It's not impossible. However, I would say that it is unlikely. Would it run iOS or a modified version of OS X made to run under ARM processors (just like Apple did with OS X 10.4 Tiger, than run both on PowerPC and Intel)?
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Warming-up for the all-new redesigned retina 2014 (2015?) MacBook Air
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It's not impossible. However, I would say that it is unlikely. Would it run iOS or a modified version of OS X made to run under ARM processors (just like Apple did with OS X 10.4 Tiger, than run both on PowerPC and Intel)?
I still think Apple is planning to eventually introduce some form of touch screen support to OS X, and I would not be surprised if it was some sort of hybrid iOS/OS X.
They hinted at it (sort of) a few years ago when they did the whole "Back to the Mac" thing. Remember they introduced a bunch of features from iOS into OS X? One of them was Launchpad. I always wondered what the purpose of Launchpad was. A little useless seeing a giant grid of icons on a 24" monitor, no? But on a touch screen...
The last couple of OS X previews they kept talking up these beautiful, amazing, full-screen modes they were adding to a variety of apps such as iPhoto. How great is it to work in full-screen! This, after so many years of "we don't do full-screen apps on Macs, that's why the green button is to OPTIMIZE the window size, not MAXIMIZE the window...."
And of course we're all used to multitouch gestures on our big, awesome trackpads, the likes of which no Windows ultraportable maker has yet been able to duplicate.
I suspect Apple is watching Microsoft and learning from their mistakes. WinRT was a flop, I agree. But you know under the hood, WinRT is really exactly the same as regular Windows 8, with two key differences: (1) it's compiled for ARM instead of Intel, of course, and (2) it ships with a setting that ONLY allows it to run code signed by Microsoft (e.g. obtained from Microsoft App Store). There is a jailbreak available for RT that turns off this code-signing setting, allowing it to run any Windows software compiled for ARM. Office for RT is basically regular Windows Office just recompiled for ARM. So the only technical reason why WinRT couldn't be just like normal Windows, is the hassle it would be to get developers to recompile all those old legacy Windows applications for ARM. Of course, that would be a huge headache, and I'm not surprised at Microsoft's choice to keep it closed.
But Apple is in a much better position, if they wanted to, to get developers to build software for both ARM and Intel. They've done it before -- twice -- during the 68K to PPC and then the PPC to Intel transitions. Fat binaries, Universal binaries, Rosetta... Apple users and developers are no stranger to this.
Also, look at the Geekbench scores for the latest ARM chips... the iPad Air scored almost 3 times higher than the computer I'm using to type this post (2007 Santa Rosa MacBook Pro). If not already, then very soon, these mobile chips will be plenty powerful for everyday computing tasks.
So, if Apple wanted to, I think they could introduce some kind of hybrid product. Maybe this rumoured "iPad Pro" will run full OS X applications, either with an on-board low power Core processor, or OS X recompiled for ARM.
They hinted at it (sort of) a few years ago when they did the whole "Back to the Mac" thing. Remember they introduced a bunch of features from iOS into OS X? One of them was Launchpad. I always wondered what the purpose of Launchpad was. A little useless seeing a giant grid of icons on a 24" monitor, no? But on a touch screen...
The last couple of OS X previews they kept talking up these beautiful, amazing, full-screen modes they were adding to a variety of apps such as iPhoto. How great is it to work in full-screen! This, after so many years of "we don't do full-screen apps on Macs, that's why the green button is to OPTIMIZE the window size, not MAXIMIZE the window...."
And of course we're all used to multitouch gestures on our big, awesome trackpads, the likes of which no Windows ultraportable maker has yet been able to duplicate.
I suspect Apple is watching Microsoft and learning from their mistakes. WinRT was a flop, I agree. But you know under the hood, WinRT is really exactly the same as regular Windows 8, with two key differences: (1) it's compiled for ARM instead of Intel, of course, and (2) it ships with a setting that ONLY allows it to run code signed by Microsoft (e.g. obtained from Microsoft App Store). There is a jailbreak available for RT that turns off this code-signing setting, allowing it to run any Windows software compiled for ARM. Office for RT is basically regular Windows Office just recompiled for ARM. So the only technical reason why WinRT couldn't be just like normal Windows, is the hassle it would be to get developers to recompile all those old legacy Windows applications for ARM. Of course, that would be a huge headache, and I'm not surprised at Microsoft's choice to keep it closed.
