And this is Why I want to see Apple go down - Commissar Cook wants to run Apple and use his powers as dictator to control what people can and can't do - Apple, according to this definition is the company of Communist culture. Cook wants power and control - RESIST !
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U.S. Antitrust Legislation Would Require Users to Be Able to Delete All Pre-Installed Apple Apps [Updated]
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Apple has worked consistently to make setting up an iPhone faster and easier. This should move in the exact opposite way. For this to have a meaningful impact, not just be ”a statement” every time a user get a new phone (even a replacement for broken phone), he or she would be required to chose every app on the system from a randomized list. That would take a great deal of time. Who do you think this benefits? If every app had to show the app’s name and the creator company, as well as the cost and if there were requirements for in-app purchases) and if there are advertisements, do you think that most iOS users would just pick the Apple versions?
Who does all this extra time benefit?
If Apple moved 180 degrees from making the setup process easier and faster to making it slower and harder, I would certainly complain.
No, it is not. There cannot be a default, otherwise there is even less purpose to this farce. To be fair, the choices have to be randomized and all the data about the options need to be provided. If you agree that most people will still pick the Apple choice on an iPhone, what benefit does it serve to waste all that time for all those users rather than let those users who want other choices to just get them from the App Store?
There is not a giant mass of users clamoring for this. The market is moving in the other direction, that is why iOS is gaining share in this country. This is a small number of large companies who want to improve their lives.
Just to be clear, are you an iOS user? How many of the apps that Apple ships would you personally replace with an alternative? Would you want to have to go through every single app and have to install them all to be able to use your brand new phone? You understand the problem for people who do not have unlimited data, or have slow internet connections? This will be a real problem for them.
The issue here is that the small amount of savings for the small number of people who want to not have the Apple apps on their iOS devices is dwarfed by the huge loss for those who want things as they are. There are several options for people who do not like this ecosystem. Why ruin it for everyone else to reward a few giant companies?
Shaking my head even more.
You do not like it, do not buy the product. Very simple. No one is forced to purchase iPhones or other Apple devices.
I get that attitude of not needing to be protected, and I share a lot of it. Likewise, I don’t need government protecting me from pre-installed apps or store branded products. I like both of those.
@jimothyGator
I came to learn that the state/gov is one those things that one does need until the thing hits the fan. Even the most rich. Even companies. Even the stock market.
People that are born with one that works, don’t really know one that does not work. Neither understand how hard, really hard it is to create one like the ones they were born in to. Took centuries, not 3 or 4 of decades, millennia , much less half a decade as some companies do.
I find it really weird that young people admire much more some guy that manipulates fundamental rights to his own gain, because it has a sizable wallet, than a org for which some of the family tree died for, fought for, starved for. Young people should ask themselves … “why they did it?” “What was happening before they did it?”
Too many commercials rewriting history and very little education. Nothing is perfect … but it can always get worst.
Now look. It looks like I do not appreciate TC. I do. If I had his brains and a community of followers like this would be doing just the same. It is not his job to preside an Anti Trust committee … it’s someone else job. He does his, they do theirs.
I am a true believer that if everyone does their job to the best of their ability things more or less balance out to the best outcome. The truth prevails … most of the times.
I came to learn that the state/gov is one those things that one does need until the thing hits the fan. Even the most rich. Even companies. Even the stock market.
People that are born with one that works, don’t really know one that does not work. Neither understand how hard, really hard it is to create one like the ones they were born in to. Took centuries, not 3 or 4 of decades, millennia , much less half a decade as some companies do.
I find it really weird that young people admire much more some guy that manipulates fundamental rights to his own gain, because it has a sizable wallet, than a org for which some of the family tree died for, fought for, starved for. Young people should ask themselves … “why they did it?” “What was happening before they did it?”
Too many commercials rewriting history and very little education. Nothing is perfect … but it can always get worst.
Now look. It looks like I do not appreciate TC. I do. If I had his brains and a community of followers like this would be doing just the same. It is not his job to preside an Anti Trust committee … it’s someone else job. He does his, they do theirs.
I am a true believer that if everyone does their job to the best of their ability things more or less balance out to the best outcome. The truth prevails … most of the times.
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When Microsoft did things in their OS to deliberately inhibit Netscape I considered that unfair competition. If all Microsoft had done was make Explorer I don’t think that would have been anti-competitive. There’s a fuzzy area where security and apps overlap that Apple may have an advantage because they know how the OS works and maybe the better way to do something under a given situation. But as long as there isn’t an intentional “Do this to break competitors or inhibit a competitors app” type of action I don’t consider what Apple is doing illegal.
:Edit removed a redundant couple of sentences.
:Edit removed a redundant couple of sentences.
The updates? I just install them OTA through settings. I don’t think I’m doing anything special.
I may appreciate a government that's there to, say, defend against an invasion by an outside force, but it doesn't follow from that I need government dictating what can and cannot be installed on my phone.
My ancestors didn't fight and die so the House Judiciary Committee could impose such rules.
Does not work that way for me. Now I am talking primarily about development devices that have no passcode and no iCloud, but my wife as had the same problems. She keeps asking why she has to keep telling Apple she wants her devices to work the same way before and after updates.
That is very odd. I’ve never see behavior like that on my phone or my wife’s phone.
