me without the DVD writer even touched and the case was scratched to all hell. It went back in. This time they performed a "repair" that rendered my DVD writer completely useless and, again, scratched the case up to no end. Apple ended up replacing the unit.
Fast forward to January and Feb. of this year. The case, again, starts to fall apart. It takes THREE trips out to repair to get the system fixed properly.
Now on to October of this year. The case, again, starts to crack and fall apart. It took about 3 weeks before Apple finally agreed to a replacement at the beginning of November.
In all, I had barely owned a Mac a year and a half by that point and I had been without it thanks to repairs for nearly three full months.
Now as far as what gotzaiPhone said about HP's practices when it comes to warranty support, I honestly don't believe it one bit. What he described would be illegal under the Magnuson-Moss act as well as many state laws. HP simply CAN NOT treat people that way if they are still under warranty. My experience with HP has been that they have been quick to replace, and upgrade, any time I've had a small problem that could have been repaired.
I also want to point out that HDD failures are NOT the fault of the computer manufacturer. Everyone buys the same WD, Hitachi, Fujitsu, Seagate, etc. drives.
I think we understand now, mosx. You had a bad experience with Apple. Then why are you in this crusade against Apple? As far as I know, it happened two years ago, when I look at your old messages. Don't you think it's time to pass at something else now?
It depends on your priorities. I got a Macbook because I was bored with PCs. I've had it for a year now, and it's still going strong. I prefer OS X to Windows, but I also prefer PC hardware to Mac hardware. However, the benefits of the OS outweigh the detriments of the laptop, so I'm satisfied. If it broke today, I'd be really pissed, because I haven't done a backup in weeks. After mourning, I'd place an order for a new Macbook.
Its happened over the course of the last two years
I just finally got my (hopefully) final replacement about a month ago. It took nearly 2 years from the time I bought my first Mac until now to finally get one that will hopefully be problem free. Thats just a testament to Apple's build quality.
Its happened over the course of the last two years
Thats just a testament to Apple's build quality.
You didn't answer to my question. Why are you constantly hating Apple and trolling this kind of topics? Why do you insist to come here, on an apple forum, when Mac OS X is obviously not good enough/fit your needs?
I don't want to start a fight, but when I look at your recent message archive, it seems the only think your post around here is about how Macs and OS X "sucks"
Well, one reason I'm here is because of the fact that I do own a Mac.
Second reason being I want to be able to help people make truly informed decisions when it comes to deciding between Macs or PCs.
Unfortunately, there are too many people here who are quick to spew lies regarding Windows that haven't been true for over a decade now. They'll say things like Vista is unstable, when its not, or that you can easily get a virus in Vista, which is absolutely untrue. They'll bring up driver compatibility issues which was something Apple made up and has absolutely NEVER been true.
So I hang around to make sure people know the truth and then they can decide for themselves.
And as I've said many times before, its truly pathetic when someone brings up "trolling" just because they don't like to hear the facts regarding Macs and OS X in general.
I don't think he's bashing on the Mac and OSX perspective. He's only giving an opinion based on both sides of this topic: HP and Mac- performance and battery life.
I don't have a problem with it really. Now, if every single topic were a "Drop Mac, get an HP" thing, then that's another story. I respect anyone's opinion, if it's legitimate, has backup evidence, and not heavily favoring and/ or influential.
I dunno, if I'm wrong, correct me.
It's not that I don't when to hear the facts. I do have some hardware problem. Nothing major. Never had problem with Mac OS X and I find it very stable, a lot more then was my XP box .But it's just that many of your facts/claims seems like generations, exaggeration or very loosy to me.
Moving your mouse to crash Mac OS X? Sorry to bother, but we have no information whatsoever you were running or anything else. I've never seen or heard a cursor crashing an OS by itself and I really don't see how it could affect OS X to produce this effect.
There's also plenty other claims that seems suspicious to me, but I just don't want to continue and take the time to talk about it over a threads (which we are way off-topic anyway).
I'm in my 6th year of uni (grad school now) and I want to throw my support behind almost everything nope7308 has already said:
1. A laptop is not a requirement for most uni's.
2. As a mobile computer in uni where electric outlets are common, footprint and weight are much more important than battery life.
3. Always backup! Whether it be an external HD or USB key or CD or emailing yourselves documents or software options like Dropbox.
4. In lecture, manually writing notes on pen and paper is far better than typing toward improving memory retention. Also, laptops can be a big distraction.
