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If the specs predicted are correct, then this is a very minor update any which way you look at it.

So they give a small CPU bump, and make a couple of previous BTO options standard, big deal.
 
Freescale

Since someone mentioned the freescale dualcore next gen e600's are not ready yet, can they perhaps enlighten us on whn they are? They were announced back in september, and it seems (by the way the advertise the thing on their site, with tech docs etc..., (something that did not happen when the motorola 'G5' was annouched centuries ago (the chip that never was...)) they are close to be ready..

In fact, it makes me wonder if these chips are closer to production than we think, or allready are but yields are a bit too low to ensure a reliable steady flow of CPU's in the direction of Apple....

I think that the dualcore e600 will be a beauty for the PB, faster buss, faster clock, lower power, that I believe would be a SIGNIFICANT development... but perhaps not yet...not yet..... :)
 
Evangelion said:
I do know a bit ;). Yes, fast FSB is a good thing. I would much rather have a fast FSB than a slow FSB. But FSB alone does not make CPU fast or slow. Like I said, why does G4 compete so well against G5, even though G5 has over three times as much FSB-bandwidth as G4 does?

uses a different technology, altivec

"the Velocity Engine, embodied in the G4 processors, expands the current PowerPC architecture through addition of a 128-bit vector execution unit that operates concurrently with existing integer and floating-point units. This provides for highly parallel operations, allowing for simultaneous execution of up to 16 operations in a single clock cycle. This new approach expands the processor's capabilities to concurrently address high-bandwidth data processing (such as streaming video) and the algorithmic intensive computations which today are handled off-chip by other devices, such as graphics, audio, and modem functions.The AltiVec instruction set allows operation on multiple bits within the 128-bit wide registers. This combination of new instructions, operation in parallel on multiple bits, and wider registers, provide speed enhancements of up to 30x on operations that are common in media processing."

if it did not have it the g4 would be kerput against the g5


If it's not an significant update, why is there a several pages long thread about it?

if we right a thread about a powermac 2.6 would that mean its a big update?

the real answer is we are mac enthusiasts

The "1GHz G5" was merely an example I used to get the point across as to what Apple would have to do in order to put G5 in a PB. No need to take it literally.

the reason i took it literally is beacause you made an argument for it:)
of course a 1.67 g5 is going to beat a 1ghz g5

Lots and lots of people talk about the need of having faster FSB. Yet the G4 does relatively well even with it's slower FSB.

they do that for a reason

"the PowerPC G5 features an industry-leading 1GHz frontside bus for each processor, offering a staggering 16GBps throughput on dual 2GHz PowerPC G5 systems. That’s a huge leap over today’s Power Mac G4, with a bus speed of 167MHz. That means you won’t have a bottleneck getting information to the chip for processing."

the faster you get that info in and outta that chip the better

Huh? Are you talking about G4 being slightly faster than G5 or G5 being slightly faster than G4? regardless, the difference between the two is not that great.

yeah sorry i ment the g5 is slightly faster than the g4, but its not great,

G5 would win some benchmarks while G4 would win others. While G5 has architectural improvements, it also has some drawbacks. It has longer pipeline than G4 does, and it has higher memory-latency. Velocity-engine is better on the G4 as (IIRC) is the integer-units.

if its over all we are talking abou the g4 doesnt really stand a chance, the 64bit g5 wipes the floor with it,


point was that if G5 was put in to laptop today, they would have to underclock it so much that it would be slower than G4 would be
i totally agree with you. but i never said anything about puting a g5 in a powerbook untill they can get a 1.8 or 2ghz in there, after all whats the point? so your right yeah but it was never me arguing that point
 
AL-FAMOUS said:
uses a different technology, altivec

G5 has it as well, just not as good. Altivec == Velocity Engine

if it did not have it the g4 would be kerput against the g5

By same logic: "If G5 didn't have higher FSB-speed and higher clock-speed, it would be kerput against the G4".

of course a 1.67 g5 is going to beat a 1ghz g5

And it would beat 1.5GHz G5 on most benchmarks as well.

the faster you get that info in and outta that chip the better

Yep. But that alone does not make the CPU fast. G5 can get data in and out of the CPU really, really, really fast when compared to G4. So, it should run rings around the G4, clock for clock, right? I mean, since G4 is so FSB-starved, right? Yet it does not.

if its over all we are talking abou the g4 doesnt really stand a chance, the 64bit g5 wipes the floor with it,

64bits as opposed to 32bits does not make the CPU automatically better. Hell, all thing equal, 64bits code would be a bit slower than 32bit code is!

