Top Stories: Magic Keyboard With Touch ID, New MacBook Pro and Apple Watches Incoming, and More

[hagar]

All these billboards that were assuring have now become insulting and offensive.

Why? Have you read the technical paper on how Apple achieved the elimination of CSAM content on their servers while still being a privacy oriented company? What they have achieved here is quite advanced, much more than what the competition is doing.

Seems like most people don’t understand what Apple did here. maybe they should have kept quiet about it as people read what they want to read.

 

[arn]

Even if you aren't logged into iCloud, Apple is still going to be able to scan your photos although no alarms will be triggered, according to Apple. With iOS 15, scanning is done on the device and Apple is alerted when a bad photo is uploaded to the iCloud account.

I realize this is perhaps a distinction without a difference - but where do they say they scan even if not connected to iCloud?

 

[TheYayAreaLiving 🎗️]

Even if you aren't logged into iCloud, Apple is still going to be able to scan your photos although no alarms will be triggered, according to Apple. With iOS 15, scanning is done on the device and Apple is alerted when a bad photo is uploaded to the iCloud account.

If you currently have iCloud backups of your phone in iCloud, Apple has access to that as well. Ideally, you should go ahead and turn off iCloud now and backup your phone to your Mac using an app like iMazing. Remove any backups you have in iCloud. If you want to store phone backups in the Cloud, create the backup with iMazing and then encrypt the backup using Cryptomator, and then you can upload to iCloud for safe storage, as Apple won't be able to gain access to that backup.

Thank you for the info! However, Apple can only scan if you use active iCloud account.

Good lord, this sounds like a lot of work and hassle. Can’t believe I have to go through this. Sounds like I’m requesting a day off from work to do all this.

 

[Apple_Robert]

I realize this is perhaps a distinction without a difference - but where do they say they scan even if not connected to iCloud?

"CSAM image scanning is not an optional feature and it happens automatically, but Apple has confirmed to MacRumors that it cannot detect known CSAM images if the ‌iCloud Photos‌ feature is turned off."

Apple Confirms Detection of Child Sexual Abuse Material is Disabled When iCloud Photos is Turned Off

Apple today announced that iOS 15 and iPadOS 15 will see the introduction of a new method for detecting child sexual abuse material (CSAM) on iPhones...

www.macrumors.com

Unless I have misunderstood what I read in that article, (which may be the case) scanning on device is automatically done whether iCloud is on or off. With iCloud off, there is no hash alert being trigged on Apple's side, since the photo isn't being uploaded to iCloud.

 

[Apple_Robert]

Thank you for the info! However, Apple can only scan if you use active iCloud account.

Good lord, this sounds like a lot of work and hassle. Can’t believe I have to go through this. Sounds like I’m requesting a day off from work to do all this.

What most people don't realize is that when a backup is done in the iCloud, Apple automatically attaches a decryption key to the backup. That is how they are able to unlock information for law enforcement. Using the manner I mentioned take a few more steps but, it secure against Apple and anyone else who might get access to your account.

 

[TheYayAreaLiving 🎗️]

"CSAM image scanning is not an optional feature and it happens automatically, but Apple has confirmed to MacRumors that it cannot detect known CSAM images if the ‌iCloud Photos‌ feature is turned off."

Apple Confirms Detection of Child Sexual Abuse Material is Disabled When iCloud Photos is Turned Off

Apple today announced that iOS 15 and iPadOS 15 will see the introduction of a new method for detecting child sexual abuse material (CSAM) on iPhones...

www.macrumors.com

Unless I have misunderstood what I read in that article, (which may be the case) scanning on device is automatically done whether iCloud is on or off. With iCloud off, there is no hash alert being trigged on Apple's side, since the photo isn't being uploaded to iCloud.

Another question: What if I create a new fake iCloud account that can be use daily with fake information I guess.

LOL? OMG, I’m thinking like a criminal now.

 

[Momof2.1107]

Dear MacRumors: Can we move this under the top #1 story, please?

Apple Reveals New Child Safety Features, Including Scanning Photos for Known Sexual Abuse Material

Apple dropped the bomb on us this week. It’s a joke. I really hope Apple reverses it’s decision.