But Apple is in a much better position, if they wanted to, to get developers to build software for both ARM and Intel. They've done it before -- twice -- during the 68K to PPC and then the PPC to Intel transitions. Fat binaries, Universal binaries, Rosetta... Apple users and developers are no stranger to this.
Also, look at the Geekbench scores for the latest ARM chips... the iPad Air scored almost 3 times higher than the computer I'm using to type this post (2007 Santa Rosa MacBook Pro). If not already, then very soon, these mobile chips will be plenty powerful for everyday computing tasks.
So, if Apple wanted to, I think they could introduce some kind of hybrid product. Maybe this rumoured "iPad Pro" will run full OS X applications, either with an on-board low power Core processor, or OS X recompiled for ARM.
You reference 'professional'
When I think of 'professional' needs, I think of software. Professional engineers (both software and hardware) often require special software tools for development.
Xcode (used for writing software for Apple products) is only available running OSX. Why in the world would Apple allow you to use an iOS device to do this work when they can sell you an OSX laptop to write it.
Then there is other special software like MATLAB (the standard software for research in many fields). Will they recompile it for iOS? I doubt it and I certainly wouldn't count on it.
Finally there is BootCamp that opens up all kinds of MS Windows program possibilities. Many professionals have to use software written for the MS OS (even if they prefer OSX)
If you move away from the comparability of OSX to use iOS you have removed the requirements for many professionals. Having a keyboard is just the beginning of what professionals need.
Intel is still king (for now). ARM is catching up but not equal quite yet and certainly not fast enough for emulating x86 code.
When the MBA saw its last major redesign it was really the best portable computer to run MS Windows. Not being able to directly run MS Windows would be a major loss in my mind.
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Of course it is, but then it isn't a MacBook any more. It is an 'iOS Book' which is a very different thing.
(And very much a gamble on Apple's part. The OSX compatibility is gone and that may push a lot of people away).
Apple is certainly investigating some sort of hybrid hardware, and some merge between OS X and iOS. Apple does that and, quite frankly, every large company does that. What we don't know is if this Apple hybrid will ever see the light of day and which form it will adopt. And, if Apple ever releases it, we don't know when it will be.
I am sure that in some 5 or 10 years we will be using some sort of totally different device. Tablets will be much more powerful by then, and laptops will be smaller. The difference between tablets and laptops is getting smaller with every generation, and soon they'll probably be the very same thing. Look at the rumors: a 12-inch MacBook Air and a 12.9-inch iPad Pro, and some users are betting they will be just one device, and not two. A merge is of course on the works, whether Apple wants it or not. It's part of evolution.
But I don't think it will happen this year. It's still too early for that. Perhaps in some 5 years or so...
If I had to guess, I would say that Apple will bet the future on iOS. iOS will become more powerful, and 64-bit processors will open more possibilities. But we're not quite there yet.
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I agree with you. I am a user of Microsoft Office and I cannot rely on the iPad. And even if I had Microsoft Office for iPad, I still wouldn't be able to use the iPad, as I have to install add-ons and multi-task. So, the iPad is still far from being a full-featured professional device.
i meant Macbook Air with Lightening Connector, A8 processor and Mavericks as the operating system not iOS.
i think this will help the Macbook Air become thinner,lighter and more portable...
I think Apple will avoid hybrid iOS/OS X as much as they can but i see them making a Surface-like Keyboard for the Macbook Air NOT the iPad Pro.
I doubt that the A8 chip has more raw horse power than my 2011 MBA with the i5 in it....i HIGHLY doubt that.
An A8 processor is an ARM based device. That means compatibility with all previous OSX programs (and MS Windows programs through BootCamp) is gone.
I wouldn't be any more valuable to me or any other professionals if it is running an ARM based version of Mavericks compared to running iOS.
I would feel tricked if I bought what was termed a MacBook Air computer and it was really running an ARM based version of Mavericks (very MS 'Surface' like).