1. A laptop is not a requirement for most uni's.
2. As a mobile computer in uni where electric outlets are common, footprint and weight are much more important than battery life.
3. Always backup! Whether it be an external HD or USB key or CD or emailing yourselves documents or software options like Dropbox.
4. In lecture, manually writing notes on pen and paper is far better than typing toward improving memory retention. Also, laptops can be a big distraction.
I'd disagree with this, while I did notice the battery life isn't as good on the newer macbook, I'd go for the aluminum for the ruggedness and 1/2 lbs weight savings alone. The plastic macbooks have had issues with cracking on the palm rest (if you use one a lot, this is pretty much guaranteed to happen, I've seen it time and time again).. The LED backlight, glass screen, backlit keyboard, more rigid housing (less flex = better for internal components), slimmer profile are all great as well.
I haven't noticed an issue with wifi reception in day to day use, but I haven't done any critical testing either. If you use it in an area with reasonable signal strength I doubt you'd have any issues.
Rob
I'm going to call BS on this one, OS X doesn't get dirty and slow with time anywhere close to as much as Windows does, thats just flat out false.
Rob
mosx said:
Or Apple's equally powerful integrated graphics.
Wow, if you buy a more expensive or external battery, you get better battery life, that is amazing. I'll buy a second battery for my Macbook and get 10 hours of battery life, 12 even with wireless and bluetooth off.
Not sure about the charging time, but my Macbook has never taken an extensively long period to charge where it starts to annoy me. All of the Apple notebooks feature a fast charge, where it will charge to 80% in 1 hour, then take a couple of hours to finish the final 20%. I'm guessing this is on PC's too.
Apples quality control out surpasses Dell and HP, second only to Lenovo. Statistics don't lie. Not to mention Apple hands down have the best customer service in the industry. You get a far better built computer made from a solid piece of aluminium, a great screen which is far better than the screens on the old Macbooks, and a product that doesn't feel that it will bend from its own weight when you pick it up. Not to mention that it looks amazing, and of course runs an infinitely superior operating system.
Again, mosx, you have had some bad experiences with Apple, so have a lot of others. Why does that warrant you to go on a crusade against them, and think that ALL apple products are poorly built, when evidence clearly shows that both their build quality and customer service is better than Dell and HP. Apples products as with all other OEM's have always had build quality issues, it is no better and no worse than it was 5 years ago. There are far more people complaining because Apples sales have increased 50%+ year over year for quite some time.
Not to mention that Apple are always on the absolute bleeding edge when it comes to design. Others stick with tried and tested- yet fugly products.
I don't know what you are talking about with OSX having to be re installed. I've been on Macs for nearly 20 years, never owned a PC (cooties) and that is ridiculous unless you are loading weird apps.
DVD writers are also not made by Apple. Sorry for your already known issues with the plastic macbook, but you should have just insisted on a new DVD burner and new topcase after doing the research on the cracking cases.
I've had such good response with Applecare over the years, I also don't know what you are talking about. On the last day of my Powerbook G4's three year warranty, they replaced the topcase, logic board and bottom case for free. It was essentially a new computer. And i mean it was the LAST day of warranty. That computer is still running.
I doubt Apple is going to update the lower end Macbook with a backlit keyboard, this is classic Apple upselling... it worked on me
I'm diggin my backlit Macbook, it was money well spent. Keep in mind the most significant difference is the OS, that alone is worth every bit of extra money the Mac may (or may not) cost. Not worrying about spyware, viruses, constant security issues, hardware compatibility issues are great benefits of OS X, not to mention the far superior UI, features like Time Machine, the UNIX core if you decide to geek out, etc..
If you were looking to run only Windows, then I'd consider a Thinkpad as well... for reliability, ease of working on, the Thinkpads are top of the line (or were? I've worked on many IBM thinkpads, but only used a couple Lenovos, so I can't make a real informed statement on them)... but the Thinkpads are very modular (like using daughter boards for power input; instead of saving a couple bucks by soldering the regulators and jack onto the mobo; which means expensive replacement for parts that commonly go bad), replacement parts are easy to come by, they are very well designed and made, very durable. I think they're better made than any Macs I've worked on, especially including the iBook (horrible laptop to take apart) and the plastic macbooks.. the Unibody Macbooks are very nice, but replacement parts out of warranty will surely be more expensive than Thinkpad parts, albeit probably not hard to come by.
