Waiting for the 2018 MBP

[falcon511]

I say this with 90% confidence:
June.
Hexa-Core
Polaris OR Vega... this one is the biggest wildcard actually!

I dont mind if its Polaris or Vega. I wont be using the MBP as a gaming laptop. It will be mostly my web surfing/ design machine. I have a gaming desktop for that. I just rather have a hexa-core cpu as ive been using quad cores for years now. I have an 8700k and it plays great.

 

[SteveJUAE]

Not long time ago, Apple was the only maker of premium laptops, everyone else just went as cheap as possible. Now, Dell, Microsoft and the others are getting more confident in the premium segment as well. Still, the tradeoffs between the XPS and the MacBook Pro are the same as for the last few years — the first has slightly faster GPU and is cheaper, the second is lighter and has longer battery runtime.

This simply is not true even when Apple were producing cheap white plastic MB companies like Sony were tendering the high end premium market with their Z series and continued until 2015

Apple know by their own metrics that Pro users is a limited ~15% and MB's have to be a middling set of specs to meet it's mass audience wrapped up in a nice shell with added support for those that want it at additional cost

There's nothing clever about building a laptop in a one horse race based on a set profit point that appeals to a known audience. Of course it helps to throw in a few bragging points like support for 4x4K that's probably a complete mismatch for their target audience who would likely of got more out of an SD slot

The clever part is convincing users less is more and the need to buy accompanying devices to be a whole and a one with Apple

 

[afir93]

Is it safe to assume that the 15 inch will have a 6 core cpu standard and a vega gpu?

There's a good chance that the 6 core CPUs will be standard across the 15", but it's not certain. For example, I wouldn't rule it out that the lowest-end 15" model gets "only" one of the new quad-core chips and only the higher-end configurations receive hexa-core.

This is what Apple has been doing with the 13" variants for the last two years: the nTB-models (even if you choose the CPU-upgrade) had a weaker CPU than the entry-level 13" TB model because they had only one fan and a lower TDP, so they naturally couldn't choose the same CPUs as for the TB models. For example in the (unlikely) case that the by-many-requested 15" nonTB model becomes a reality, I could easily imagine that they go down the same route here and only give the TB-models hexa-cores and the nTB 15" quad cores, to provide further incentive for people to choose the TB variants.

 

[maflynn]

but it's not certain

It may happen, it may not, but so many people think its virtually written in stone that it will happen. Tbh, I don't need 6 cores, but rather great battery life, and a good solid keyboard.

 

[fokmik]

It may happen, it may not, but so many people think its virtually written in stone that it will happen. Tbh, I don't need 6 cores, but rather great battery life, and a good solid keyboard.

i understand that 8th quad core or 6 core are both 45W so this means same battery life no matter what cpu is inside?

 

[afir93]

It may happen, it may not, but so many people think its virtually written in stone that it will happen. Tbh, I don't need 6 cores, but rather great battery life, and a good solid keyboard.

With a company like Apple, would it be too far-fetched to expect all three of those?

6 cores is pretty much a given for the 2018 MBPs – not for all of them but at very least for the higher-end 15" configurations. A departure from the keyboard-issues (or at least from the extend they are currently at) also seems very likely, given how much time Apple had since these issues were initially reported on the 2016 models and into how big of a problem they have developed, to a point where even people who otherwise love the new machines advise not to buy them only because of the risk of keyboard failure.

The biggest wildcard in my eyes (outside of the ominous mobile Vega chips) is whether or not we get a battery life improvement. It seems to me that Apple could easily add 2-3 hours of battery life (maybe even more) if they used a MacBook-like terraced battery design that fills out the glaring gaps in the interior of the current MBPs, but with zero reports/rumors/leaks about it, it's hard to say if Apple ironed out the issues that they reportedly had with this battery design in time for this year's MBP, or if it'll be another year without an improvement in battery design.

 

[Gata]

From this shot of the Macbook Pro touch bar teardown from ifixit, it seems to be the case that the batteries don't necessarily even need the terraced design - they could simply be made bigger.

 

[Poki]

From this shot of the Macbook Pro touch bar teardown from ifixit, it seems to be the case that the batteries don't necessarily even need the terraced design - they could simply be made bigger.

True, looks like tons of wasted space. Would definitely bring the battery life closer to ten hours if they filled it all up with batteries.

On that note, I'd love to see a completely new cooling concept for the MacBook Pro. We had this dual fan layout pretty much forever. I know vapor chambers are too heavy for a notebook, but with liquid cooled smartphones, shouldn't there be a better way to cool a notebook than huge and loud fans?

