Tim Cook Speaks on Apple, iPhone, Apple TV

[starbase17]

Is Tim Crazy??

Clearly, the iphone is worth more than zero, which he claims is what some phones on the market are worth. Also clearly, the iPhone is not worth $499.00 and $599.00, no matter what the device does. Apple is making a huge profit on these phone. They want to sell 10 million? Crazy! I predict, at these prices, they won't even clear 1 million. This phone needs to be subsidized just like any other phone on the market. I'd say that $299.00 and $399.00 are more reasonable prices. Apple is way over estimating the appeal of the iPhone. Its a neat device, but at the end of the day, several other devices already on the market do what the iPhone does, just not as easily or elegantly. I am a Mac user and love my Mac, but no way am I spending $500.00 on a phone (and I am already a Cingular customer!)

 

[flir67]

as with the modern ipods, I don't think apple has a clue on how many movies people own. I'm just starting to backup my movies from my collection to my mini. I got 25 and my harddrive is full this is in addtion to 20gb of music.


the 40gb just isn't going to cut it, I'm going to fill it up in 20 minutes once I get one. with the average of a handbrake movie at 1gb, thats just 40 movies. people have hundreds that they want to digitize...

first step upgrade to a 100gb appletv

 

[skellener]

iPhone...I'm sure there are plenty of people willing to pay for it. I'm just not one of them. I use the phone for talking and that's pretty much it. I think it's a pretty cool phone, but for me, just not at that price point. I don't use AT&T either.

As far as AppleTV - it is EXACTLY what I expected it to be. NO DVR to be found. Apple is not about recording content. It has NEVER been about that. Why let you record what they can charge you for to download? I knew they would not include a DVR.

My questions is this - where's all the HD content? Steve has never talked about when that will roll out.

Why not simply add component connectors to the Mac-mini? My HDTV needs component connectors which no one has successfully gotten to work with the Mac-mini. I'd rather use that since it does everything else through Front Row and offers web browsing and DVD playback. I could even get DVR functionality with some third party solutions. Then I could use that as my one box for the TV. I don't think the AppleTV will fit my needs.

We'll see when it ships.

 

[starbase17]

Overpriced Apple TV

Yep, I agree with most people: the Apple TV is way over priced. Here is another new Apple product that Apple is over-hyping. It would have been worth $300.00 if it offered DVR functionality. It doesn't. Its really just a set top version of a video 5G iPod. You can do pretty much the same thing if you already have a 5G iPod. How hard would the DVR part have been? They could have licensed the technology from El Gato (assuming El Gato would license their technology). Anyways, I would buy an Apple TV if it was priced at 199.00 or below. No way will I pay $299.00 for it.

 

[MacNut]

It's for the content you got from the iTunes Store. The basic idea is that you replace your DVD collection with your iTunes collection, and all of your movies, TV shows, music, and yes, your own photos, media, and more, are accessible from the TV, right in your living room, all with a single tiny remote.



The TV has component. Many current SD TVs have component, so the TV isn't only for HD TVs.

I would rather have my DVD collection. Better quality and I can play it where ever I want. If I want to lend a movie to a friend what am I gonna do send him the whole TV.

 

[QCassidy352]

They should go beyond that it isn't a DVR because it isn't one.

They should have asked why they chose to make it a set top box alone and not include DVR functionality.

It is a strange product in my opinion. Way overpriced for what it is.
The ONLY way this product will succeed is if they throw in a bigger HD and DVR functionality... or they develop a rental service to download movies...
and even in that case... it is still too expensive.

I'm glad to finaly find someone who agrees with me. $300 to watch content on one screen rather than another? Pass.

Frankly, I just don't get this product. Maybe it's because my computer monitor (20") is bigger than my TV (19") and I'd "get it" if I had a 42" widescreen TV. But I still don't think so. The TV should be the device that brings all of your digital entertainment together in your living room, but right now it doesn't do anything that hooking my tv up to my macbook wouldn't do. Yes it's more convenient than that, but it's also $300. If it had DVR functionality I'd be intrigued, but as it is, I just don't see the point. As merge says, it needs to offer something beyond remote access to digital content that I already have one room away.

