WayTools' TextBlade Keyboard to Start Shipping to Test Group Users Next Week

[Night Spring]

Is balanced coverage something to be feared? I think not.

I think the situation is such that it's impossible for MacRumors to give balanced coverage. I think that's why they decided to bow out.

The comments threads here are worthless as long as they are full of people endlessly covering the same ground.

If you want to say what you like there is a Sub. There it will do no harm.

What makes you think MacRumors is capable of finding new grounds to cover? And what is a "Sub"? I'm not familiar with that term.

 

[Kabeyun]

I didn't set out to trick, deceive, or disappoint anyone and I apologize if I have unwittingly done so.

I can't speak for anyone else, but for the record I never felt you misled anyone on purpose. You just let your excitement compromise your objectivity. Reread your first write up with a journalist's eyes and you must agree. As much as I appreciate your comments, you owe no one an apology for malice aforethought.

I also don't know if it's necessary for MR to discontinue coverage of WayTools so much as change the focus from eager anticipation to critical appraisal. If that's your Editor's decision so be it, but there is definitely a story here. That's obvious to you now. It's just not the one you set out to write. Some good investigative journalism just might produce an interesting piece. I'd positively love to read a quality WayTools exposé from a top tier tech blog. Tell us about average product delays, official responses to I requested order cancellations, interview people who spent money, find out about their finances. And if there's nothing there, at least someone did some digging.

And to everyone complaining that with this decision you lost your only other source of product information, I have two comments:
1. You just proved my point.
2. Oh, please.

And quite short for one of your posts?

ikr? lol!

 

[Rolanbek]

I think the situation is such that it's impossible for MacRumors to give balanced coverage. I think that's why they decided to bow out.

If the claims in more hostile posts here are incorrect, how could coverage be biased? Ducking out sends the wrong message. Either that Macrumors folds under public pressure or that the claims had weight. By pressing on and giving fair coverage they extend a middle digit, quite gracefully, to all of that.

If the issue is the breakdown of trust between MR and WT over disclosure, then that is not the impression that WT are giving.

What makes you think MacRumors is capable of finding new grounds to cover? And what is a "Sub"? I'm not familiar with that term.

People have yet to see any coverage of the device other than here or on the Vendor site. It is probable that there will be no other opportunity to see one in the wild until general shipment. Who can guess when that will be.

There is a tiny subreddit. There is a lot of noise from me in there, but I think it evens out the hagiographic content in the WT forum.

 

[dabigkahuna]

Reviewing "Bias"

The article, on my display, not counting pictures, is just 92 lines of text.

There are 4 (second paragraph) that are definitely negative - about the delays. The remaining 2 are somewhat negative since they are telling people they have to wait more for TREG testing to happen.

Then next 6 lines continue that TREG testing part which, again, is negative to most people waiting.

Then 8 more, quoting WT about the TREG testing situation so we are already up to 20 lines that are either definitely negative or at least things people won't like about what WT is doing. Yet this is followed by 6 more about customers having to wait! So, already 26 out of 92 at least somewhat negative.

Near the end we have 4 more lines warning about the delays or how new customers will be waiting longer.

And finally, 2 more about WT lack of communication. So, that brings us to 32 lines that are tend towards negativity, leaving us with just 60 for EVERYTHING ELSE.

I didn't even include the negative aspect when she says there will be a learning curve. I consider that a simple, logical, observation.

Which covered shipping information, the box it came in, and various other experiences and observations which a lot of people would really like to know about.

So, what about this idea that it was too positive. Well, there seems to be darn little of that since most of the rest was a simple recitation of facts.

Let's see, there is this: "The pieces of the TextBlade feel delicate but sturdy, and I'm still impressed with the functionality vs. the size."

Dang, that is just such irresponsible journalism!

Nah, can't be that. Ah, maybe this: "but with a launch on the horizon, that silence is at an end."

Must be. I mean, we all know of the many delays so it must be really bad to write as if this time is the charm. Of course, it may be. Or may not. But really, that's about all critics have got if you want to complain about it not being unbiased.