 

[bykaraanne]

It seems that my iPhone 6 has also decided to give itself some dead pixels as I wait for my MBP 2018. Whyyyyyy. I was desperately hoping for it to reach its 4th birthday.

 

[falcon511]

There's a good chance that the 6 core CPUs will be standard across the 15", but it's not certain. For example, I wouldn't rule it out that the lowest-end 15" model gets "only" one of the new quad-core chips and only the higher-end configurations receive hexa-core.

This is what Apple has been doing with the 13" variants for the last two years: the nTB-models (even if you choose the CPU-upgrade) had a weaker CPU than the entry-level 13" TB model because they had only one fan and a lower TDP, so they naturally couldn't choose the same CPUs as for the TB models. For example in the (unlikely) case that the by-many-requested 15" nonTB model becomes a reality, I could easily imagine that they go down the same route here and only give the TB-models hexa-cores and the nTB 15" quad cores, to provide further incentive for people to choose the TB variants.

I can see the base 15 inch getting the 8750H, with a chance to upgrade to either the 8850H or the new i9 8950H. The next step up would be the higher end 15 inch getting the 8850H with an option to upgrade to the i9 8950h.

If the base 15 inch doesnt get the hexa core then i can see Apple selling it with an i7 from Kaby lake. I dont see them selling the 15 inch without an i7. At least the TB 15 inch. If they sell the 15inch base model with an i5, that would be a huge disappointment.

 

[Ener Ji]

Which MacBook Pro and with which WiFi module exactly? Just a note that you can run Sierra (or High Sierra) on the 2008 MBPs, but some of the MacBook Pros from that era have WiFi issues with Sierra (or High Sierra).

15" Late 2008 MBP. I would need to check the WiFi module and I'm not at that computer right now, but I'm fairly certain these are the hardware specs:

https://support.apple.com/kb/SP499?viewlocale=en_US&locale=en_US

i understand that 8th quad core or 6 core are both 45W so this means same battery life no matter what cpu is inside?

Unlikely to be exactly the same in real-world usage. The reported battery life (streaming video or whatever Apple chooses to publicize) might be the same, because it will be a test which is single threaded (or at least has a low number of threads), allowing many of the cores to be powered down. If you are doing anything which prevents the extra cores from powering down then I could see the six-core processors getting worse battery life.

 

[smirking]

A notebook that can outperform a 10 core Mac Pro

And it's basically a Frankenlaptop. A desktop jammed into a laptop form factor with predictable drawbacks.
https://www.laptopmag.com/reviews/laptops/asus-rog-strix-gl702zc

Some interesting user complaints on that laptop too:
https://www.amazon.com/Gaming-FreeSync-Display-Editing-GL702ZC/dp/B077GBJCNC

 

[Falhófnir]

I can see the base 15 inch getting the 8750H, with a chance to upgrade to either the 8850H or the new i9 8950H. The next step up would be the higher end 15 inch getting the 8850H with an option to upgrade to the i9 8950h.

If the base 15 inch doesnt get the hexa core then i can see Apple selling it with an i7 from Kaby lake. I dont see them selling the 15 inch without an i7. At least the TB 15 inch. If they sell the 15inch base model with an i5, that would be a huge disappointment.

I believe an i5-8300H or i5-8400H is in effect an i7-7700HQ to all intents and purposes, they have 4 core & 8 threads whereas the big difference for the i5-7300HQ was it lacked hyperthreading so was 4 core & 4 threads. The slight differences in clock speed won’t really make a huge difference tbh.

 

[Queen6]

And it's basically a Frankenlaptop. A desktop jammed into a laptop form factor with predictable drawbacks.
https://www.laptopmag.com/reviews/laptops/asus-rog-strix-gl702zc

Some interesting user complaints on that laptop too:
https://www.amazon.com/Gaming-FreeSync-Display-Editing-GL702ZC/dp/B077GBJCNC

It's and interesting notebook, equally definitely has it's quirks I wouldn't mind one at the right price to tinker with. Think I said in the "alternatives" forum it's very much an AMD driven effort to usurp Intel. It's a great option if you can lever full advantage of the CPU and you need a portable platform, however the rest of the notebook is rather lacklustre. It's not a gaming powerhouse, and needs a better display for content creation.

