Tim Cook Calls Apple's Tax Avoidance Accusations 'Total Political Crap'

[JimmyHook]

Read this and then tell me how they pay tax on revenue in Individual European countries.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/ampp3d/apples-uk-tax-avoidance-two-4344344


http://www.cnet.com/uk/news/apple-faces-billions-in-fines-in-tax-avoidance-probe/

Read this and then tell me how they pay tax on revenue in Individual European countries.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/ampp3d/apples-uk-tax-avoidance-two-4344344


http://www.cnet.com/uk/news/apple-faces-billions-in-fines-in-tax-avoidance-probe/

It's the mirror. And they state their own logical fallacy:

Normally tax is a percentage of profit, not revenue. However, because so much of Apple's expenditure is paid to itself, we're showing their stated revenue instead.


Tell me, again, why should they pay more than they are legally compelled to? Why are you blaming a company for following laws enacted by governments?

 

[nebo1ss]

The country is Ireland, the method employed is to choose to do business in a country with lower tax rates, and it is not improper.

So you would be ok with Apple selling product in New York and booking the income in Panama.

 

[Mr D]

Oh, but I do get to choose! I can choose not to bad Apple's coffers.

And how exactly does this effect Apple?

 

[MH01]

You want them to give 40 percent of their wealth to the US government when no law compels them to???? I want you to hand over 40 percent...

When you get a job, earn enough and that is what YOU will have to do

Is not the top tax tier in personal income in the USA 39.6%

 

[bushido]

It sounds like Ireland does the same for corporations.

but under EU law thats illegal so really Ireland should get fined

 

[Gary03mw]

Tim's right... it is total political crap.

 

[JimmyHook]

Sorry, I forgot Ireland is the next frontier. You thought the Chinese market was huge... Please. Apple is in Ireland for one reason and one reason alone, to not have to pay taxes. It's the same reason Apple keeps hundreds of billions of dollars overseas. To avoid paying taxes. Same reason why they borrow money when they don't need to. So they don't have to pay taxes and bring money back home. They use every trick in the book and use every loophole to avoid what? Paying taxes.

Tell that to the thousands they employ in Ireland. You want them to close shop and fire them all?

 

[nebo1ss]

It's the mirror. And they state their own logical fallacy:

Normally tax is a percentage of profit, not revenue. However, because so much of Apple's expenditure is paid to itself, we're showing their stated revenue instead.


Tell me, again, why should they pay more than they are legally compelled to? Why are you blaming a company for following laws enacted by governments?

Pointless discussing this any more. They will eventually be found guilty by the European courts and will have to pay millions if not billions in back tax.

 

[CalWizrd]

Sorry, I forgot Ireland is the next frontier. You thought the Chinese market was huge... Please. Apple is in Ireland for one reason and one reason alone, to not have to pay taxes. It's the same reason Apple keeps hundreds of billions of dollars overseas. To avoid paying taxes. Same reason why they borrow money when they don't need to. So they don't have to pay taxes and bring money back home. They use every trick in the book and use every loophole to avoid what? Paying taxes.

Exactly as they should. It is their obligation to their shareholders.

 

[JimmyHook]

Oh, but I do get to choose! I can choose not to bad Apple's coffers.

Then dont. Why are you on an Apple fan site again?

 

[Rogifan]

"Total crap".
Loosing his nerves. Typical of someone lying.

What is Tim Cook lying about?

 

[gnipgnop]

You want them to give 40 percent of their wealth to the US government when no law compels them to???? I want you to hand over 40 percent...

Where did I say that I "wanted" them to? I'm simply disputing the idea that 40% is some sort of barrier for doing business. They plan for much more complicated things than that in their own manufacturing process.

 

[furi0usbee]

Tell that to the thousands they employ in Ireland. You want them to close shop and fire them all?

No, have them start assembling computers. Right now, the exist only to funnel money. Pay taxes on the money and maybe open some manufacturing plants there, not tax avoidance plants.

 

[neuropsychguy]

OT, but is it me, or does Tim look like he's gaining weight?

I don't know, do you look like you're gaining weight?

 

[JimmyHook]

Pointless discussing this any more. They will eventually be found guilty by the European courts and will have to pay millions if not billions in back tax.

Lol! Ireland said they would defend them, as they should. I don't support governments who turn their backs on agreements they made. I don't support liars and thieves

 

[MrNomNoms]

Oh come on - you pay taxes on PROFIT not revenue. Do people know the difference between profit and revenue? Oh, and why should Apple pay tax on those overseas profits given that those profits were made overseas and paid tax for the business generated in those jurisdictions? if Apple are using techniques that are perfectly legal to reduce their tax bill then shouldn't the debate be around why politicians don't reform the tax code in the United States?

