Tipping

[Shaun.P]

I disagree with tipping. They are getting paid to do their job.
I work in an electronics store (read: Comet) and I don't get 'tipped' when I deliver outstanding customer service. Why should I? That's what I get paid to do!

 

[Unspeaked]

Several people have said they don't tip regardless, even in this [age and including the poster I responded to.

Yes, this is the main point we're debating, I think.

A lot of people here are saying they never tip - even for good (or great) service and even when they know the server is making well below minimum wage - as a matter of principal.

I disagree with tipping. They are getting paid to do their job.
I work in an electronics store (read: Comet) and I don't get 'tipped' when I deliver outstanding customer service. Why should I? That's what I get paid to do!

You shouldn't, because you make a living wage.

If your employer suddenly said, "We're going to pay you $2 an hour. Feel free to be extra nice to customers so they might slip you a little something before they check out." you might feel a little differently.

 

[Shaun.P]

This is different in the UK. Everyone receives at least minimum wage. Getting paid $2 an hour and expecting to make the rest up on tips is simply ridiculous and an inherent flaw in the US employment practice.

 

[leekohler]

I disagree with tipping. They are getting paid to do their job.
I work in an electronics store (read: Comet) and I don't get 'tipped' when I deliver outstanding customer service. Why should I? That's what I get paid to do!

Because you get paid to do it! Waiters rely on tips because restaurants do not even pay minimum wage.

To everyone here in the US with this "opinion": I would challenge you all to be waiters for one year. Come back and tell me how that goes for you when you tell your employer to pay you at least minimum wage.

 

[Shaun.P]

As I said, this doesn't happen in the UK - everyone is eligible for minimum wage, which is currently £5.73 or $9.86. I myself get £6.05 ($10.41).

It isn't fair that the employers are allowed to do this.

 

[Unspeaked]

As I said, this doesn't happen in the UK - everyone is eligible for minimum wage, which is currently £5.73 or $9.86. I myself get £6.05 ($10.41).

It isn't fair that the employers are allowed to do this.

Like I mentioned earlier, I'd MUCH rather restaurants here did this.

Just charge 20% more and let me not have to worry about tipping, evaluating service, debating how much to leave when eating with a group, etc.

If someone is stellar, I might still leave a few bucks extra, but for the most part, it would make things so much easier.

 

[Shaun.P]

I agree.

Don't get me wrong, if I was to receive outstanding service, I'd want to leave a tip. But unfortunately, it's just "expected", even when the service has been sub-par.

You get into this situation where you leave a tip anyway as you're too embarrassed not too.

The whole thing seems sloppy and unprofessional.

I'm addicted to Pizza Hut. When I go for the lunch buffet, a member of staff will ask what you want to drink and then you help yourself to the buffet. After that you're lucky if a member of staff comes up to you again. Is that worth tipping? No! Is it expected? Yes! If they notice my drink is getting low and they automatically bring me a free refill (without asking) I usually tip

 

[Much Ado]

Haven't read whole thread, sorry if others have said something similar:

I was in a restaurant in the US this summer, and gratuity was already included on the cheque. There was also a space for 'additional gratuity', which seemed ridiculous, but I went along with it. The waiter then argued with me that the % of this added tip was not enough. I was being asked for extra, extra gratuity.

Odd that it's a percentage system. I'd imagine serving a cheesebuger is as taxing as serving caviar, but clearly not. If your meal cost $200, then the waiter gets a bigger tip than someone who does the same work at a cheaper place. It doesn't add up.

Now in Iceland it's rude to tip, because that implies that the waiters are not being paid enough. That must be the case in the US, which is sad.

 

[samiwas]

Originally Posted by ShaunPriest
I disagree with tipping. They are getting paid to do their job.
I work in an electronics store (read: Comet) and I don't get 'tipped' when I deliver outstanding customer service. Why should I? That's what I get paid to do!

You shouldn't, because you make a living wage.

If your employer suddenly said, "We're going to pay you $2 an hour. Feel free to be extra nice to customers so they might slip you a little something before they check out." you might feel a little differently.

This is the part that so many people don't get. If you are working in an electronics store, you are more than likely making above minimum wage. When you are working as a server, and making $2.13 an hour, it's quite different.

Yes, maybe the restaurant industry is wrong for operating in such a way, but to not tip is taking your opinions out on the wrong person. Not tipping your server (for good service!!) is hurting the server, not the restaurant. And the restaurant industry will not change it's policies based on that.