Bottomline: Do not upgrade to iOS 15. Say good bye to privacy and your personal data.

View attachment 1815936

I just might stay on iOS 14.1. There’s nothing compelling on 14.7 or the iOS 15 beta that make me want to upgrade my software. Plus in the jailbreak community, someone is going to make tweaks to mimic some of the newer features.

 

[Apple_Robert]

Another question: What if I create a new fake iCloud account that can be use daily with fake information I guess.

LOL? OMG, I’m thinking like a criminal now.

What you could do, is get a second-hand used phone and use that for taking pictures. Don't log into your Apple ID on said phone. No tracking or scanning then, as far as I am aware. You could then AirDrop any pictures you wanted to save from that second phone to an external drive for safe keeping and or upload the photos to an encrypted Cryptomator folder in the cloud for safe keeping from Apple.

If you buy another phone new from Apple (online) using your Apple ID, the new phone can be tracked to you even if you don't log into your Apple ID. If you want to buy a new phone now for this purpose, buy it new and pay cash for it from someone else that doesn't require Apple ID for purchase like the Apple Site.

The process I mentioned earlier is not hard at all and only takes a few minutes to do once set up. Cryptomator is a free program.

Cryptomator - Free & Open-Source Cloud Storage Encryption

Cryptomator is an open-source encryption tool for secure cloud storage. Protect your privacy for free on Dropbox, Google Drive, OneDrive, and more.

cryptomator.org

If you get a new Mac or update to Monterey, you will run into the same kind of Apple problem.

 

[Jamers99]

Slows news day so let's just recylcle the old rumors from 2 months ago and pretend it's real news.

 

[arn]

"CSAM image scanning is not an optional feature and it happens automatically, but Apple has confirmed to MacRumors that it cannot detect known CSAM images if the ‌iCloud Photos‌ feature is turned off."

Apple Confirms Detection of Child Sexual Abuse Material is Disabled When iCloud Photos is Turned Off

Apple today announced that iOS 15 and iPadOS 15 will see the introduction of a new method for detecting child sexual abuse material (CSAM) on iPhones...

www.macrumors.com

Unless I have misunderstood what I read in that article, (which may be the case) scanning on device is automatically done whether iCloud is on or off. With iCloud off, there is no hash alert being trigged on Apple's side, since the photo isn't being uploaded to iCloud.

That wasn’t the intention of the article

Just Apple said that if you turn off iCloud Photo Library, then it won’t happen and there is no specific “off” setting just for the CSAM thing. Basically iCloud or not is the choice, and if iCloud Photo Library is off, it won’t happen.

 

[antiprotest]

Why? Have you read the technical paper on how Apple achieved the elimination of CSAM content on their servers while still being a privacy oriented company? What they have achieved here is quite advanced, much more than what the competition is doing.

Seems like most people don’t understand what Apple did here. maybe they should have kept quiet about it as people read what they want to read.

I am happy that you know so much more than Edward Snowden, the EFF, and many security researchers. The rest of us either understand exactly what is going on and are still dissatisfied, or need much more assurance.

 

[briko]

Can you please try and understand the difference of (searchable) cloud storage and a fully encrypted device without a backdoor? They provided all data that is available to them which is iCloud. They did not magically find a way to decrypt a device and they did not implement a backdoor into the whole thing because backdoors get exploited all the time. This is the same reason why Apple AirPort routers have been among the most secure - they are proprietary in the good way.

I understand the difference quite well, and I am aware that they provided iCloud backups. My post was short and I didn’t feel like diving into all the details, so I don’t fault you for assuming otherwise. No hard feelings

You may recall, the FBI still wanted Apple to unlock Syed Farook’s iPhone because they argued that pertinent data existed on the iPhone that was not included in the iCloud backups that were provided. They even wanted to strong-arm Apple into developing a method (back door) to get into the phone. Apple resisted being compelled to develop this back door, because regardless of the good it would do for this case, there were too many risks for abuse down the line. (I agree with this stance by the way)

All I’m trying to say is, I think it’s odd that Apple fought so hard to resist developing software to opening a known terrorist’s device, yet they have no qualms developing software for mass-surveillance on average citizens whom should be presumed innocent of this heinous crime.

