Trump Suggests Tariffs Could Be Placed on iPhones and Laptops Imported From China

[fairuz]

Wrong again. Most high school kids are not taking calculus or art history. I sense a Marie Antoinette syndrome here. Skilled manufacturing are not unwanted jobs, but needed jobs as it brings in ancillary industries as well. You are confusing service jobs that pay little and attract migrant workers for skilled and semi-skilled jobs that pay a considerably higher wage.

Migrant workers can do the semi-skilled jobs just fine. Actually better. The way it is now, the migrants would dominate those manufacturing jobs if it weren't for barriers to entry like labor unions, language differences, and ofc the difficulty of immigration.

Schools suck because they're behind the times and teach at a slow pace. For example, the whole math curriculum is set up around calculus, as if it's the 1960s, instead of more practically useful things like probability, statistics, and computer science. It's still heavily weighted towards humanities. They think they can go into the future with blind integration of tech like iPads when the top private schools do best with pencil and paper. And the kids have no respect or sense of responsibility for whatever reason, which seems to be less of a problem the poorer the country is.

 

[mozumder]

Wrong again. Most high school kids are not taking calculus or art history. I sense a Marie Antoinette syndrome here. Skilled manufacturing are not unwanted jobs, but needed jobs as it brings in ancillary industries as well. You are confusing service jobs that pay little and attract migrant workers for skilled and semi-skilled jobs that pay a considerably higher wage.

Assembling iPhones and iPads would be similar to a skilled electrician's apprentice. The problem is that Apple's and other companies profits would be much lower if they had to hire Americans. They are taking advantage of currency and cost of living differences of developing countries like China.

Assembling iPhones is a zero-skill job. It's exactly the kind of job a third-worlder would do.

In the US, high school kids start with algebra, and go up from there.

How much algebra does a strawberry picker or motel cleaner need?

How many Americans do you know want to pick strawberries or clean motel rooms, at any price?

 

[Alaxlmartin]

Apple would eat the loss you say......

You think so huh

Like Tim will swallow 0.01
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Assembling iPhones is a zero-skill job. It's exactly the kind of job a third-worlder would do.

In the US, high school kids start with algebra, and go up from there.

How much algebra does a strawberry picker or motel cleaner need?

They could just move or send the parts to Asia or Canada to avoid the 10%

 

[sentiblue]

You still haven't answered my question. On whose behalf are you speaking?

Allow me to address your replies in items

Unskilled immigrants are supposed to perform these tasks.

Sure, I have no problems with unskilled immigrants doing these jobs. What about unskilled Americans? You can't force them to go to college and graduate with a highly skilled degree. But even if they had higher education, there's no guarantee they will have jobs. Talk to me when you can guarantee 100% Americans are highly educated. In the 2017 report, there's roughly 60% Americans less educated than a BA/BS program.
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Educational_attainment_in_the_United_States

The problem is we spend thousands of dollars in k-12 public education training each citizen in things like calculus and art history and geopolitics - things they don't get in third-world countries - and you expect them to perform oxen jobs?

These K-12 qualities such as calculus, art, history, geopolitics do not guarantee jobs. Proof? If you only have a high school diploma, you will flip burgers for a living. And btw, you're very wrong about the part "things they don't get in 3rd world countries". In lots of 3rd world countries trigonometry is taught in 9th grade, 3d geometry in 10th, calculus in 11th and advanced calculus as well as organic chemistry in 12th. In US, only AP (advanced placement) students learn calculus in high school.

Not only that, but Americans don't even WANT those unskilled jobs. It's impossible to hire people to work these unskilled jobs, at ANY price, because Americans expect to perform higher skill work, because we trained them to expect that kind of work.

Again, you think you were authorized to speak on America's behalf. You're not. Your claim is not only too general, it's not backed by any proof or data.

 

[MacCurry]

Migrant workers can do the semi-skilled jobs just fine. Actually better. The way it is now, the migrants would dominate if it weren't for barriers to entry like labor unions, language differences, and ofc the difficulty of immigration.

Schools suck because they're behind the times. For example, the whole math curriculum is set up around calculus instead of more practically useful things like probability, statistics, and computer science. And the kids have no respect or sense of responsibility for whatever reason, which seems to be less of a problem the poorer the country is.

You said it best - language barrier. Those who learn the language do get into skilled labor. Most public schools have removed the vocational education option in high school. Some states offer it on another vo-tech campus, but then those kids won't get the rest of their classes on a time basis.

 

[mozumder]

Again, you think you were authorized to speak on America's behalf. You're not. Your claim is not only too general, it's not backed by any proof or data.

I guess you haven't seen any articles on companies not being able to hire American workers, at any price?

Allow me to allow you to catch up on the discussion by letting you do your own research.

 

[Greenmeenie]

Migrant workers can do the semi-skilled jobs just fine. Actually better. The way it is now, the migrants would dominate those manufacturing jobs if it weren't for barriers to entry like labor unions, language differences, and ofc the difficulty of immigration.

