whole lot of cool-aid drinking here folks. i used to wonder how jim jones could get 1100 adults to agree to go belly up in the jungle. after reading the mac fanboi posts the last couple of years, i don't anymore.
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Today's Announcements: The Untold Story
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
There also seems to be some difference between fixes (including security patches) and enhancements or new functionality.
These new apps fall firmly into the new functionality category. Most patches to the OS are fixes and don't provide anything new (10.5.1 certainly didn't). Even something like the change to stacks mooted for 10.5.2 could be seen as fixing it based on what was demo-ed/promised.
Naw, we all know you're kidding us. Cut and Paste on the iPhone, indeed! 😛
I agree that Apple should have let everyone share in their success by giving the applications away for free, although it's likely the 1.2 OS update will just bundle them anyway (otherwise they'd always have to have two updates for the Touch) regardless of whether or not you paid for them now.
Sarbanes-Oxley is the excuse for charging, and Apple seem to be very serious about not breaking this law. New features on the PSP, PS3 and XBox360 however aren't affected by this law, or you don't need to charge for new features and Apple is making stuff up. I think a law that effectively means you can't give your customers free upgrades in functionality is rather weird. Also why does this affect us in the UK?
However it is optional, and if you were happy with the iPod Touch at release then there shouldn't be an argument now. Pay the small fee, or not.
One more thing
I think they pulled something from the keynote at the last minute
Finishing with Randy Newman!?! Come on...
I bet the record and /or movie studios pulled the pin on the pan European iTunes store or worldwide movie rentals at the last minute
Probably due to Fox and the combined iTunes/DVD
Apple are the whipping boy of the consumers who are still getting screwed by the demands of the out of touch big studios
I think they pulled something from the keynote at the last minute
Finishing with Randy Newman!?! Come on...
I bet the record and /or movie studios pulled the pin on the pan European iTunes store or worldwide movie rentals at the last minute
Probably due to Fox and the combined iTunes/DVD
Apple are the whipping boy of the consumers who are still getting screwed by the demands of the out of touch big studios
nomad01
macrumors 68000
If it bothers you so much why stick around?? You're saying that you're preaching to the perverted already so just give it up man!
With the lower price and new software features it could sell more, although I am not buying one until it can do full HD video (whether or not my eyes can tell the difference, heh) and play Divx, etc. Problem is that I'll get a PS3 at some point and that can do all that, so why would I need this?
However if Apple are making a profit off the device, and a revenue stream from the movie rental stuff, they'll keep it going.
tremendous
macrumors 6502
hold on; if it should have had these features from the beginning, why did you buy it knowing it didn't have them if this was going to be such an issue for you? You can't have it both ways.
deputy_doofy
macrumors 65816
I need someone to explain why the $20 is a problem at all. Too many people have been complaining that they shouldn't have to pay $20 for something that already cost them $400.
Yet, these are the same people who have no problem with iLife being $79 (or free with their next computer purchase).
My MBP cost a lot more than an iPod Touch and you don't hear me complaining one bit.
Apple cannot both succeed financially and give everything away free.
Yet, these are the same people who have no problem with iLife being $79 (or free with their next computer purchase).
My MBP cost a lot more than an iPod Touch and you don't hear me complaining one bit.
Apple cannot both succeed financially and give everything away free.
I personally think that this $20 is a farce in the same way that the 802.11n update ($2 or something ridiculous) for my MBP was.
I'll pay for a 2.0 upgrade, maybe even a 1.2 upgrade if it's substantial. But a 1.1.3 upgrade, what a farce! for 0.0.1 we pay $20. How much are they going to charge for 1.2? Based on $20 for every 0.0.1 I'd put it at $200 for 1.2, that's fair right?
Anyway I guess there's no point me complaining. Apple hasn't taken anything away from me and I don't want these features so will not pay $20... easy!
Instead I'm sticking with my Jailbroken 1.1.2, which has a large array of much more entertaining applications for free. God compared to maps and notes, how much is a PSX emulator, ScummVM, a GBA emulator, a multi-language dictionary (I live in Japan), a chat client, a drawing program...etc worth? Well I get them all for free.
It just makes MacWorld a bit disappointing as Apple hasn't matched the 3rd party developers in any way, and to rub it in they're charging $20 for their comparatively less than impressive efforts, while at the same time putting a meat axe to support for these superior 3rd party apps in their newly released firmware.
I say Apple shouldn't support 3rd party apps at this stage, but shouldn't actively take them away from us! Why bother spending all the man hours disabling useful hacks?