Or, of course, one can always bring up old stories and complain that they weren't included.

But this article is quite fair and covers the things the same way we see most products covered.

 

[Night Spring]

By pressing on and giving fair coverage they extend a middle digit, quite gracefully, to all of that.

If the issue is the breakdown of trust between MR and WT over disclosure, then that is not the impression that WT are giving.

Well, the way I see it, no matter what MacRumors writes, someone is going to accuse them of being biased one way or another. There is no graceful way to continue with this story.

And what do you mean by "impression that WT are giving"? Has somebody at WT said something? If so, can you post a link? I'm finding the WT site confusing and having a hard time locating recent postings.

 

[Rolanbek]

DBK Thank you for your line by line Analysis. It was unnecessary.

Who exactly are you talking to? It is not clear from your post what you are trying to achieve.

here Night Spring

https://forum.waytools.com/t/the-irrational-claim-a-victim-and-hurt-us-all/1433/11

 

[Night Spring]

here Night Spring

https://forum.waytools.com/t/the-irrational-claim-a-victim-and-hurt-us-all/1433/11

Thank you for the link. That was interesting.

Google turned up some articles covering the TextBlade delay.
http://www.zdnet.com/article/tiny-textblade-keyboard-still-not-shipping-after-five-months/
http://tow.com/2015/12/15/waiting-for-textblade-2016-calendar/

To me, they read as objective and balanced, but I'm sure there are people who would find things to object to in them.

 

[shareef777]

I want to give everyone an update on MacRumors' position on the TextBlade. We've read through the comments posted here, taken into account emails we've received, and looked through information on the WayTools forums. We've heard what you have to say and we won't be continuing on to do a review or further coverage of the TextBlade.

To set the record straight, I have never had any kind of monetary or personal relationship with the WayTools staff. I've been criticized for the tone of my posts, which I wrote as someone who was just as excited as you were about a unique keyboard on the market that went above and beyond anything else available.

I want to explain something about my early posts that I think gives some insight into why I trusted what WayTools had to say. When I visited WayTools in March, I saw and used a finished TextBlade product. I saw a room full of engineers typing on finished TextBlades.

I saw the components for hundreds of TextBlades and rows and rows of completed TextBlades. Having used one myself, which seemed to function well, I had no reason to think that the TextBlade wouldn't be shipping out soon. I was told about a change to the butterfly, but I was also told an updated version was already in production and would ship soon.

Ahead of my second post in July, I was told a lot of reasonable information about why there had been a delay since March and how those problems had all been fixed. A lot of products can get delayed at the stage from limited production to mass production, so I gave WayTools the benefit of the doubt because the TextBlade finally seemed ready to ship (to Night Spring -- I *did* do research on this).

This time, I saw dozens and dozens of completed TextBlades lined up. I saw people using them. I saw photos of the TextBlade production line in Malaysia and I was told hundreds of TextBlades were being made and were going to be ready to go out in July.

Was I overly optimistic and perhaps too trusting? Yes. Was I out to deceive? Absolutely not. As the months ticked by after July, I decided not to continue on with coverage until the TextBlade started shipping. This time around, I had a TextBlade in my possession at the time of the post, concrete proof that WayTools is finally letting them out into the wild. I wouldn't have done a post at all had I not received multiple requests to do so.

I didn't ignore the production issues and the long delays in this most recent post, but many of you feel that I did not go far enough highlighting the customer service problems. To that end, I would like to say that there are problems that I was not even aware of, such as the canceling of orders.

A lot of the accusations in this thread have been off base and highly stressful for me. I've been struggling figure out how to explain myself in a way that you guys would find satisfactory, and I'm still not sure how to do it. The idea that I would deceive MacRumors readers or write something untruthful for money (or whatever other benefit I'm supposedly getting out of this) is so entirely preposterous to me that I've been at a loss for words.

I've been with MacRumors for 2012 and I love my job. I love the community. I love writing for all of you. I didn't set out to trick, deceive, or disappoint anyone and I apologize if I have unwittingly done so.

