Unauthorized App Store Cydia Sues Apple for Anticompetitive Behavior

[vipergts2207]

Apple doesn't single-handedly dictate anything. If they want to act like a monopoly just because they have 99% US market share, they'll lose the rest of the world, and Google will get it for free. It is a duopoly, though.

So if Apple wanted to act to their own detriment by abusing a nonexistent monopoly position, and they somehow got a hold on the US such that nobody here could really switch to – what would be – the obviously superior Android phones the rest of the world uses, I'd be complaining.

Yes they do. You're arguing against plain facts. If tomorrow, Apple said they were no longer going to allow video apps like Netflix and Hulu on the app store, they will have single-handedly effected over half of the country's smartphone users. Arguing otherwise is blatantly ignoring reality.

There's a reason all these lawsuits and government investigations (both foreign and domestic) are coming to a head, and it's because the tech marketplace is becoming very mature and makes up a gigantic proportion of the economy. And a lot of people are looking at Apple, Google, Amazon, and Facebook and seeing an awful lot of what looks like anti-competitive behavior. Just because you don't see it or don't want to see it, doesn't mean others don't. Over the next couple years, we're likely going to see these companies get smacked down, some more than others. And when it happens you're somehow going to be shocked by it, while the rest of us saw it coming. Likely the only way they don't is by willingly changing their own behavior. Did you miss Apple's recent reactions to these investigations and lawsuits by making changes to the app store commission and their stance on streaming gaming apps? Those moves were attempts to lower the heat on them a bit. We'll see if it was enough, or if they willingly implement more changes to avoid being forced to.

 

[miamialley]

Do people even still JailBreak? It's 2020, no need to do it anymore.

I know right? I can't even think of something I'd jailbreak for these days. Ten years ago...different story. I remember when Apple wouldn't let you use your cameras flash as a light. They were ridiculously restrictive. Still are, mostly with widget related items and general customization.

 

[hot-gril]

Yes they do. You're arguing against plain facts. If tomorrow, Apple said they were no longer going to allow video apps like Netflix and Hulu on the app store, they will have single-handedly effected over half of the country's smartphone users. Arguing otherwise is blatantly ignoring reality.

There's a reason all these lawsuits and government investigations (both foreign and domestic) are coming to a head, and it's because the tech marketplace is becoming very mature and makes up a gigantic proportion of the economy. And a lot of people are looking at Apple, Google, Amazon, and Facebook and seeing an awful lot of what looks like anti-competitive behavior. Just because you don't see it or don't want to see it, doesn't mean others don't. Over the next couple years, we're likely going to see these companies get smacked down, some more than others. And when it happens you're somehow going to be shocked by it.

Single-handed affected them by making them switch to Android.

It's one thing to argue about what _should_ happen and another to say what _will_. Those are counter-trading words. If you want to know, my money is in SPY and AMZN and is staying there. I'm not ultra confident, but it's what I picked.

(Edited^, original version was more annoying: Tell me what you're shorting so I can buy. AMZN? I'm already in deep there.)

 

[vipergts2207]

Single-handed affected them by making them switch to Android.

It's one thing to argue about what _should_ happen and another to say what _will_. Those are counter-trading words. Tell me what you're shorting so I can buy. AMZN? I'm already in deep there.

Anti-trust laws aren't only about the consumer it's also about competitors. Do you think removing Netflix and Hulu would be anti-competitive when Apple offers their own streaming service? And as far as the consumer goes, do you think courts and regulators would look kindly on Apple single-handedly making consumers spend hundreds to thousands of more dollars for a new phone solely due to Apple taking anti-competitive actions?

 

[jameslmoser]

"I hope regulators force Apple to make things the way I want instead of the way the market wants."

If Apple is pretty much the only option to distribute your software, the market isn't involved. It is not in the markets best interest for their to be more phone platforms that everyone else has to support, and its not likely a new platform can take hold and take off right now... Windows Phone is a perfect example.

Sometimes markets need regulated... Apple should understand that if they are arguing they have to regulate theirs!

 

[hot-gril]

Anti-trust laws aren't only about the consumer it's also about competitors. Do you think removing Netflix and Hulu would be anti-competitive when Apple offers their own streaming service? And as far as the consumer goes, do you think courts and regulators would look kindly on Apple single-handedly making consumers spend hundreds to thousands of more dollars for a new phone solely due to Apple taking anti-competitive actions?

They wouldn't like that, but Apple doesn't have the muscle to do it in the first place. Otherwise they would've done it yesterday.

 

[hot-gril]

If Apple is pretty much the only option to distribute your software, the market isn't involved. It is not in the markets best interest for their to be more phone platforms that everyone else has to support, and its not likely a new platform can take hold and take off right now... Windows Phone is a perfect example.

They aren't the only option, though. Don't get me wrong, it'd be nice for there to be a third place instead of basically a duopoly, but markets don't tend to work that way, and really the duopoly isn't bad either.

 

[jameslmoser]

Have you moved to Linux? On what hardware? I'm going to see how this plays out with the regulators and will otherwise reluctantly also move away from Mac and iPhone.

Yes... I primarily use Fedora now on a machine I made myself. I actually went from Linux (and FreeBSD) to Mac OS X when it became a thing... now I'm going back.

 

[jameslmoser]

And they really, really want a walled iOS? Must be two completely distinct groups in that case.

