U.S. Bills Allowing Sideloading Would Cause Consumers to Be Hit With 'Malware, Ransomware, and Scams,' Says Apple

[threesixty360]

And what about the free and open workd of macOS? Does macOS have relentless malware and ransomware attacks? It's not like you need to be a genius to see that it doesn't.... or maybe you do. ?‍♂️

And has been stated numerous times over and over and over again whenever the subject of sideloading and an alternative app store to Apple's comes up, if you don't feel comfortable using an app store not operated by Apple, you're free not to. You will not be forced to do so.

Do you understand what that means?

MacOS is not your personal emergency device is it?
The Mac has nowhere near as many users installed compared to iOS/iPhone.
And we have to deal with the existing architecture of macOS because its been there for 20 odd yrs now. So you live with the technical debt. iOS is a new and better way to secure personal computing devices to the extent that they can be used as an emergency device. Its designed in such a way to facilitate low maintenance operation and security by default. I want that choice to still exist. If I didnt care I'd just buy an Android machine and live with the "Swiss cheese" OS that no one bothers upgrading properly.

 

[ian87w]

I've been bored with my iPhone 13 PM so I bought a Flip 3. It's pretty awesome and I have had no issues. Apple spin is just laughable.

Actually, you did exactly what's proper. Don't like Apple, then buy a different phone. I use Android (S21) as my primary driver for a reason, iPhone doesn't offer all the features I need. That's proper response.

 

[FlyingDutch]

Apple can use their trillions to run sideloaded apps in a container like how Android runs inside a container on ChromeOS but it's obvious Apple don't plan to relinquish their excessive control and profit.

So your idea of secure environment is ChromeOS ? ?

 

[gnomeisland]

To this day you still cant run IOS apps on the Mac desktop in Monterey like APPLE promised Can you??

You can run Android Apps in Windows 11.

. . . I do. You do need an M1 or Apple Silicon Mac, but it works. Ironically it was developer uproar that changed the policy to opt-in instead of opt-out. In the early days of the M1 almost every iOS app could be installed.

 

[H2SO4]

I don't think requiring Apple to allow side loading and use of other purchase systems makes any sense.

Presumably, the 3rd party systems must also be required to permit side loading and other purchase systems too, and so on ad infinitum to uncontrolled market complexity. This amounts to an indirect and cumbersome way to address the underlying issue, which seems to be fair competition in the app market.

A simple, non exponential runaway approach might be to require that the App Store be run as a separate business, with the offerings of Apple developers and all other developers being treated equally and uniformly in all respects. This safeguards competition and also allows this App Store to use rationale, rigorous review for security, infringement etc.

This would require some refinement to work out, as some Apple software "apps" are hard to separate from the hardware + software total offering that is an Apple product.

You mean like on a Mac?

 

[HiVolt]

I resent how Apple always presents this as a binary argument. Either it's locked down and safe or opened up and dangerous.

It doesn't have to be wide open by default. Leave it as-is by default and give users the ability to dig down into the system settings and enable side-loading. They can even put up a big scary warning that enabling this feature opens their phone to all kinds of nefarious evils and oozing, dripping nastiness. Most people would be just as happy leaving it off and having a safe phone. For those few who want to fiddle with it, turn it on. This is literally the model used on the Mac. You can restrict it to only trusted sources or tell the OS to go for it. So far, the entire Mac OS landscape hasn't burned to the ground, and it's unlikely everyone is downloading and running untrusted apps.

I don't understand why it always has to be scare tactics and oversimplified arguments when it comes to side-loading apps.

It's to protect the revenue source, obviously. They didn't do it to Mac platform because it was always a computer anyone could do anything on. The iOS platform was closed from the beginning, so people that used it knew it, and knew that likely that would never change.

But cracks are appearing in Apple's iron grip on the iOS both in terms of payment and alternative software loading. Give it a bit more time.

