Tim Cook on iPhone XS: People Want the Most Innovative Phone Possible and 'It's Not Cheap to Do That'

[Sackofnickels]

Many of us have $1,000 disposable income, but we're not stupid enough to blow it on a useless phone.
The old one is good enough, they stopped giving us innovative features.

It's all relative. Make six figures but have six figures worth of debt. How rich are you really?

I agree completely. I have family that comes from old money. They can buy anything they want, but are the most frugal people I know.
[doublepost=1537321140][/doublepost]

I am not trying to be mean. How is it helpful if I am doing something wrong or do not know about something if someone just says "this is wrong"? How can I possibly learn?

I have enough in savings where I am very comfortable if I am laid off tomorrow and unable to find a new job for around 8 months. 0 income in 8 months. That is proper financial management there. It doesn't matter if the company is big or small, layoffs happen. And the job market sucks where I live.

I obviously have the funds to buy the phone in full at purchase. I do not do this because that $1,000 might come in handy if the worst happens.
[doublepost=1537315193][/doublepost]

I have enough in the bank to buy dozens of them in full. I still don't consider that disposable income. That is just my opinion though.

Im sorry but much of what you say does not sound like it's coming from a person with the resources you claim. You would not be here on a forum announcing your wealth and resources to bunch of strangers in my opinion.

Your reasoning for financing a phone month to month so you can keep your bank balance up is ridiculous. If you truly had the resources you said you have, you would purchase the phone and declare it as a business expense on your taxes, limiting your tax exposure. Either that or you are extremely leveraged, which actually makes more sense. Congratulations on your success.

There was another person on the forums that listed all of the hardware he owned including the prices in his profile, talked about his trophy wife, beach house and his limitless resources. Very entertaining.

 

[Glockworkorange]

Like I said, that just means you’re not very affluent and don’t have that much in savings. “Dozens” of iPhone in net worth isn’t very big. Again, not an insult—just stating a fact.

[doublepost=1537317702][/doublepost]

I've already explained the essence of what was wrong to you, but you choose not to read. You seem to be of the opinion that there are relatively poor people, people around your level of savings and income (which I would describe as "comfortable" but not affluent), and then some rich elite like Tim Cook. You ignore the millions of Americans who are in between categories 2 and 3—who have a lot more than you do and yet are nowhere near Tim Cook levels of compensation.


Sounds like you agree with me 100%. Tell it to that xWhiplash guy! Maybe if he hears it from enough people it'll finally start to sink in.

I do agree with you.
[doublepost=1537321737][/doublepost]

He probably would have been fired again ...

I don't think he'd have released an Apple Watch, that's for sure.

I think Apple would already have a streaming TV service, also.

And to be fair to Cook, I do love the iPhones released since Job's death--especially the X series. They're gorgeous.

I'm just more of a Mac guy and the focus on iPads is...boring, at least to me. I don't think iPads are the "next generation of computer," either.

The next interface, at least in my opinion, will be a mixture of AR and voice controlled systems.

If you're correct and the Mac goes away in 5 to 10 years, I will be sad.

In fact, these machines I have now should carry me for at least the next five years, so it's possible I've bought my last Mac.

 

[Quu]

Carrier plans do not charge interest.

Yes and? - I never said anything about carrier plans. If you buy the iPhone through Apples own website on a payment plan it adds 17.6% interest per year that you pay for the phone.

Don't assume anything, it will just make you look foolish.

 

[stylinexpat]

It may not be cheap but it is also not that expensive either. We all know what the phone costs out of China. We also all know how much money Apple has made and stashed away. We also know that Apple has not been paying good dividends either. So where is all the money going? Parts in the iPhone are basic parts. Nothing special about the parts. The OS though is from Apple and the OS has been around for years. Once in a while it gets an update. Same system that is usually just modified. Nothing from contacts,messages and email has changed. Hardware parts are basic parts also.

 

[Ethosik]

It's all relative. Make six figures but have six figures worth of debt. How rich are you really?

I agree completely. I have family that comes from old money. They can buy anything they want, but are the most frugal people I know.
[doublepost=1537321140][/doublepost]

Im sorry but much of what you say does not sound like it's coming from a person with the resources you claim. You would not be here on a forum announcing your wealth and resources to bunch of strangers in my opinion.

Your reasoning for financing a phone month to month so you can keep your bank balance up is ridiculous. If you truly had the resources you said you have, you would purchase the phone and declare it as a business expense on your taxes, limiting your tax exposure. Either that or you are extremely leveraged, which actually makes more sense. Congratulations on your success.

