'Weak Demand' for VR and AR Causing Concerns for Companies Investing in the Technology

[apolloa]

I am really really really really really NOT surprised by this report, just like 3D, no one wanted it years ago and they don't want it now! I played on VR arcade games 15 or more years ago, if you can't make a success of it the first time why bother trying again?
AR seems like it might have some uses, but not VR unless it's for industry's like architects etc.

 

[Wahlstrm]

When you can hook up anything to it with a simple HDMI (or equivalent) and just use it as easy as any other screen. No special software, no special hardware. Just plug and play. Then sales will take off.

= Give me "iMAX-home-glasses" with VR-gaming capabilities and I'm all in

 

[vpro]

If they invest just billions more every year in the middle class, keep it from further dwindling -- then and only then would companies expect to see astronomical demand. It's basic math. Most companies are creating products to appeal to those who are big spenders, who can afford expensive toys or those who can't, but are willing to make it a dream goal.

Companies are creating fantasy demand where there is no realist demand what so ever for their stuff, that ends up in landfills; too much too quickly and toxifying water in China's and other third world or developing countrie's little villages, where children burn and sort out precious metals to sell for a bowl of rice?

Seems companies are concerned but really, they shouldn't be in the business of "concern", why go into business as a multi-national corporation then? With all that money and man power, talented people working for you, why should a little bit of economics scare them at all? Seriously? Just keep doing your jobs and quit whining about demand, demand that you create out of fantasy ! Match made in heaven, suck it up you princesses LMAO !






QUOTE="MacRumors, post: 24022385, member: 3"]

Sales related to virtual reality and augmented reality products "have been weaker than expected," according to data collected by a number of market research firms and shared by DigiTimes.

A lack of content and expensive prices, specifically for VR headsets, are two factors said to be at the center of the weak demand for the technology as 2016 closes out. The results could potentially have a negative effect on companies investing in VR and AR technology development, including Apple.

The market watchers noted that Sony's PSVR, Google's Daydream View, HTC's Vive, Samsung Electronics' Gear VR, and the Oculus Rift all ended up with sales figures weaker than their initial expectations. Coming out of Black Friday and Cyber Monday last week, the research firm SuperData noted that VR headsets have been "the biggest loser" this holiday season.

Because of the slower-than-expected consumer adoption of each technology, companies rumored to be investing in VR and AR products are believed to be feeling "pressured" about such investments. Specifically, HTC was noted as "seeing decreasing share in the worldwide smartphone market" while waiting for its Vive headset to contribute profits.
Although Apple's relation to such technology has leaned more towards an AR experience -- most recently suggesting a feature that would be integrated into the iOS camera app -- the company has been rumored to be developing a full-on VR headset as well. If included in pre-existing apps within iOS, an augmented reality experience by Apple would be less risky for it to undertake, but some rumors also point towards a separate product category coming down the line.

It's unclear when Apple's decade-long investment in VR/AR development might come to fruition in a consumer product, but some basic AR experiences have already proven popular on the company's devices, including this summer's gaming phenomenon Pokémon Go.

Article Link: 'Weak Demand' for VR and AR Causing Concerns for Companies Investing in the Technology[/QUOTE]

 

[mlody]

Haven't they learned anything from the 3D TVs fiasco?

 

[SeattleMoose]

Only appeal is to hard core geeks and gamers. Rest of us...meh.

However, a porn version would sell like hot cakes with the right set of sensors/effectors (and solve world overpopulation)

 

[sportsfan]

It is expensive to buy the VR equipment, not to mention a PC to power the graphics.
I think the headset needs to become wireless before it takes off.

 

[5105973]

There's a good deal of research going into causes and solutions to simulator sickness now. I think I read an article a few days ago on Ars Technica about it (too lazy and short of time right now to look it up ). Getting frame rates up is a big factor. Types of VR where the environment doesn't move for you are also a big help (room scale where you move or stationary, if your eyes tell you you are moving but your inner ear says "no" that causes a problem). 360 degree treadmills are also effective (not sure how that doesn't still affect inner ear but for whatever reason research shows it is working). Even though you already have Gear VR on your list I'd recommend going Vive or Rift for the extra horsepower and thus frame rate, I think you'll be happier.

I don't currently have the space or the computer necessary to run a Vive or Rift. I liked the Gear VR well enough at the AT&T store. It's not something I want to do all the time yet anyway. I'll give it a better more dedicated try in a year or two after I finish getting my home office fixed up.

