Today's Announcements: The Untold Story

[guzhogi]

The iPod touch does not fall under this model, and therefore under Apple's reasoning, a major feature upgrade must incur a charge.

So it's kinda like when people had to pay $1.99 to activate the 802.11n card in the first MBPs. W/ the MBPs, I kinda had a problem w/ it since the card was actually built-in, but not advertised. W/ the iPod Touch, it's a new feature (kinda). Actually, aren't the iPod Touch & iPhone relatively the same hardware minus the phone? So it would've been really easy to just copy the software over. But whatever. I'm not getting an iPod Touch so doesn't really matter.

 

[Freis968]

How do you know if the iPod Touch in the store has the upgrade already? Is there some new UPC# or some sticker on the outside telling you its upgraded?

 

[jayducharme]

Having a non jailbroken iPod just seems like the right thing to do now that the apps are officiallly available. Who's with me?

I agree with the non-jailbroken iPod statement. I launched the software update feature in iTunes and something caught my eye: "January Software Update." I'm cynical and paranoid, so this is probably over-reacting. But why is it specifically called a "January" software update? The implication is that this is the first of future monthly updates, almost like a subscription service. I can see Apple bundling the new apps that are developed with the SDK and every month enticing people to shell out more $$$.

The only app I really wanted in this bundle was the Notes app. Well, that and also the ability to re-arrange the icons (which IMO should have been part of the system update). So I think I'm going to wait a bit....

 

[tivoboy]

Sox

I haven't read the ENTIRE thread, but the point to make is

The issue of Software Revenue Recognition rules and requirements is 100% valid. In order for apple to be able to BOOK all the revenue of the SALE of any product, there must be NO ADDITIONAL deliverable, consequential or INCONSEQUENTIAL in the future. Otherwise, a percent of REVENUE would have to be DEFERRED till such time that those items are DELIVERED, ACCEPTED and INSTALLED by the end user.

Such a scenario is bad for revenue timing, and REALLY bad for tracking of DELIVERY.

With a charge, (and it DOES have to be somewhat reasonable) it becomes a NEW REVENUE opportunity and a NEW DELIVERY with its OWN REVENUE SCHEDULE.

Remember the 802.11N update, that was 2.99$ or something crazy. SAME Thing.

It is just anothe reason why we HAVE to pay something for SOFTWARE upgrades, but not UPDATES

 

[Baron58]

Why does everybody assume that $20 is fair???

Why not?

I bought my iPod touch because I am on a college campus and can't afford the data plan the iPhone requires.

So?

Why does Apple consider my product differently?

Why do you consider it the same?

$20 means a lot to me.

Then don't spend it. Your Touch will function just as it always has.

Not to mention that this iPod touch thing keeps screwing me over.

How? If it's broken, get it fixed under warranty. If it works AS IT WAS SOLD TO YOU, then how is it 'screwing' you? By doing exactly what it was designed to do?

$20 upgrade for capability it should have had from the beginning?

"Should" have had? Oh, I thought you were a college student. I didn't realise that you were the VP of Product Design for Apple. My bad.

why is the iPod touch being treated like a bastard sibling of the iPhone instead of the brother it really is??

Did APPLE define it as the brother, or did YOU? I don't recall ever seeing Apple marketing material that called it a phoneless iPhone, it's called an iPod that happens to have some additional features. You BOUGHT an iPod that happened to have some additional features. If you expected more, then that's your fault. It performs exactly as advertised. You knew this when you bought it. No promises were made for any additional apps.

Now, Hey! Here's some new Apps (if you want them). Cost for these apps = $20. So, you make a choice: are they worth $20 to you? If so, spend it. If not, don't. Nothing has been taken away from what your touch already does. No promises were broken. Get over it.

I am SO SICK of all the whining about this keynote and its products, and in general, all of the whining about how Apple is out to screw people.

 

[jayducharme]

the increased functionality is anything but free.

Yes, but Apple had no obligation to add the new apps to the iPhone. You could have been paying the same tariffs without them. So your iPhone now has "added value" which might make the tariffs slightly more attractive, especially if Apple continues adding more functionality at no additional cost.

Touch owners, though, apparently will always have to pay for that functionality.
Again, I see the point people have been making: the Touch is really an MP3 player; it's not a "subscription-free" iPhone. MP3 players don't need GPS and Notes.

But it would be nice....

 

[guzhogi]

Why not?

So?

Why do you consider it the same?

Then don't spend it. Your Touch will function just as it always has.

How? If it's broken, get it fixed under warranty. If it works AS IT WAS SOLD TO YOU, then how is it 'screwing' you? By doing exactly what it was designed to do?

"Should" have had? Oh, I thought you were a college student. I didn't realise that you were the VP of Product Design for Apple. My bad.



Did APPLE define it as the brother, or did YOU? I don't recall ever seeing Apple marketing material that called it a phoneless iPhone, it's called an iPod that happens to have some additional features. You BOUGHT an iPod that happened to have some additional features. If you expected more, then that's your fault. It performs exactly as advertised. You knew this when you bought it. No promises were made for any additional apps.