There was another person on the forums that listed all of the hardware he owned including the prices in his profile, talked about his trophy wife, beach house and his limitless resources. Very entertaining.

Well you can believe what you want. I won't send you pics of my bank statements or anything to try to prove my savings account. I save for the long term. Either unemployment or something else. I would like a nicer house, which costs money. $1,000 every year for 10 or so years adds up to a decent chunk when I go to buy a much better house.

And like I said, I make six figures, but in my area with the cost of living and bills and other stuff, its not all that much in the end.

Like I said, I was raised with the SAVE SAVE SAVE mindset. Why spend $2,000 in two years when I can just pay around $35 a month with the same end goal? Makes more sense in my position. Like I said, I am not a collector, I always like the latest phone even though I am a gen or two behind just so all the kinks and issues are worked out. There will be no reason for me to keep my X next year and I can simply just trade it in and get the XS for around $35 again instead of having $2,000 spent.

Paying around $35 a month for two years is $840
Paying for iPhone X a few months ago in full would be $1,000 (without tax). In two years for the iPhone XS would be another $1,000 (without tax) totaling in $2,000.

Why waste $1,160? I am not going to keep my iPhone X when I get the XS and I would just rather avoid the hassle of selling it off to someone.

Hey more power to you if you prefer to pay it in full. I prefer the monthly cost. Its fine if you do not agree with it.

And marking my phone as a business expense would be illegal because it is not a business expense.

 

[john123]

Well maybe I should have clarified. I do not know a name of someone who makes high 6-figures. That is what I was going for. I guess the example I provided was too extreme, sorry. People like Pewdiepie or some fairly common Twitch streamers make a crap load of money and they are not Fortune 500 CEO level. I would consider those to have disposable income based on living expenses.

There really is no good example for what I meant, because in some areas making $500,000 a year is better than a different area. People's living expenses or their situations are also different. Someone could be making $750,000 a year and not have as much savings as someone making $50,000 a year in some weird situations.

You are right. I am not rich and I make six figures. What is the average for this country? Mid 5-figures I think. That was my entire argument. I do have enough to buy the phone at full cost, but prefer to keep that $1,000 extra in my savings and just get hit ~$35 a month. Every grand matters, even though I have enough for bills and living expenses to last 8 months unemployment with 0 income (so no unemployment checks). How much money do you make? Figures wise not exact amount. I am at a senior level in my career and just hitting the six figures.

We can disagree what is considered disposable income. Yes I have a lot in my savings. Heck, I do not even consider buying a $20 movie as "disposable". I always question "do I really want this, will I watch it again or just wait and rent it for $4". Even that is questionable on some movies. Like Solo a Star Wars Story. Renting that is too expensive IMO (sorry if you like it, its not for me and that is okay). Will that $20 or $4 rental break me? NO. But I still don't consider that disposable income. If you do, great. It just shows we have different end goals.

If I buy dozens of iPhones or several iMacs, and get my ass fired (not intentional obviously), I would be massively screwed and would need to sell all of that. I have taken classes and spoke with MANY advisors. They all say act like there is no such thing as disposable income until you get to the high 6 figures and in some areas 7 figures (low 6-figures is not very impressive where I am).

I could sell my house and just get a cheapo apartment and have MORE in my savings. I have what they call long-term savings. I have enough in my savings where if something catastrophic occurs, I am safe for up to 8 months. It has happened to colleagues where they were out of work for 6-months.

I was raised this way, trained this way with financial advisors, and have a mindset of SAVE SAVE SAVE SAVE and act like you are broke. In the long run, it is better. My kids will end up with great inheritance money

Sorry, I didn't mean for my few sentence comment to turn into this giant discussion haha.

Averages are often horribly misleading. That is why it's so important to look at distributions rather than averages. For reference, about 4 million people in the US make over $200,000 per year.

My objection is that you're taking a term that has a very specific meaning in finance and economics and mis-using it. This may sound pedantic, and to some extent it is, but it leads to exactly the sort of thing that's happened for in this thread over the last couple pages.

You're frugal. So am I. Some would call us "cheap," but let's not get into that. There are many people who think like we do when it comes to spending.

All that said...I know many financial advisors, and I got my MBA from one of the top 3 business schools in the country. None of them say, "act like there is no such thing as disposable income until you get to the high 6 figures and in some areas 7 figures." All encourage smart financial practices, but none take it to the extreme that you are. I'm going to go with the benign interpretation, which is that you probably misunderstood what they were saying.

