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Vivo Unveils 3D Sensing Technology With 10 Times as Many Data Points as Apple's Face ID

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Chinese mobile phone maker Vivo has today unveiled new 3D sensing technology which it says has 10 times the accuracy of the Face ID authentication system in Apple's iPhone X.

Vivo says its Time of Flight (TOF) system uses 300,000 data points to map the user's face in three dimensions, compared to the 30,000 points of infrared light used in Apple's facial mapping technology.


The TOF system works by detecting the time it takes for emitted pulse light to return to the sensor, which allows it to accurately map objects at up to three meters in front of it, according to Vivo. The company said the tech would enable "new opportunities in facial, gesture and motion recognition, 3D photography and AR, expanding the capabilities of the next generation of smart devices."
"From last year's debut of In-Display Fingerprint Scanning Technology, the recent launch of the truly bezel-less Vivo NEX, to our ground-breaking TOF 3D Sensing technology, we continue to forge ahead and evolve towards the truly intelligent future by opening new ways for the AI to help the consumer," said Alex Feng, Senior Vice President of Vivo. "By combining TOF 3D Sensing Technology with AI, we will continue to explore new possibilities for a better future."
Vivo demonstrated the 3D sensing technology at the Mobile World Congress in Shanghai, a stage it has used in the past to make similar big reveals. Last year Vivo used the platform to unveil its screen-embedded fingerprint sensor technology, at a time when Apple was thought to be struggling to achieve the same result. Of course, it later emerged that Apple was leaving fingerprint recognition systems behind.

Vivo says its latest 3D sensing tech is "no mere proof of concept", but it will be a while before it makes it into a commercial smartphone. Whether the increased number of data points automatically translates in practice to better security and accuracy remains to be seen.

Article Link: Vivo Unveils 3D Sensing Technology With 10 Times as Many Data Points as Apple's Face ID
 

KPandian1

macrumors 65816
Oct 22, 2013
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Oh goody! More of our vital data in the hands of the Chinese. Vivo can no more be trusted than ZTE.

Also, how difficult is it for these devices to record our iris and retinal features? Too much paranoia? Maybe.
 
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Plutonius

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Feb 22, 2003
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I thought it was said that it would take years to equal let alone exceed Apples technology in this area.

The Chinese company must have some amazing engineers /S.
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Do you think the more data points would make unlocking successfully more difficult? For example, subtle changes of appearance affecting the authentication?

It all depends on the facial recognition software.

It would be interesting to compare the facial recognition software on the Vivo to the facial recognition software on the iPhone.
 
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Gorms

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Oh goody! More of our vital data in the hands of the Chinese. Vivo can no more be trusted than ZTE.

Also, how difficult is it for these devices to record our iris and retinal features? Too much paranoia? Maybe.

I might be way wrong on this but I don’t think that IR penetrates the eyeball surface before bouncing back? If not, then probably quite difficult as it should effectively be IR bouncing off a flat surface of your outer eye, not scanning deeper to the iris level.
 
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KPandian1

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Oct 22, 2013
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I might be way wrong on this but I don’t think that IR penetrates the eyeball surface before bouncing back? If not, then probably quite difficult as it should effectively be IR bouncing off a flat surface of your outer eye, not scanning deeper to the iris level.

Iris is not too tough to capture, even with IR; retinal scans and capture are more difficult, I agree.

The point is both the loss of privacy to the Chinese regime and the polar opposite paranoia that we live with these days. Remember how much we resent being finger printed at ports of entry, passport offices and the DMV, all of these within the USA.

Some foreign airpots do scan the retina of arriving passengers already.

As for accuracy of the FaceId method, is that the goal of the company? Again on the paranoia chain, another Analytica.:(
 
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LovingTeddy

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Oh goody! More of our vital data in the hands of the Chinese. Vivo can no more be trusted than ZTE.

Also, how difficult is it for these devices to record our iris and retinal features? Too much paranoia? Maybe.

Yeah... Like i would trust any American company for my data right? I trust Chinese more than american, what can Chinese government do to me whem they have my data? I am more worrying about US government because i am living in North America.
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Yea, but does it “just work”?

iPhone does not just work, especially with iOS 11
 
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Dwalls90

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Feb 5, 2009
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I feel like this is the Samsung argument of “we have more GHz in our chips”, yet performance wise, their phones are still years behind the Apple A design in iPhones. More “numbers” doesn’t equate to a better experience.