Now, Hey! Here's some new Apps (if you want them). Cost for these apps = $20. So, you make a choice: are they worth $20 to you? If so, spend it. If not, don't. Nothing has been taken away from what your touch already does. No promises were broken. Get over it.

I am SO SICK of all the whining about this keynote and its products, and in general, all of the whining about how Apple is out to screw people.

You bring up a lot of good points, but there's no need to be rude. I agree that if someone put in effort for this to happen, they should get paid for it. However, there are many times where people may really need something, but can't afford it. So something's gotta give.

 

[bytethese]

Locate me tool - Great feature, but it would have been a lot helpful if it were on my iPhone like a month ago! I spent christmas in New York, and I got totally lost at one point in the upper east side, and it took me forever to find out where I was... So I had to improvise... (Long story).

Multiple Text Messaging - How handy would this have been for Christmas day and New Years, the amount of times that I had to type the same message over and over again, wishing all of my friends and family a merry christmas... My fingers got so tired... With multiple texts, it would have been so much easier!

I guess these features would come in handy this year and future years to come right?

Sorry, I always get a chuckle out of people who get lost on numbered streets. But yes, Locate Me would have been helpful not only a month ago, but from the getgo! The Multiple Text Message feature is going to save me a lot of typing!

 

[Small White Car]

I don't see how this is any different than buying a new computer with iLife '07 and then a few months later having new computers include iLife '08 for free while everyone else has to pay for it.

EXACTLY.

Everyone is so thrilled that they can put a computer in a phone or put a computer in an iPod. "Wow" the say. "This is way better than those old phones...this is a whole computer in here!"

Well, guess what, kids. Computer software costs money. And for those saying the iPhone gets it for "free" you do realize those people are paying $80 - $150 per MONTH to use that thing, don't you? You really want to compare yourself to that? (And yes, Apple gets a chunk of that each and every month.)

Maybe you should realize when you're ahead and leave it at that!

 

[dan-o-mac]

No. There were not any major features added to 10.3.x or 10.4.x, nor will there be to 10.5.x. Just bugfixes and minor tweaks. Any feature that materially adds to the value of the product will be in the next (e.g. 10.6) release, which you will *pay* for, and then get bugfixes for 'free' until the next major release, and so on.

This is not Apple being mean. This is a result of the Sarbanes-Oxley (SOX) accounting laws.

What about the iTunes example someone gave earlier? Wasn't a major feature added yesterday?

IMO this was a poorly handled update by Apple. They should have just waited for the SDK to be released and sold each app separate. The way they did it now, it just comes off as a greedy move.

I think most people are upset because they knew these apps could have been on the Touch a long time ago, and held back just to milk us later. I don't even have a touch and I feel it's a snake move on Apple's part(especially releasing it after the Holiday season).

Oh well what can you do. If you don't like it, don't support it. If you feel its wrong and took the time to write about it on this forum, I hope you take the time out to send Apple some feedback.

 

[carlostsr]

I bought my iPod form Germany and I live in Romania I have no option to buy that update. In Apple's vision some customers are more customers than others. Not to mention that "special" 20$ update issue. What a disgrace for all the customers what a shame!

I will make a complaint to European Union for unfair commercial practices for that 20$ surcharge and for discrimination within EU economic space. Please contact the European Union board under Meglena Kuneva Commissioner.
For all the europeans please fill up the complaint against Apple.Inc

http://ec.europa.eu/consumers/index_en.htm

As a customer I have the right to be customer! Apple did not think of that.

 

[eastcoastsurfer]

Apple has always been closed, but I think now we see why they are becoming even more closed. They want to be able to nickel and dime customers to add features (which arguably should have been their to start) to their products now.

What's so wrong with jailbreaking the ipod touch? Don't let Apple fool you and say it messes up the customer experience. Jailbreaking gets in the way of Apples revenue stream and that's why they fight it so much. Forget what's best for the consumer (or the fact that you OWN a piece of hardware once you buy it). Apples recent treatment of it's customers with the iphone and now the touch have soured me on them. They used to embrace the hackers (anyone remember the Apple 2 came with a complete circuit layout!), and were once hackers themselves fighting the closed hardware makers. My how times have changed. Makes me think more and more that my mbp will be the last apple computer I own

 

[Mackan]

Ok, existing iPod touch owners have to pay for this update, but new buyers get it for free. Those who think this is fair, how do you reason?

For me, it's okay they charge you if you want good new applications. But why put these applications on new shipping iPods? They should have a base firmware for all iPod touch, then let all owners go buy new cool applications through iTunes, if they want.

That is what would be fair for me. Right now they just screw early buyers. It is hardly encouraging. Despite their cool products, their buisness models are clearly very greed directed.

 

[iStefmac]

I think iPod touch users got off cheap. Real cheap.

 

[iStefmac]

Ok, existing iPod touch owners have to pay for this update, but new buyers get it for free. Those who think this is fair, how do you reason?

For me, it's okay they charge you if you want good new applications. But why put these applications on new shipping iPods? They should have a base firmware for all iPod touch, then let all owners go buy new cool applications through iTunes, if they want.