Rob
I'm a college senior and I've used a black macbook throughout my time at school. Sure, many schools have outlets all over the place. Not all do, and it varies from building to building, but I think that it doesn't really matter.
For school, having to move from class to class, from lounge to lounge, etc, etc... I would say that a good battery life on a computer is just butter. You don't want to be that guy trying to whip out/zip up his adapter after every lecture... it's tedious for you and potentially annoying for the people that need to get around you. Eventually, some punk is going to trip on your power cord (not so bad with the magsafe... has saved my computer more than once from a horrifying death).
I'd say go with the mac... you'll like the real-world battery life and they're great for school.
G'luck
As I said, I've had OS X crash many times at random doing seemingly innocent things.
Absolutely nothing was running in the background when I sat down to use the computer that day and it froze.
I've had OS X crash while emptying the trash (only jpeg files were in it), I've had it crash while trying to burn a data DVD in Finder, I've had it crash while connecting an optical audio cable, I've had it crash while browsing Gamespot in Safari. I can go on and on and on.
I've used Windows for more than a decade and OS X for a couple of years now. OS X definitely slows down with time. If you run ccleaner on Windows and Onyx on OS X then they generally both stay good as new.
hah! The 9400M as powerful as as a 512MB 9600M GT? I don't think so. HP offers a 9600M GT in the 15.4" and 17" Intel models.
The 9400M is more powerful than the old 8400M GS, but the 8400M GS is more than 2 years old now.
Thats not true. With the MacBook you absolutely HAVE to have the screen at 50% brightness. It's unusable below that. Despite Apple's claim, the real world battery life, in my experience on all THREE of my MacBooks (including the aluminum one), with screen at 50%, WiFi on, and doing light browsing, I get around 4 hours. So in reality, buying TWO batteries for the MacBook (and going through the hassle of swapping them out) will net you less battery life than having a 12 cell and a standard 6 cell battery on an HP
Oh and 12 cell is not "external".
You're thinking of the iPods, not Macs. iPods have the fast charge feature. Not a single one of my MacBooks has ever been able to reach 80% charge in a single hour.
Go read the Apple support forums. I just did a quick google search and a number of posts there confirm that the MacBook has no fast charge feature.
Hah! What statistics? If you had kept up on your news at all, you'd know that Lenovo's build quality is nowhere near what IBM's was. They're just another cheap manufacturer that charges too much now.
And I've had several HPs and Macs over the years. My aluminum MacBook is the FIRST of all of them to actually be built as good as my HPs. But with the Mac I now have to worry about dents, scratches, and corrosion.
If Apple had the best customer service in the industry, I'd still be on my first Mac! I wouldn't be on my THIRD one now because of incompotent technicians and engineers that not only can't properly repair computers but destroy them at the same time.
Oh and "good" customer service isn't only open on business days and closed every day after 6PM.
Yeah the top case with the keyboard and such feels very solid. The other parts, however, like the top and bottom, feel somewhat soft and its obvious they will dent or scratch with even a slight amount of force.
Yeah, thats true. But not as good as the 1680x1050 glass screens that HP has been offering for months before Apple went that route.
My HPs have never felt that way. My MacBooks haven't either. The MacBook Pros and PowerBooks I've used, however, have felt very "bendy".
Yeah it looks exactly like my HP dv6500t that I'm typing on right now. In fact, when I open my aluminum MacBook and sit it right next to the HP, it looks like its smaller sibling.
Yeah an a "superior" operating system that got pre-emptive multi-tasking 6 years after Windows did and even a decade later can't fully hardware accelerate video the same way Windows has been for a decade, and the same way Linux has been doing for awhile now.
My experience says otherwise. HP has been infinitely better to me than Apple ever has been. All three of my HPs have been built better than all of my MacBooks and I have much less to worry about with my HP than I do with my MacBook.
I'm on no "crusade", I just want people to make informed decisions based off FACTS and not FUD like "Vista crashes!".
Really? Thats kind of funny. Because HP moved to glass screens months before Apple did. Not to mention the fact that the plastic MacBook looked a lot like that iBook that was introduced in what was it? 2001? And the MacBook Pro looked a lot like the aluminum PowerBooks introduced more than half a decade ago now. The MacBook and MacBook Pro introduced in October basically took the designs HP had been using for years and then abandoned, and then took HP's designs from their new systems (glass screen) and combined the two. I wouldn't call that "bleeding edge".
