U.S. Government to Investigate Sideloading and Web App Restrictions on iOS

[TheToolGuide]

then don't use them. nobody is forcing anyone to install sofware. right now users are forced not to.

If I don‘t want security cameras installed on my property because I’m concerned the security could be compromised but my neighbors buy cameras and many of them point onto my property and windows should I be okay with that because well at least I didn’t buy them.

I often have personal information on my phone. People I know also have some of my personal information on their phones. I can control my phone but I don’t get to control them. If their phones get compromised in some way I’m still affected by it.

I don’t think this will be a rampant issue necessarily but the argument doesn’t really hold a lot of water when folks could just go and get an Android phone.

This really isn’t much about a fight for the consumer as its an argument for developers to keep more of their money and for governments and companies to try and circumvent Apple’s privacy walls. Apple has been building it up further over the years and I suspect (but don’t know) that companies and governments don’t like that.

If Apple’s privacy walls and private App Store were so bad for everyone than folks would just get another phone and the market would change. As it is a lot of people love the protections Apple created and is why it has remained successful among other things.

 

[MBAir2010]

Apple should blame Ukraine like everybody and everything else going wrong in that country.
perhaps during the senate hearings Tim Cook'd should claim "slide loading app were developed rigorously outside Pr¥aPåt during the MAGA regime and we consider your privacy a fore point in everything  creates and offloads"

that will baffle the heck out of anyone sitting at the congressional hearing
and Tim will Control the Narrative!
win-win!

 

[iGeneo]

Like I said before. Let it happen.I have zero interest in that nonsense. Not overly concerned about changing icons, themes or even Home Screen layouts to look like the now dead Windows phone.

Just add a tag in the about screen ““Apple Certified” that no rogue apps have been installed.

 

[4743913]

YET! As soon as the option exists there will be companies pushing it as the only option. Even more so once the next step and the order to allow alternate stores.

And, yes, I may be impacted. The use case for mobile is different than that of PC / Mac. They are always one, always with, and (for many people) always in hand. They are also much more closely coupled with online services (iCloud / Family / Handoff / Contacts / etc.). In one person I know or knows me installs an app that is, let's say, less than ethical that app will find me and I will most likely be impacted.

 

[carlob]

I'm waiting for a "pull out of the US market" comment ?

 

[usagora]

apple should just let people sideload. it's not going to harm anyone for goodness sake. they don't have a problem letting people download apps on MacOS that don't come from their store. Windows, Linux, Android, and MacOS allow it so why not iOS? they are too scared to lose control and money from their cashcow.

the US gov should force apple to implement sideloading. If you don't want to use it then don't. Simple as that. If you like your hand being held and/or sucking up to Apple then you can keep downloading stuff from the App Store. Everyone should still be given the choice to NOT use the App Store.

No, the government should butt out of this. Even many people who want Apple to allow sideloading on iOS agree that the government shouldn't be determining this. I personally don't care either way about sideloading - I just think it's Apple's right, and theirs alone, to decide this.

 

[Macative]

I'm glad that web apps are mentioned here. As a web app developer, there are numerous pain points where Apple has deliberately allowed web apps to be limited, or bugs to go unfixed for months, that wouldn't fly on any other platform. Apple has purposely made web apps worse to discourage them, and they can't use the same excuse about security here. It's about competition, and enough is enough.

 

[Sophisticatednut]

Yes, it does. Anytime you poke holes in the walled garden to water the plants, the vermin are sure to follow. And with as many devices as Apple has in the wild, the vermin will be overflowing.

I expect any number of those “alternative” app stores that are forced upon us by government dunces and the squeaky wheel crowd will be hacked by the Russians or the Chinese or the North Koreans and identities compromised or malware injected into the downloads. It’s not a matter of if, it will be a matter of when. Again, if this is forced upon me, I won’t be downloading any apps from developers that use these alternative app stores. Having to worry about apple and their security on the App Store is bad enough, let alone worrying about apps from 2-3 App Stores. It’s bad enough worrying about it with macOS and Windows, I’ve felt relatively secure with iOS. All this so people who think a $5 app is too expensive can get it cheaper in the “free enterprise marketplace” or are simply looking for a way to screw Apple because they are personally offended at Apple’s “greed” in their eyes. Too bad the full weight of repercussions won’t fall on the people clamoring for this open market, but will end up falling on all of us.

