Warming-up for the all-new redesigned retina 2014 (2015?) MacBook Air

[skaertus]

There was a time when the MBA commanded a higher price than Apple's other larger laptops. This was contrary to your argument (and what I meant when I suggested that 'Apple could make the MBA special...again').

I was in these same forums then and I remember several posts being critical of people who favored the MBA. To paraphrase,"They are getting so much less computer and paying more more money just so it could be a little thinner and maybe a pound lighter!" This was said as if people who paid the additional costs and made the performance sacrifice were idiots.

I am an electrical engineer and I work in an industry where smaller size wins (contracts). There is no doubt in the electronics world that smaller sized components often demands a higher price tag. For example, one can always choose to go with 'chip-scale' packaging where the silicon plastic packaging is replaced with circuits not much bigger than the silicon die itself (more expensive to make the chips and to place them on the PC board). This is just one example where you can pay more to make things smaller. They may have other options that can make it smaller for a higher price that are available. We have no clue what Apple could do if they spent the extra cash.

It was a long time ago when you had to pay a premium for a MBA and maybe Apple won't go there again. I just don't think you can make blanket statements thinking that smaller MBA will automatically mean it will be their cheapest computer.

It very well may turn out to be that the new 12" MBA is an entry level machine as you suggest (and I am setting myself up to be disappointed) but, at this point, we really don't know.

I remember when Apple released the very first MacBook Air, and it was not so long ago. It was in early 2008, and it was indeed very expensive. The Air only became cheaper in 2010.

I understand that smaller components are more expensive. But that does not mean that people in general will understand that. As you mentioned, people were complaining when Apple first released the Air, that it meant paying more for a lesser computer. People understand "big" and "small", and understand differences in products categories. Look at Apple product line and you will see that Apple tends to replicate what is in people's minds.

The cheapest product in Apple's line-up is the iPod shuffle, which is also the smaller. And the most expensive products are the largest Apple laptop (the 15-inch retina MacBook Pro) and the largest Apple desktop (the 27-inch iMac). People understand that a laptop may be more expensive than a desktop, but somehow fail to understand that a small laptop may be more expensive than a large laptop. It's weird, and Apple plays with that.

So, look at what we already have as a rumor. The rumored screen is a 12-inch with a 2304x1440 resolution. It is smaller, but the pixel density is the same then the screen in the 13-inch retina MacBook Pro. That means that the 12-inch screen in the next Air will be cheaper to manufacture than the 13-inch screen in the Pro. Smaller is more expensive, but when it has the same functionality. The processor in the 12-inch Air will be slower than the processors in the higher-end laptops.

 

[rambo47]

I'd like to see a 15" MBA. Thin, light, insanely great battery life. That's the one for me!!

 

[skaertus]

I'd like to see a 15" MBA. Thin, light, insanely great battery life. That's the one for me!!

You know that this is very unlikely to happen, right? The 15-inch Air has been rumored for years and never became a reality. In fact, the current 15-inch Retina Pro ended up being the 15-inch Air, as it is thin, light (for its size) and has SSD instead of HDD. The price point may not be what you would expect, but, hey, this is Apple, it is supposed to be expensive...

 

[iRun26.2]

I remember when Apple released the very first MacBook Air, and it was not so long ago. It was in early 2008, and it was indeed very expensive. The Air only became cheaper in 2010.

I understand that smaller components are more expensive. But that does not mean that people in general will understand that. As you mentioned, people were complaining when Apple first released the Air, that it meant paying more for a lesser computer. People understand "big" and "small", and understand differences in products categories. Look at Apple product line and you will see that Apple tends to replicate what is in people's minds.

The cheapest product in Apple's line-up is the iPod shuffle, which is also the smaller. And the most expensive products are the largest Apple laptop (the 15-inch retina MacBook Pro) and the largest Apple desktop (the 27-inch iMac). People understand that a laptop may be more expensive than a desktop, but somehow fail to understand that a small laptop may be more expensive than a large laptop. It's weird, and Apple plays with that.

So, look at what we already have as a rumor. The rumored screen is a 12-inch with a 2304x1440 resolution. It is smaller, but the pixel density is the same then the screen in the 13-inch retina MacBook Pro. That means that the 12-inch screen in the next Air will be cheaper to manufacture than the 13-inch screen in the Pro. Smaller is more expensive, but when it has the same functionality. The processor in the 12-inch Air will be slower than the processors in the higher-end laptops.