Two months ago. The basic lowest-tiered iPad 2020, delivered in a sealed box, set it up myself as new. I had to install Keynote, Pages, Numbers, and GarageBand.
I'm amazed at the short sighted statements in this thread based on a article with no facts. Many of you have taken that story and stretched it to: You'll get a phone with a blank screen, You'll get a phone with 20 choices for a calendar apps, It's like buying a car with no tires, seats, and steering wheel, etc. The absurdity is amazing.
2x iPhone 12 Pro, iPad Air 4, 2x MacBook Air M1. All set up as new, and all have the apps on them already. Every Apple device I have bought in the past, oh, 5 years has had them pre-installed.
You are both right.
They come pre-installed on devices with more than a certain amount of storage.
I don’t understand in what measure is the gov dictating what consumers (you) can and what cannot install on their (your) phones. It’s precisely the contrary. Its is trying to make sure that no organization too big for that can manipulate you by dictating what you an install or not, including the government itself. You see, when a small company can and does that, its not much of a problem, its a choice, but when a very large company can and does that, say one with 50% of market share, sooner or later it becomes a problem to the consumer as choice becomes dictated by a couple or a few. This happens over and over and over and over again when companies become increasingly large. Apple is just like any other company in this matter, no special treatment.
Focusing on Apple. TC says its all about protecting their customers privacy, security so on and so forth. Ok, in what way blocking two game streaming services, xCloud and Stadia, from 50% of smartphones had to do with any of this? What’s next? Newspapers? Netflix? Spotify? Demand every magazine, every newspaper to be an app while their, themselves reserve the privilege to offer aggregate services? You see, is not about blocking what (game streams, newspapers), but the total unscrutinized ability to do so by selling devices that enabled them to do so. You might think, oh TC would never do that, but what about the next CEO and next and next with Apple becoming larger and larger? What’s the baseline?
The other day the company introduced AirTags and Find my. A mass “thing” surveillance system. In order for someone without AirTags to be “fully” protected from its misuse one needs to either have an iPhone or and Apple app on an Android phone that detects the person is being tracked. In what way is this protecting people’s privacy but selling iPhones to protect people privacy over a situation the company created itself by bringing this device to market.
PS: By the way, Govs do much more such as bailing out too big to fail organizations. They also support production, farming, energy industry, provide multiple billion contracts to companies so on and so forth. They also deal with Pandemics, health crises, major natural disasters, quality of air, so on and so forth …
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Conflating data privacy and security and including a whatsboutism for good measure?
All while completely misstating the service or the device.
Unless he is somehow trying to tie Apple and AirTags to a stalker's maliciious intensive by dropping an AirTag in someone's bag. Apple did not "invent" that either - Tile, Samsung, others before and since. Apple also did not significantly increase or facilitate the threat as much as others. There are more Samsung phones than iPhones in the world (per market share numbers) so the odds of Samsung being the "bigger danger" here are high. And, no I don't expect every Samsung phone owner to buy Samsung tags, just as I don't expect every iPhone user will. Given no optics into phone :: tag ratios, we have to go with phone numnbers.
Its not Samsung CEO that using Privacy as one of the fundamentals of his marketing plot. Putting this aside you seam to be arguing that some bad tech justifies and vindicates another bad tech? That is a race to the bottom which I will not waste time arguing about.
I did not misstate the service. Just thought that restating what the service was built as been written ad nauseous … not so so much the side effects. This becomes relevant given the Privacy and Security bat being played every time App Store policies and others are put in question. Which basically exposes how much of it is being used as marketing to justify practices that may be considered anti competitive rather than actually simply limiting Privacy or Security issues. Don’t think the cure to Privacy and Security is within the choice of giving all data, choice, money and your property control to or through Apple or any other big tech. Which seams to be the Apple marketing enabled solution for its users, they call it protection, quite a convenient one should I say.
In my opinion, true Privacy and Security while keeping choice, can only come from regulation concerted and implemented with all interested parties, private and public organizations, including government elected by its citizens within a democratic framework. Not through voting by wallet, which in a democratic system is nothing but a conceptual aberration reminiscent of a totalitarian system construed by the self made silicon elites along with their success in the stock market.
I guess @I7guy does not know how Privacy and Security are intertwined concepts. I suggest a good read about the subject.
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Intertwined but not the same unless you’re claiming data security = data privacy. I’m standing by my original point.
Never argued that it was the same so I have no idea what you are arguing about. Maybe something to divert the discussion from the given point?
Another counter ?argument? racing to the bottom. At least I don’t try misreading other people’s arguments. Two tried to do this time around. Maybe because what they have read did not compute with the projected stance of Apple?
What is wrong being able to uninstall defaults apps and replace with others? What is wrong payed services, fermium or otherwise not to be installed by default? Since when buying an iPhone means wanting to buy into Apple TV+ or Apple Music? Judging by popular services metrics does not look like it does … it does look like a competition measure favoring their payed services as time goes buy. That was not the initial premisse that made iOS popular.
What does this have todo with either Security or Privacy usual mentioned by TC when these topics come by in interviews?
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What does what I quoted https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...lled-apple-apps-updated.2301181/post-30030054 have to do with the thread topic again? I guess when one doesn't have a good argument the ship trys to be steered in alternate longer directions?