 

[Xtir]

“…Allowing Sideloading Would Cause Consumers to Be Hit With 'Malware, Ransomware, and Scams,' Says Apple”​

On iOS I am hit with spam, fishing and scams.. on my mac not better or worse.. this bird does not fly..

 

[Stunning_Sense4712]

This has always confused me, how have the game consoles gotten away with it for so long?

You can bypass the games console store by buying the game on disc. Apple has no way around getting applications thru the App Store without jail braking the phone which voids the manufacturer warranty.

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

Whatever happened to the idea that a corporation could do what they feel would protect their users? People, after all, don't HAVE to buy an iPhone. There are other options available, so let's use the cudgel of legislation to beat down a corporation. Wow...

It also seems that the bills aren't 'allowing' sideloading, but requiring it.

 

[bobcomer]

Not true at all. You can turn off side loading in Android, and Apple could do the same thing.

User choice, who'd of thunk it. That's really all this legislation is addressing and I *like* it.

 

[citysnaps]

No, they aren't, but they are forcing me to use the Apple app store since I already own an iPhone -- that's the problem.

Seems you bought into the wrong platform. Go Android and find happiness.

 

[citysnaps]

Actually, you did exactly what's proper. Don't like Apple, then buy a different phone. I use Android (S21) as my primary driver for a reason, iPhone doesn't offer all the features I need. That's proper response.

Holy smokes! Astonishing seeing someone here take responsibility for their choices instead of whining about Apple not doing what they want. Big tip of my cap!

 

[Stunning_Sense4712]

If this passes, Apple should advise users strongly against side loading and make clear in their sales contracts/user agreements that Apple won’t troubleshoot or provide support for any software issues potentially or possibly caused by malware or side loaded apps, where Apple has sole discretion to determine when that is the case with no legal recourse. Basically any problem not hardware related has no warranty if Apple determines it could be related to a side loaded app. Apple should also make clear that users side loading apps may and are likely to have their data used in ways that are not permitted by the App Store. Also side loaded apps should be heavily restricted and not able to draw on many iOS services, such as creating calendar entries, reading contacts, etc.

That would be illegal under the magnuson moss warranty act. In order for Apple to deny the warranty they have to be able to actually prove that the user caused the damage not speculate they might have caused the damage so they can deny their warranty. So Apple would have a high bar of proof in order to legally deny warranty repair based on side loading.

 

[bobcomer]

I would not be comfortable downloading apps from other app stores.

Then don't! Choice is good.

I haven't downloaded anything from an android third party app store either. Mainly because everything I want is in the google store -- the choice of other stores tends to put pressure on google to not disallow things arbitrarily like Apple does. And no, I never had an android virus either.

 

[bobcomer]

So I dunno... would lowering the rates solve most of the problems? Or would alternate app stores and sideloading still be required?

It wouldn't solve any problems. They'd also have to start allowing more things like the Epic gaming and outside pay ability.

 

[citysnaps]

That would be illegal under the magnuson moss warranty act. In order for Apple to deny the warranty they have to be able to actually prove that the user caused the damage not speculate they might have caused the damage so they can deny their warranty. So Apple would have a high bar of proof in order to legally deny warranty repair based on side loading.

Whatever it takes. Apple should not have to take responsibility for customers making poor decisions resulting in their phone being bricked, their data compromised, or a payment going sideways (extra $ debited).

Hopefully that will be a wakeup call for those always expecting others to take responsibility for their poor actions. Welcome to adulthood.

 

[I7guy]

Then don't! Choice is good.

Yep, android and linux phones are there for the taking.

I haven't downloaded anything from an android third party app store either. Mainly because everything I want is in the google store -- the choice of other stores tends to put pressure on google to not disallow things arbitrarily like Apple does. And no, I never had an android virus either.

 

[bobcomer]

Seems you bought into the wrong platform. Go Android and find happiness.

I already have both an iPhone and an Android phone actually. I just do not like corporations with monopoly powers limiting choice because they can.

If I had to choose one or the other, I'd pick the one that had more granular privacy/permissions controls, yet open to choice in the app store, and that isn't the iPhone..