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bay trail would still be a big upgrade over any ARM processor ...
nice 2 in 1s at CES right now
nice 2 in 1s at CES right now
Considering there are rumours of a completely redesigned Macbook Air, and a new iPad Pro at the same time. I hardly think these are two different products.
And come on. Is not people seriously waiting for the inevitable "we merged our two products together" announcement?
And come on. Is not people seriously waiting for the inevitable "we merged our two products together" announcement?
if anything I would expect the Air to stay roughly the same as far as specs but be redesigned to conform with the newer "Black and Grey" design language of the iPhone, New Mac Pro and iPad Mini.
At least that is what I am hoping will happen by the time I retire my 2012 laptop.
At least that is what I am hoping will happen by the time I retire my 2012 laptop.
The iPhone and new iPad Mini have retina displays while the Mac Pro can now drive a 4K monitor.
Thus, the new MBA now needs to have a retina display.
I would agree except it may be an issue with pushing the boundaries of a thin-light form factor and keeping heat and battery life under control.
Also, in order to maintain the MBP and MBA lines as distinct, there need to be distinguishing benefits of moving up from an Air to a Pro.
Right now there is only a marginal weight difference, a decent but not huge CPU difference and retina to differentiate.
If both have retina display than for a lot of users the MBA will beat the more expensive MBP. They will be paying for more CPU they may not need and carrying about a pound more weight for the benefit.
You can't use the current MBA weight and 'thinness' as a comparison. That argument is only valid if the new MBA is not any thinner and lighter than the current model. It ought to be better.
Everything will go retina soon so that will not be a differentiating factor very long. Maybe the MBP will have more accurate colors.
The biggest challenge is price. The MBA is now the entry model. It didn't use to be that way. How can Apple possibly push the envelop when people expect it to be Apple's cheapest laptop. Because of this factor Apple will never make an impressive MBA again.
I am being convinced that the MBA will only become thinner because of some damn A8 chip that uses very little battery power. They could make it super thin and light yet run the toy iOS
that is kind of how I see it as well.
It used to be the sought after elite model when it was introduced. Now it is the cheapest MB you can buy, with the rMBP models having stolen it's differentiating features of lightness and long battery life. But adding in higher speed, and resolution.
If you juxtapose the IOS device lineup things get weirder. The Ipad air is the top of the line for IOS devices, the opposite for Macbook Air where only the mini is any cheaper.
I am really thinking the Ipad pro may kill the Air entirely if it is a real thing.
Same as the Macbook (non Pro) was deleted a while back.
Apple is not known for allowing many SKUs to flourish.
If they do go with an A8 (ARM based) processor in the new MBA then they probably espect people ike me, who need an x86 (Intel based) processor, to switch to the 13" MBP. That does not work for me because I want the small footprint of the 11" MBA. I have no interest in a 11" iOS (A8) MacBook Air or a 13" MacBook Pro.
I'm curious why you need the Intel architecture?
Is it dev work?
I know on the chip side Intel likes it's customers to buy "suites" of its stuff. For example, to have a certain Intel badge on a Windows desktop like "Centrino" you would need to have Intel wifi as well as their ACH/northbridge and CPU. The CPU by itself is not sufficient for the marque. There are also some energy efficiency features that require all Intel fittings (and the ultrabook form factor was pioneered by Intel, not Apple btw).
Likewise I expect that they have package incentives for their customers who buy all Intel chipsets for their CPUs. So it may be in Apple's benefit to stick with Intel. However the last few teardowns I have seen of Apple products show less Intel stuff not more. Which does kind of seem like moving away from them.
But...and it's a big but, Thunderbolt is an Intel thing. I do believe they need to have Intel chips to take advantage of TB, or TB2 for that matter.
I am hoping this means the MBA will stay Intel. I see an 11" MBA in my future, since my nMP will be doing the heavy lifting, I can afford to have a less burly laptop now (which means less sore shoulder!).
most software will not run on arm..plain and simple..
also..anything more cpu intensive would suffer greatly on ARM vs intel
also..anything more cpu intensive would suffer greatly on ARM vs intel
whether software will run is usually a function of the OS.