The update is appreciated. A lot of people (myself included) look upon MacRumors reviews as guidance for a lot of our purchasing decisions. At the end of the day, don't ever stress about what people that you don't know post (myself included ... again). Learn from it and move on. But you're already proved you're not with WayTools cause you sent an update ;-)

 

[bobdobalina]

I want to give everyone an update on MacRumors' position on the TextBlade. We've read through the comments posted here, taken into account emails we've received, and looked through information on the WayTools forums. We've heard what you have to say and we won't be continuing on to do a review or further coverage of the TextBlade.

…

We all just want a great portable keyboard.

I never thought the original MacRumors articles were out of line. But I do support your (MacRumors) decision to suspend further reviews of TextBlade. This product has been very problematic and you could not have anticipated that. But one year later WayTools has not shipped a single unit, and that must be taken into account. Any other than critical reporting that occurs before (if) they ship existing orders could be interpreted as enabling WayTools in misleading their existing customers, and rewarding failure by generating new, unsuspecting customers.

TextBlade will probably ship. If it does, why not report on that success and unpack the rocky journey at the same time? Until then, let 'em earn their ink (by shipping).

p.s. I actually have money on the table for a TextBlade. The hostility towards WayTools is understandable. But as for the more vitriolic attacks on MacRumors and staff: sure, this couldn't been handled somewhat more critically, but let's keep in mind what is being reported on here. This isn't some case of insider complicity in suppressing war crimes reporting. It's just a keyboard, albeit a pretty unique one that has aroused a lot of passions...

 

[palmfox]

I want to give everyone an update on MacRumors' position on the TextBlade. We've read through the comments posted here, taken into account emails we've received, and looked through information on the WayTools forums. We've heard what you have to say and we won't be continuing on to do a review or further coverage of the TextBlade.

To set the record straight, I have never had any kind of monetary or personal relationship with the WayTools staff. I've been criticized for the tone of my posts, which I wrote as someone who was just as excited as you were about a unique keyboard on the market that went above and beyond anything else available.

I want to explain something about my early posts that I think gives some insight into why I trusted what WayTools had to say. When I visited WayTools in March, I saw and used a finished TextBlade product. I saw a room full of engineers typing on finished TextBlades.

I saw the components for hundreds of TextBlades and rows and rows of completed TextBlades. Having used one myself, which seemed to function well, I had no reason to think that the TextBlade wouldn't be shipping out soon. I was told about a change to the butterfly, but I was also told an updated version was already in production and would ship soon.

Ahead of my second post in July, I was told a lot of reasonable information about why there had been a delay since March and how those problems had all been fixed. A lot of products can get delayed at the stage from limited production to mass production, so I gave WayTools the benefit of the doubt because the TextBlade finally seemed ready to ship (to Night Spring -- I *did* do research on this).

This time, I saw dozens and dozens of completed TextBlades lined up. I saw people using them. I saw photos of the TextBlade production line in Malaysia and I was told hundreds of TextBlades were being made and were going to be ready to go out in July.

Was I overly optimistic and perhaps too trusting? Yes. Was I out to deceive? Absolutely not. As the months ticked by after July, I decided not to continue on with coverage until the TextBlade started shipping. This time around, I had a TextBlade in my possession at the time of the post, concrete proof that WayTools is finally letting them out into the wild. I wouldn't have done a post at all had I not received multiple requests to do so.

I didn't ignore the production issues and the long delays in this most recent post, but many of you feel that I did not go far enough highlighting the customer service problems. To that end, I would like to say that there are problems that I was not even aware of, such as the canceling of orders.

A lot of the accusations in this thread have been off base and highly stressful for me. I've been struggling figure out how to explain myself in a way that you guys would find satisfactory, and I'm still not sure how to do it. The idea that I would deceive MacRumors readers or write something untruthful for money (or whatever other benefit I'm supposedly getting out of this) is so entirely preposterous to me that I've been at a loss for words.

I've been with MacRumors for 2012 and I love my job. I love the community. I love writing for all of you. I didn't set out to trick, deceive, or disappoint anyone and I apologize if I have unwittingly done so.