People say, "Well, then they should look for a different job!". OK, then who is going to serve you if all the waiters and waitresses find a new job?? If every person who didn't like making ONLY $2.13 an hour left and found other work, who would you be left with? Yes, you would be served by bums and homeless people...those who would die for $2.13 an hour...and I'm certain you would not enjoy the experience.

My wife worked as a waitress in a large national chain restaurant. She started in New Hampshire, and did pretty well. Wasn't going down the path to riches or anything, but made enough to get by. Then we moved to Atlanta. She worked for the exact same chain, making the same "wage", and doing the same job. She would work an 8-hour shift and come home with $10, because she worked in an area where people did not tip. She could not afford her bills, so she quit, and took up two other jobs in retail to make up for it. I know she was a very good server (not even putting the husbandly bias into it), so it has nothing to do with that.

We went out to eat later at that same restaurant, just to see how things had become. The service from the person we had was absolutely horrific. The guy could not remember a drink order from the moment he turned around. He came up to the table every minute to double-check what we had ordered because he had forgotten. And the orders were wrong when we did get them. And we could tell that's how the service was generally in the place, because those are the people that would work for the low wage.

But there's a huge difference that a lot of people don't factor in when saying "Well, they should just get another job!". Schedule. The restaurant industry is generally quite lenient with schedules, which is great for students, single parents, etc. Most other professions either require certain hours or certain days, and taking time off is not generally acceptable, as is working around another schedule. THIS is one of the main reasons some people work in the restaurant industry.

The reason for the automatic tip on tables of six or more is easy. Have you ever had the bill add up on a table of six when jointly paying the bill? I have started always getting my own bill, because i was tired of the bill being $214, there being $202 on the table, and every person claiming "I put in extra!". Impossible, but they all claim they did. And so the restaurant, and more likely the server (who has spent most of their time on the large table) makes nothing. Well, except that I would always have to cover the cheapskates.

You can go on about how you don't tip because you think it's stupid. I DO NOT condone tipping when service is not good...that should never be expected. Usually, if I receive bad service, I'll write the problem in the tip column ("her drink was your tip" was one of them when the waiter forgot my wife's drink after three reminders). But if you go to a decent restaurant with table service, and you receive good service, tip the person accordingly. Until the restaurant industry fixes itself, you are only hurting the person serving you. You think you are sticking it to the man, and think you are all badass. But everyone around you thinks you suck.

And no, I have never worked in the restaurant industry.

 

[leekohler]

Odd that it's a percentage system. I'd imagine serving a cheesebuger is as taxing as serving caviar, but clearly not. If your meal cost $200, then the waiter gets a bigger tip than someone who does the same work at a cheaper place. It doesn't add up.

The government here taxes waiters on a percentage of the amount in dollars they sell, not what they actually make. That is why it works that way. Yes- it's definitely messed up.

This is the part that so many people don't get. If you are working in an electronics store, you are more than likely making above minimum wage. When you are working as a server, and making $2.13 an hour, it's quite different.

Yes, maybe the restaurant industry is wrong for operating in such a way, but to not tip is taking your opinions out on the wrong person. Not tipping your server (for good service!!) is hurting the server, not the restaurant. And the restaurant industry will not change it's policies based on that.

People say, "Well, then they should look for a different job!". OK, then who is going to serve you if all the waiters and waitresses find a new job?? If every person who didn't like making ONLY $2.13 an hour left and found other work, who would you be left with? Yes, you would be served by bums and homeless people...those who would die for $2.13 an hour...and I'm certain you would not enjoy the experience.

My wife worked as a waitress in a large national chain restaurant. She started in New Hampshire, and did pretty well. Wasn't going down the path to riches or anything, but made enough to get by. Then we moved to Atlanta. She worked for the exact same chain, making the same "wage", and doing the same job. She would work an 8-hour shift and come home with $10, because she worked in an area where people did not tip. She could not afford her bills, so she quit, and took up two other jobs in retail to make up for it. I know she was a very good server (not even putting the husbandly bias into it), so it has nothing to do with that.

We went out to eat later at that same restaurant, just to see how things had become. The service from the person we had was absolutely horrific. The guy could not remember a drink order from the moment he turned around. He came up to the table every minute to double-check what we had ordered because he had forgotten. And the orders were wrong when we did get them. And we could tell that's how the service was generally in the place, because those are the people that would work for the low wage.

But there's a huge difference that a lot of people don't factor in when saying "Well, they should just get another job!". Schedule. The restaurant industry is generally quite lenient with schedules, which is great for students, single parents, etc. Most other professions either require certain hours or certain days, and taking time off is not generally acceptable, as is working around another schedule. THIS is one of the main reasons some people work in the restaurant industry.

