Tim Cook Pens Open Letter on Tax Evasion Claims, Says Apple is Confident Decision 'Will be Reversed'

[BruceEBonus]

Can't say you're getting much sympathy here, Timmy. You've turned this passionate Apple fan and defender into a jaded, listless user, praying that his 2012 MBP won't die.

Excellent post. Summarises succinctly both this topic and the current general state of Apple in 2016 without bias, beautifully. Well done, mate.

 

[Keebler]

All companies are doing it too ya know.

Yup! I worked for Corel Corporation back in the 90s and they had a major office in Dublin.

Curiously I asked why.

I was flat out told it was 100% 'tax reasons'.

Although I don't agree with companies trying to hide from proper tax practices, I also think corporations are raked over the coal just because they're successful.

Everyone - both individuals and corporations should pay their taxes to help those with physical and mental issues preventing them from working and to also pay for health care, road infrastructure etc... , but it's a fine line when politicians mishandle the money.

If I could have exact input as to where my taxes went, I'd be happier.

But when my government blows money on gas plants which never materialized, e-health and other massively pathetic blunders, it's tough to shallow when my taxes keep going up which essentially pays for previously mentioned BS. Just because I bust my rear end to work hard, I get to pay more? Doesn't make sense in my book. (can you tell I live in Ontario Canada and loath the Liberal party?!?! LOL

So I understand why corporations will try to do what they can to get a lower tax rate.

I don't blame them whatsoever.

If rates were reasonable...but they're not.

Cheers,
Keebler

 

[Apple Knowledge Navigator]

I thought it was $200bn plus?

I stand corrected.

 

[sofila]

0.005% should be an argument strong enough for a decent silence

 

[keysofanxiety]

You really need to spend your time better.

Well, I'm working tech support and browsing MR between calls, as I'm fully entitled to do. My sincere apologies if that's an offensive use of my time.

 

[mashinhead]

Tim Cook has become a delusional pseudo politician in his responses. Has he lost his mind?

 

[Robstevo]

Yup! I worked for Corel Corporation back in the 90s and they had a major office in Dublin.

Curiously I asked why.

I was flat out told it was 100% 'tax reasons'.

Although I don't agree with companies trying to hide from proper tax practices, I also think corporations are raked over the coal just because they're successful.

Everyone - both individuals and corporations should pay their taxes to help those with physical and mental issues preventing them from working and to also pay for health care, road infrastructure etc... , but it's a fine line when politicians mishandle the money.

If I could have exact input as to where my taxes went, I'd be happier.

But when my government blows money on gas plants which never materialized, e-health and other massively pathetic blunders, it's tough to shallow when my taxes keep going up which essentially pays for previously mentioned BS. Just because I bust my rear end to work hard, I get to pay more? Doesn't make sense in my book. (can you tell I live in Ontario Canada and loath the Liberal party?!?! LOL

So I understand why corporations will try to do what they can to get a lower tax rate.

I don't blame them whatsoever.

If rates were reasonable...but they're not.

Cheers,
Keebler

A 12 percent tax rate is very reasonable....heck I wish myself, a lonely human being trying to earn a Crust for my family, paid a 12 percent tax rate!

Instead Apple are paying flipping. 0.005%! Why is there even a debate going on! 0.005% Ffs

 

[draugminaion]

All those profits are still sitting in the bank somewhere, and 40% of that belongs to the US. Just because the US is OK with waiting for that 40% until Apple brings it into the US doesn't mean they are OK with the EU stealing some of it.

 

[Ries]

1) Apple is a publicly traded company, and as such, has a fiduciary responsibility to its shareholders to use any legal means to minimize its tax liabilities.

2) Ireland's current tax laws that Apple is taking advantage of may or may not need to be updated based on how things have changed since they were first written. Whether they should be or not is a subjective matter that can be discussed by all stakeholder parties, and any changes made need to be in line with other Ireland and EU governing policies.

3) However, the EU simply cannot retrospectively change Ireland tax laws on what they think they should have been. The only relevant question is did Apple follow existing Ireland tax law correctly? If so, they cannot impose a retroactive tax on Apple. The EU does have leverage to drive changes to Ireland's tax policies moving forward, though.

4) This type of ham-handed extra-legislative action by the EU is exactly the type of thing that got the "Brexit" stuff started (and even passed). If the EU bureaucrats continue to overstep their boundaries and supersede the legislatures and courts of the member countries, they're going to continue to find themselves with fewer member countries (and more to the point, the net tax-paying countries that can both afford to leave and have the biggest impact when they do).

3) they didn't change anything retro, the laws were in effect during the whole period. Secondly, there is nothing preventing laws from being created which also include the past.

 

[BaldiMac]

A 12 percent tax rate is very reasonable....heck I wish myself, a lonely human being trying to earn a Crust for my family, paid a 12 percent tax rate!