Julie

Thank you for the apology. I have a better understanding of your three posts and the position that you took. My comments were only based on the article you wrote, verses the service I received from Waytools. As I mentioned, I often read your articles and enjoy them.

As others have said, I would encourage you to not stop reporting on Waytools. I would suggest that as you are now aware of the deceitful nature of the company, to ask the questions of Mr. Knighton regarding the cancellation of orders, the derogatory comments made by the unknown employees in their forums (such as calling anyone who questions Waytools, spies for the competition) that the customers would like answers to.

In other words, you have given the Waytools the benefit of the doubt. Now it is time to give the customers, some who have waited since January 13, 2015, the benefit of the doubt as well. Yes they are angry and have taken it out on you. (personal attacks are not warranted, no matter the situation). Have Mr. Knighton answer the hard questions. I would be curious if he even responds, if he knows that tough questions will be asked. Based on his company's history, he will be too busy with production to answer any questions he feels will put Waytools in a bad light.

Once again, I urge you not to quit. If you do, then there will be NO news outside of the company spin.

 

[shareef777]

.

 

[bobdobalina]

deleted

 

[Rolanbek]

Oh okay then.

It's just a keyboard,

People aren't annoyed at the keyboard, they haven't had a chance to be.

Don't worry not all the Pre-order customers bite.

Some but not all...

 

[KaliYoni]

I understand MacRumors' decision to suspend its coverage. From a strategic perspective, there isn't much to be gained from remaining closely engaged with a company that is untrusted by many of its customers due to a history of duplicitous actions. WT's reversion to conspiracy theories and ad hominem attacks on its own message boards in response to what's happening here reinforces why it's in MR's interest to step away for now.

The TextBlade is a niche product with a limited audience currently. MacRumors, in taking steps to protect its goodwill with the broad Mac and iOS user universe, has little to lose by curtailing contact with WayTools. A well-managed organization does not let an outside company over which it has little influence determine its reputation.

Finally, the fact that MR became the front line source for information about the TextBlade is a problem, not a justification to continue writing articles. It points to how thoroughly WT has failed its customers and supporters.

 

[Night Spring]

TextBlade will probably ship. If it does, why not report on that success and unpack the rocky journey at the same time? Until then, let 'em earn their ink (by shipping).

As others have said, I would encourage you to not stop reporting on Waytools. I would suggest that as you are now aware of the deceitful nature of the company, to ask the questions of Mr. Knighton regarding the cancellation of orders, the derogatory comments made by the unknown employees in their forums (such as calling anyone who questions Waytools, spies for the competition) that the customers would like answers to.

From a strategic perspective, there isn't much to be gained from remaining closely engaged with a company that is untrusted by many of its customers due to a history of duplicitous actions. WT's reversion to conspiracy theories and ad hominem attacks on its own message boards in response to what's happening here just reinforces why it's in MR's interest to step away for now.

I just wanted to comment that these are all reasonable suggestions, and I see some merit in all of them, even if some of the suggestions may be mutually contradictory. Personally, I feel like it's best to leave this behind, but of course, it's up to Juli and MacRumors how to proceed from here.

 

[iMarc845]

I want to give everyone an update on MacRumors' position on the TextBlade. We've read through the comments posted here, taken into account emails we've received, and looked through information on the WayTools forums. We've heard what you have to say and we won't be continuing on to do a review or further coverage of the TextBlade.

(snip)

A lot of the accusations in this thread have been off base and highly stressful for me. I've been struggling figure out how to explain myself in a way that you guys would find satisfactory, and I'm still not sure how to do it. The idea that I would deceive MacRumors readers or write something untruthful for money (or whatever other benefit I'm supposedly getting out of this) is so entirely preposterous to me that I've been at a loss for words.

I've been with MacRumors for 2012 and I love my job. I love the community. I love writing for all of you. I didn't set out to trick, deceive, or disappoint anyone and I apologize if I have unwittingly done so.