No, not really. iOS started off as a phone operating system. With current hardware more people are using it as a general purpose device. Apple sells iPad's now as an laptop replacement... so they are trying to compete with general purpose devices. macOS is (or its suppose to be) a general computing platform... though its being restricted more and more.

 

[NT1440]

Yes they do. You're arguing against plain facts. If tomorrow, Apple said they were no longer going to allow video apps like Netflix and Hulu on the app store, they will have single-handedly effected over half of the country's smartphone users. Arguing otherwise is blatantly ignoring reality.

There's a reason all these lawsuits and government investigations (both foreign and domestic) are coming to a head, and it's because the tech marketplace is becoming very mature and makes up a gigantic proportion of the economy. And a lot of people are looking at Apple, Google, Amazon, and Facebook and seeing an awful lot of what looks like anti-competitive behavior. Just because you don't see it or don't want to see it, doesn't mean others don't. Over the next couple years, we're likely going to see these companies get smacked down, some more than others. And when it happens you're somehow going to be shocked by it, while the rest of us saw it coming. Likely the only way they don't is by willingly changing their own behavior. Did you miss Apple's recent reactions to these investigations and lawsuits by making changes to the app store commission and their stance on streaming gaming apps? Those moves were attempts to lower the heat on them a bit. We'll see if it was enough, or if they willingly implement more changes to avoid being forced to.

Can you cite an example that isn’t theoretical? I’m pretty anti-trust (not that it’s actually enforced in the US) suits have to show actual evidence, not the absurd scenario you laid out above.

 

[laptech]

The same line told gets more and more boring every time Apple and anyone else that uses it, which is 'Apple does not have a monopoly on mobile phones because they have competition from Android'. The thing is, that is not the point which is being made. The point that is being made is that Apple have a monopoly on iOS, which is true.

 

[hot-gril]

How dare they not allow Cydia and its ability to install pirated software!

for shame!

I used to jailbreak back in the iPhone 4 days, back when it made sense to. Never used it for piracy. It's a tool, not a weapon.

 

[jameslmoser]

Unless Microsoft approves a game, it’s not getting on the Xbox. Same goes for Playstations.

Those are not general purpose computing platforms. iPhones were not originally either given the hardware when they were launched... they are becoming those. For many people that has become their primary computing device now.

 

[hot-gril]

Those are not general purpose computing platforms. iPhones were not originally either given the hardware when they were launched... they are becoming those. For many people that has become their primary computing device now.

Those people don't need the freedom or even want it. They have freer options like Android and PCs. Apple realized you can bring computers truly to everyone by making them really simple.

 

[jameslmoser]

They aren't the only option, though. Don't get me wrong, it'd be nice for there to be a third place instead of basically a duopoly, but markets don't tend to work that way, and really the duopoly isn't bad either.

They are the only option for anyone who bought an iPad or iPhone, and is now pretty much locked into an ecosystem (also apple's intention).

 

[jameslmoser]

Those people don't need the freedom or even want it. They have freer options like Android and PCs. Apple realized you can bring computers truly to everyone by making them really simple.

Really... they don't??? Apparently I and many others on this thread don't exist. They are not my primary devices because they can't be... but I have family members who use it as their primary device and have issues with this.

 

[hot-gril]

They are the only option for anyone who bought an iPad or iPhone, and is now pretty much locked into an ecosystem (also apple's intention).

Anyone who doesn't want to be locked in can leave fairly easily, even if they use iCloud. Takeout used to be a novel feature for cloud providers, but with iCloud it was there from the start. Turn it off, keep your stuff. (Or just don't use it from the start cause it sucks.)

 

[hot-gril]

Really... they don't??? Apparently I and many others on this thread don't exist.

I didn't say that. You picked one the freer options I mentioned if you're using a Fedora PC.

 

[jameslmoser]

I didn't say that. You picked one the freer options I mentioned.

Not for my phone. I wish I could but there isn't another option. I find Android to be really inferior and the ecosystem is not stable and the updates are too slow.

 

[apple404]

It’s my phone. What do you not understand?

Yes it is. But it isn't your software.

 

[hot-gril]

Not for my phone. I wish I could but there isn't another option. I find Android to be really inferior and the ecosystem is not stable and the updates are too slow.

Well there's a reason Android has those problems.

 

[vipergts2207]

Can you cite an example that isn’t theoretical? I’m pretty anti-trust (not that it’s actually enforced in the US) suits have to show actual evidence, not the absurd scenario you laid out above.

An example of what, anti-competitive actions by Apple? Disallowing streaming gaming apps, a stance they just recently changed. Forcing companies like ProtonMail to add in-app purchases or be removed from the app store. Simultaneously allowing apps onto the phone through only one doorway, while simultaneously controlling who is allowed through that doorway. This wasn't a big deal when smartphones were in their infancy. Now they're such a central part of daily life, that Apple can wield their control over access to half of US consumers like a cudgel against whoever it wishes.

 

[vipergts2207]

They wouldn't like that, but Apple doesn't have the muscle to do it in the first place. Otherwise they would've done it yesterday.

My argument wasn’t about whether or not Apple would do it, but whether they could single-handedly adversely impact half of consumers. You said they couldn’t, which is clearly false, by your own admission of Apple making consumers buy a new Android phone through such an action.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

I hope the big tech companies will be broken up. I assume you mean the same.

Continue to hope.

 

[Naraxus]

Good on Cydia. Apple deserves all of these lawsuits for its anti-competitive behavior and more.