Who knows, I think I already bought my last mac because it can't run x86 OS's in a VM (need it for work), maybe I've bought my last iPhone too. The 3GS was my first iPhone, and I have a drawer full of them.

 

[citysnaps]

I already have both an iPhone and an Android phone actually. I just do not like corporations with monopoly powers limiting choice because they can.

If I had to choose one or the other, I'd pick the one that had more granular privacy/permissions controls, yet open to choice in the app store, and that isn't the iPhone..

Who knows, I think I already bought my last mac because it can't run x86 OS's in a VM (need it for work), maybe I've bought my last iPhone too. The 3GS was my first iPhone, and I have a drawer full of them.

Godspeed going forward with non-Apple computers and phones. Sinply vote with your wallet and find happiness.

 

[Spock]

You can bypass the games console store by buying the game on disc. Apple has no way around getting applications thru the App Store without jail braking the phone which voids the manufacturer warranty.

Thats not how it works, the game still has to be installed onto the console, even if it is on a disc. Sony still has to approve the game, digital or disc. You can't just burn a game to disc and sell it without Sony taking a cut.

 

[hrMACnstuff]

To this day you still cant run IOS apps on the Mac desktop in Monterey like APPLE promised Can you??

You can run Android Apps in Windows 11.

i'm running an ios app, beachbum berry's total tiki, on my m1 macbook air with monterey and it works great.

 

[Mousse]

Yes, because Apple is acting anti-competitive.

They allow plenty of clone and knockoff apps that charges consumers $$$ because that makes Apple mo' $$$. The recent Wordle kerfuffle comes to mind.

“…Allowing Sideloading Would Cause Consumers to Be Hit With 'Malware, Ransomware, and Scams,' Says Apple”​

On iOS I am hit with spam, fishing and scams.. on my mac not better or worse.. this bird does not fly..

Lots of us know this. But it's like talking to a brick wall trying to get fanbois to see the FUD.

Apple, the Prophet? of Profits?, is all about $$$. They'll allow competition if there are coins to be earned and will block competition if there are coins to be earned.

 

[I7guy]

They allow plenty of clone and knockoff apps that charges consumers $$$ because that makes Apple mo' $$$. The recent Wordle kerfuffle comes to mind.

Lots of us know this. But it's like talking to a brick wall trying to get fanbois to see the FUD.

Apple, the Prophet? of Profits?, is all about $$$. They'll allow competition if there are coins to be earned and will block competition if there are coins to be earned.

That's the thing about choice. People who want absolute freedom in their cell phones have a multitude of android manufacturers to buy from. Hopefully, this bill goes in the same pile that other ill-fated bills have gone in.

 

[Realityck]

I don't follow this. Cloud-based gaming already exists (via web apps like GamePass).

Apple Arcade is a licensing scheme - all apps are still native apps that must be individually installed. The only thing is the Arcade version is includes the necessary entitlement so that it is included in the Arcade "bundle". Some of the games in the Arcade library were previously available for purchase. Some of the games are available on other platforms as well.

See https://www.macrumors.com/2021/12/09/microsoft-apple-cloud-gaming-negotiations/

Apple has successfully prevented cloud-based gaming services from Microsoft and Google from launching on the ‌App Store‌ because of its requirements that each app be submitted individually. For Google Stadia, Google too has opted for a web-based system that does not require it to comply with the ‌App Store‌ rules.

Apple wanted Microsoft to submit every game to the App Store individually to be overseen by ‌App Store‌ reviewers rather than offering games in an overarching Cloud Gaming app. Microsoft initially expressed reservations about doing so because of the workload it would create and the negative customer experience, but in March 2020, Microsoft agreed that it could actually submit each app on an individual basis while offering a catalog app linking out to them.

 

[robd003]

I'm not a fan of censorship that the AppStore imposes. They ban political apps all the time.

Side-loading would let people be free to make their own choices. Free markets, free people.