An iPhone is not a PC or a Mac and I like it that way…so do the vast majority of users. I really do hope karma bites you people right in the ass.

I think I rather take personal responsibility and freedom over a company trying to nanny my safety

 

[VulchR]

ah so your true motive reveals itself.

??? Not sure what you mean. My stake in this is as a user.

 

[jakey rolling]

As usual, the EU leads and the US follows.

Party like it's 1939!

 

[Sophisticatednut]

Apple should, yes. But it is their right to do so. As long as they're not using any anti-competitive practices, they are the ones with the ultimate rights to determine what should happen on their own platform, store, and so on. Apple owns and maintain the platform, the app store, and so on, this isn't a public forum.

Government forcing companies to open up their platforms, app stores, absolutely not.

If the market wants an open platform and open app store, they can go with Android or have the government create their own OS, devices, and app store.

If Google promises an open app store and platform but uses practices such as enforcing 20+ steps barrier to sideload that is absolutely unreasonable or create FUD, then the government should write the laws to regulate the said open app stores rules and enforce it but not to private companies that do not have open app stores.

But what if we don’t want android and love iOS, but want it to be more like MacOS? Are we **** out of luck then

 

[Ethosik]

and just like that, developers can keep 100% of their $$$ and users can "install software".

Not necessarily true. This might result in how Unreal Engine is used where you need to pay a royalty fee for using the Apple provided APIs on another store. UE takes 5% of my royalties if I post it on Steam but 0% if I post it on Epic.

 

[Ethosik]

are you impacted by macs or pcs? because they sideload too except that it's called "install software" for them.

Actually yes. I recently had a security breach due to Video Copilot plugins being infected. A legit purchase I made, from a legit site, had malware in their downloads. This is the problem with the "classic" desktop operating systems.

Ransomware reports still show up in my news feeds. Solarwinds and Exchange had some serious issues lately.

 

[Boris Bronson]

If I don‘t want security cameras installed on my property because I’m concerned the security could be compromised but my neighbors buy cameras and many of them point onto my property and windows should I be okay with that because well at least I didn’t buy them.

I often have personal information on my phone. People I know also have some of my personal information on their phones. I can control my phone but I don’t get to control them. If their phones get compromised in some way I’m still affected by it.

I don’t think this will be a rampant issue necessarily but the argument doesn’t really hold a lot of water when folks could just go and get an Android phone.

This really isn’t much about a fight for the consumer as its an argument for developers to keep more of their money and for governments and companies to try and circumvent Apple’s privacy walls. Apple has been building it up further over the years and I suspect (but don’t know) that companies and governments don’t like that.

If Apple’s privacy walls and private App Store were so bad for everyone than folks would just get another phone and the market would change. As it is a lot of people love the protections Apple created and is why it has remained successful among other things.

You know your contact info can already get uploaded from iPhones by your friends and family, even in the walled garden?

 

[Ethosik]

You can just choose not to sideload if that a major concern for you. Nothing about your experience would have to change unless Apple implemented sideloading horribly.

Please people need to stop saying this. Yes stuff will change. Proof is Epic Games on PC and how they purchase exclusivity rights. Epic WILL do the same on iOS and Android (Google is in trouble for making side-loading "too difficult" too you know).

And you honestly think Facebook and those highly used apps will remain on the App Store and force to disclose everything they like to track?

 

[Ethosik]

IMO, the difference is that with a desktop computer, you turn it on when you use it and turn it off when you don't. And it's usually not a life-or-death situation if it crashes. A mobile device needs to be on all the time because it's also a communication device. I wouldn't want to be facing the equivalent of a BSOD if I have to call 911. I want my iPhone to be secure and perform reliably. So far it has, and I think that's because Apple has so tightly controlled what goes onto it.

But as others have pointed out, if the mobile world becomes a Wild West for software I could simply choose to live with Apple's default apps. I'd prefer a curated App Store though.

I agree but be careful here! I said the same thing and someone started saying you can use Skype on Windows to call 911 so its the same!

 

[Ethosik]

It’s possible to be against crass government overreach while being in favor of third party app stores.

Then let the market speak to it and correct it. Want Apple to change? Buy and Android. If enough people do so, Apple will need to change.