Well, of course you are right.

My argument was kind of silly.

 

[Steve121178]

This thread needs to be retitled "Warming-up for the all-new redesigned 2015 MacBook Air"

 

[skaertus]

This thread needs to be retitled "Warming-up for the all-new redesigned 2015 MacBook Air"

There still may be hope.

However, it seems like the latest rumors, about the imminent release of a refresh, are true: https://www.macrumors.com/2014/04/28/apple-updated-macbook-airs/

The redesigned Air is to come only later this year (or perhaps in 2015 only).

 

[MyopicPaideia]

There still may be hope.

However, it seems like the latest rumors, about the imminent release of a refresh, are true: https://www.macrumors.com/2014/04/28/apple-updated-macbook-airs/

The redesigned Air is to come only later this year (or perhaps in 2015 only).

Yeah, but it feels just like the refresh of the non-retina pros right when the new retinas were released. That is my hope, even if it could very well be an Intel driven update (pushing out an updated processor and discontinuing the older version).

 

[skaertus]

Yeah, but it feels just like the refresh of the non-retina pros right when the new retinas were released. That is my hope, even if it could very well be an Intel driven update (pushing out an updated processor and discontinuing the older version).

I don't think it would be the same. The 12-inch retina MacBook Air will probably come with a Broadwell processor. The retina screen would need additional battery life, and Apple would only be able to deliver that with the power-saving capabilities of Broadwell (which, according to Intel, is 30% more power-efficient than Haswell).

In addition, there seem to be two part numbers only, so only two MacBook Airs released tomorrow (the 11-inch and the 13-inch).

The retina version will come out when Broadwell arrives, which will happen in Q4 2014 or Q1 2015.

 

[citivolus]

So are you getting the current MBA just to sell it later in the year and get the rMBA when it (hopefully) gets released?

No, I found a Late 2013 rMBP on Craigslist for a steal: 4 GB/128GB with Applecare in mint condition for $950. This should tide me over until the fall, when I can then sell it to buy whatever Apple decides to release at that point!

 

[MyopicPaideia]

I don't think it would be the same. The 12-inch retina MacBook Air will probably come with a Broadwell processor. The retina screen would need additional battery life, and Apple would only be able to deliver that with the power-saving capabilities of Broadwell (which, according to Intel, is 30% more power-efficient than Haswell).

In addition, there seem to be two part numbers only, so only two MacBook Airs released tomorrow (the 11-inch and the 13-inch).

The retina version will come out when Broadwell arrives, which will happen in Q4 2014 or Q1 2015.

Sorry, that's not what I meant. I in no way believe we are going to see the new model now. Possibly announced At WWDC and shipping in the Fall, or its own event later. But, between iPhone, iPad, possibly iWatch, and this, Apple will need two events to cover it - probably iPhone/iWatch and iPad/Macs if nothing is announced at WWDC.

 

[skaertus]

No, I found a Late 2013 rMBP on Craigslist for a steal: 4 GB/128GB with Applecare in mint condition for $950. This should tide me over until the fall, when I can then sell it to buy whatever Apple decides to release at that point!

That certainly looks like a steal. You can get that and wait for the next refresh, when Apple will unveil the retina Air model. You may even wait until the retina Air gets a price drop...

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Sorry, that's not what I meant. I in no way believe we are going to see the new model now. Possibly announced At WWDC and shipping in the Fall, or its own event later. But, between iPhone, iPad, possibly iWatch, and this, Apple will need two events to cover it - probably iPhone/iWatch and iPad/Macs if nothing is announced at WWDC.

I don't think Apple will announce the retina MacBook Air at WWDC if it updates the current model tomorrow. Probably they will get two events later in the year, one in September for the iPhone (and maybe iWatch, if it ever comes to be released), and another one in October for the iPad and the Mac. Apple has been doing so in the last few years.

 

[MacRazySwe]

I got sick of waiting. I figured the rMBA won't be released in june, and most likely not even until the end of 2014. A store nearby had 10 % off on all Apple-products, so I managed to get a 13" rMBP 2.4/8/256 for a great price. Retina sure is nice.