Anyone who has been on Macs for more than 10 years has already been using an OS that supports mutually exclusive hardware (PowerPC and Intel).
If Apple is idiotic enough to think it is a good idea to go down that road again, just to make a thin laptop thinner, they can certainly do it.
And anything CPU intensive would be better served by a more fully fledged Mac than the Air.
the os was coded based on the cpu architecture of the device its supporting...so yes...it matters
arm is not sufficient for my needs
arm is not sufficient for my needs
Damn it. We might lose the ability to use Windows programs! What a loss. NOT
i'm doubting the retina display rumors. even if the rumor battery savings are true for the display itself, broadwell won't come early enough for macbook air to utilize it before the summer update. I'm thinking this is the year of the ipad Pro. Macbook air will get a silent refresh, awaiting perhaps a late fall 12" if there is one. THis summer, we'll get the ipad Pro with the IGZO display and similar retina specs and perhaps an accompanying apple dock/keyboard.
12-inch IGZO display?
2304x1440 resolution?
Thinner and lighter?
Touch screen?
New materials?
Cheaper?
Better battery life?
this literally sounds like ipad pro specs. 12" check, higher resolution? check, thinner and lighter? probs not, touch screen? yes, new materials? most definitely not, cheaper? than a mba yes, better battery life? than a mba? yes
12-inch IGZO display?
2304x1440 resolution?
Thinner and lighter?
Touch screen?
New materials?
Cheaper?
Better battery life?
this literally sounds like ipad pro specs. 12" check, higher resolution? check, thinner and lighter? probs not, touch screen? yes, new materials? most definitely not, cheaper? than a mba yes, better battery life? than a mba? yes
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To me, it will be the difference between purchasing the new MBA or being forced to buy a Window's Ultra-Book.
Just because you don't have to use programs requiring MS Windows doesn't mean it is the same for everybody else. I much prefer OSX but there are lots of engineering / design software tools that are not written for both operating systems.
I am stuck with it.
Interesting thread. Looking around at the latest batch of attempted Windows hybrids, there's certainly more maturity there but I'm not really sure Apple needs to respond yet. I remember it wasn't that long ago that Apple's leadership made remarks about toaster-fridges (IIRC). If these rumours are to be believed, I guess they now feel comfortable with their software and hardware to give this a shot.
All I'll say is even if I hadn't just bought a 2013 MBA (which I still marvel at every single day), I wouldn't want to be an early adopter of Apple's first hybrid device.
Am I the only one who's actually worried about the software? Apple's done a fair bit on the software front lately and the QC hasn't been good enough IMHO. iCloud flakiness, Maps, Mail, iOS 7 lag and other issues are uppermost in my mind. These are not peripheral issues with peripheral software and it doesn't inspire me with confidence for the future.
I'd love to see the research showing that people would use an iPad-MBA hybrid outside the house a lot more than the current MBA. Anything over pocket-size, or an iPad mini at most, would go through roughly the same decision-making process when walking out the door I would've thought. Ie 9.7" iPad and 11"/12"/13" MBA would be viewed roughly similar in terms of likelihood to leave home with or without it, whether it weighs 400g or 1.3kg. I could be wildly wrong there.
All I'll say is even if I hadn't just bought a 2013 MBA (which I still marvel at every single day), I wouldn't want to be an early adopter of Apple's first hybrid device.
Am I the only one who's actually worried about the software? Apple's done a fair bit on the software front lately and the QC hasn't been good enough IMHO. iCloud flakiness, Maps, Mail, iOS 7 lag and other issues are uppermost in my mind. These are not peripheral issues with peripheral software and it doesn't inspire me with confidence for the future.
I'd love to see the research showing that people would use an iPad-MBA hybrid outside the house a lot more than the current MBA. Anything over pocket-size, or an iPad mini at most, would go through roughly the same decision-making process when walking out the door I would've thought. Ie 9.7" iPad and 11"/12"/13" MBA would be viewed roughly similar in terms of likelihood to leave home with or without it, whether it weighs 400g or 1.3kg. I could be wildly wrong there.
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