if its over all we are talking abou the g4 doesnt really stand a chance, the 64bit g5 wipes the floor with it,

Not really. Sure G5 has better performance, since it reaches higher clock-speeds. But it does that by running really hot. So, if you wanted to build fastest Mac possible, you would use G5, no question about that. But if you wanted to build best possible laptop, you would use G4. When it comes to clock-speed (the thing where G5 has it's advantage), the two CPU's would me more or less even when it comes to clock-speed. And in cases like that, G5 loses.

i totally agree with you. but i never said anything about puting a g5 in a powerbook untill they can get a 1.8 or 2ghz in there, after all whats the point? so your right yeah but it was never me arguing that point

OK then :). But, I'm not so sure that would 1.8Ghz G5 have significant benefits over 1.66Ghz G4.
 
k2k koos said:
Since someone mentioned the freescale dualcore next gen e600's are not ready yet, can they perhaps enlighten us on whn they are? They were announced back in september, and it seems (by the way the advertise the thing on their site, with tech docs etc..., (something that did not happen when the motorola 'G5' was annouched centuries ago (the chip that never was...)) they are close to be ready..

IIRC, they are scheduled for release in summer of 2005.

In fact, it makes me wonder if these chips are closer to production than we think, or allready are but yields are a bit too low to ensure a reliable steady flow of CPU's in the direction of Apple....

No, they are not that close to production. AMD has dual-core systems up & running as we speak and (AFAIK) they have send dual-core CPU's to OEMs and developers. And they have talked about dual-cores for quite some time and they have docs available. Yet they are scheduled for release in 3Q 2005 (around same time as DC-G4 is). These thing take time.

I think that the dualcore e600 will be a beauty for the PB, faster buss, faster clock, lower power, that I believe would be a SIGNIFICANT development... but perhaps not yet...not yet..... :)

Not only faster bus, it would also have integrated mem-controller. Which means significantly lower memory-latencies and less need for ultra-fast buses. FSB is mostly used to access the RAM. When you have integrated mem-controller, the RAM-access uses a dedicated channel, leaving the FSB to serve other purposes (talking with PCI-devices, vid-cards, HD's etc. etc.).
 
C'mon, stop fighting already. I'm not an Apple apologist and I do think the G4 has outlived most of its usefulness, but I must say, I STILL don't want a Pentium-M machine. They are very nice to look at, but Windows is Windows (sorry, Linux folks, I have no experience). No matter how many virus and spyware holes you plug up, there are still many more in existence and being exploited every day.
Yes, I know it's not "all about the OS," but it is partially about the OS. Point being, I wouldn't buy a 5GHz Pentium 5 running Windows RG.
 
k2k koos said:
Since someone mentioned the freescale dualcore next gen e600's are not ready yet, can they perhaps enlighten us on whn they are? They were announced back in september, and it seems (by the way the advertise the thing on their site, with tech docs etc..., (something that did not happen when the motorola 'G5' was annouched centuries ago (the chip that never was...)) they are close to be ready..

In fact, it makes me wonder if these chips are closer to production than we think, or allready are but yields are a bit too low to ensure a reliable steady flow of CPU's in the direction of Apple....

I think that the dualcore e600 will be a beauty for the PB, faster buss, faster clock, lower power, that I believe would be a SIGNIFICANT development... but perhaps not yet...not yet..... :)

I think they were talking sometime this fall. Which translates into if Apple doesn't announce the release of a G5 PowerBook at WWDC they will release a Freescale dual core sometime this fall. One or the other will happen.
 
edesignuk said:
If the specs predicted are correct, then this is a very minor update any which way you look at it.

So they give a small CPU bump, and make a couple of previous BTO options standard, big deal.

It's funny how depending on one's perspective how attitudes change, titter titter :rolleyes:
 
MacMyDay said:
So I guess ThinkSecret got something wrong then....
That remains to be seen. I didn't expect Jobs to announce such a minor upgrade in his keynote speech. This will be a "quiet" upgrade.
 
Other things to update besides G5...

Yeah, it is very annoying that there is still no G5 in the PB line, but why has Apple neglected to update other patrs of the PB line? For example: increases the LCD resolution to 1920 X 1200 on the 17" and maybe the 15" already. If Apple want s to say they make the sexiest laptop available they better have the screen to back it up. For those of you who think that this is too dense of a resolution, it should at least be there as a BTO option. What about also increasing battery life? Isn't that one of the primary reasons for buying a laptop, so you can use it for extended periods of time on the road or simply unplugged in your home? Finally, when is the PB line going to get a 256MB video card? Or at least the to[p of the line 128MB video card. Simply put, the PB line may be sleek, but it can't compete with other laptops in many areas.
 
