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Tim Cook 'Deeply Offended' by BBC Documentary on Apple Factory Conditions
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Some of those fathers being paraded out as if its Apples fault the fathers sent their 12yr old and 15yr old sons to work. Hello your the father put your foot down.
So much of the program sucked. Made for idiots by idiots.
Documentaries like this are made by the kind of people that think we should have no taxes AND universal free healthcare. Unrealistic and idealistic thinking not based on what the world is actually like.
I have no doubt Apple could do more but this was just a shock doc as bad as anything channel 4 or 5 produces.
I have no doubt Apple could do more but this was just a shock doc as bad as anything channel 4 or 5 produces.
The only real solution would be to move all manufacturing to the United States or other country with more stringent working rights but then all the kids won't be able to afford their nice shiny new $2000 phone (according to some experts if made in the USA).
The outrage will only go as far as the how much the masses can afford the device.
Personally, I'm not sure what Apple can do in terms of telling Foxconn how to run it's business in China. I suppose you could threaten pulling your business to somewhere else to which the Chinese would give a hearty laugh about the threat due to the huge profits made by employing Foxconn.
If Apple wants to claim moral superiority in the supply chain, then they best start directing more money that way to make the change to actually own the superiority or move it all to the USA.
I honestly don't think Apple can force Foxconn to do anything if they don't threaten to move away from them. Worker's rights in China is almost nil there (for a worker's paradise..heh).
The outrage will only go as far as the how much the masses can afford the device.
Personally, I'm not sure what Apple can do in terms of telling Foxconn how to run it's business in China. I suppose you could threaten pulling your business to somewhere else to which the Chinese would give a hearty laugh about the threat due to the huge profits made by employing Foxconn.
If Apple wants to claim moral superiority in the supply chain, then they best start directing more money that way to make the change to actually own the superiority or move it all to the USA.
I honestly don't think Apple can force Foxconn to do anything if they don't threaten to move away from them. Worker's rights in China is almost nil there (for a worker's paradise..heh).
You're absolutely right. Why bother trying to improve this world? It's already good enough for you, **** the other seven billion.
Bingo. When you are a company that advertises its raging liberal leanings, you better either live up to your own liberal standards, or quit being so "deeply offended" at being called out on your hypocrisy in the name of profit.
This dickumentary had nothing to do with any Apple factory.
For example: A tin mine! That has got to be four to six degrees of freedom away from Apple corporate or any "Apple factory". We're talking the stuff that goes into solder for heaven's sake.
Let's consider another solder-related example. Go buy a spool of solder. What control do you have over the poor downtrodden rosin-factory laborers? Well, the profit that your purchase provided enabled them to make a living, but what actual influence do you have over their lot? ...None and zero, of course.
Now maybe if you were in the position of buying many billions of dollars of solder spools then you could sit the solder retailer down and strongly suggest that they should treat the rosin workers in their supply chain better, and maybe they'll listen to you, but that falls well short short of outright control or influence... or responsibility, quite frankly.
Why does no one speak of the rosin-factory workers? Won't someone please think of the rosin-factory workers?
And cue the BBC.
I haven't been able to watch all of the Panorama episode, but what I have seen I don't think is anything new. I thought immediately of Nike in Vietnam, M&S etc in Bangladesh. We have seen these undercover reports before where the end client (in this case Apple) is trying to do something in the correct way and force change, but the manufacturer simply does what they want as soon as the end client's back is turned. I think the real story here is how difficult it is to do business in these countries, and how difficult it is to make change for the better.
At the very beginning, the video claims that Apple operates these factories. WRONG! These are foreign suppliers. Also, every foreign and much of the local made products are being manufactured under these conditions. This is not an Apple problem, it is and always has been an industry problem. They're attaching Apple's name to it just to get more viewers.
Spot on. Those fathers should've gone straight to their managers down at the office and gotten those kids an internship that'll set them down the same path of bliss with a 401k and decent healthcare benefits. Or even better, they should've quit their job and live off government benefits to support their family.
You know what, forget these people. They don't have any money, who really cares what happens to them...
Yes. I think Apple's factories are pretty much top of the list. But that list really is not hard to top.
The conditions are still absolutely appalling. I'm not saying don't buy anything from China. These days that's borderline impossible. What I am saying though is Apple have more retained profit than any company in the world and putting just a little of that aside to make their factories at least respectable would be a start.
These companies don't take low-level labour seriously. They're saying they're moral and ethical because the public is finally taking notice, but for the most part it's merely a PR facade.
Spot on. Those fathers should've gone straight to their managers down at the office and gotten those kids an internship that'll set them down the same path of bliss with a 401k and decent healthcare benefits. Or even better, they should've quit their job and live off government benefits to support their family.
You know what, forget these people. They don't have any money, who really cares what happens to them...
If you let your 12yr old son goto work instead of school and he dies who's fault is it?
If you had quoted my entire post you would see that I was merely making the point that it's the same across the industry. I'm not saying that's right at all. I totally agree with what you're saying.
They could, but that won't solve the key problem, will it? Even "not really working" is better than "not working at all".
Let me guess, Steve never would have allowed this?
While the topic certainly is not, the report is laughable.
Amateur work, BBC. Be better.
While the topic certainly is not, the report is laughable.
Amateur work, BBC. Be better.
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You see that? That was my post going RIGHT over your head. Wooosh...
Just be thankful you may never have to be in such a position as those families.
You see that? That was my post going RIGHT over your head. Wooosh...
Just be thankful you may never have to be in such a position as those families.
Ah but those families had enough to eat but they still sent their son off, why?
ps.. didn't go over my head cause I watched the doc. You don't seem to have or didn't take it in and see past the ********.
If anything Steve would have encouraged this. You've seen how he treated those close to him, does it surprise you at all he couldn't care less about the ones he wasn't?
Apple are just digging a deeper hole. Offering an interview for the programme and then backing out at the last minute doesn't look good. Then your main response being to tell all your UK employees that Apple are ace and the BBC are bad just makes things worse.
The programme wasn't so much about the bad conditions as about Apple's claims about the working conditions and whether they were keeping to them and the promises they've made.
There is lots more Apple could do if they were serious about this. According to the programme Apple pay $5 for the assembly of the phone, if they paid $10 that would enable the workers to keep to 40 hour weeks, live in better conditions, have the proper training they need and so on.
But they're not serious about it, as all they're interested in is making money and doing the right thing would affect their profit margin. Apple have repeatedly stated they use every tax dodge in the book (whilst staying just within the limits of the law) to increase their profits, how could anyone think that it is different when it comes to working conditions in their factories?
The programme wasn't so much about the bad conditions as about Apple's claims about the working conditions and whether they were keeping to them and the promises they've made.
There is lots more Apple could do if they were serious about this. According to the programme Apple pay $5 for the assembly of the phone, if they paid $10 that would enable the workers to keep to 40 hour weeks, live in better conditions, have the proper training they need and so on.
But they're not serious about it, as all they're interested in is making money and doing the right thing would affect their profit margin. Apple have repeatedly stated they use every tax dodge in the book (whilst staying just within the limits of the law) to increase their profits, how could anyone think that it is different when it comes to working conditions in their factories?
Well, that is nonsense.
Every product, you have a cost to produce and sell it, and you have a price that people are willing to pay. Both are not necessarily related. To make profit, you need to create a product where people are willing to pay more than it costs you to make.
If you have a rubbish product, you can only do this by either cheating the buyers, are by abusing the people making the product. But if you have excellent products, like Apple does, cheating and abusing people is not necessary to make profit. That's how you make profit without doing so at the expense of others.