 

[MacNut]

What the TV needs is the ability to burn my current DVD library just like iTunes can rip my CD's. Then it would be worth it. Let me dump everything I own into the box, music,video,pictures and TV in high quality then I would buy it.

 

[azajohns]

Apple TV

I see the Apple TV as jumping too far ahead of its time. It will make sense in 10 years time when we all have HD plasmas, terabytes of hard drive space, when 1000's and 1000's of movies & shows are available for RENT and purchase on IT - worldwide, and when internet speeds are sufficient for quick downloads, or even live streaming of HD TV.

Right now, I think it would have made more sense to include a built in DVD player so we could use our EXISTING media, and replace our existing player. Even better, if we could 'rip' our DVDs to the hard drive that would be something (legal arguments aside). It could have also included some support for 3rd party tuners such as EyeTV (couldn't be that hard surely).

Failing that, the Apple TV as it stands merely replaces the S-video cable I have running through the roof from my back room. Cost me $15 and 20 minutes work. And with that setup I CAN use my EyeTV.

And what does the AppleTV do that the Xbox doesn't do for the windows world?. And the Xbox is ALSO a games console!

What am I missing?

 

[tribulation]

It's for the content you got from the iTunes Store. The basic idea is that you replace your DVD collection with your iTunes collection, and all of your movies, TV shows, music, and yes, your own photos, media, and more, are accessible from the TV, right in your living room, all with a single tiny remote.

At 7+ GB a disc (dual layer DVD movie), you'd have to have a dedicated computer (to make any worthwhile use of it, to be "always on") and terabytes of hard drive space. And then what's the point? I'll just hook up my mac to a TV if I wanted that. On the other hand, if it had DVR functionality I'd get one in a heartbeat. It's Apple for god's sake, couldn't they just partner up with Tivo to provide the TV guide part, assuming they don't want to deal with it?

I still see no good reasons to buy one of these things......

 

[gugy]

I see the Apple TV as jumping too far ahead of its time. It will make sense in 10 years time when we all have HD plasmas, terabytes of hard drive space, when 1000's and 1000's of movies & shows are available for RENT and purchase on IT - worldwide, and when internet speeds are sufficient for quick downloads, or even live streaming of HD TV.

Right now, I think it would have made more sense to include a built in DVD player so we could use our EXISTING media, and replace our existing player. Even better, if we could 'rip' our DVDs to the hard drive that would be something (legal arguments aside). It could have also included some support for 3rd party tuners such as EyeTV (couldn't be that hard surely).

Failing that, the Apple TV as it stands merely replaces the S-video cable I have running through the roof from my back room. Cost me $15 and 20 minutes work. And with that setup I CAN use my EyeTV.

And what does the AppleTV do that the Xbox doesn't do for the windows world?. And the Xbox is ALSO a games console!

What am I missing?

You said it all.

I like the concept of TV but is not ready for primetime now.
I wish Elgato had a partnership with Apple and create a DVR solution that integrates with TV. That would make sense to me. you record shows on the fly and stream it right away to TV.
Right now TV is only good for me to streaming music to my stereo. The lack of HDTV support and lack of DVR makes a no-no product to me. plus the current quality of tv shows and movies on iTunes is just to low to justify paying for it. I much rather buy a DVD have a hard copy and much better quality.
Maybe TV 2.0 might address some of these issues and make me a believer.

 

[tribulation]

As far as AppleTV - it is EXACTLY what I expected it to be. NO DVR to be found. Apple is not about recording content. It has NEVER been about that. Why let you record what they can charge you for to download? I knew they would not include a DVR.

That might be true, but I don't see it as a sustainable revenue source. Why would *anyone* buy a TV show for $3 or whatever it costs [$.20 is too much if on a per-show basis]? Maybe the very, very seldom chance of missing an episode [which doesn't happen with a DVR anyways], and 1/1000 people would maybe buy that single episode. But that's about it. While Apple can make miracles, there's no way, absolutely no way that they will make money off of charging for TV shows, per show, when I can get them via cable [all TV shows, 1 price].