That said, competition makes things better for consumers, so we should be eager to see a real world comparison.
 
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3:16

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Mar 18, 2018
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Shocker! Apple reveals a new idea and Vivo steals it then makes a newer better version?
 
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Lidar

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Feb 9, 2015
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Time-of-flight LiDAR technology is old school. Very few professional-grade sensors still use that method by itself. Most are just phase-based and there are some that are a blend of the two methods. Let’s be honest though, 30,000 points spread across your face is a ton of points. Why in the hell would you need more, then to just one up someone for the sake of saying we can?
 
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Kabeyun

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Mar 27, 2004
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which it says has 10 times the accuracy of the Face ID authentication system in Apple's iPhone X.

Vivo says its Time of Flight (TOF) system uses 300,000 data points to map the user's face in three dimensions, compared to the 30,000 points of infrared light used in Apple's facial mapping technology.

Point of clarification: 10 times the data points does not automatically mean 10 times the accuracy, at least from a usability standpoint. I can draw a straight line, for example, with two points or 50 points and be equally accurate. Of course faces are more complicated, but I’m pointing out that more data points aren’t necessarily more accurate. In fact, if the logic behind the data points isn’t smart, such a setup could theoretically actually be less accurate by interpreting subtle changes in facial expression, or a scar, or a shadow, as a different face.
 
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kkk123kkk123kkk

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Nov 14, 2017
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This is just pure dishonest claim by Vivo. (if the article is completely accurate) How can the number of data points be comparable if the underlying technology is completely different. According to this article Vivo is using Time of Flight which is very bad to track anything but motion (like Microsoft 2nd gen Kinect). Apple didn't use Time of Flight for face recognition. They only use Time of Flight as the proximity sensor to trigger rest of the FaceID main components. The main technology Apple use for FaceID is Structured-light which is far more accurate in 3d space recognition than Time of Flight can ever hope to achieve.

To explain why Time of Flight is bad for face recognition no matter how many data point they add. It is due to physic especially speed of the light. Time of Flight rely on detecting extremely tiny difference in time of travel for the light to bounce back from the target. The speed of light is extremely fast, and for the tiny distance between your face and where you normal hold your phone the difference in distance between how far is point A and point B on your face from your phone is too small to tell for any modern CPU (The accuracy is limited by the clock speed. for any CPU it can only detect difference no smaller than its single clock cycle, and for the time between a single clock cycle for a 3Ghz CPU the light can travel almost 10cm during that time. It can barely tell that you had a nose) It might be good for application such as autonomous driving sensor or AR/VR in large space where resolution of few centimeters isn't really that much an issue when combine with other sensors, but unless this article is wrong about which technology they use I wouldn't trust it any more than the pattern lock on Android phone.
 
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maflynn

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May 3, 2009
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Well by that logic, Touch ID was an utter failure. Especially if you've been a tradesman all of your life and your fingerprints have more in common with 100 grit sandpaper than skin.
No, not at all. I simply stated that "it just works" mantra didn't work for some people with faceid. I didn't say it was a failure by any stretch, just that it failed to live up to the ideal of it just works.
 
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Relentless Power

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Jul 12, 2016
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Shocker! Apple reveals a new idea and Vivo steals it then makes a newer better version?

How do we know the Vivo ‘stole it’? They could have been developing their version of this technology perhaps at the same time or before Face ID launched. There is no evidence supporting that they actually stole facial recognition technology from Apple, it might have been taking them longer to develop/manufacture their version before it’s ready to release to the public. And we can’t make the judgment that it’s better, because it’s not available as of yet for a commercial smart phone.
 
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H3LL5P4WN

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Jun 19, 2010
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No, not at all. I simply stated that "it just works" mantra didn't work for some people with faceid. I didn't say it was a failure by any stretch, just that it failed to live up to the ideal of it just works.

Which I understood, I just meant that by extrapolating your statement, Touch ID is a disaster for someone like my dad.

I'm really hoping that this years phones will have some extraordinarily heavy duty case that I can put his new one in because of the phones likely glass construction. (He managed to smash a Lifeproof Fre and shift the front facing camera out of it's mount. The Genius had never seen anything like it.) That being said, Face ID is a godsend for him (and my mom, since she can't grasp the concept of using the meat of her fingers to interact with the phone instead of the tip and her fingernails, lol.
 
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