 

[phillipduran]

Countries make the tax laws. Apple follows the tax laws. Apple doesn't want to burn money away at places with high taxes. They find the places with low taxes. Sounds like sound and brilliant economic sense to me.

The ONLY reason people have their panties in a bunch is if they feel entitled to this money. That Tax is ours! They get mad because the USA doesn't get to be the one to tax the cash. Well maybe, if we stopped treating businesses so bad, and made the environment here comfortable for businesses, we would have more people keeping their cash here. Over tax businesses and what happens? Steel mills shutdown, car manufacturers move out of country, manufacturing moves out.

But down with corporate greed right? Lets tax big business right? People just don't want to recognize how valuable to this country, these big businesses are. 40% tax. That is just robbery. Flat out government robbery.

I hope cook beats our politicians with that tax code until they give in.

 

[postpc]

It's their money, not yours. You don't get to choose

Wrong, the goverment that answers to its electorate decides what gets done with it.

Never ceases to amaze how Americans get brainwashed into cheerleading for huge corporations, every dollar they don't pay in taxes you do, with your hard work and your lifetime. I respectfully suggest you stop bending over and start standing up for your own interests.

 

[Gary03mw]

I think people mix up the Ireland tax haven and the issue of US taxing overseas income.


The US is one of the only countries that has a tax code that taxes you on profits made in other countries.

A simplified description:

If you are a US company, build a computer in China, and sell it in Germany, you pay German taxes, and then US taxes when you bring the money home.

But if you're an Irish company, build a computer in China, and sell it in Germany, you pay German taxes only. You don't pay Irish taxes on a computer that wasn't sold in Ireland.


The rest of the world operates on the latter principle. Because the US expects you to pay US taxes on foreign profits, that makes it really bad to be a US company.

So, companies go out and form a secondary company for all non-US sales, and put that headquarters in another country. In this case, Ireland is selected due to low corporate tax and because of other, separate tax tricks you can do out of Ireland. If Ireland wasn't an option, virtually every other country in the world would also work, Ireland just has other bonuses as well.


Tim Cook wants the US to drop the tax code that says "You pay US taxes on your business in other countries after paying their taxes too." Because it's not actually raising money. It's just leading to companies not bringing their money back to the US to avoid getting taxed.


Politicians spin this in silly ways. It's easy to get political points by accusing Apple as a tax avoider. Democrats and Republicans alike spin this pretty badly. I've seen several politicians do stuff like divide global profits by US taxes to claim Apple only pays 4% in "net effective" taxes. It gives them free points to villainize Apple on a stage.

^This... well written and explained.

 

[furi0usbee]

Exactly as they should. It is their obligation to their shareholders.

Exactly. Which is why if someone says Apple is a different kind of company, don't believe them. They are in the business of making money, by making tech devices, not the other way around. It's why they sell an $80 iPad case that costs less than $10 to make... all for the shareholders. I love their computers, but hate their practices.

 

[phillipduran]

-> Cook described the tax avoidance accusations as total political crap.

-> He added that repatriating the money is not reasonable due to high corporate tax rates.

Those claims contradict each other. Apple is either avoiding tax or it isn't!

Tax avoidance is fine. You take deductions, you're using tax avoidance. No problem.

Tax evasion, that's a crime.

 

[MH01]

What is Tim Cook lying about?

See post number 3 on this thread. sums up the situation, in a nice comtradiction.

Any educated person knows they are avoiding tax, though no....Tim says they are not lol. even you know they are avoiding it legally......

 

[Unami]

Oh come on - you pay taxes on PROFIT not revenue. Do people know the difference between profit and revenue?

while this may be right in that context, it's not universally true. in some european countries, we have something called a revenue-tax, which apple would have to pay locally if they weren't be able to book all stuff sold online to ireland. you can get that tax paid on revenue back, if you don't make enough profit, but it's still a revenue tax.

 

[GFLPraxis]

Tax avoidance is fine. You take deductions, you're using tax avoidance. No problem.

Tax evasion, that's a crime.

Using a 1031 exchange to sell your house and buy another one with the money without paying taxes on it is technically "tax avoidance". Just the legal kind. You're doing what the law says you can do to minimize taxes.

 

[convergent]

Tax avoidance is fine. You take deductions, you're using tax avoidance. No problem.

Tax evasion, that's a crime.

Exactly. Anyone one in the US that has an IRA or 401K is as guilty of 'tax avoidance' as Apple is. If you aren't avoiding as much tax as you can, I personally think you are a total moron. The US govt. is pretty much totally inept at doing anything productive with the money you've earned and ordered to give them.