On the other hand, if they did build in DVR functionality as well - they could sell me on the movie part, possibly. At least they'd have my attention and I'd be using the box daily to watch all TV content. They wouldn't be loosing any money, because again - there will never be many people paying for TV shows unless cable goes to utter hell. But they would be making money from my original Apple TV purchase, possibly more iTunes music purchases, and possible movie purchases.

No DVR = totally pointless still for my needs. And I think for most people's needs as well from looking at the comments on here.

 

[Rocketman]

Im still upset with the reason of why they chose cingular to be their EXCLUSIVE carrier!

I believe the real reason is EDGE is far more widely deployed than any other broadband cellular format. It is ATT after all (even before Cingular). Sprint is faster but not as widely deployed. Cingulars more modern cellular broadband is deployed in half again fewer places as Sprint.

The principal of iPhone using wifi as the primary contact method (VioP) is the point. When wimax becomes widely deployed and an element of iPhone it will replace cellular entirely.

Sprint is deploying wimax. Is ATT too?

Rocketman

 

[3282872]

Thats a bold statement for a product that hasn't even had one customer review.

Don't get me wrong, but seriously has there been one apple product that hasn't had rev A issues?

I must concede I agree with your comment. As a huge Apple supporter, I still think it is just an overpriced Video/Audio hub for television. If the specs are correct, there isn't much justification for playing iTunes videos on your TV. If it could record and then send those recordings via the internet, that would be interesting, and justifiable for a $300 price tag.

 

[3282872]

I would rather have my DVD collection. Better quality and I can play it where ever I want. If I want to lend a movie to a friend what am I gonna do send him the whole TV.

Exactly. I'll stick to my DVD collection.

 

[Cult Follower]

I think the TV will start out slow but eventually take off as more and more movies are sold. It really is the future in entertainment, not dealing with discs, but a nice UI.

 

[matticus008]

The TV has component. Many current SD TVs have component, so the TV isn't only for HD TVs.

Why on earth would an SDTV have component input? Component is HD-only (EDIT: only offers benefits for HDTV resolutions, but supports inputs as low as 480i--TV still requires a 480p minimum). SDTVs often have composite inputs (the yellow RCA plug on the back), but that doesn't provide Apple TV connectivity. Apple TV requires a HD set.

 

[tribulation]

I think the TV will start out slow but eventually take off as more and more movies are sold. It really is the future in entertainment, not dealing with discs, but a nice UI.

Probably will be some day, but the prices will have to shift along with the technology. I'm still sticking to my position on "No DVD = Useless to 99.8% of customers".

I think that if they don't add dvr functions quickly, they'll end up loosing a Microsoft/Apple-war-to-the-end problem, and someone else will come in (Tivo maybe? Would be an excellent time to develop something that works like that, I think Tivo actually has the stronger hand with an Apple TV type of product than Apple itself.

Obviously I don't know much...but I'm telling you, if they don't put DVR functionality in the box, and lower the price a tad, the Apple TV won't live past 2-3 revisions max. And the longer they wait, the more competitors that will knock them out of the race for waiting around. The winner will be a one-trick-pony (And Apple COULD do it best, just for some unknown reason is choosing not to, which I feel is a horrible mistake that will cost them dearly). Newton? Duo?...

Just make the darn v1.5 release spectacular. Add DVR features into it, and keep the rest. that's all your customers are asking for (me, most of this board it looks like, and most likely everyone in the market to buy a "plain" current DVR). They're going to miss the boat on this one I strongly feel. And once they do, it's basically over. One shot, one kill. nighty night!