I shouldn't have had to insist on anything. Apple's repair facility should have been compotent enough to replace the drive and NOT damage the new case in the process.
So? It was under warranty. Just because it was the last day doesn't mean anything. In California and many other places, if you tell them of the problems while IN warranty they have to repair it OUT of warranty regardless.
Spyware and viruses are an absolute NON-ISSUE with Vista and XP SP3 (and SP2). The only way you can get a virus or spyware is by ignoring the browsers multiple warnings and the OSes multiple warnings and actively download, install, and run the software yourself.
Bringing up something that hasn't been true since Windows 95 is like harping on the fact that Mac OS didn't finally get multi-tasking on the same level as Windows 95 until Mac OS X
Security updates are issues just as often as they are by Apple, and Microsoft has actually been proven to be FASTER at releasing security updates than Apple.
I'm sorry but that is COMPLETE nonsense. I've been using Windows since Windows 3.0 and I have NEVER EVER had hardware compatibility issues. I have NEVER had driver issues. I have NEVER had ANY problems with ANY piece of hardware I have EVER owned.
As far as looks go, Vista's Aero is miles ahead of the depressing grey tone of Leopard.
As far as useability goes, why did Apple remove live previews from the dock for Leopard?
Honestly, aside from Expose, Windows is better in every way. You don't have to worry about an application crashing and holding the menu bar hostage in the process (happened to me plenty of times) and you don't have to worry about other silly little things, like requiring two different keyboard shortcuts to tab through applications and windows to get to where you want to be.
Because wasting storage space by having multiple copies of every single file on a single backup drive is somehow a good thing.
HP has had separate DC connector boards for years now.
Plus they're reinforced and generally designed to handle the wear and tear of plugging in and unplugging.
Which is no better than the average PC in a real world situation. Apple just overstates the battery life in unrealistic conditions.
I'm no computer component pro, but I would that your unit had faulty hardware. The same could have happened into another notebook from another brand and it would still freeze like you mentionned.
Onyx is doing pretty much what OSX does automatically at night, it's just that it put an UI over it and you can launch every maintenance tool (permission repair, disk checking...) from OSX on the go. All that and some useful tools like cache deleting.
Thats not true. With the MacBook you absolutely HAVE to have the screen at 50% brightness. It's unusable below that. Despite Apple's claim, the real world battery life, in my experience on all THREE of my MacBooks (including the aluminum one), with screen at 50%, WiFi on, and doing light browsing, I get around 4 hours. So in reality, buying TWO batteries for the MacBook (and going through the hassle of swapping them out) will net you less battery life than having a 12 cell and a standard 6 cell battery on an HP
unusable at lower then 50% brightness? It's ******** or you to go check your eyes. Depent of the environment, but I still can use it at my desk, with the room's light in my back and still be able to work without problem. I been also successful in using in my classes rooms with the lowest brightness.
And switching isn't that much of a hassle, just shutting it down (might take just around 5-10secs anyway) switch battery and turn it up again. I'm sure I would be able to do it in less then 2 minutes.
Defective computers does happen, and you got two. It's just bad luck in the end. **** happens. But you were able to get a new Macbook nonetheless.
Oh, and mediocre techniciens does exist. Even at Apple.
It's all about taste. Who really cares anyway?
I call ********. Non-issue? If it was a so not issue, there would be no security update or thing like that. You wouldn't even be forced to put an Antivirus and be obligated to do weekly scan to be sure you didn't get any. Same thing about Spyware. If I neglect doing any Ad-Aware and SpyBot scans, I would turn crazy at the amount of crap my Windows box would drag with it. I can't count the times where a virus just bypass every resources sucking security programs I was running and had to format the hard drive. All that because of some tiny security holes that wasn't patched by Microsoft at time.
I've been running my mac free of any third party security programs for 2 months now. Still running as new.
But in the end again, it all depend of how you use your computer.
Good for you. But because you had no difficulties mean absolutely nothing about the millions others that used it.
It's a matter of taste, AGAIN.
It does not work like that entirely. If you make constant changes to some files, then yes there would be many copy of the files. But if it stay unchanged, Time Machine will not make copy to waste place.
That would be incorrect! Any mac user will tell you that. I have been a windows laptop user for years and had a bunch of different ones, and NONE of them came CLOSE to the battery life i have on the Alu MB. Simple fact.