I'll pay for a 2.0 upgrade, maybe even a 1.2 upgrade if it's substantial. But a 1.1.3 upgrade, what a farce! for 0.0.1 we pay $20. How much are they going to charge for 1.2? Based on $20 for every 0.0.1 I'd put it at $200 for 1.2, that's fair right?
Anyway I guess there's no point me complaining. Apple hasn't taken anything away from me and I don't want these features so will not pay $20... easy!
Instead I'm sticking with my Jailbroken 1.1.2, which has a large array of much more entertaining applications for free. God compared to maps and notes, how much is a PSX emulator, ScummVM, a GBA emulator, a multi-language dictionary (I live in Japan), a chat client, a drawing program...etc worth? Well I get them all for free.
It just makes MacWorld a bit disappointing as Apple hasn't matched the 3rd party developers in any way, and to rub it in they're charging $20 for their comparatively less than impressive efforts, while at the same time putting a meat axe to support for these superior 3rd party apps in their newly released firmware.
I say Apple shouldn't support 3rd party apps at this stage, but shouldn't actively take them away from us! Why bother spending all the man hours disabling useful hacks?
rspress
macrumors member
How Can I Fault Apple?
How can I fault Apple for charging 20 bucks for these apps. When the iPod Touch came out I sent feedback to Apple saying they should do just that, charge 20 bucks for the apps because one way or another people would find a way to use them anyway and so would I. I did just that by jailbreaking the iPod and installing many third party apps.
Even though I have the apps but not with all the new features I will happily plunk down my 20 bucks to go legit and get the updated apps. If this spurs Apple to make more 3 party apps available for the Touch then all the better! I would love more third party apps from Apple. I have sent my wish list into Apple via the iPod Touch feedback page and so should other users. I would really like a way to run the Widgets I made for Tiger and Leopard on the Touch and since they are just HTML, CSS and Javascript this should be a whole lot easier than it is and even third parties have not gotten this right yet. A more seamless tie in with dotmac would be cool as well. Copying and pasting text is a MUST! Leopard data detectors would be nice as well.
How can I fault Apple for charging 20 bucks for these apps. When the iPod Touch came out I sent feedback to Apple saying they should do just that, charge 20 bucks for the apps because one way or another people would find a way to use them anyway and so would I. I did just that by jailbreaking the iPod and installing many third party apps.
Even though I have the apps but not with all the new features I will happily plunk down my 20 bucks to go legit and get the updated apps. If this spurs Apple to make more 3 party apps available for the Touch then all the better! I would love more third party apps from Apple. I have sent my wish list into Apple via the iPod Touch feedback page and so should other users. I would really like a way to run the Widgets I made for Tiger and Leopard on the Touch and since they are just HTML, CSS and Javascript this should be a whole lot easier than it is and even third parties have not gotten this right yet. A more seamless tie in with dotmac would be cool as well. Copying and pasting text is a MUST! Leopard data detectors would be nice as well.
lavem
macrumors member
This revenue generating business still bugs me. ATV gets a free update and more functionality because it is a product that is supposed to generate cash for them. But I can buy an ATV and never pay a penny for content.
Same goes for the touch, you can buy content on it and generate more revenue for them. Or you don't bother.
I think they just want to screw us over and experiment with their itunes software store at the same time.
This fool isn't biting. 😛 I think the majority feel the same way.
Same goes for the touch, you can buy content on it and generate more revenue for them. Or you don't bother.
I think they just want to screw us over and experiment with their itunes software store at the same time.
This fool isn't biting. 😛 I think the majority feel the same way.
jayducharme
macrumors 603
Now this finally makes sense to me. In the other Touch Update thread my position was that, as an early adopter, I felt punished for buying a first generation product. But this point is well taken: if you look at it as a software package along the lines of iLife and not a system update (which Apple did provide for free), the $20 fee makes perfect sense.
Perhaps Apple needed a better strategy for announcing it. If they had made the parallel between iLife and the new Touch apps, perhaps it would have gone down a bit better.
But then again, there's the nagging issue of the iPhone -- all of those users (lucky enough to be part of Apple's "subscription" model) get the upgrade for free. 😕
because, iPhone and iPod Touch are quite the same HARDWARE.
It's like if you buy an iMac 24 you got for free iWork, if you got iMac 20 no because 24 is more for profesional use, and the video card is faster.
