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ThinkSecret's iPod Rendering

Re: i'm a n e w b i e

Originally posted by mkaake
i've been reading for a while, and seeing as i'm a *newbie*, i don't know if this sort of post is looked down apon (as much as *first post!!!* anyways), but holy cow! some of you people really need to get a life! or maybe a job! or both!

my first complaint of complaints:
you're complaining about spacing of buttons being to far away on a device that is currently about the size of a deck of cards! think about that for more that 3 seconds!

my second complaint of complaints:
how many of you talk and type before you think?
how many times has it been said that firewire isn't going anywhere, usb2 is not concidered by apple as threat to fw (and it's not). just a lot of little things like that, where ppl just seem to be whining about everything that pops into their head, and before they stop to think about it, they write it down, because it really sounded good at the time.

of course, i still may be one of those people that needs to get a life, seeing as i'm still here reading every last post... hmm...
Click to expand...

I'd say. Complaining about people complaining, in my experience, is somewhat of a waste of time.

Doing it so rudely is just bad form.

You can argue your ideas without putting people down so harshly. We're all losers who need to get lives, duh! 😛
 
Some of you guys crack me up. Assuming that the new design does NOT increase the size of the iPod at all (and all indications seem to support this), I can't see how any of these "it will be hard to use with one hand" arguments hold any water at all.

For anybody who's worried that has a current iPod, do this: hold the iPod in your left or right hand, then run your thumb along the bottom of the screen from one edge to the other, where the new buttons will allegedly be located. See how easy it is to access the entire width of the iPod with one hand? I can do this no problem, and I have small hands!

Having said this, I prefer the LOOK of my original 5GB iPod, but I think this new design will probably be a big improvement in functionality. The circular button design sure is "purty", but it can be a pain to press the small buttons sometimes. I also get the same "accidental volume" thing as others do when changing tracks. Putting a small amount of space between the buttons and the scroll wheel will help the usability quite a lot.

The new design isn't fugly at all. To me, it's the difference between strikingly beautiful (the old design) and "merely" beautiful (the new design).
 
But it's not harder! I can't believe this is an issue! (regarding new button configuration)

It is most certainly harder! With the current button configuration you can navigate your iPod without looking down to see what buttons your pressing, its all by feel.
AND! might I say that anyone who REALLY has trouble with the current button configuration ( hitting the scrollwheel, accidentally turning up the volume etc. ) must be some of the most uncoordinated people on the face of this earth.

Let us not forget that with the current iPod form & function both peacefully coexist. If Apple is really changing the buttons for the sake of making it fresh, new, and different looking then that is one of the dumbest moves I've ever heard of. IF ITS NOT BROKE DON'T TRY TO FIX IT!!!

Don't get me started on how pointless an accessory the cradle is. What can it do that a single Firewire cable can't? Does this mean it comes in place of the Firewire cable? I'd rather they NOT include it and reduce the price of the iPod.

I think it goes without saying that we have limited information/details and will await its release until giving final judgement, but based on the rumors it doesnt sound promising.
 
The scroll-wheel is going away

I don't know if anyone has looked at Software Update today, but there is an iPod update that specificl references "scroll wheel iPods", which indicates to me that the new ones are not only coming soon, but that they won't have a scroll wheel.

Here's the text:

iPod Software 1.2.6 has improved battery management, providing the following updates:


Increased playback time on scroll-wheel iPods
Longer stand-by time for all iPods


nemo
 
Re: The scroll-wheel is going away

Originally posted by nemo
I don't know if anyone has looked at Software Update today, but there is an iPod update that specificl references "scroll wheel iPods", which indicates to me that the new ones are not only coming soon, but that they won't have a scroll wheel.

Here's the text:

iPod Software 1.2.6 has improved battery management, providing the following updates:


Increased playback time on scroll-wheel iPods
Longer stand-by time for all iPods


nemo
Click to expand...

No. This has been discussed already.

Apple distinguishes between the original iPods with a moving scroll-wheel and the newer ones with track-wheels.
 