Schools suck because they're behind the times and teach at a slow pace. For example, the whole math curriculum is set up around calculus, as if it's the 1960s, instead of more practically useful things like probability, statistics, and computer science. It's still heavily weighted towards humanities. They think they can go into the future with blind integration of tech like iPads when the top private schools do best with pencil and paper. And the kids have no respect or sense of responsibility for whatever reason, which seems to be less of a problem the poorer the country is.

Some American States have actually forced Creationism to be added to their school textbooks. Yikes. Not a good sign. Lol.

 

[Alaxlmartin]

Assembling iPhones is a zero-skill job. It's exactly the kind of job a third-worlder would do.

In the US, high school kids start with algebra, and go up from there.

How much algebra does a strawberry picker or motel cleaner need?

How many Americans do you know want to pick strawberries or clean motel rooms, at any price?

With the ZERO skill being used lately, maybe Foxconn needs to increase their wages

 

[fairuz]

Some American States have actually forced Creationism to be added to their school textbooks. Yikes. Not a good sign. Lol.

Eh, we learn about lots of religions with different explanations on how the world was created. Doesn't hurt as long as they're still learning evolution. These anti-science groups get a footing if it looks like they're being deliberately silenced.

 

[jeremiah256]

Assembling iPhones and iPads would be similar to a skilled electrician's apprentice.

I'm pretty sure this is incorrect.

The vast majority of the assembly of the iPhone is repetitive labor. Closer to working in the fields during harvest or at a meat packing plant than what a skilled electrician's apprentice would do. It's relatively unskilled labor. And then there's the difference in the labor pool. There are few individual cities in the U.S. that would be able to come close to providing the vast amounts of laborers willing to work for unskilled wages that China can (200K plus at one plant). And even with that said, Foxconn is building robots as fast as they can to take over these tasks from humans because even Chinese unskilled labor is becoming costly.

 

[fairuz]

Sure, I have no problems with unskilled immigrants doing these jobs. What about unskilled Americans? You can't force them to go to college and graduate with a highly skilled degree. But even if they had higher education, there's no guarantee they will have jobs. Talk to me when you can guarantee 100% Americans are highly educated. In the 2017 report, there's roughly 60% Americans less educated than a BA/BS program.
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Educational_attainment_in_the_United_States

You can't force them, but you can give them a better chance in primary education. American colleges are the best in the world. Schools before that, not so great.

You can also give them a better incentive to try. This is the best country to work in any tech-related field (I don't mean just computers) and many others, so people who live here and have the advantages of being native should really get the top spots. So... actually to some degree you can force them if you start taking away entitlements.

 

[sentiblue]

I guess you haven't seen any articles on companies not being able to hire American workers, at any price?

Allow me to allow you to catch up on the discussion by letting you do your own research.

And what articles would those be? I'm an excellent research... but I'd like to ask you to provide one article to support your claim.

 

[MacCurry]

Assembling iPhones is a zero-skill job. It's exactly the kind of job a third-worlder would do.

In the US, high school kids start with algebra, and go up from there.

How much algebra does a strawberry picker or motel cleaner need?

How many Americans do you know want to pick strawberries or clean motel rooms, at any price?

Assembling an iPhone and picking strawberries or cleaning hotel rooms are not the same. Sorry, let's agree to disagree on that. It's not a 3rd world job. If iPhone manufacturing comes to the US, then Apple will move toward much more automation and robotic assembly. The number of people employed in the US will be much less than China, but those who are employed will be paid more than strawberry picker. They will be paid equivalent to a skilled electrician's apprentice. Over $20/hour. On top of that local suppliers to the factory will pop up as well.

Only 10-15% of US high school kids take calculus. Algebra is what they start with and most end with it and maybe some trig and analytic geometry.

 

[0924487]

Trump's steel tariffs is why GM just laid off everyone.

Congratulations Trump voters, you played yourself.

The US economy is a globalist one that seeks open borders and free trade. The quicker you understand that, the better off you will be in this country.

Apple is doing exactly that by designing products by brilliant engineers in Silicon Valley, while having them built by cheaper, lower educated people in China.

If a person in China can build something for cheaper than in America, LET THEM - that is economic efficiency. An efficient economy will always win over an corrupt, inefficient one. Americans should only do jobs that only Americans can do, like high-end services jobs. Our economy is based on massive higher-education - the best in the world. No other country has a university system like ours, and we should take advantage of that.

We don't want Americans to perform manual labor that oxen can do. We only want engineers and scientists and artist - people that can create value with their minds.

New York, Silicon Valley and Hollywood are good examples of the kind of economy the US should be going forward.

A good example of complete economic failure is Russia - their economy is entirely based on selling things they find on the ground. When was the last time anyone bought something designed/made in Russia?

The thing is 50% of all Americans have double digit IQs. If you have an IQ of less than 115, there is nothing is the world you can do to help them get into a University and actually graduate with a bachelors degree in ANY major. The ones you mentioned are high-end STEM degrees, which have an average graduate IQ of around 130 or better. That's only 2.1% of American population and most of them are East Asians.