So Apple is not getting any "subscription revenue" from ipod users right? You're telling me that those of us that have spent hundreds of dollars on itunes do not contribute to apple's revenue? Ipod users have to pay for the music just like apple tv users have to pay to watch movies and iphone users have to pay to get the service. Im sorry but Im just very disappointed with Apple's decision and I cant find a reasonable excuse. Specially since you can get those app's easily and for free right now. Just imagine if apple decides to charge for every single update from now on?
ftaok
macrumors 604
How about this perspective?
Apple will be opening up the iPod Touch and iPhone to developers in Februrary, right. If they give away free software, which is what some here are asking for, they might be accused of undercutting the 3rd party developers.
Maybe a developer wants to make a Notepad application and sell it for $2. Apple comes along and offers one for free. How would that make him feel?
I don't know, maybe I'm talkin' out my ass.
ft
Apple will be opening up the iPod Touch and iPhone to developers in Februrary, right. If they give away free software, which is what some here are asking for, they might be accused of undercutting the 3rd party developers.
Maybe a developer wants to make a Notepad application and sell it for $2. Apple comes along and offers one for free. How would that make him feel?
I don't know, maybe I'm talkin' out my ass.
ft
That is because true GPS is based on sattelite tracking which is "everywhere", whereas the iPod Touch is based on Wi-Fi tracking, which isn't everywhere...yet.
I hope you mother in law enjoys it, I got one (even though it is a base model - GPS only) for the Holidays, and it's been great.
If you're angry about the $20 charge for the Touch upgrade, then complain to your congresspeople about the law. This is an election year, after all.
Dang, you Apple people have had it too good for too long. I'm a Windows guy about to go MBP this weekend. Hop over to the M$ side of things and I'm sure you'll appreciate what you have.
Had Billy-Boy released something like this for the Zune, it would require a HW attachment, some convoluted authentication scheme, and your wallet would be at least $100 lighter.
As others have pointed out, if you think the update has value, buy it. If not, don't.
Thanks. I'm not awake yet. 😀
Had Billy-Boy released something like this for the Zune, it would require a HW attachment, some convoluted authentication scheme, and your wallet would be at least $100 lighter.
As others have pointed out, if you think the update has value, buy it. If not, don't.
Thanks. I'm not awake yet. 😀
that's odd because i've had a really good look at my ipod touch and can't find the gsm phone or the camera. and my ipod touch has more RAM. and the iphone processor is faster. the iphone is certainly bigger, which suggests that there's something in there.
you mean they're compatible which is different.
look at it this way. the people who bought an iphone paid extra. why shouldn't they get more apps?
people who buy OS X server get stuff that's not in regular OS X. that's not because OS X Server won't run on a non-server mac. something like wikiserver on a macbook for local wiki's would be cool and, by your logic they could give it to me for free because it already exists.
but i don't expect it because OS X and OS X server are DIFFERENT PRODUCTS in the same way that the iPhone and the iPod Touch are different products.
apple bundle stuff up and flog it to us. we make the choice on whether to buy it or not and, where there are different versions, we choose which one we buy by weighing up what it offers and what it costs.
but you don't get to buy the product and then moan about the fact it doesn't do something it never claimed to do.
it uses both to improve accuracy.
still, in the arse end of no-where you'll still get +/- 5 miles because there won't be enough registered hotspots or masts.
free?
have you seen the price of an iPhone and subscription plan? in the UK it comes to about £800 ($1600) over a couple of years.
the increased functionality is anything but free.
i agree with your disappointment but that's no argument - it's not a subscription because there is no commitment.
i know plenty of people who have an ipod but have never spent a penny on iTunes.
No. There were not any major features added to 10.3.x or 10.4.x, nor will there be to 10.5.x. Just bugfixes and minor tweaks. Any feature that materially adds to the value of the product will be in the next (e.g. 10.6) release, which you will *pay* for, and then get bugfixes for 'free' until the next major release, and so on.
This is not Apple being mean. This is a result of the Sarbanes-Oxley (SOX) accounting laws.
SilentLoner
macrumors 65816
It riles me that people bought the ipod touch without these features, so they can buy the updates if they want but still they got a ipod touch that is exactly the same as when they first bought it. The iphone is a completely different kettle of fish as it on a subscription based service.
You mean, that they've become a profitable, innovative, growing-market-share company? Yes. It's sad when success happens. 🙄
What, exactly, were they before they were 'greedy ****s'? You really prefer the Apple, Inc. that made Performas, System 7.x, incompatible everything, "Sorry, a system error has occurred <bomb>", "Error Type 11", and had ~ 1% marketshare, if that?