 

[skaertus]

I got sick of waiting. I figured the rMBA won't be released in june, and most likely not even until the end of 2014. A store nearby had 10 % off on all Apple-products, so I managed to get a 13" rMBP 2.4/8/256 for a great price. Retina sure is nice.

And there you go. Apple has just updated the current MacBook Air line-up. At least the prices dropped. Well, in the U.S. Here in Brazil prices are as expensive as they always were.

 

[jclardy]

I don't think it would be the same. The 12-inch retina MacBook Air will probably come with a Broadwell processor. The retina screen would need additional battery life, and Apple would only be able to deliver that with the power-saving capabilities of Broadwell (which, according to Intel, is 30% more power-efficient than Haswell).

In addition, there seem to be two part numbers only, so only two MacBook Airs released tomorrow (the 11-inch and the 13-inch).

The retina version will come out when Broadwell arrives, which will happen in Q4 2014 or Q1 2015.

That is assuming Apple is sticking with the intel roadmap for this 12" machine...

 

[petvas]

So, one question I do have: Who can change the title of this thread?
2015 will be the year of the Retina MBA

 

[Nautilus007]

They will put a retina display inside, add/remove ports, change the hinge..and call it revolutionary. In the end it will still be probably one of the best computers on this planet even with lackluster updates.

 

[skaertus]

That is assuming Apple is sticking with the intel roadmap for this 12" machine...

Yes, but that is what I think it is likely to happen.

I don't think Apple will get any early access to Broadwell processors, as it has not gained such privileged access since it decided to change the integrated graphics card of the Core 2 Duo processors, putting an NVIDIA-powered video card instead of the default Intel one.

And I don't think Apple will release the 12-inch retina Air powered by a Haswell processor. The retina display will consume too much power and, to keep battery life at the current amazing 12 hours, Apple will have to rely on the power-saving capabilities of the Broadwell processor (which, according to Intel, is 30% more power efficient than Haswell).

So, I assume Apple is sticking with Intel's roadmap. Should I not?

----------

So, one question I do have: Who can change the title of this thread?
2015 will be the year of the Retina MBA

I can!

But I am not so sure yet which title to put...

 

[leonw]

So probably no announcement about release and specs/retina/ batterylife before october? And price?
Could this pricedrop mean that Apple wants to get rid of stock so they will only continue with the 12"rMBA. Or will the new rMBA get a premium price and the 11" mba continues as cheap entry model?

 

[dblissmn]

I wouldn't want to try and run Retina off Haswell ultra-low-voltage integrated graphics. Broadwell is a big boost in graphics power and still manages to reduce power consumption. A pity it has gotten so delayed.

 

[skaertus]

So probably no announcement about release and specs/retina/ batterylife before october? And price?
Could this pricedrop mean that Apple wants to get rid of stock so they will only continue with the 12"rMBA. Or will the new rMBA get a premium price and the 11" mba continues as cheap entry model?

In my point of view, now that Apple has just released a new MacBook Air, October is the earliest possible date in which a new version could be announced. Perhaps early 2015.

As for price, it is really hard to tell. Apple has been consistently dropping the prices of the Air. Now it has reached a new low. Will it raise the prices again when the new version is released? Will it repeat the fiasco of the 13-inch Retina Pro launch? Or will it keep prices low, in a time where Macs are being replaced by iPads?

 

[psik]

I'll be getting the has well refreshed rmbp then which should also come out by number hopefully

 

[walkthruwalls]

If memory serves me right, newly redesigned products like the launch of the Retina Pros, very first Macbook Airs, first Aluminum Macbook Pros, first iPhones, have an uber expensive price tag so I wouldn't count on a low price when we see the new 12 inch, fanless Air. The good news is that the second iteration of these products will see a price decrease as the products gain production momentum and make their way into a bigger mainstream market.

With that, I can't wait to see what's in store when this product comes to fruition, then weeks later read real world user reviews and see all the kinks and flaws ironed out before I decide to get the second generation.

I'm rather very curious about the GPU performance if this is indeed fanless. Would we see throttling issues with a fanless Broadwell on modern games? The current Airs' HD5000 is quite efficient in gaming. Taking a step back in GPU performance with a new product could be a sad transition, at least for one or two years. That's gonna make some buyers hold their money and get a slightly bulkier Pro.

Nope, I don't even want to think about a non-Intel Air unless we're ready to say goodbye to Bootcamp and have tons of OSX software incompatibility issues.