Hi Juli,

I am sorry that you were given the brunt of people's frustrations. I never doubted your sincerity or your ability. It is indeed a shame that we won't get to read your detailed review of the TextBlade. I value your opinion.

Hopefully, when the units are shipping and the order backlog has been sated, you and MacRumors will feel "safe" in posting a review of it as is done with other new products. Unfortunately, people are so annoyed and disgruntled with some of WayTools behavior that they struck out at you. It is neither appropriate nor fair but that is what the Internet Mob Mentality does to some people.

Please don't forget that there are many of us out here who appreciated your coverage of this story. You were sometimes our only source of information. And now some people's short-sightedness has taken that from us. Again, neither appropriate nor fair.

To all of you who so misdirected your anger, frustration and conspiracy theories:

Thanks for ruining it for everyone!!

 

[Dshanz1]

A perfectly reasonable explanation from the editor, and appreciated. She was scammed, that's clear. I still wonder what WT's game was all about. Apparently they had a working prototype but instead of moving toward production they spent enormous energy on dummying up reports. Go figure.

 

[dabigkahuna]

A perfectly reasonable explanation from the editor, and appreciated. She was scammed, that's clear. I still wonder what WT's game was all about. Apparently they had a working prototype but instead of moving toward production they spent enormous energy on dummying up reports. Go figure.

???

Exactly how was she "scammed"?

Also, the unit she got was not a prototype. It was a production model. They've had production models (that is, made on the regular production lines - nothing special like prototypes) going back to at least March. We know because of the hands on testing. Now, that doesn't mean there weren't problems to deal with whether in hardware or firmware before they felt they were ready for customers and that, to be sure, has been very unfortunate for all of us. But they are not prototypes.

But what I can't figure out at all is your claim of "dummying up reports". What does that refer to?

 

[Arran]

I prefer buying finished goods in stores and exchanging cash concurrently with receiving product.

Saves time.

 

[Rolanbek]

???

Exactly how was she "scammed"?

"Scammed" may be a little strong. From Juli's follow ups I get the impression that the full extent of the story was not known at the time of of writing.

"Used" might be more apt. Sadly

R

 

[ericpeets]

Yes, it seems that waytools has gone into another paranoid mode, apparently blaming its forum userbase of having forced Juli quit writing about them. They are accusing their users on their own forum, otherwise they'd be saying things like this here:

Because a few people have an agenda, they have used multiple aliases to try to discredit her on this forum and on MacRumors site. (Some of them even agreeing with their own alter-egos).
These abusive posts were aimed at intimidation, and blocking her liberty to write as she sees fit.
Given the unusually cruel and personal nature of these attacks, we think her response was entirely appropriate.
No matter what commercial interests may be involved, they can never justify trying to hurt another human being. This behavior is not ok, and we will resist it wherever we see it.

This follows a known sycophantic troll, being the drama queen he is, who decided to cross post this discussion to the waytools forum to get his sick thrill out of it.

Notice how waytools feels some "commercial interest" has "an agenda" who's intimidated Juli "blocking her liberty". They talk about how people are using multiple aliases who even agree with their own alter-ego. You can't make this stuff up. We're dealing with crazy people here. And they are blaming their own userbase.
[doublepost=1456231684][/doublepost]Oh, and this follows another delay of shipping to testers (no surprise, being the end of the month). They're also closing down some forums and demoting (or banning) some of the users on the forum. This follows their pattern of paranoid rampage they displayed last year (around this time of the year, I may add - must come with the air of spring).

 

[Night Spring]

Oh, and this follows another delay of shipping to testers.

So is Juli the only one who got a testing unit? It sounded that way, but I couldn't be sure.

 

[Dshanz1]

I was referring to the fake videos, consistent false claims from WT, incomprehensible explanations, unverifiable testimonials. That sort of thing. Here's what I wrote on August 14:

I'm now convinced that it is a complete scam. The "hands-on" event that was sold as proof of existence (via video) was, I'm pretty sure, completely bogus. Are any of the identified people known to anyone? One "expert" who was purportedly there announced on Twitter that he thought the Textblade was just terrific has tweeted 78 times since 2009. A real person? Hard to believe. Even the note confirming my refund was beyond strange:

"We've already refunded $99 to your Amex ... . Your refund was immediately sent via our card processor (Authorize.net). Your card company controls the funds now, and usually takes about 7 days to show this on your credit card statement.