If Apple either implements this on their own or changes it due to market direction, I am cool with it. Government legislation and laws to dictate that Apple must do this? That is wrong. Were people just sleeping the last 10+ years? This isn't a "iOS suddenly locked down" its ALWAYS been this way.

Oh right I know what is going on, this is essentially telling all of is its bad to be too successful in this world. You will get punished.

 

[Ethosik]

Perhaps, but forcing a company to change its business model like what appears to be proposed is overreach of the worst sort. If this happens, don't assume apps will be offered in both Apple's app store and other stores. There will be a mass exodus from Apple's app store and we will be faced with using Wild West apps with a higher security risk or not using them at all. This actually lowers consumer choice because it leaves no mobile operating system with a decent walled garden for security.

As I said, I could see the government requiring Apple to guarantee security of the apps in its store, so that the security benefits of the walled garden can be accrued and it is not just window dressing to gouge consumers and developers. Other than that, though, lawmakers should butt out.

I agree. App Store review has problems sure. Demolishing it is not the solution but improving the review process is.

 

[Ethosik]

I agree that government should probably not be involved in a private business model, but the app ecosystem would not suddenly become the “Wild West”. Android allows side loading, but a majority of apps on Android are on the Google Play Store. Discovery would still be an issue on phones. In fact, a majority of independent developers would probably want to stay on the App Store for this very reason.

Android is also being targeted because it is "too difficult" to side-load.

 

[44267547]

Apple should blame Ukraine

No, they shouldn’t.

 

[Deguello]

Then let the market speak to it and correct it. Want Apple to change? Buy and Android. If enough people do so, Apple will need to change.

If Apple either implements this on their own or changes it due to market direction, I am cool with it. Government legislation and laws to dictate that Apple must do this? That is wrong. Were people just sleeping the last 10+ years? This isn't a "iOS suddenly locked down" its ALWAYS been this way.

Oh right I know what is going on, this is essentially telling all of is its bad to be too successful in this world. You will get punished.

Or people could just give Apple feedback. If Apple sees opportunity for enough additional profit, Apple will do it.

I can only conclude you skipped the multiple posts in which I wrote that this should be Apple’s decision to make.

 

[Deguello]

Please people need to stop saying this. Yes stuff will change. Proof is Epic Games on PC and how they purchase exclusivity rights. Epic WILL do the same on iOS and Android (Google is in trouble for making side-loading "too difficult" too you know).

And you honestly think Facebook and those highly used apps will remain on the App Store and force to disclose everything they like to track?

I think if they want to reach the vast majority of people who don’t know much about changing their default browser, let alone their default App Store, they will.

 

[Gasu E.]

are you impacted by macs or pcs? because they sideload too except that it's called "install software" for them.

It's a different market, though. The level of technical competence for iOS users is expected to be very low, relative to PCs. I don't see Apple being able to provide the level of software support for naive side-loaders that they will need, as part of a basic AppleCare contract. In the PC space, there's an expectation that you are going to require some kind of paid tech support (or support from a friend or relative) if you are not technically competent.

 

[jz0309]

Please people need to stop saying this. Yes stuff will change. Proof is Epic Games on PC and how they purchase exclusivity rights. Epic WILL do the same on iOS and Android (Google is in trouble for making side-loading "too difficult" too you know).

And you honestly think Facebook and those highly used apps will remain on the App Store and force to disclose everything they like to track?

exactly this, the average user (who is not represented here on MR) will NOT benefit from this.

 

[Ethosik]

I am hearing rumblings on twitter that Apple if ruling is against them will allow a two tier system

Tier 1: Apple store walled garden where Apple will be responsible for vetting all apps and privacy

Tier 2: Apple allows sideloading, Apple does not vet apps and privacy transparency will be dropped which will allow companies like Facebook to Track you. on the setup screen you will acknowledge that you will not hold Apple legally responsible for any data breach.

You can only have a Tier 1 or Tier 2 device. You can only choose Tier 1 or Tier 2 once. If you choose Tier 2, You will need a new device to start using Tier 1 again but you can go from Tier 1 to Tier 2 but not go back to Tier 1.

That would be good but it won't work. Epic would have a fit (remember they sued Google for it being "too difficult" to side-load).