 

[skaertus]

If memory serves me right, newly redesigned products like the launch of the Retina Pros, very first Macbook Airs, first Aluminum Macbook Pros, first iPhones, have an uber expensive price tag so I wouldn't count on a low price when we see the new 12 inch, fanless Air. The good news is that the second iteration of these products will see a price decrease as the products gain production momentum and make their way into a bigger mainstream market.

With that, I can't wait to see what's in store when this product comes to fruition, then weeks later read real world user reviews and see all the kinks and flaws ironed out before I decide to get the second generation.

I'm rather very curious about the GPU performance if this is indeed fanless. Would we see throttling issues with a fanless Broadwell on modern games? The current Airs' HD5000 is quite efficient in gaming. Taking a step back in GPU performance with a new product could be a sad transition, at least for one or two years. That's gonna make some buyers hold their money and get a slightly bulkier Pro.

Nope, I don't even want to think about a non-Intel Air unless we're ready to say goodbye to Bootcamp and have tons of OSX software incompatibility issues.

Not always. Not always.

The retina iPad was sold for exactly the same price as the second-generation iPad it replaced. The iPhone 4, with the retina display, did the same. And so did the iPhone 5.

The first MacBook Air was expensive, but the redesigned model that replaced it was actually cheaper.

I honestly don't think the new Air will be more expensive; if it is more expensive, I don't think it will be by much.

The launch of the retina MacBook Pro cannot be taken as a comparison. The new Pro was unveiled with a 2880x1800 display that no other laptop used at the time, and that certainly made the machine more expensive. In addition, retina Pro used SSDs, which are far more expensive than traditional HDDs as used in the non-retina Pros. Even the lower-end retina Pro came with a 256 GB SSD, which is very expensive. All of this justified the high price tag.

Now, with the Air, there are no such things. Retina displays got cheaper (the 13-inch retina Pro is down from US$ 1,699 at launch to US$ 1,299 in the entry level). And the current Air already uses SSDs, so this would represent no price increase. I expect Apple to keep its prices, or to raise them only slightly, when unveiling the new models.

I could, of course, be wrong.

 

[skaertus]

As for pricing, it is interesting to see right now that the current MacBook Air is competing with the iPad in the same price range, as some websites are pointing out:

http://www.tuaw.com/2014/04/29/the-macbook-air-is-directly-competing-with-ipad-pricing-for-the/

http://www.zdnet.com/new-macbook-air-vs-ipad-air-closer-than-you-think-7000028961/

128 GB iPad Air (wi-fi): US$ 799
128 GB iPad Air (wi-fi + cellular): US$ 929
128 GB 11-inch MacBook Air (2013): US$ 799 in Best Buy and some other stores
128 GB 11-inch MacBook Air (2014): US$ 899

Very close indeed. Sure, these are high end iPad Airs and low end MacBook Airs. Still, they are in the same price range, despite the Macs being far more capable machines, although they may have different functions.

 

[petvas]

As for pricing, it is interesting to see right now that the current MacBook Air is competing with the iPad in the same price range, as some websites are pointing out:

http://www.tuaw.com/2014/04/29/the-macbook-air-is-directly-competing-with-ipad-pricing-for-the/

http://www.zdnet.com/new-macbook-air-vs-ipad-air-closer-than-you-think-7000028961/

128 GB iPad Air (wi-fi): US$ 799
128 GB iPad Air (wi-fi + cellular): US$ 929
128 GB 11-inch MacBook Air (2013): US$ 799 in Best Buy and some other stores
128 GB 11-inch MacBook Air (2014): US$ 899

Very close indeed. Sure, these are high end iPad Airs and low end MacBook Airs. Still, they are in the same price range, despite the Macs being far more capable machines, although they may have different functions.

I am happy that Apple is pricing the MBA a bit lower. People that need a great laptop can get one for under a thousand dollars, and yes, the difference to the iPad is not that big anymore, especially if you consider the additional storage you get with an MBA..
I think that Apple has also seen the negative trend that tablets have on the market...
I believe that tablets won't replace laptops, at least not for the next 50 years...
Sales are dropping and even big analyst companies believe that tablets growth is slowing down. I think that people start to understand how limiting tablets really are..
The MBA on the other side is great and I love it!