The reason for the automatic tip on tables of six or more is easy. Have you ever had the bill add up on a table of six when jointly paying the bill? I have started always getting my own bill, because i was tired of the bill being $214, there being $202 on the table, and every person claiming "I put in extra!". Impossible, but they all claim they did. And so the restaurant, and more likely the server (who has spent most of their time on the large table) makes nothing. Well, except that I would always have to cover the cheapskates.

You can go on about how you don't tip because you think it's stupid. I DO NOT condone tipping when service is not good...that should never be expected. Usually, if I receive bad service, I'll write the problem in the tip column ("her drink was your tip" was one of them when the waiter forgot my wife's drink after three reminders). But if you go to a decent restaurant with table service, and you receive good service, tip the person accordingly. Until the restaurant industry fixes itself, you are only hurting the person serving you. You think you are sticking it to the man, and think you are all badass. But everyone around you thinks you suck.

And no, I have never worked in the restaurant industry.

Thank you!

 

[anjinha]

Several people have said they don't tip regardless, even on this page and including the poster I responded to.

And no- of course people don't deserve tips if they've done a bad job. So- should your salary be docked when you do a bad job as well? Just asking.

If I don't do my job correctly I risk getting fired, so I wouldn't get a salary at all.

 

[Shaun.P]

This is the part that so many people don't get. If you are working in an electronics store, you are more than likely making above minimum wage. When you are working as a server, and making $2.13 an hour, it's quite different.

Yes, maybe the restaurant industry is wrong for operating in such a way, but to not tip is taking your opinions out on the wrong person. Not tipping your server (for good service!!) is hurting the server, not the restaurant. And the restaurant industry will not change it's policies based on that.

People say, "Well, then they should look for a different job!". OK, then who is going to serve you if all the waiters and waitresses find a new job?? If every person who didn't like making ONLY $2.13 an hour left and found other work, who would you be left with? Yes, you would be served by bums and homeless people...those who would die for $2.13 an hour...and I'm certain you would not enjoy the experience.

My wife worked as a waitress in a large national chain restaurant. She started in New Hampshire, and did pretty well. Wasn't going down the path to riches or anything, but made enough to get by. Then we moved to Atlanta. She worked for the exact same chain, making the same "wage", and doing the same job. She would work an 8-hour shift and come home with $10, because she worked in an area where people did not tip. She could not afford her bills, so she quit, and took up two other jobs in retail to make up for it. I know she was a very good server (not even putting the husbandly bias into it), so it has nothing to do with that.

We went out to eat later at that same restaurant, just to see how things had become. The service from the person we had was absolutely horrific. The guy could not remember a drink order from the moment he turned around. He came up to the table every minute to double-check what we had ordered because he had forgotten. And the orders were wrong when we did get them. And we could tell that's how the service was generally in the place, because those are the people that would work for the low wage.

But there's a huge difference that a lot of people don't factor in when saying "Well, they should just get another job!". Schedule. The restaurant industry is generally quite lenient with schedules, which is great for students, single parents, etc. Most other professions either require certain hours or certain days, and taking time off is not generally acceptable, as is working around another schedule. THIS is one of the main reasons some people work in the restaurant industry.

The reason for the automatic tip on tables of six or more is easy. Have you ever had the bill add up on a table of six when jointly paying the bill? I have started always getting my own bill, because i was tired of the bill being $214, there being $202 on the table, and every person claiming "I put in extra!". Impossible, but they all claim they did. And so the restaurant, and more likely the server (who has spent most of their time on the large table) makes nothing. Well, except that I would always have to cover the cheapskates.

You can go on about how you don't tip because you think it's stupid. I DO NOT condone tipping when service is not good...that should never be expected. Usually, if I receive bad service, I'll write the problem in the tip column ("her drink was your tip" was one of them when the waiter forgot my wife's drink after three reminders). But if you go to a decent restaurant with table service, and you receive good service, tip the person accordingly. Until the restaurant industry fixes itself, you are only hurting the person serving you. You think you are sticking it to the man, and think you are all badass. But everyone around you thinks you suck.

And no, I have never worked in the restaurant industry.

I am not making much more than minimum wage. As I stated, minimum wage here is roughly $10. If the waiter/waitress was making that, would you still tip, or agree with it?

See it from my perspective - why should I tip people who probably make roughly the same as me for customer service, when I offer good service in my job, in an business where you wouldn't tip? And no, I don't get commission .