And if Apple was concerned about such systems being abused before, then why is that concern no longer valid today?

I remember the prevailing sentiment was: any backdoor is a bad backdoor, because even if we promised to only use it for terrorists, we can’t guarantee it won’t be abused later. Shouldn’t we be able to say the same thing here as well? Any unwarranted surveillance is bad surveillance, because even if we promise to only use it for CSAM now, we can’t guarantee it won’t be abused later.

 

[Shadow Demon]

I have never seen so many people in one place who believe they are John Connor and Apple is the new SkyNet. To each their own. As for me, I trust Apple, I will be using iCloud, and will be upgrading to iOS 15. Guess what, Apple knows my physical address and has my credit card info. Of course, I have always kept the most vital and important documents encrypted when in the cloud; however, photos are not and will never be in that category.

 

[briko]

I have never seen so many people in one place who believe they are John Connor and Apple is the new SkyNet. To each their own. As for me, I trust Apple, I will be using iCloud, and will be upgrading to iOS 15. Guess what, Apple knows my physical address and has my credit card info. Of course, I have always kept the most vital and important documents encrypted when in the cloud; however, photos are not and will never be in that category.

This honestly won’t affect you or me, and that’s just great for us.

But I’m not about to brag to all the LGBT people living is Saudi Arabia, or to other groups facing religious persecution about how little this is going to affect me.

And as far as trust goes? I trust Apple to do in the future exactly what Apple has done in the past.

When China told Apple to send over the iCloud encryption keys, they complied. Can you really blame people for voicing concerns about this?

 

[person s]

If Apple had Google's gumption, they would've given the finger to the CCP long ago. Just wait for the new iPhone to don the privacy mantle as if iOS 15 never happened. The hypocrisy just reeks.

‘give the finger’ and continue to operate in the country?
that doesn’t happen anywhere

 

[arn]

I have never seen so many people in one place who believe they are John Connor and Apple is the new SkyNet. To each their own. As for me, I trust Apple, I will be using iCloud, and will be upgrading to iOS 15. Guess what, Apple knows my physical address and has my credit card info. Of course, I have always kept the most vital and important documents encrypted when in the cloud; however, photos are not and will never be in that category.

I think where much of the criticism comes is it seems directly contradictory to Apple's stance in the past.

Customer Letter - Apple

A Message to Our Customers

www.apple.com

Specifically, the FBI wants us to make a new version of the iPhone operating system, circumventing several important security features, and install it on an iPhone recovered during the investigation. In the wrong hands, this software — which does not exist today — would have the potential to unlock any iPhone in someone’s physical possession.

Some would argue that building a backdoor for just one iPhone is a simple, clean-cut solution. But it ignores both the basics of digital security and the significance of what the government is demanding in this case.

The government suggests this tool could only be used once, on one phone. But that’s simply not true. Once created, the technique could be used over and over again, on any number of devices. In the physical world, it would be the equivalent of a master key, capable of opening hundreds of millions of locks — from restaurants and banks to stores and homes. No reasonable person would find that acceptable.

"This tool is only used for CSAM" is the current claim, but once it exists, it could be used for other things. If it didn't exist, it couldn't be.

 

[Shadow Demon]

This honestly won’t affect you or me, and that’s just great for us.

But I’m not about to brag to all the LGBT people living is Saudi Arabia, or to other groups facing religious persecution about how little this is going to affect me.

And as far as trust goes? I trust Apple to do in the future exactly what Apple has done in the past.

When China told Apple to send over the iCloud encryption keys, they complied. Can you really blame people for voicing concerns about this?

I get what you are saying. My trust in Apple is based on my personal relationship with the company not on a judgement of their relationship with the rest of the world. It might work out for them but that is neither my concern or worry. It is definitely not going to be the basis of my ongoing financial relationship with Apple.

 

[Shadow Demon]

I think where much of the criticism comes is it seems directly contradictory to Apple's stance in the past.