13% of Americans have an IQ of 82 or less. That's 13 people out of every 100 Americans. What's so special about IQ of 82 you ask. Well, that's the legal cutoff line for American Military recruit. It is illegal for anyone under any condition to accept a new recruit into the American Military for any position or training with an IQ of 82 or less. What does that mean? That means 13 out of every 100 Americans cannot generate any productivity under any amount of training by the most well-funded institution in America. Why would you think the profit driven market would hire them to be of any use? This is just the military cutoff. In reality, the line is drawn around about 87 for the lowest end jobs in America like cleaning toilets or flipping burgers. 21 out of every 100 Americans have an IQ of 87 or less. That's 21% of the population totally useless for the economy under any amount of training effort.

You expect everyone will have the cognitive capacity to excel?

Well, now you know, and this is just the prerequisite for the potential of doing anything complex in life. Having this condition met is just the beginning.

 

[mozumder]

Assembling an iPhone and picking strawberries or cleaning hotel rooms are not the same. Sorry, let's agree to disagree on that. It's not a 3rd world job. If iPhone manufacturing comes to the US, then Apple will move toward much more automation and robotic assembly. The number of people employed in the US will be much less than China, but those who are employed will be paid more than strawberry picker. They will be paid equivalent to a skilled electrician's apprentice. Over $20/hour. On top of that local suppliers to the factory will pop up as well.

Only 10-15% of US high school kids take calculus. Algebra is what they start with and most end with it and maybe some trig and analytic geometry.

So if a person is trained in algebra, why would they work assembling iphones (which doesn't need any math or any skills except following instructions) or pick strawberries or clean motels?

 

[Solomani]

Don’t like seeing him pick and choose different products. Make it 20 percent for all products built in China.

I'll call your 20, and raise you 35 percent!

 

[mozumder]

And what articles would those be? I'm an excellent research... but I'd like to ask you to provide one article to support your claim.

You could literally google the exact sentence i wrote to find the answer.

 

[imageWIS]

The sad part most of Trump voters still support him despite all the contrary facts. They will shout fake news, etc.
Waste of time deliberating with these folks. They do not want to see the truth.

Hillary despite the lousy sound bite, she was so right about calling them deplorable. Hit the nail on the head.

This is why I have stopped trying to engage them, it's a waste of time.

 

[fairuz]

Assembling an iPhone and picking strawberries or cleaning hotel rooms are not the same. Sorry, let's agree to disagree on that. It's not a 3rd world job.

How is assembling iPhones not a third-world job? The third world is where all iPhones are made right now.

 

[imageWIS]

And alienate half of his customer base?

Lol at least now we know why you don’t run Apple.

Half of the country isn't Republican... it's less than half.

 

[BaltimoreMediaBlog]

America supports open borders and has always supported open borders. I'm sure you already know that America had an open borders policy for its first hundred-fifty years.

And remember, steel tariffs increase costs of cars, which reduces their sales.

Let's all be thankful of the booming economy that the great President Obama put into place. Let's make sure Trump doesn't cause it to crash, like Republicans typically do.

Yeah, I remember the Obama malaise. I was unemployed for most of the time. He had 8 years to fix the economy and couldn't. The world loved him because he helped Europe at the expense of Americans. He put more African Americans on welfare & unemployment than any President in U.S. history. And as soon as he's out of office, he's credited with something he had nothing to do with. Yeah right. That's believable that it's Obama's economy. Not by any real economist.

Trump was elected because of The Wall and because Americans didn't want Open Borders. You might not like that, but it's still true.

That's what separated Trump from the other Republicans and Democrats. Wall Street wants Open Borders as do both political parties. Trump did not and that's why he won.

 

[MacCurry]

So if a person is trained in algebra, why would they work assembling iphones (which doesn't need any math or any skills except following instructions) or pick strawberries or clean motels?

Again, you're using the false analogy of assembling iPhones to picking strawberries.

 

[imageWIS]

That statement by her was unpresidential - she lost the mid-West just because of that one line. Enough to lose the Electoral College.
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Proof that the Electoral College is utterly antiquated.

 

[MacCurry]

Half of the country isn't Republican... it's less than half.

Take California out and the rest of the US is more than half Republican. The difference is becoming clear - urban centers and rural areas are at a demographic divide.

 

[fairuz]

The sad part most of Trump voters still support him despite all the contrary facts. They will shout fake news, etc.
Waste of time deliberating with these folks. They do not want to see the truth.

Hillary despite the lousy sound bite, she was so right about calling them deplorable. Hit the nail on the head.

Cause they assume all politicians are lying anyway, so it doesn't matter a great deal to them whether they do it secretly or blatantly.

And to actually call news false is kinda dumb, but idk if they really think that. Might just be that many big newspapers are obviously following some party's agenda. Look at how any of them try to paint a presidential candidate before and after he/she's won the primary, and that draws the line between personal biases in the writers and deliberate political control. For example, Fox hated Trump until he was the Republicans' only choice. MSNBC does the same crap. I think they were good at hiding it until Trump with his unusual nature came in.

I only dislike Trump cause he's a jerk and makes bad decisions that are hurting everyone right now. Obviously like half the people disagree, and they still make him win if you call them names.