I don't know why I would get so sick in "real life" but don't seem to get simulator sickness, at least not for limited time I've tried these things. I can also ride all kinds of crazy amusement park rides without a problem even a day after having a seizure migraine. I rarely get motion sickness and never had a problem on a boat. But I will get dizzy and fall over sideways just walking across a room. And I read a comment from someone else, over on Android Central, I think, who also has medical problems like mine but didn't have any problems with VR. Odd. Maybe some of us are meant to live in VR but not the real world.

 

[spazzcat]

Let me know when you build holodecks....

 

[5105973]

I don't like VR because it's so anti-social. Besides speech, humans communicate with facial expressions. It's been shown many times that the eyebrows, the eyes, the nose, and the mouth all matter a ton in communicating with another person. VR headsets cover up a lot of that.

Part of the fun of seeing a movie is experiencing it with someone else. I like seeing my friends' reactions, facial expressions, and exclamations.

Same with gaming. Look at the streaming video trend with gaming - people obviously want to see the faces of whoever is playing to see their reactions and antics.

A VR headset covers up most of the face, and that makes it a very lonely device.

Interesting. I am an introvert by nature. Circumstances force me to be sociable now for my kids sake, and my past employment forced me to shut my introverted instincts off and talk to people as much as possible. Now that I can be a grumpy old housewife and shoo people off my lawn, I haven't really given much thought to that aspect of VR gaming.

I suppose it is very anti social. I know I feel shut out when my husband puts on his noise cancellation headphones and can't hear a word I say. Which is stupid, because everyone deserves their space and it's not as if I speak that much anyway or would have anything to say to him if he were listening to the stereo. But I find myself frustrated I can't hear what music he's hearing, as I would if he were listening to the stereo. I get so ridiculously curious. He also closes his eyes so he can't see me at all in addition to not hearing me.

It's for me, a weird simulation of being a ghost and feels insulting even though I know that's not his intention. Because I would do the same if I weren't permanently on call as a mom, who must always know where every article of clothing or sports equipment is at any given moment and be able to recite this information whenever someone bellows "Hey mom...!". It's illogical to take it personally, but sometimes I do. So yeah, I imagine watching someone with VR blocking their friends and family out could have negative effects on social interactions and relationships.

 

[R3k]

Millions? So far it looks like not even one million will buy the Sony PlayStaion VR. None of the gamer-focused VR headsets have sold more than half a million units even.

The only VR headsets that sold any significant quantity are the smartphone-caddy type that stick a smartphone in front of your face. That's not exactly online gaming.

And with online gaming, the area where there is actual growth is with streaming the games. The most popular of these show the game, and a video of the gamer in front of a webcam in the corner of the stream. This part is key - people want to see the gamer himself or herself, their facial expressions, and their reactions to what is happening in the game.

No, I mean millions of gamers don't find it necessary to physically sit with friends and see their faces.

 

[spiderman0616]

Have you tried the new resident evil demo? I have ps vr too and it is absolutely awesome... Whats interesting about the sales numbers is, despite the low numbers, I never see any VR's in stock? Are we sure sony is not selling units because no ones interested or is it because sonys not making enough?

Sony's issue is definitely supply constraints, and I think it's self inflicted. They are launching cautiously. But they are also approaching this the right way. They are the only company creating VR devices where there are already 50 million machines in the hands of customers that can drive the headsets. The issue with Sony is that some analyst said they'd sell 2 million and they were only able to get 750,000 on store shelves. And then said analyst cries "LOSER!" when his predictions aren't met. (Reminds me of another company we talk about a lot on these forums.)

The cell phone based systems can be cool, and you can get headsets that work with your iPhone too, but they're not the same thing as "real" VR, where you have a camera tracking your movements and hand motions. The Google Daydream type experiences that only work with one handset, I believe, are the wrong way to go. Again, Sony is the ONLY company making "real" VR gear right now that already has a 50 million unit user base out on the market.

I have not tried the RE demo yet, because I don't even like being chased by zombies in standard games. Totally gives me the willies.

 

[oneMadRssn]

No, I mean millions of gamers don't find it necessary to physically sit with friends and see their faces.

What about the millions of gamers that watch Twitch, where seeing the gamers' face is a huge part of it?

I think this shows that gamers are a diverse group of people who game for different reasons and in different ways. Some will find VR to be compelling enough to purchase and use on a regular basis. Some will find it pointless. Some will find it neat, but not worth the hassles or trade-offs. VR will not be appealing to every gamer, nor even a majority of gamers.