Re: The scroll-wheel is going away

Originally posted by nemo
I don't know if anyone has looked at Software Update today, but there is an iPod update that specificl references "scroll wheel iPods", which indicates to me that the new ones are not only coming soon, but that they won't have a scroll wheel.

Here's the text:

iPod Software 1.2.6 has improved battery management, providing the following updates:


Increased playback time on scroll-wheel iPods
Longer stand-by time for all iPods


nemo
Click to expand...

This was already covered once.. the update you refer to is not new, for starters. Secondly, the 20 gig iPod never had a scroll wheel, and the 10 only had one in the first revision. What the sentence you are quoting really means, is: People who bought the first and second incarnations of the iPod, with the mechanical, moving wheel, will see increased playback time. As the article that accompanies your snippet explained, these older iPods tend to complain about low battery power and stop playing BEFORE the battery is really drained. This update fixes that.
 
Originally posted by MacRumorSkeptic
If Apple is really changing the buttons for the sake of making it fresh, new, and different looking then that is one of the dumbest moves I've ever heard of.
Click to expand...

Although I disagree, you do have a point. I don't think Apple would change the buttons for no reason. I speculate that the iPod OS will be updated as well to include other PDA type features like games.

Also, the cradle would be a good idea if the rumored Apple Tablet could also dock on it.

Are the rumors saying Firewire AND USB2, or Firewire OR USB2? Because if the iPod had USB2, then we could probably connect a keyboard directly to it.
 
Re: Re: The scroll-wheel is going away

Originally posted by IndyGopher
This was already covered once.. the update you refer to is not new, for starters. Secondly, the 20 gig iPod never had a scroll wheel, and the 10 only had one in the first revision. What the sentence you are quoting really means, is: People who bought the first and second incarnations of the iPod, with the mechanical, moving wheel, will see increased playback time. As the article that accompanies your snippet explained, these older iPods tend to complain about low battery power and stop playing BEFORE the battery is really drained. This update fixes that.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the clarification. I just assumed that even though the "wheel" on the 20 gig isn't mechanical, its only function is to "scroll" through song titles, so it still qualifies as a scroll wheel. And since the Software Update specifically mentions "scroll wheel" and not mechanical wheel, I thought it might be a hint of things to come.

Sorry for the retread of information.

nemo
 
It is most certainly harder! With the current button configuration you can navigate your iPod without looking down to see what buttons your pressing, its all by feel.
Click to expand...

There's no reason you can't navigate a row of straight buttons by feel either. I have no problems navigating my TV remote by feel, just like my iPod.

I don't see this as a valid "it'll be harder" argument. Even my old cassette Walkman circa 1985 is easy to navigate by feel, too.

AND! might I say that anyone who REALLY has trouble with the current button configuration ( hitting the scrollwheel, accidentally turning up the volume etc. ) must be some of the most uncoordinated people on the face of this earth.
Click to expand...

Oh come on. That's just unnecessary. I could say the same thing about you - if you find pressing a row of straight buttons "hard", then you're pretty uncoordinated, too. But I wouldn't say something like that. 😀

Let's just say that some people might prefer one arrangement, and others might prefer another. Leave the ad hominem attacks on our supposed coordination abilities out of it.

Bottom line is, you might like the design, you might not. That's quite fair, and much too subjective to argue about. Express your opinion and move on. But I still haven't seen any valid arguments that this alleged new design somehow ruins the FUNCTIONALITY of the iPod, it only affects the LOOK, period.
 
Re: Functionality

Ergonomics come to mind.

Having to move your thumb back and forth between the wheel and buttons makes it harder to use the iPod with one hand. People with smaller or "less coordinated" hands might have to use two hands to use it comfortably.

Even with large hands you'd have to shift your hand back and forth.
 
I go on vacation for a couple days and all iPod Hell breaks loose. First, I REALLY like the new design. I love my old (scroll wheel, heh-heh) iPod, but that love has been IN SPITE OF the layout of the buttons. I'm fat, and I have fat fingers and I'm always adjusting the volume or hitting "menu" when I don't intend to. the new layout is better.