Strix GL702ZC is an interesting concept, although I rather feel that Asus will likely EOL the notebook as I don't really see the market for such a notebook, but it has to be said it's computational performance is very impressive. Over all the upcoming hex core i7/i9 CPU's are going to offer far better balance and choice of GPU. Apple would be well suited to the Intel/AMD collaboration having no GPP relationship with NVidia, i7 performance with Vega graphics

Q-6

 

[TheRealAlex]

You Guys are Gonna be Very Mad. When you read this.

I highly encourage people NOT to buy the 8th Gen Intel Based 2018 MBP. Why ?
While true that 13” Dual Core MBP SKUs will be bumped to Quad Core SKUs
And 15” Quad Core MBP SKUs to 6 Core SKUs

Essentially, Intels been selling the same CPU for years now. Since 2013 Haswell
Since the die shrink of Haswell to 14nm Broadwell Intels been stuck.
Then came Skylake, Kabylake And now CoffeLake which is just Kabylake with 2 extra Cores, and before that we we have Skylake which was in the 2016 MBP.

To buy a new Intel CPU and Architecture you need to wait for 10nm Cannonlake and the Mobile Version Icelake.

By this time next year We will have 8 Core i7 Icelake Intel CPUs with many benefits.
And they Intel will spend 3-4 years stuck on 10nm 8 Core CPUs.

On the cusp of a major new architecture is the worst time to buy.

 

[Poki]

[...]And now CoffeLake which is just Kabylake with 2 extra Cores,[...]

This "just Kaby Lake with two extra cores" has almost double the multi core performance of the previous generation (speaking of the 15W/28W chips). I don't really care if the architecture itself isn't anything revolutionary, and I wouldn't advise anyone to wait another three to five years until Ocean Cove is here. Cannon Lake is "just" a die shrink too, not a completely new architecture.

 

[meme1255]

TRA: I'll buy whatever is released as I have no other choice (unless I wouldn't mind switching, which I (still) do.)
[doublepost=1525000395][/doublepost]

You Guys are Gonna be Very Mad. When you read this.

I highly encourage people NOT to buy the 8th Gen Intel Based 2018 MBP. Why ?

I'll buy whatever is released as I have no other choice (unless I wouldn't mind switching, which I (still) do.)

 

[leman]

Cannon Lake is "just" a die shrink too, not a completely new architecture.

Cannon Lake/Ice Lake will have AVX-512 though, which will be a game changer for many pro applications.

Still, Coffee Lake, especially if paired with Vega, would be a great upgrade. I will certainly upgrade to it and then maybe replace my machine next year if a refresh is good enough.

 

[falcon511]

I believe an i5-8300H or i5-8400H is in effect an i7-7700HQ to all intents and purposes, they have 4 core & 8 threads whereas the big difference for the i5-7300HQ was it lacked hyperthreading so was 4 core & 4 threads. The slight differences in clock speed won’t really make a huge difference tbh.

That sounds like a good cpu to use in a Non-TB model. It be weird for Apple to use an i5 in their base mbp. Maybe I am being optimistic.

I wonder if the i9 would work in the mbp. It is a 45w cpu. But would it generate a ton of heat?

 

[han_del_]

P.S. Here is the original press release from the first ever MacBook Pro introduction in 2006: https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2006/01/10Apple-Introduces-MacBook-Pro/

Yes, even with the first MBP the emphasis was on a thin form factor. Also remarkable is how much MORE we get with today's 15" MBP for $100 less!

2006 MBP specs and price:


Today:


And of course the beautiful 15" retina screen.

Apple should release a laptop with all of those above and use their magic (like reduce the 120hz to 60hz/use integrated graphics/whatever) to mantain battery life.

What is the refresh rate on the MBP? I thought 60hz while the iPad Pro has 120hz. I think the move should be toward 120 on all screens, mostly because I heard an eye doctor say it relieves eyestrain.

True. That is why they are using LPDDR3, which is much more energy-efficient than DDR3 and also more energy-efficient than DDR4 in some scenarios.



LPDDR3 is much more expensive than DDR4. What you are saying is utter nonsense. Using DDR4 would save them a lot of money.

P.S. See this summary https://www.reddit.com/r/hardware/comments/5dimal/lpddr3_vs_ddr4_power_usage/ for a discussion. And please educate yourself instead of repeating two year old misconceptions. This has been long discussed, explained and straightened out.

The issue is summed up by this reddit commentator: "LPDDR3 and DDR4 use about the same energy under load, however LPDDR RAM can ramp down into a low power state faster and consume far less energy while there."

Any word any keyboard improvements for the 2018 MBP?