A lot of the opinions here seem to be aimed at the people earning $2 / hour. This doesn't happen in the UK, so my views more than likely would be different if I live in the US.

 

[leekohler]

I am not making much more than minimum wage. As I stated, minimum wage here is roughly $10. If the waiter/waitress was making that, would you still tip, or agree with it?

Waiters don't make that much. What they make has already been detailed here. So what is your point?

 

[Shaun.P]

Waiters don't make that much. What they make has already been detailed here. So what is your point?

My point is clear. Less people would tip if they were not getting paid $2 an hour. In the UK minimum wage is $10, which justifies my reasons for not tipping - this is roughly equal to what I earn in a customer, front of house job (sales) when I have to refer to the customer as "Sir" and be polite and informative, and sustain a sales related dialogue with the customer and respond to all their questions, and give them a shopping 'experience'. Yet my line of work isn't tipped. So when I eat out at a restaurant, I grudge tipping as they are getting at least minimum wage $10. In the UK, wages aren't subsidized through tips.

As I said, my opinion would probably be different if I lived in the US.

 

[iShater]

It is amazing to me the people from countries were the system is different are here bitching about tipping. Read the thread, if they were being paid regardless of service then the TIP is a BONUS just like you are saying.

That is not the issue, we are talking about how the TIP IS IN FACT PART OF THEIR WAGE IN THE U.S. and how because that system is messed up, not tipping at ALL is just being cheap.

Why are you arguing when it is clear you are talking about something totally different than what we are talking about?

 

[samiwas]

I am not making much more than minimum wage. As I stated, minimum wage here is roughly $10. If the waiter/waitress was making that, would you still tip, or agree with it?

No, if the waiter or waitress was making $10 an hour in a standard restaurant, then I would only tip when service was absolutely exceptional. I would still believe in tipping highly experienced and ultra-professional service of the higher-end restaurants, although probably not at the same rate.

As has been discussed ad-nauseam, generally servers in the US receive $2.13 an hour, every cent of which is taken for taxes, and thus they receive a $0 check each week. All of their income is based on tips. Yes, it is a bad system, but it's unfortunately what the system is. No one has to agree with it, but then they also shouldn't be partaking of it.

I also found restaurant service in the UK to be extremely slow, but I think that's more of a customary thing than a service thing. I had hour lunch breaks from work and could rarely, if ever, make it back to work on time...even from a hamburger place.

 

[leekohler]

My point is clear. Less people would tip if they were not getting paid $2 an hour. In the UK minimum wage is $10, which justifies my reasons for not tipping - this is roughly equal to what I earn in a customer, front of house job (sales) when I have to refer to the customer as "Sir" and be polite and informative, and sustain a sales related dialogue with the customer and respond to all their questions, and give them a shopping 'experience'. Yet my line of work isn't tipped. So when I eat out at a restaurant, I grudge tipping as they are getting at least minimum wage $10. In the UK, wages aren't subsidized through tips.

As I said, my opinion would probably be different if I lived in the US.

I understand how it works in Britain. British tourists used to be more than happy to inform me how it works there as an excuse not to tip here.

But we've been talking about tipping here in the US- at least that's what I thought.

EDIT: I of course in no way mean to malign our British members here. I know you all are cool cats.

 

[iShater]

I understand how it works in Britain. British tourists used to be more than happy to inform me how it works there as an excuse not to tip here.

Seems that we are not using the same language, cause people are still arguing on why they shouldn't tip in the US

Edit: And I think we all agree that BAD service doesn't get tip regardless where you are at, unless the individual tipping decides to be generous and leave something. It all depends on your definition of BAD.

 

[Shaun.P]

Just to clarify, if I knew someone was getting $2 an hour (£1) I would give a tip, as I'd probably say it is the morally correct thing to do.

 

[samiwas]

Just to clarify, if I knew someone was getting $2 an hour (£1) I would give a tip, as I'd probably say it is the morally correct thing to do.

Woohoo! Someone who figured it out! Thank you, ShaunPriest.

 

[scotthayes]

As most of the Brits have said, tipping over here is normally only done based on the quality of the service (or cuteness of the waitress) but when in Rome...

I'm off to the States in a few weeks time and know that tipping is expected so I factor that into my budget for a meal. Last time I was there I worked on 10% for poor service, 15% for normal/good service, 20% for outstanding service and once, for truly unbelievable service (barman in the Hub Pub, Boston) 40%.