Nope. It happened with two different MacBooks and two different versions of OS X.
On top of that, both Windows XP and Windows Vista were 100% rock solid stable on both. If it was hardware then Windows would have been affected to and it wouldn't have happened on two different systems.
OS X doesn't do anything at night or own its own without you telling it to.
As I've said in other posts, my optometrist tells me I have some of the best eye sight hes seen
It's just that, unlike Apple fans, I'm not willing to let eye strain become a regular part of my life. Thats why having the display below 50% is unacceptable.
On an aluminum MacBook? Shut it down, remove the cover, take the battery out, put the new one back in, put the cover back on and hope that it goes back on right and its not loose or uneven or anything, then turn it back on. On the HP? Shut it down (takes as long to shut down as OS X does), slide the latch to release the battery, pop the double capacity battery in, restart.
I didn't get defective computers. I got computers that are typical of Apple's bad build quality.
You know that OS X has security updates, right? And in a hacking contest earlier this year, OS X was the FIRST to fall, right?
Please stop spreading FUD.
You are absolutely 100% NOT FORCED to install anti-virus or spyware software. All you have to do is NOT visit shady sites and NOT ignore the multiple warnings you get when YOU try to actively download, install, and run malicious software YOURSELF. We are NOT talking about Windows 95 any more. Something absolutely CAN NOT install itself without the users permission any more.
Then thats YOUR fault for browsing shady and malicious websites. Its your fault for not using secure software while taking part in questionable activities.
I've been running Vista for more than a year with no anti-virus and it's still running as good as new.
Only Apple has ever said anything about hardware compatibility issues. Real world PC users never run into such issues.
And I've had several Windows notebooks as well as my aluminum MacBook and 2 other MacBooks and I can tell you that REAL WORLD battery life is better on my HP and very similar in other cases.
Just because you say it, doesn't make it true. Apple advertises over 5 hours on these new MBs. Most other laptop manufacturers advertise 2.5-3 hours at the most. You mean to tell us that Apple just decided to LIE about the extra 2 hours? They would've been sued 1000 times over by now.
My last laptop a 1 year old Toshiba had an advertised battery life of 2.5 hours. I could NEVER get more than 1h30-1h45 minutes, no matter what Performance Mode i chose in Vista.
Take the Alu MB, I can actually get 4-6 hours of use, WITHOUT having to sacrifice any CPU (only lower the brightness, which one would have to do on a PC laptop as well).
This is the truth. There is no way that a factory battery on a pc laptop, will do better than a Mac in REAL WORLD or any other world you want.
To solve this argument going on...
I like BOTH! Macs, new for me, are nice to use. I especially like the iLife software.
HPs are reliable (I have a family HP desktop here). I have grown up with HPs my entire life.
So, to summarize everything, I will be buying an aluminum MacBook June of 2009, and any extra money left over, I will be building a custom gaming PC that can handle a lot of intense gaming. The MacBook will be for school and work.
I like BOTH! Macs, new for me, are nice to use. I especially like the iLife software.
HPs are reliable (I have a family HP desktop here). I have grown up with HPs my entire life.
So, to summarize everything, I will be buying an aluminum MacBook June of 2009, and any extra money left over, I will be building a custom gaming PC that can handle a lot of intense gaming. The MacBook will be for school and work.
Bottom line is, you BUY something that WORKS FOR YOU! I can tell you how amazing OSX or Vista are 'til you're blue in the face, you still need to chose whatever you're most comfortable with, not what PEOPLE think you should buy. I've been bugged by my friends for YEARS to switch to a Mac, and never did until the right time came along, and I reasoned my decision very well. And now that I did it at the right time I couldn't be happier! I switched not because of my friends or anybody else, but simply because I decided that a MAC would be the best fit for me right now..
It looks like you have good arguments for your decision, and thus you will enjoy your purchases.
You've never noticed the fine print on Apple's website?
They clearly tell you that battery life depends on usage and condition of the battery. So do other manufacturers. It's in little tiny print at the bottom of the page.
HP advertises 4.5 hours with the 12 cell battery but I can get 6.5 out of it. They advertise 3.5 with the 6 cell and I get almost that much. I did when it was new.
Apple advertised 6 hours on my first white MacBook. Real world was 3.5 hours. This aluminum MacBook is the same, 3.5 out of 5 rated.
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