 

[stealthman1]

Your kidding right? My Mitsubishi 32 inch CRT type SD TV bought in 1991 had component video input.
DVR is so 2000s! I love streaming content off my MP to my TV...I just hate having to hook up my MBP to the TV to do it. Getting all those damn DVD cases out of my living room will be a dream! They can go right into the same boxes with my 45s, albums, cassette tapes, and CDs. Get rid of all the stupid packaging...hurray!!! Give me digital packaging on my 60 inch TV, now that's more like it. Another year or so and 5tb home file servers won't raise but the novice computer users eyebrows and if they can get the bandwidth up a bit more on phone lines you won't even need the fat HDD space, you can just stream from the great server farm in the sky .
Indies will flock to iTMS and Hollywood can suck my !!!

 

[Lucy Brown]

Being an Apple fan I want to see this succeed but I dont have much faith in it as it stands. I hope they dont lose there ass on this but I have a feeling this is going to fail. At best it will flounder around unless some significant changes are made to it. From all the forums I've read the majority of the people dont see the point to this product and wont be buying it. At this point public opinion does not look good for tv

At this point I'm not even clear on this thing being able to play movies in 5.1 surround. Why would I buy a movie from itunes with no extra content that I get with a dvd and no 5.1 audio. Not to mention the fact that the movie is now bound to the cpu vs having a hard copy that you can sell, trade, lend to a friend, etc.

 

[darwen]

All of the responses were very well stated. Not very much new information here yet I still feel rather informed. Glad to read this, thanks for the reassuring info Apple!

 

[Xaimous]

I don't understand the Apple TV. For $249 I can buy an iPod and take it everywhere I go and then use a $39 universal dock to watch iTunes content on my TV.

I can also use my Apple Remote from my iMac with the dock and while it won't have pretty menus it's the same thing for $10 less with mobility.

Also if a friend has the dock I can just bring my iPod loaded with some movies over and watch them at his house. *wouldn't want to disconnect my dock, it's a mess behind the tv.

 

[puuukeey]

Leopard better be good

great until the last answer. then my heart sank. more confirmation that apple is shifting focus from the Macintosh.

The sad fact is that in spite of it being a great platform, it's got growing to do as an eco system. We need serious innovation done by developers. Apple can not buy/steal all the good software. They have to encourage experimentation. I find it so sad that Apple thinks the only people who can innovate on a Mac is themselves.

If this is the mac's golden age, then why does it feel like the mac is the art and not the canvas?

 

[pseoudynman]

I think Apple is either making assumptions concerning these two products based on its past successes with the ipod (I'd call this attitude "hubris"...) or it's basing its rush to market these two products (tv and phone) on information that we don't have -- that, or a combination of both these things.

OS X 10.5 , 10.5.1, .mac, or ichat might have added functionality that would make either or both of these products more attractive to most people, but in their current stand-alone iterations I can't see most people rushing out to buy either of them unless they are some kind of an early adopter AND apple fanatic. I'd be very surprised if itunes movies/tv show sales take off in the near term but can see that its not in apples best interests to bundle dvr functionality in the apple tv due to the current reliance on itunes for revenue -- they'll make more overall hardware sales if an apple-tv-based dvr app is integrated in the OS and especially if an updated and price-tiered .mac service is part of the equation. Integrating visual voicemail into ichat and/or .mac would also boost sales. But personally, I have no desire for a combined ipod/phone (I rarely use my ipod) and I intend to buy a MythTV box and add 1TB of hdd space rather than use an Apple.

Yes, this is my first post. I've been a reader for years but could never sign up with a yahoo address. Gmail is your friend.

 

[jialuolu]

Ridiculous

It's hard to believe that they're selling the TV at all in Canada when the only video content we can purchase are those freaking Pixar shorts and music videos

But I see the TV getting Slinbox-like features before becoming a DVR. Watch your content from any internet connected device in the world? Like the iPhone? Yeahh I wish

 

[NewSc2]

If the TV had a DVD player, I'd get it. Why they didn't put one on makes me . A good DVD player costs what, around $100? I'd pay an additional $100 or so to have extra functionality added on. As it stands I'd much rather have a Mac Mini instead of the TV.