 

[Zab the Fab]

Weak demand, yes, that sure is unsettling isn't it. I'm sure Apple looked at those 10 years of Microsoft tablet sales and decided to not launch the iPad ....oh, wait.

 

[oneMadRssn]

Again, Sony is the ONLY company making "real" VR gear right now that already has a 50 million unit user base out on the market.

I would consider the HTC Vive to be "real" VR gear.

Also, while there are 50 million PS4s out there, I don't think you can consider each one to be a potential VR consumer. I think Sony would consider it a smashing success if they get even 5% of those users to buy a VR set.

 

[Mr. Dee]

I hope you realise you are displaying delusional fanboyism. Most of what you said is so selective and misses out crucial facts, it actually made me chuckle.

I am not an Apple hater, I currently own and use their watch, phone and MacBook. But this is closer to folklore/mythology than anything factual.

I have a MacBook Pro, iPhone 6s and 4 Windows PCs. In fact, I bought my first Mac and iPhone last year. Prior to that, I only owned a 3rd gen iPod Touch and a shuffle. Does that sound like a fan boy to you? Your problem is you are consumed by capitalism and the machinery behind it, which is to buy more, more, more because it has a bitten Apple on it.

Certainly, Apple still has a strong presence in industrial design. The reality is, the company is certainly lost in one aspect of the company's characteristics. I am a huge Michael Jackson fan, but the last Michael Jackson album I bought was Invincible. The truth is, Michael was no longer interested in music after 2002, and anything that was released after his death was just the record company desperate to capitalize on his death. They released a couple posthumous albums in 2010 and 2014. Xscape is actually a good effort, but you could honestly sense Michael would never approve of it.

I purchase electronics to add value to my life. It took me 9 years to buy an iPhone, even though Apple released one every year since 2007. I went to the Apple store last month while visiting the states. Had the cash ready to buy a iPhone 7, but I said to myself, what do I honestly need of this I can't currently get out of my iPhone 6s?

Your problem is, you are in denial that "One More Thing" is truly dead and you are trying to hold on to some nostalgia that no longer exist. Steve Jobs said it, the products they make, others will one day follow. I certainly won't be loyal to a brand because of a logo. I don't plan to aimlessly walk off a cliff either for everything they make under the sun and the same goes for every other electronics company. I don't need a Surface Studio, Surface Book, Oculus Rift and all the other industry gimmicks that have popped up over the past 5 years.

 

[fullauto]

Weak demand for PSVR? They've been selling out as soon as shipments are available.. Sony hit a home run IMO. Can't wait to unwrap mine for Xmas!

 

[jlo1158]

These Android fans never learn, do they?

Do you really think that DayDream will have any chance just because it's Google and not Samsung?

When Samsung is giving away theirs for early buyers...

So the mass market appeal for these devices are extremely niche use cases. I don't see how you build mass market demand that way.

I was just showing that vr can be more versatile than just for gaming. I've got approx a $5000 gaming rig. I have a 55"4k Sony for it. I still think my Gear VR allows me to get more into the game than my PC can. I would like to check out the Vive. It looks nice.
[doublepost=1480967539][/doublepost]

Weak demand for PSVR? They've been selling out as soon as shipments are available.. Sony hit a home run IMO. Can't wait to unwrap mine for Xmas!

Hope you enjoy it. My son has a PS4. I just upgraded my Xbox 1 to the S. Only for the 4k playback though. I am very interested in the Vive though.
[doublepost=1480967766][/doublepost]

Only appeal is to hard core geeks and gamers. Rest of us...meh.

However, a porn version would sell like hot cakes with the right set of sensors/effectors (and solve world overpopulation)

Maybe you need to get out more. There's a lot of gamers out there. It would only take a part of them to make VR successful.

 

[spiderman0616]

I would consider the HTC Vive to be "real" VR gear.

Also, while there are 50 million PS4s out there, I don't think you can consider each one to be a potential VR consumer. I think Sony would consider it a smashing success if they get even 5% of those users to buy a VR set.

There are 50 million machines on the market that are fully capable of running PSVR--not all of them will buy PSVR, but that's huge potential.

And yes, I agree, the Vive and Oculus are "real" VR because they have external camera systems and motion controllers. Their audience is even more limited than Sony's though because they require such powerful PCs to run correctly. For the record, both are superior to PSVR in my opinion.

All that being said, I am having a BLAST with PSVR. It has serious potential.