:( I'm pretty upset that they haven't upgraded their workstations. If they are going to offer people top of the line video and audio software, and even the best OS, then they need to offer good computers too, and right now, their (workstation) computers suck compared to the industry. They only reason I'm not switching to Linux on PC is because I paid a good amount of money for Cubase SL a while back, and I don't think my expensive audio hardware has drivers for Linux. Apple needs to step it up or license the platform to a more capable company, like IBM. I'm not saying that a Powerbook isn't capable of doing what I want to do, but there haven't been updates since April, and that's ridiculous. :(

:) PS, just in case anyone else feels like switching to Linux, debian is a solid distro. Check out Cinelerra if you want HD video editing, compositing and effects, 64 bit color, and more. If you have to buy X86, please go with AMD, and don’t use Windows please. Linux is totally capable for audio and video production, including 3D animation and recording. The only problem you might encounter is with hardware support, but there are usually workarounds. :)
 
Diatribe said:
Why? Did you seriously think Jobs would "announce" an "upgrade" like this ? If you really did, I am amazed. :p

It's true, this upgrade is sort of bad, except for Bluetooth 2 and upgraded video card. Where is the screen resolution though!? I'm so sad. That Thinkpad looks very tempting right now...
 
legal action

Did anybody stop to consider if Think Secret posted the "wrong" PowerBook rumor on purpose?

Think about it. They are currently being sued by Apple for passing trade secrets. By having a "wrong" post on their list of MacWorld predictions ... they can now claim the "rumors" they post are just speculation and not illegally obtained trade secrets.

A little misinformation to help their agruments in court. It makes sense to me.
 
yawn

Metatron said:
OMG, I fu**ing hate apple sometimes. 9 months later for this. The G5 has been out for 2 years now. And the G4 has been out for something like 7. Don't you the hell tell me they could not put a G5 in the damn thing underclocked to at least get us away from the 133 mhz fsb.

All apple cares about now is thier damn iPod. Great, apple is turning into sony.
Thank goodness you are not running the show. They could put an underclocket G5 into it ... but the complainers would really be out in full force then. It is also not protecting the brand. It is better to get it right then provide a quickie to appease consumers like yourself.

Apple does not upgrade stuff until it meets specific criteria.

1. They can make it look good. (No PB G5 until they can resolve heat issues and get it into a sleek form factor)

2. They can maintain specific profit margins. This is not Dell people. They do things once the economies of scale have kicked in. Once the price of the components are available and reasonabily priced ... they make a move.

3. Timing. Right now it is better timing for the Mac mini than new Powerbooks.

4. Momentium. There needs to be an announcement to accompany the release of Tiger. A new G5 Powerbook sounds good to me. They also need to keep the wankers on Wall Street happy.
 
now what?

So there was no update and the possibility that Think Secret made that up to back up their case in court seems likely to me. I've been waiting for an updated PowerBook and am about to buy one just now, but rather than wanting the fastest G5 or dual-core or whatever, all I'm waiting for right now is anything that Apple calls an update because what I don't want is that I order a PB and the price is dropped so soon.
That's also why I see unlikely that updated models would be that much cheaper. That would mean that the current ones would have twice the price drop, wouldn't it?

BTW if you already own a recent PB G4, I don't see what's the big deal about everybody needing a G5 or dual core, when the G4 is capable of doing everything you could possibly and currently need with a portable. Or what is it that you guys can't do with a PB G4 that you can with any other portable?
 
Given that ThinkSecret nailed the iPod Shuffle after the lawsuit came out, I seriously doubt they "just made it up for the lawsuit". It would certainly be out of character given the comparative apparent intelligence of old Nick.

~J
 
ubergizmo.com post

Does anybody know if this is real or something? Seems like apple would say something first...

Digitimes reports that Apple has ordered anywhere from 30000 to 50000 PowerBook G5 laptops from Quanta, a Taiwanese manufacturer. Quanta is the largest laptop builder in the world and contracts for most major OEM such as Dell, HP and Apple.

The iBook G5 will also debut in this timeframe as the initial order from Apple seems to be in the order of 1.5 million units. Asustek who manufactures the iBook will also produce half a million iPod shuffle per month!

From: http://www.ubergizmo.com/15/archives/2005/01/apple_to_launch.html
 
Pictures

Even more news from Taiwan: there are some pictures too. :D
 

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