Instead Apple are paying flipping. 0.005%! Why is there even a debate going on! 0.005% Ffs

Did you ever consider that a number taken out of context from the prosecution's case isn't the whole story?

 

[Bubba Satori]

$14.5 billion dollah?
That would buy a lot of stock options and suicide nets.
Tell those Euro socialists to take a hike, Tim.

 

[draugminaion]

A 12 percent tax rate is very reasonable....heck I wish myself, a lonely human being trying to earn a Crust for my family, paid a 12 percent tax rate!

Instead Apple are paying flipping. 0.005%! Why is there even a debate going on! 0.005% Ffs

Well, Apple has to pay 40% US tax on their profits. But they are allowed to wait with paying until they bring it into the US. So they wait.

 

[Padaung]

All those profits are still sitting in the bank somewhere, and 40% of that belongs to the US. Just because the US is OK with waiting for that 40% until Apple brings it into the US doesn't mean they are OK with the EU stealing some of it.

I reckon you'll find many tax paying people living in the EU countries where their money was spent will argue very strongly that this is not stealing US money.

Company profits are taxed in a country of origin before the money is then moved to the US, where your government taxes it again, before any remaining cash goes into Apple's US bank account.

 

[dragje]

Apple should pay taxes according to the EU legislations like any other company has to do so. Simple as that. Writing an, emotional, letter about what you have done as a company for the company in any given city is not relevant.

 

[miniyou64]

Here come the communists.

"I'm not satisfied unless the government steals enough money from successful entitites and spends it on ... roads!!!"

 

[2010mini]

I don't get it...... What's an open letter going to do? This is a matter for the courts.

 

[Lord Hamsa]

I don't get it...... What's an open letter going to do? This is a matter for the courts.

Reassure stockholders that this won't affect the bottom line?

 

[Sandstorm]

Can't say you're getting much sympathy here, Timmy.

You've been hosing customers for years with high prices and (still expensive) entry-level products that just don't perform to an Apple standard. You've been making ludicrous profit margins on every product and building up a wall of cash to sit on. You've been smashing down on suppliers to lower the costs even further, yet maintain those same high prices and margins on products.

You raise prices in countries when the exchange rate is having a few hiccups, when if anything, they should be lowered due to the age of the tech. As you're not an engineer or even a Mac user, you have no appreciation of how much difference even a simple Fusion drive can make in entry-level Mac Minis, for an utterly negligible cost. You do all this and still sniff your own farts about Apple being the best company in the world and make products that enrich people's lives.

Even with all this considered, I've been defending Apple left, right, and centre where I believe it's applicable.

But now that we find out Apple have been paying 0.005% tax on European sales? The deep realisation has hit me that you couldn't give a damn about your customers' experience, and no amount of money or profits will ever be enough for you, or convince you to appropriately put back into the products you sell.

For what utterly little it's worth (and it is very, very, very little to you, I'm sure), you've turned this passionate Apple fan and defender into a jaded, listless user, praying that his 2012 MBP won't die.

100% agree on EVERYTHING you said!

 

[BaldiMac]

I don't get it...... What's an open letter going to do? This is a matter for the courts.

PR

 

[Lancetx]

Tim Cook has become a delusional pseudo politician in his responses. Has he lost his mind?

Quite the contrary, he's simply further proven himself to be the prototypical 'do as I say, not as I do' liberal.

 

[The Mercurian]

Time for Ireland to join Britain in leaving the EU!

Umm how do you reckon ? Britain votes to leave - your economy went into freefall. Ireland stayed in the the EU want to give us 13Billion that our government and Apple screwed us out of. Yay for the EU !

 

[keysofanxiety]

100% agree on EVERYTHING you said!

It's rare we agree on something, Sandstorm.

See you in the next thread where I'm defending the 15" rMBP performance? (I do maintain it's still the best portable on the market)

 

[swagi]

3) However, the EU simply cannot retrospectively change Ireland tax laws on what they think they should have been. The only relevant question is did Apple follow existing Ireland tax law correctly? If so, they cannot impose a retroactive tax on Apple. The EU does have leverage to drive changes to Ireland's tax policies moving forward, though.

Given the fact that hosting a business in a EU country gives you the benefit of not having to deal with custom fees, there is a simple advantage that being part of the EU offers.

As has been ruled on many occasions using money to nurture different industrial complexes has been deemed sort of illegal as special tax deals for high profile companies defeat the purpose of a sharing European community.

 

[needfx]

cry me a river Timmy

 

[draugminaion]

So what will happen

I reckon you'll find many tax paying people living in the EU countries where their money was spent will argue very strongly that this is not stealing US money.

Company profits are taxed in a country of origin before the money is then moved to the US, where your government taxes it again, before any remaining cash goes into Apple's US bank account.

As I understand it, there are international agreements in place that allow you to not pay taxes twice. So, usually you can deduct from your taxes owed the amount you already payed elsewhere.