I wish there was a 40 GB, but 30 will do. I was also hoping they'd be a little cheaper... I'll buy a new one anyway.

I don't know what to think about the dock. Just another thing on my too crowded desk. Will I still be able to charge it on the raod with just a cable and power plug? I travel too much to want to have to lug the dock with me as well.

Originally posted by rangerrick
new macwarehouse catelog describes iPods as bluetooth connectable-- any news about this?
Click to expand...

Many people seem to want bluetooth compatibility. It might work for those of you who use the thing to store your contacts and/or calendar, but it would never work for music files. Much, much to slow. Bluetooth is slower than most dial-up connections.
 
This is all sooooo terrible! I'm going to slit my own throat. Buttons, not buttons!!!! Waaaaaaa!!! Life is too cruel.
 
I'm not going to bitch about the new design, as it lowers the cost of the current 10 GB original and refurb stock if it's true. That said, the purported new layout is just so...unelegant. That's one of the things that made the iPod such a hit to begin with, it's simplicity of design and clean lines. I really hope Apple's not going to be cluttering it up like this. It just kind of feels like something Creative would do.
 
FW800: Some have said that it exceeds the speed capabilities of the small HDs used in iPods, so no benefit except during the initial moments of transferring to buffer. Thus, the more common FW400, with no adpaters needed, makes sense still. I don't know, personally.

Navigating by feel: much easier with the new buttons away from the wheel: feeling for buttons around the wheel means accidentally moving the wheel (changing the volume). Now, that problem is solved. As for finding which button you want, here's an experiment: pick up your iPod, close your eyes, and try to touch an imaginary button on the right side. Open your eyes and see if you made it, or if you accidentally wound up on the left. I don't have an iPod on me to test this.
 
You've just got to wonder... why would they change the layout of the buttons?

Is it just to do something different?

Is it because everything needed to be re-arranged internally to add other features?

Is it based on user feedback?

Guess we'll find out eventually... but I'm certainly not sweating over it. 😉
 
Oh come on. That's just unnecessary. I could say the same thing about you - if you find pressing a row of straight buttons "hard", then you're pretty uncoordinated, too. But I wouldn't say something like that.

I never said I find pressing a row of straight buttons "hard", I could easily do both. Its just that with the current button configuration I don't have to glance down for a split second to see what I'm pressing thus its easier, more intuitive and almost like a natural reflex.

Here are some crystal clear examples:
1.) To pause or play simply feel for & click the bottom most button.
2.) To Fast Forward or Skip feel for & press Right most button.
3.) To Rewind or Skip back feel for & press Left most button.
I'm sorry but there is NO WAY its easier to do this with any other type of layout.

This rumored configuration is a HUGE step backward unless the new iPod has increased funtionality that gives good reason for the new buttons.
 
My remote for my TV, stereo, DVD Player, etc. ALL have a "layout" similar to the alleged new iPod, I have no problem with them. Why would it be different here? It seems easier... actually, there is LESS hand movement if all you want to do is change pause/play, next, etc.... which is often what I would want to do... not volume.

I also don't think we have to worry about looks... when was the last time Apple let us down in that department?
 
New iPod buttons

Assuming this rumor is true, I personally would like to see and feel the real iPod before I jump to conclusions as to the egernomics/ease of use.

One concern I do have, as I look down at my old TV remote (which many people have compared the new button model to) I can't help but notice that after a few years of use there are no longer numbers on my TV keypad. Over the years, the paint has worn right off.

Hopefully if the buttons do have some kind of painted on identification they'll take this into account. Maybe by painting the underside of the button or perhaps not painting them at all, just engraving them somehow.

Just a random thought...
 
Originally posted by MacRumorSkeptic
Oh come on. That's just unnecessary. I could say the same thing about you - if you find pressing a row of straight buttons "hard", then you're pretty uncoordinated, too. But I wouldn't say something like that.