 

[leekohler]

Seems that we are not using the same language, cause people are still arguing on why they shouldn't tip in the US

Edit: And I think we all agree that BAD service doesn't get tip regardless where you are at, unless the individual tipping decides to be generous and leave something. It all depends on your definition of BAD.

Agreed on all points.

As most of the Brits have said, tipping over here is normally only done based on the quality of the service (or cuteness of the waitress) but when in Rome...

I'm off to the States in a few weeks time and know that tipping is expected so I factor that into my budget for a meal. Last time I was there I worked on 10% for poor service, 15% for normal/good service, 20% for outstanding service and once, for truly unbelievable service (barman in the Hub Pub, Boston) 40%.

That is actually perfect. Good man!

Just to clarify, if I knew someone was getting $2 an hour (£1) I would give a tip, as I'd probably say it is the morally correct thing to do.

Even better!

 

[heehee]

I don't tip alot, probably between 10-15%. Most of the time when I eat at Chinese restaurant, 10% is normal since us Chinese have this thing called +1, means 10% tip. I once tipped $45 on a $250 bill for 2 and my gf yelled at me and I thought I was being stingy. The waitress probably took 15 photos of us that night.

 

[Unspeaked]

But there's a huge difference that a lot of people don't factor in when saying "Well, they should just get another job!". Schedule. The restaurant industry is generally quite lenient with schedules, which is great for students, single parents, etc. Most other professions either require certain hours or certain days, and taking time off is not generally acceptable, as is working around another schedule. THIS is one of the main reasons some people work in the restaurant industry.

This is an excellent point that I was going to bring up earlier myself.

There's only so many 7-Elevens in the world where someone who has kids and night classes can find a shift.

Think about when you go out to eat and who's serving you: 90% of the time, it's some poor kid in school (high school or college) or a working mother, because they can't do the 9 to 5 thing or even the retail thing with more standardized shifts.

Do you think they want to work at Arby's or Ruby Tuesdays and put up with the crap the average customer at those places gives them? And then have to deal with some of the tightwads here who think the couple of bucks they get from their employer is all they deserve?

 

[teflon]

Actually, servers make minimum wage too. They may be on the clock for two bucks an hour, but laws state that if they don't earn enough to make minimum wage, then the employer has to make up the difference. At the end of the day, server's minimum wage = retail workers = mc donalds workers.

No one here is against tipping. I'm only against tipping when the waiters do a bad job. I have no problem tipping if they do a good job. If they are worried about meeting the minimum wage they should try their best to do a great job.

I've worked as a waitress. I didn't expect tips, especially if I did a bad job.

I don't know how to make it any clearer. Anybody legally working in the USA is lawfully entitled to the federal minimum wage of $6.55 an hour.
Tipped employees may be clocked at something as low as $2.13 an hour, but if their tips and wage don't add up to $6.55 an hour, the employer has to make up the difference!!

So... Why would you tip a crappy server giving you bad service, knowing he's making the same minimum wage that thousands of other Americans make? What is the point of this compulsive tipping behavior that we've all grown so accustomed to? Why do bad servers 'deserve' more than the average American?

In the end, the customers always get the short end of the stick, not the restaurant owners. If you're unwilling to pay up and let the restaurants pay the waiters (which they should anyway in my opinion), then the prices of food will rise, which some of you are unwilling to see. You can't not tip the waiter, not want the price of food to increase, and still say you are not just an incredibly selfish bum.

I also don't understand why Canada doesn't simply include tax into the price you see on the price-tag, but anyway....

Because stupid corporations are unwilling to see the prices "go up". As if no one ever remembers consumer tax until they reached the cashier .

So I am supposed to tip someone who did their job because well, they did their job? And this is only in a few select industries. But we never think to tip in other industries such as grocery stores, etc. There is something slightly wrong with this I feel like.

And as for the person working in the restaurant industry, they choose to do that. I am sorry if its hard to find a job right now, but if you want to make a decent living, I wouldn't put that in the hands of someone else. Suck it up. You picked that job, you deserve the pay you get. This all goes back to other industries not getting tipped and someone simply doing their job.

The other industries pay minimum wage.

When my mom came to Canada many, many years ago, she had $100 USD on her. The only English words she could speak were "thank you" and "tea". Tell me, what else could she have worked as other than as a waitress? Thank god here the waiters/waitresses made at least minimum wage, but even with that and the tips she could barely pay for my formula and diapers. If everyone is like you, who is unwilling to let restaurant raise their prices to pay waiters/waitresses minimum wage AND unwilling to tip, then I probably would've starved.