"Even before they post it online, your card company can verify the $99 credit by phone. If you need that, call the 800 number on the back of the card, and they can usually confirm it within 24 hours.

"You should be all set now. Need further help? Ask WayTools"

Who confirms refunds like that? I will be very pleased and surprised to see my $99. Something fishy here.
[doublepost=1456233524][/doublepost]A couple of days later, I posted:

I may have spoken too soon -- I just received my $99 refund, in full. I think I'll wait a while before I withdraw all my comments, though. I don't want to be an ungracious winner, I still am not at all sure about this company. But I did get my money back after 10 days, I'll give them that.

Finally, I posted:


If the waytools team was perpetrating a fraud they would be doing things exactly the way they're doing things. Nothing rings quite true, does it? From the doubletalk on their blog, to the strange video they put out, to their unwarranted hostility to customer complaints, to their strangely incomplete website and so on. They seem to be playing for time; something is rotten. Things aren't always what they seem, but they usually are.

I was quite a prolific poster, it seems. Here was my last indignant post:

You may well be right, but I’m a doubter. Who are the principals? Who are the investors? What’s their history? The company claims to have donated $1 million to elementary schools – name one. The “hands-on” video event – why wasn’t anybody identified? All those out-of-the-blue promises of additional benefits for early adopters – umm, we’d rather just have the keyboard, thanks. The hostile and unwarranted responses to customer complaints – that’s just not the way real companies respond. It's not amateurish, it's crazy. Their Web site– some good pages coupled with very odd and clunky forms. Also, never updated. The supposedly real-time typing video in the "Products" section – it sure looks fake to me. You can’t pause it or examine it closely. $99 says it’s animation. Finally, I cancelled my order a while ago and still haven’t received my refund. If it isn’t a scam I’ll be surprised. Still, the MR reporter actually used the product, right? So you may be right.

 

[Rolanbek]

Yes, it seems that waytools has gone into another paranoid mode, apparently blaming its forum userbase of having forced Juli quit writing about them. They are accusing their users on their own forum, otherwise they'd be saying things like this here:
**excised quote**
This follows a known sycophantic troll, being the drama queen he is, who decided to cross post this discussion to the waytools forum to get his sick thrill out of it.

Notice how waytools feels some "commercial interest" has "an agenda" who's intimidated Juli "blocking her liberty". They talk about how people are using multiple aliases who even agree with their own alter-ego. You can't make this stuff up. We're dealing with crazy people here. And they are blaming their own userbase.
[doublepost=1456231684][/doublepost]Oh, and this follows another delay of shipping to testers (no surprise, being the end of the month). They're also closing down some forums and demoting (or banning) some of the users on the forum. This follows their pattern of paranoid rampage they displayed last year (around this time of the year, I may add - must come with the air of spring).

One wonders if he is working with or against WT doesn't it? Longer this all plays out the more he gets to hear the sound of his own voice.

One don't forget the September purge, where I was found guilty of living in the same house as my wife, which got us both banned.

Us bystanders are watching from the sidelines here https://www.reddit.com/r/textblade/ pop in to add some balance if you like. Redditors love us a good post.

It is interesting that they accept no responsibility for the searing wave of hatred in their own forum. Maybe they should not use the least popular and longest winded member as a mouthpiece?

So is Juli the only one who got a testing unit? It sounded that way, but I couldn't be sure.

That we know of so far. Twitter only sourced MacRumors (must drop the u...) and aggregators who sourced MacRumors.

 

[ericpeets]

So is Juli the only one who got a testing unit? It sounded that way, but I couldn't be sure.

Yes, Juli's the only one who got one - testing unit or otherwise. Nobody else outside of Waytools has received one.