That is what would be fair for me. Right now they just screw early buyers. It is hardly encouraging. Despite their cool products, their buisness models are clearly very greed directed.

Please. Don't go there. iPhone owners would tear you a new one for saying that $20 for the remaining 5 of our apps (excluding phone as a possibility) is screwing early buyers. Hardly. Dropping the price of the iPhone by $200....THAT was screwing early adopters. $100 credit or not. Its a GIFT is what it is. People who want them will have them. People who don't, won't.

 

[Nym]

Am I wrong or is this the FIRST time since the iPod introduction that the customer has to pay for a software update?

 

[sikkinixx]

All I know is my iPod stays jailbroken, with more features, with a much more attractive skin, and it cost me 20 minutes of my time. I bet it took them about the same amount of time to change the code to 'update' the apps for the ipod.

 

[gkarris]

I haven't read the ENTIRE thread, but the point to make is

The issue of Software Revenue Recognition rules and requirements is 100% valid. In order for apple to be able to BOOK all the revenue of the SALE of any product, there must be NO ADDITIONAL deliverable, consequential or INCONSEQUENTIAL in the future. Otherwise, a percent of REVENUE would have to be DEFERRED till such time that those items are DELIVERED, ACCEPTED and INSTALLED by the end user.

Such a scenario is bad for revenue timing, and REALLY bad for tracking of DELIVERY.

With a charge, (and it DOES have to be somewhat reasonable) it becomes a NEW REVENUE opportunity and a NEW DELIVERY with its OWN REVENUE SCHEDULE.

Remember the 802.11N update, that was 2.99$ or something crazy. SAME Thing.

It is just anothe reason why we HAVE to pay something for SOFTWARE upgrades, but not UPDATES

Yep, we got rid of SOX (Sarbanes-Oxley) at work because of their other strange rules that were upsetting our clients...

I don't think it would affect a lot of people - most bought the Touch as an iPod.

Now, it's the BEST PDA available!

The only reason I didn't get the Touch is becuase it didn't have the iPhone apps. Now I'm thinking if something happends to my iPhone, I'll just get a cheap phone and replace it with a Touch...

 

[asiayeah]

Disappointed

If I want to get the capability to display lyrics on the iPod touch, do I have to pay the USD20? The lyrics display capability is more like a missing feature than a new feature. Because the feature is available on almost all existing ipods, except the ipod shuffle.

How about installing 3rd party applications when the SDK is available? Do we have to pay USD20 to get a customizable home screen so that we can install any future application on it?

I think Apple should free the lyrics display and customizable home screens as a free upgrade, because those should be part of the original iPod touches. For Mail, Google Maps, Weather or Stock, feel free to charge them and better individually at $5 each.

 

[asiayeah]

And BTW, is the Radio Remote supported by firmware 1.1.3 yet?

 

[Teddy's]

Style and status rather than performance.

It's obvious that most of the current iPT users are not happy with the charge. Even if it is $20 or $4.99 or $1.99 It does not matter!

Yesterday I saw a different company. One that is more interested in lifestyle and status rather than performance.

Shortly, Apple will be working with Abercrombie to release Mac Scarves for your MB Air... at $200 a piece.

 

[Mechcozmo]

About the iPod Touch apps...

Could this be like the 802.11n updater? Where Apple cannot 'enable' new features without a fee due to the way revenue is counted?

The price could be cheaper, sure, but just throwing that idea out into the wild...

 

[ablashek]

the last straw

wow, its almost like apple likes to harm its early buyers.
All those who bought the iPhone in the first days paid full price, when the prices dropped 200$ they gave back 100$ store credit. Now the iPod Touch, all those that bought the iPod early will have to paid 20$ for software that is included in all iPod Touches after this date?

After these events, i'll wait before i purchase the MacBook Air... who knows in 4 months maybe they will include the cd/dvd player for free?

thats a bad apple...

 

[Mackan]

Please. Don't go there. iPhone owners would tear you a new one for saying that $20 for the remaining 5 of our apps (excluding phone as a possibility) is screwing early buyers. Hardly. Dropping the price of the iPhone by $200....THAT was screwing early adopters. $100 credit or not. Its a GIFT is what it is. People who want them will have them. People who don't, won't.

New buyers of iPod touch get the applications for free, early buyers don't. That's what unfair and we have to react against it. I am not counting the dollars here. I see some people on this forum defending all what Apple is doing, to death. It doesn't matter what clear logical reasoning you do.

 

[joeconvert]

Why does everybody assume that $20 is fair??? I bought my iPod touch because I am on a college campus and can't afford the data plan the iPhone requires. Why does Apple consider my product differently? $20 means a lot to me. Not to mention that this iPod touch thing keeps screwing me over. No apps? $20 upgrade for capability it should have had from the beginning? Apple is ubiquitous in the academic environment, but they just refuse to show me any love. If only Apple had heard of Google's mantra - don't be evil!

To put it succinctly - why is the iPod touch being treated like a bastard sibling of the iPhone instead of the brother it really is??

The post above yours pretty much summed it up. You are paying Apple nowhere near what iPhone users are.... get over it.