I never said I find pressing a row of straight buttons "hard", I could easily do both. Its just that with the current button configuration I don't have to glance down for a split second to see what I'm pressing thus its easier, more intuitive and almost like a natural reflex.

Here are some crystal clear examples:
1.) To pause or play simply feel for & click the bottom most button.
2.) To Fast Forward or Skip feel for & press Right most button.
3.) To Rewind or Skip back feel for & press Left most button.
I'm sorry but there is NO WAY its easier to do this with any other type of layout.

This rumored configuration is a HUGE step backward unless the new iPod has increased funtionality that gives good reason for the new buttons.
Click to expand...


Mon Dieu. Its a matter of personal preference. Some will like the old some will like the new. But, I think its wrong to dismiss the new when all we know of the new design is very VERY basic layout. We know nothing of improved features that may have warrented the change. It may be that with the new software having the old configuration use would be very complicated. So in onder to keep the simplicity of operation that the ipod is based upon the chage was necessary.

The Simple fact is we dont know and dismissing the new configuration outright is simply crap.

Personally, I have been waiting a few months now to get an ipod because of the rumorred updates. The way I look at it now is I get a great new 15gb ipod or a cheaper 10gb or old 20gb ipod.
 
Re: New iPod buttons

Originally posted by KLFloyd
Assuming this rumor is true, I personally would like to see and feel the real iPod before I jump to conclusions as to the egernomics/ease of use.

One concern I do have, as I look down at my old TV remote (which many people have compared the new button model to) I can't help but notice that after a few years of use there are no longer numbers on my TV keypad. Over the years, the paint has worn right off.

Hopefully if the buttons do have some kind of painted on identification they'll take this into account. Maybe by painting the underside of the button or perhaps not painting them at all, just engraving them somehow.

Just a random thought...
Click to expand...

I'm guessing this won't be an issue, unless it is with current ones. (I don't see why they'd change the materials of the buttons)
 
I never said I find pressing a row of straight buttons "hard", I could easily do both.
Click to expand...
Then what's the problem? Either you can "easily do both", OR it's a "HUGE step backwards". You can't have it both ways. Maybe the old way is much better for you. Fine - but that's a long way from saying that the new way is going to be actually difficult, as opposed to "slightly less easy". Sounds like you're exaggerating things to make your point.

It sounds to me like some people don't like the new look and are fishing for serious ergonomic reasons to back up their subjective opinion. Why is that necessary? Saying "I think the new design sucks" is plenty good enough, you don't need to bring anything else into it.

For the record, I've already said that I think the new design isn't as nice looking as the old one. I just don't see any ergonomic or functionality problems with the new design after a glance at some crude artist's renditions. And yes, I do have small hands and have no problem with coordination (see my "test" in a previous post).
 
If true, 2 steps backward no wheel input and a freaking cradle?

OK...

IF this thing is accurate...

The wheel navigation is one of the simplest most useful interfaces I have used. I love it. Adding those freaking buttons is just going to drive the prices UP on the old ones.

Cradle? CHRIST!

Suggestions?

Dump the chrome with a more scratch resistant surface, extend battery life, a tiny bit more gain on the outputs and either shrink it a bit more OR make it more 'drop proof'.

The originals were damn near perfect. Do you really NEED more capacity NOW?
 
Originally posted by Hemingray
You've just got to wonder... why would they change the layout of the buttons?

Is it just to do something different?

Is it because everything needed to be re-arranged internally to add other features?
Click to expand...

This is where I say "BINGO!"

Have you heard one bit of complaint about the buttons around the edge of the scroll wheel? I haven't . In fact I think they will still exist in the new iPods.

The four buttons at the top are for RECORDING functions.

That is the only justification for them I can see.

If I am not right here, the only other reason I can think of is production cost. Perhaps it will save them a boatload of money. Maybe even allow them to lower the price.

Otherwise, the drawing is 100% accurate.. as a rendering of BS.
 
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