Is it really? The FBI being able to unlock my devices vs a hash scan of my photos. Here is how I see it. For example, I rent a storage locker that contains my possessions. It is locked and secured. There is known illegal drugs in the area. A drug sniffing dog passes my storage locker “scanning“ my possession. The dog finds nothing but if he did there would be probabe cause to open the locker that is not my property. This is all about protecting Apple’s property of iCloud servers the rest is marketing spin.

 

[arn]

Is it really? The FBI being able to unlock my devices vs a hash scan of my photos. Here is how I see it. For example, I rent a storage locker that contains my possessions. It is locked and secured. There is known illegal drugs in the area. A drug sniffing dog passes my storage locker “scanning“ my possession. The dog finds nothing but if he did there would be probabe cause to open the locker that is not my property. This is all about protecting Apple’s property of iCloud servers the rest is marketing spin.

Yeah, it's not a perfect example, but you are also viewing it from the eyes of the FBI.

What about another government agency that isn't the U.S.? Would you not mind if Apple cooperated with other countries who could offer their own database of hashes for Apple to report to them if any of their citizens has specific images?

 

[briko]

Is it really? The FBI being able to unlock my devices vs a hash scan of my photos. Here is how I see it. For example, I rent a storage locker that contains my possessions. It is locked and secured. There is known illegal drugs in the area. A drug sniffing dog passes my storage locker “scanning“ my possession. The dog finds nothing but if he did there would be probabe cause to open the locker that is not my property. This is all about protecting Apple’s property of iCloud servers the rest is marketing spin.

Your analogy is incomplete. The dog wouldn’t just be sniffing the locker is one area. It would be sniffing all lockers in the country, regardless of vicinity to an illegal substance. And the sniffing doesn’t happen once, it happens continuously every day. And on top of that, you aren’t factoring into the possibility for abuse of the system.

 

[nvmls]

The top story of the week is the Magic Keyboard with Touch ID? What a joke of a site.

Thats because its finally backlit.. oh wait..

 

[briko]

I get what you are saying. My trust in Apple is based on my personal relationship with the company not on a judgement of their relationship with the rest of the world. It might work out for them but that is neither my concern or worry. It is definitely not going to be the basis of my ongoing financial relationship with Apple.

I don’t want to miss interpret your post, so please help me understand if this is what you’re saying.

So basically, you don’t mind what Apple does as long as it doesn’t negatively affect you? Even if there are devastating, or deadly, consequences for people in other countries?

I’m not trying to put words in your mouth. Just honestly trying to understand what your point of view is.

 

[Shadow Demon]

Yeah, it's not a perfect example, but you are also viewing it from the eyes of the FBI.

What about another government agency that isn't the U.S.? Would you not mind if Apple cooperated with other countries who could offer their own database of hashes for Apple to report to them if any of their citizens has specific images?

At this time, there is no proof that such a thing would happen. However, each country has their own laws for good or evil. Every company that sells their products within another country has to decide. I consider myself a neutral party in which in my personal case their decision one way or another would not be a determining factor.

 

[arn]

At this time, there is no proof that such a thing would happen.

Yes, you are right... but that's not the heart of the argument. The argument that Tim Cook / Apple presented when writing that open letter about the FBI backdoor is... if the backdoor tool exists, it can be used and abused. If the tool doesn't exist, then it can't be used or abused.

There's a large gap between asking Apple to write you a tool that doesn't exist, vs asking Apple to use a fully developed and deployed tool.

In this case, the tool now exists.

(Edit: to be clear, it's not that I'm arguing this point, necessarily. I'm just pointing out it seems to contradict Apple's previous stance. And maybe you would have sided with the FBI — why not open write a tool to unlock the terrorist’s phone? He’s a terrorist, after all. But, regardless if I agree with you or not, at least you’d be consistent in your stance. Apple is not being consistent.)

 

[Shadow Demon]

I don’t want to miss interpret your post, so please help me understand if this is what you’re saying.

So basically, you don’t mind what Apple does as long as it doesn’t negatively affect you? Even if there are devastating, or deadly, consequences for people in other countries?

I would hope that it works out for the best for everyone. However, I refuse to worry about the possibility or use it as basis of support for Apple. As long as the United States remains a constitutional republic, there will be no negative effacts from Apple to me. If not, I have more to worry about than Apple.