Your mindset is fine, especially for your kids. It is, however, a personal choice. It's very risk averse, and as long as it doesn't make you unduly unhappy, then it's great—for you. It certainly removes one of the major causes of stress that many Americans face.

But let's not twist that into some blanket financial advice to the tune of, "no one except the top 0.2% should spend be spending $1000 on a phone." No financial advisor worth their salt would say that. Want proof? Find a section on the Series 65 study materials suggesting anything even remotely close to that. I'll save you the time: it doesn't exist.

 

[Ethosik]

Many of us have $1,000 disposable income, but we're not stupid enough to blow it on a useless phone.
The old one is good enough, they stopped giving us innovative features.

That is what I am getting at lol. Except I like the X and still didn't want to pay $1,000 for it.

I have no issues dropping $4,500 for an iMac. And I plan to drop whatever the price is on the new Mac Pro when it comes out if it does, would that be around $8,000? It is all about the type of item. Computers I plan to use until they die or become too much of a hassle like my 2010 Mac Pro was since I wanted to move to HEVC encoding.

 

[john123]

That is what I am getting at lol. Except I like the X and still didn't want to pay $1,000 for it.

I have no issues dropping $4,500 for an iMac. And I plan to drop whatever the price is on the new Mac Pro when it comes out if it does, would that be around $8,000? It is all about the type of item. Computers I plan to use until they die or become too much of a hassle like my 2010 Mac Pro was since I wanted to move to HEVC encoding.

...but...but...but...what if your air conditioning goes out?

Congratulations! You just ripped to shreds everything you typed previously.

Sometimes I don't know why I even waste my time on here.

 

[Ethosik]

Averages are often horribly misleading. That is why it's so important to look at distributions rather than averages. For reference, about 4 million people in the US make over $200,000 per year.

My objection is that you're taking a term that has a very specific meaning in finance and economics and mis-using it. This may sound pedantic, and to some extent it is, but it leads to exactly the sort of thing that's happened for in this thread over the last couple pages.

You're frugal. So am I. Some would call us "cheap," but let's not get into that. There are many people who think like we do when it comes to spending.

All that said...I know many financial advisors, and I got my MBA from one of the top 3 business schools in the country. None of them say, "act like there is no such thing as disposable income until you get to the high 6 figures and in some areas 7 figures." All encourage smart financial practices, but none take it to the extreme that you are. I'm going to go with the benign interpretation, which is that you probably misunderstood what they were saying.

Your mindset is fine, especially for your kids. It is, however, a personal choice. It's very risk averse, and as long as it doesn't make you unduly unhappy, then it's great—for you. It certainly removes one of the major causes of stress that many Americans face.

But let's not twist that into some blanket financial advice to the tune of, "no one except the top 0.2% should spend be spending $1000 on a phone." No financial advisor worth their salt would say that. Want proof? Find a section on the Series 65 study materials suggesting anything even remotely close to that. I'll save you the time: it doesn't exist.

I didn't exactly say that ONLY the 0.2% should drop on a $1,000 iPhone in full. Like I said, my example of using Tim Cook might have been on the extreme side. And it is ALL down to the environment and situation. Someone making $30,000 a year fresh out of college, still living with their parents, still on their insurance (if the 25/26 year old rule still applies), no car expenses or bills to pay other than phone CAN drop $1,000 on an iPhone.

When you have six figures, house, bills, house repairs and equipment costs coming up, it is not as easy to simply drop $1,000 at a moments notice. And again, as someone that recently got an iMac for $4,500, it is entirely situational. I do not consider $1,000 at one-time a good choice for a phone. For a computer that I hope will last around 8-10 years? Absolutely $4,500 is good.

It was with my planning and what my goals are that the financial advisors told me that until I get to the upper 6 or 7 figures to start going crazy lol. So they tailored their advice to fit my end goals.
[doublepost=1537324105][/doublepost]

...but...but...but...what if your air conditioning goes out?

Congratulations! You just ripped to shreds everything you typed previously.

Sometimes I don't know why I even waste my time on here.

I guess my examples were bad. Sorry . Did you forget me mention it like 6 times that I have enough saved for 8 months of unemployment for safety? I do have enough for my air condition repairs still.

So bottom line: I do not consider $1,000 at once on a one-year device to be a good deal. $35 a month yes
I DO consider $4,500 on a 8-10 year device to be a good deal. Besides. I use this device for video production business so that helps too. Can't really use my phone for that.