I didn't like the new keyboard at first but have to admit I've grown to like it. Whereas the old keyboard was cushy (and there's still something to be said for that), I like how the new one is so snappy.

Need we say more...

I seriously tired of needing to baby Apple's finest with auto destruct dGPU's, as for keyboard's good luck with that one
​

My experience with Apple is exactly the opposite of what that video says. I keep buying Apple because their products last and last beyond the point where I want a new one. In fact, it was my two Windows-based laptops that died on me prematurely. As for the guy's experience as a repairman, it could be that people don't bother repairing cheap Windows laptops compared to more expensive Apple ones. I know I threw out my two Windows laptops. Far from feeling cheap, the MacBooks have always had a premium look and feel to them compared to the competition. Mine have always looked and felt SOLID. And have performed solidly, too.​

 

[Falhófnir]

That sounds like a good cpu to use in a Non-TB model. It be weird for Apple to use an i5 in their base mbp. Maybe I am being optimistic.

I wonder if the i9 would work in the mbp. It is a 45w cpu. But would it generate a ton of heat?

If it’s a 45W TDP chip I think it should go in a computer designed to handle that TDP, the i9 is just branding more or less (It's based on how well it performs in intel's binning tests so it's an identical chip to the i7s just one of the best performing ones that can sustain the highest clock speed)

 

[Poki]

That sounds like a good cpu to use in a Non-TB model. It be weird for Apple to use an i5 in their base mbp. Maybe I am being optimistic.

The 13" MacBook Pro also comes with an i5 standard in every single configuration. The differences are almost exclusively branding anyway. According to the review of the current XPS 13 with both the i5-8250U and the i7-8550U, there is no measurable speed difference beyond margins of error. Of course there would be a (small) difference if the cooling could handle max turbo frequencies of both chips, but still.

In the 15", the difference obviously would be bigger due to the i5-8400H only offering four cores. However, I could see them potentially offering a low end variant (maybe with a Radeon Pro 450 equivalent GPU) with this chip to replace the aging 2015 MBP they still offer. The Touch Bar strategy will be interesting to watch though.

 

[falcon511]

The 13" MacBook Pro also comes with an i5 standard in every single configuration. The differences are almost exclusively branding anyway. According to the review of the current XPS 13 with both the i5-8250U and the i7-8550U, there is no measurable speed difference beyond margins of error. Of course there would be a (small) difference if the cooling could handle max turbo frequencies of both chips, but still.

In the 15", the difference obviously would be bigger due to the i5-8400H only offering four cores. However, I could see them potentially offering a low end variant (maybe with a Radeon Pro 450 equivalent GPU) with this chip to replace the aging 2015 MBP they still offer. The Touch Bar strategy will be interesting to watch though.

I should clarify, when I said base mbp, I meant the 15 inch. The 13 I am well aware does offer an i5 as its default. My point is Apple usually offers the i7 in the 15 inch as that is their performance model. I do agree if they do a non touch bar 15 inch, then the 8400H would be a good fit.

 

[Queen6]

My experience with Apple is exactly the opposite of what that video says. I keep buying Apple because their products last and last beyond the point where I want a new one. In fact, it was my two Windows-based laptops that died on me prematurely. As for the guy's experience as a repairman, it could be that people don't bother repairing cheap Windows laptops compared to more expensive Apple ones. I know I threw out my two Windows laptops. Far from feeling cheap, the MacBooks have always had a premium look and feel to them compared to the competition. Mine have always looked and felt SOLID. And have performed solidly, too.

Mostly I find that equally priced Windows based notebooks are just as durable as any Mac. Personally I've had more Mac's die than their Windows alternatives, equally in fairness I've owned more Mac's over the years. Personally I think it's just a fallacy that Mac's last longer with the comparison of a cheap OEM to a $2K MBP being a joke.

Q-6

 

[Poki]

Mostly I find that equally priced Windows based notebooks are just as durable as any Mac. Personally I've had more Mac's die than their Windows alternatives, equally in fairness I've owned more Mac's over the years. Personally I think it's just a fallacy that Mac's last longer with the comparison of a cheap OEM to a $2K MBP being a joke.

Q-6

All high-end notebooks use pretty much the same components, so failure rates should be very similar. Some specific models may fail more often due to inadequate cooling or some other specific problems (like shipping them with defective GPUs), but apart from that, I wouldn't expect any brand of notebooks to last longer than any other brand.

Having said that, I had both MacBook Pros as well as Windows based notebooks last more than ten years of active daily use, so in my limited experience, they can last pretty much as long as they are fast enough to be of any use.