 

[NT1440]

I was just showing that vr can be more versatile than just for gaming. I've got approx a $5000 gaming rig. I have a 55"4k Sony for it. I still think my Gear VR allows me to get more into the game than my PC can. I would like to check out the Vive. It looks nice.
[doublepost=1480967539][/doublepost]

Hope you enjoy it. My son has a PS4. I just upgraded my Xbox 1 to the S. Only for the 4k playback though. I am very interested in the Vive though.
[doublepost=1480967766][/doublepost]

Maybe you need to get out more. There's a lot of gamers out there. It would only take a part of them to make VR successful.

I wouldn't call a new gaming paradigm anything other than just a new way to game. I think AR has massive potential for breaking out of the gaming world. I don't see any type of mass market breakthrough for VR.

 

[spiderman0616]

Weak demand for PSVR? They've been selling out as soon as shipments are available.. Sony hit a home run IMO. Can't wait to unwrap mine for Xmas!

Again--this is the same crap that analysts pull on Apple. There was one analyst that said Sony should sell 2 million of these things, and the supply channel couldn't support that estimate, so now that same analyst is calling PSVR a "loser". It's called fitting the data to the narrative.

It's hard to read comments from people who haven't tried this tech out. As primitive as it will seem in a few years, it's so much fun. And no, not all the games are <5 minute "experiences". I have put several hours into Tethered, Holoball, Batman, Thumper, and Rez Infinite. Batman's main story is very short, but it has replay value if you look for all the collectibles and easter eggs. When I want something a little more low key, I might jump into Carnival Games and just do that for a while. Time goes by much slower when you're in VR, and I often take the headset off and realize I just killed 3 hours without realizing it.

The tech is in its infancy, but this is the beginning of the type of VR we've been waiting for since the 80s. Truly exciting.

 

[Marshall73]

I can see why. I played around with PlayStation VR for a day before returning it as it was stupidly pointless. Not one of the games justified its existence tbh. Much better playing normally with a big HD screen.

It's one of those technologies which is for a very niche market and entertains the 'look at the shiny shiny' generation.

 

[Pootmatoot]

But none of these things are are at "consumer" level yet.

It's all dev kits and adventurous 1st gen consumers.

It's like panicking about telephony uptake when only the Queen and the US president could receive telegrams.


Wait 5 years until MS Hololens is mainstream.

 

[spiderman0616]

I can see why. I played around with PlayStation VR for a day before returning it as it was stupidly pointless. Not one of the games justified its existence tbh. Much better playing normally with a big HD screen.

It's one of those technologies which is for a very niche market and entertains the 'look at the shiny shiny' generation.

you must not have tried the same games that I've been playing. There are several gems in the launch lineup already.

 

[WRChris]

I have Playstation VR, and it is absolutely fantastic. I have been using it almost every night for the last month, and it makes gaming so much more fun and immersive. However, I agree with your statement. There are a lot of people clamoring for tech to move faster faster faster, but I don't think the general population is ready. Smartphones, tablets, and laptops are still what people want, even if there's been a slowdown in how many of those items people are buying.

We are at the point where we can get all the information we need, create all the content we need to create, and do all the work we need to do on the devices we already have. People should remember that when they tear into Apple for not bombarding the market with brand new device categories every 6 months. The every day ordinary consumer has had enough for now.

I will stick to my guns on VR though--it is fantastic tech, even in its early stages. I really have enjoyed it so far.

The problem is what you have just described, unknowingly. Prices are way to high for what you get. When I can buy a vr headset and use it out of the box I will. Not buying a PS4,ps VR and god knows what else just to use it. I'm not spending 800$ on an oculus that requires a 1000$ computer.

 

[shamus99]

Sony's issue is definitely supply constraints, and I think it's self inflicted. They are launching cautiously. But they are also approaching this the right way. They are the only company creating VR devices where there are already 50 million machines in the hands of customers that can drive the headsets. The issue with Sony is that some analyst said they'd sell 2 million and they were only able to get 750,000 on store shelves. And then said analyst cries "LOSER!" when his predictions aren't met. (Reminds me of another company we talk about a lot on these forums.)

The cell phone based systems can be cool, and you can get headsets that work with your iPhone too, but they're not the same thing as "real" VR, where you have a camera tracking your movements and hand motions. The Google Daydream type experiences that only work with one handset, I believe, are the wrong way to go. Again, Sony is the ONLY company making "real" VR gear right now that already has a 50 million unit user base out on the market.

I have not tried the RE demo yet, because I don't even like being chased by zombies in standard games. Totally gives me the willies.

I believe Sony is doing it right... and if you dont like 2d horror games, do NOT try this! lol