NOW if I suddenly end up being unemployed and it is going on 4 months or so, I will need to sell the iMac

 

[FelixDerKater]

Why doesn't the A12 have 8 cores? They could have done 8 in the XS and XS Max and then 6 for the XR.

 

[spacemnspiff]

The Note 9 was very innovative (though it has its flaws) and the price is maxed out at $1250 — expensive? Totally, but it’s more reasonable

It’s not reasonable with free Android OS, it should be half the price of what it is. Samsung should only charge for hardware since software is free. If the Samsung hardware has to be this expensive, then the phone is overpriced compared to iPhones.

 

[brofkand]

Why doesn't the A12 have 8 cores? They could have done 8 in the XS and XS Max and then 6 for the XR.

Don't give them any ideas.
[doublepost=1537325152][/doublepost]

It’s not reasonable with free Android OS, it should be half the price of what it is. Samsung should only charge for hardware since software is free. If the Samsung hardware has to be this expensive, then the phone is overpriced compared to iPhones.

You could make the same argument for iOS since Darwin is free. Android is free, but Google services are not. It's been that way since the first Android phones.

 

[rmoliv]

It's stupid that he's fine with people getting into debt by doing deals with carriers just so they can have an iPhone. He's got no shame.

 

[Chopper9]

Can someone tell Tim to quit saying "most advance iPhone EVER!"... he sounds like a fool. Like they're going to come out with a LESS advanced iPhone. God damn, I hate listening to him speak.

 

[applefan69]

I'd settle for a slightly less innovative phone at a reasonable price that isn't already 2 years old.

Agreed. Unfortunately we have to start looking at the competition. I am thinking Microsoft is going to be the new Apple.

 

[mackinmike]

Galaxy S10 FTW. Can't wait

 

[Sackofnickels]

Well you can believe what you want. I won't send you pics of my bank statements or anything to try to prove my savings account. I save for the long term. Either unemployment or something else. I would like a nicer house, which costs money. $1,000 every year for 10 or so years adds up to a decent chunk when I go to buy a much better house.

And like I said, I make six figures, but in my area with the cost of living and bills and other stuff, its not all that much in the end.

Like I said, I was raised with the SAVE SAVE SAVE mindset. Why spend $2,000 in two years when I can just pay around $35 a month with the same end goal? Makes more sense in my position. Like I said, I am not a collector, I always like the latest phone even though I am a gen or two behind just so all the kinks and issues are worked out. There will be no reason for me to keep my X next year and I can simply just trade it in and get the XS for around $35 again instead of having $2,000 spent.

Paying around $35 a month for two years is $840
Paying for iPhone X a few months ago in full would be $1,000 (without tax). In two years for the iPhone XS would be another $1,000 (without tax) totaling in $2,000.

Why waste $1,160? I am not going to keep my iPhone X when I get the XS and I would just rather avoid the hassle of selling it off to someone.

Hey more power to you if you prefer to pay it in full. I prefer the monthly cost. Its fine if you do not agree with it.

And marking my phone as a business expense would be illegal because it is not a business expense.

Exactly. A bean counter such as yourself would be much better suited with say a One Plus phone. You could save yourself 40% and justify the expense. Not to mention have a comparable phone. Don't tell me your justification is Apple and their OS or eco system. You would be giving yourself away.
[doublepost=1537332436][/doublepost]

I didn't exactly say that ONLY the 0.2% should drop on a $1,000 iPhone in full. Like I said, my example of using Tim Cook might have been on the extreme side. And it is ALL down to the environment and situation. Someone making $30,000 a year fresh out of college, still living with their parents, still on their insurance (if the 25/26 year old rule still applies), no car expenses or bills to pay other than phone CAN drop $1,000 on an iPhone.

When you have six figures, house, bills, house repairs and equipment costs coming up, it is not as easy to simply drop $1,000 at a moments notice. And again, as someone that recently got an iMac for $4,500, it is entirely situational. I do not consider $1,000 at one-time a good choice for a phone. For a computer that I hope will last around 8-10 years? Absolutely $4,500 is good.

It was with my planning and what my goals are that the financial advisors told me that until I get to the upper 6 or 7 figures to start going crazy lol. So they tailored their advice to fit my end goals.
[doublepost=1537324105][/doublepost]

I guess my examples were bad. Sorry . Did you forget me mention it like 6 times that I have enough saved for 8 months of unemployment for safety? I do have enough for my air condition repairs still.

So bottom line: I do not consider $1,000 at once on a one-year device to be a good deal. $35 a month yes
I DO consider $4,500 on a 8-10 year device to be a good deal. Besides. I use this device for video production business so that helps too. Can't really use my phone for that.

NOW if I suddenly end up being unemployed and it is going on 4 months or so, I will need to sell the iMac

If you are making six figures and need to finance a $1000 purchase you are doing something wrong. Like I said, leveraged. Six figures means nothing if your expenses are too high. It's all relative. You mentioned you don't want to post your bank statements but what is your debt to income ratio if you don't mind me asking?

Just trying to understand where you are going from. You seem to be going out of your way to educate us on your wealth, but your rationalizations for purchasing a phone seem to elude me.

 

[pankajdoharey]

An iPhone isn't a necessity like food, water, gasoline, electricity —it's a freaking toy for 98% of the population. Apple can set any price it wants for its toys and if we don't buy them, they won't get sold.
Every person griping about the extremely high price of these Appletoys sounds like aspoiled brat. Are Mercedes Benz websites filled with endless posts complaining about the price of their cars? BMW?, Canon cameras? Etc etc etc.
The entitlement assumed by the hoards of Apple complainers is epic.

Woah, you just compared iPhone with Mercedes. Dont be a blind Apple Fan, sometimes Apple is plain wrong. Semiconductor prices have dropped crazily in the past few yrs. Its cheap to make memory and even cheaper to make a ARM Cortex processor. If Semiconductor is cheap what material cost makes iPhone that expensive? Dont tell me Angela felt the products should be priced that way so she can buy a Boat. Apple knows it isnt correct pricing which is why Apple was forced to produce an iPhone XR even that is still priced in the iPhone 6S price range. Apple has gone nuts, they have single handedly killed gaming on the Mac and iOS ecosystem nobody in interested in making game for Mac, around 2011-12 A lot of developers were interested in making games for Mac and iOS, but these days no one. What good is a toy without games? Most devs have left the ecosystem, Indie Devs have no hope with mac or iOS, because the people who will buy these devices dont buy games and the ones that did are not considering it at all. As a developer i like Mac, but i am not going to upgrade. I am switching to PC, so that i develop on Linux and Play on Windows. I am almost there to abandon Mac for good all because of silly pricing of Tim, i had lot of hope from him. But not anymore!

 

[Tech198]

Why doesn't the A12 have 8 cores? They could have done 8 in the XS and XS Max and then 6 for the XR.

Too expensive?

 

[ChrisChaval]

I almost forgot :

I do not need Mr. Cook to lecture me how to finance his products

 

[Naaaaak]

…most people pay $30 a month for it, so that's about $1 a day.

Apple wants to extract at least $1 / day from you. If not through device payments, then perhaps software or services. You rent it until you upgrade, then you start the payment process all over again.

Technology is an ongoing subscription payment.
[doublepost=1537338065][/doublepost]

I'd settle for a slightly less innovative phone at a reasonable price that isn't already 2 years old.

I think they tried that with the iPhone 5C. The problem is they didn't go low enough in pricing, colors were goofy, and it wasn't particularly innovative or different -- just a re-packaged version from last year.

What are you thinking? Price points, specs, etc.? It seems the only real differentiators these days are screen size, 1 camera or 2, notch or notchless (old design), storage capacity.

 

[balaplus]

Can someone tell Tim to quit saying "most advance iPhone EVER!"... he sounds like a fool. Like they're going to come out with a LESS advanced iPhone. God damn, I hate listening to him speak.

Guess they should hire speech writers...

They can afford it!

 

[Ramchi]

It’s not reasonable with free Android OS, it should be half the price of what it is. Samsung should only charge for hardware since software is free. If the Samsung hardware has to be this expensive, then the phone is overpriced compared to iPhones.

No it is not FREE or ZERO COST! Samsung has to implement many of the of features and functionalities in their own ways - good amount of development and testing. BTW, it has something called Knox, many other features NOT available out of the box in Android OS. For this reason, they cannot keep upgrading the OS forever like iOS.

 

[mrklaw]

Im almost positive he was talking about the Xs or Xr.

In the quote he references an 'over $1000 phone', which itself is a response to the question about the XS Max being $1100.

So he isn't talking about the XS or Xr. and even the Xr is more than $30 per month ($34 for the base model, XS is $46, XS max $51.50)

 

[bmot]

Where can I get a $1,100 phone for $1 a day Tim Cook? That would take three years to pay it off, what is this guy smoking?

You just can buy it: 365*3= 1095