What would you change the Mac Pro?

[Tesselator]

Yeah, it looks like everyone agrees that the price needs to be changed. Gee, I wonder why?

But ya know. I wouldn't mind paying the price they're asking if there were 8 HDD sleds and connectors, RAID5, 18 DIMM slots, and built in SAS. Heck, then their prices would be just right with the rest of the industry - Like the Mac Pro 1,1 ~ 1,3 were.

 

[ungraphic]

1) Mini-PCIe, but yes, I agree. The BTO option's a joke.

2) Sure.

3) Add Firewire 3200. I remains suspicious that USB 3.0 will again deliver high theoretical, lower actual throughput.

4) Support. I could care less about actually building the drive in because it'll be more expensive to have  do it.

5) Would require them to care about graphics cards, but it would be nice to see the software support for that. Pretty much a pipe dream.

6) Wasn't the 2008 MP the last one to use FB-DIMM? Still ECC, but don't the 2009 MPs use the "regular" RAM that does, in fact, cost much less?

I really don't know about the RAM from the 2008 and 2009 macs. I'd have to look into that, but i'm basically going on from my own experience based on my mac (and things haven't changed all that much).

Oh, and I agree with everything you said.

 

[Nater]

That still looks like tin to me though.

http://www.hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1031259325&postcount=179


I know that it's actually not according to this: http://windy-online.com/ so why do I think so? Is it just that the Mac Pro case is so thick? Or maybe it's that those Windy cases and the Lian Li ones are painted? Maybe it's both? Hmm, I'm confused.

When I tap on the side of a Lian Li case (or a Windy for that matter) it rattles like it's tin and feels thin. It looks thin too. When I tap on the side of a Mac Pro case it almost feels like it's one solid block. There's no rattle. And when I look at any edge of any external wall on the mac pro case I see 4mm thick aluminum. Not Lian Li or Windy tho:














I keep looking but so far I haven't found anything that comes close to the solidness and material-thickness of the Apple MP case. <Shrug>

Yeah, maybe you should actually look at one in person. Photos on a web page don't do any case justice. Not trying to be sarcastic, it's just pretty hard to judge something's quality from a small picture on the web.

All the Lian Li cases I've dealt with personally have 4mm thick for the parts that matter. Main structure, side panels, ect. I measured with my calipers. I can't bend one by placing it on my thigh and pushing down with all my strength. It's certainly not 'thin'. Lian Li, Silverstone, and WINDy cases also aren't painted, they're anodized.

I have a Lian Li and WINDy sitting besides me and a G5 case in the closet. The LL is even on build quality, the WINDy surpasses it. It has some of the best aluminum work I've seen outside of racing cars and bikes. The only problem is it seems to be designed for smaller Japanese hands and it's a pain to work with.

All that said, judging a case by it's side panel thickness is judging in error. There are parts of the Silverstone TJ07 that are 8mm thick, so it must be twice as good as a Lian Li or MP case, right?. With a case, it depends on a lot of things.

If it were a choice between 4mm thick side panels with four 3.5" and two 5.25" bays or a case with 3mm side panels that could swallow eight hard drives and four or more 5.25" devices, I'd definitely go with the latter.

When I get my Mac Pro, I'll definitely keep it in the provided case. It's too much of a pain to swap to a different case (though I could probably do it with the older Harpertown/Clovertown/Woodcrest machines). The case it has is very good, it's very well built, and it doesn't look half bad. But that isn't to say that there aren't better cases to be had, because there are.

 

[nanofrog]

All the Lian Li cases I've dealt with personally have 4mm thick for the parts that matter. Main structure, side panels, ect. I measured with my calipers. I can't bend one by placing it on my thigh and pushing down with all my strength. It's certainly not 'thin'. Lian Li, Silverstone, and WINDy cases also aren't painted, they're anodized.

I can't say as to the Lian Li's you've on hand, but it seems they've gone to thinner materials. The thickest panels on mine (PC-V2010) is 2.5mm. It's still sturdy, and as its a full tower, has some room in it. The thinner material is formed in a manner that it's structurally sound enough to do it's job. I wouldn't recommend using it as a chair per se p), but it certainly gets the job done.

The finished is in fact anodized aluminum, and is well done on this one, and others I've seen. Personally, I prefer silver, as scratches blend in bettern than black, or the more recent blue or red finishes offered on a couple of models.

I have a Lian Li and WINDy sitting besides me and a G5 case in the closet. The LL is even on build quality, the WINDy surpasses it. It has some of the best aluminum work I've seen outside of racing cars and bikes. The only problem is it seems to be designed for smaller Japanese hands and it's a pain to work with.

I've never seen a WINDy, and tried to look at the website linked. They do look nice, but wouldn't work for what I need to do (massive drive quantities due to RAID). 16 drives internal drives limits my choices.

If it were a choice between 4mm thick side panels with four 3.5" and two 5.25" bays or a case with 3mm side panels that could swallow eight hard drives and four or more 5.25" devices, I'd definitely go with the latter.

This may very well be what Lian Li did with the full tower models. But I need the space, so I got it. I'm quite happy with it.

I must say, the wheels are a nice touch as well.

When I get my Mac Pro, I'll definitely keep it in the provided case. It's too much of a pain to swap to a different case (though I could probably do it with the older Harpertown/Clovertown/Woodcrest machines). The case it has is very good, it's very well built, and it doesn't look half bad. But that isn't to say that there aren't better cases to be had, because there are.

I figure it can be done as well, and might make sense for those needing RAID of a drive quantity greater than can be fitted in the orginal case. Given the cost of external drive enclosures, it might make better financial sense as well, as for the same or less money for an 8 bay enclosure, you could get a full tower case, and the backplanes to fit 16 drives, possibly more (depending on specific model). <Case @ $300USD, 2x 3.5" backplanes @100USD ea. as an estimate.> A single 8 bay external enclosure (backplanes for hot swap) will set you back ~$600USD these days.

 

[Nater]

I'm not particularly surprised that a full tower would use thinner materials for the side panels and such. The price difference is usually on the order of $50 to $75 between mid and full in a particular series. I could definitely see them using less material to make an already expensive case less so.

I've never sat on my Li, but you can use the Silvestone TJ07 for a chair. That's the case I'm definitely going to buy soon, it's already been around four years and I don't know how much longer it's going to be on the market. Perfect match for what I need for my gaming PC because of the huge amount of room for mounting radiators in the bottom chamber.

I don't think that most users need 16 drive bays. I'm putting a 3U storage server together and I'm going to connect to it via iSCSI (two bonded 1Gb/s ports). It's not as fast as a local drive, but fine for storage. I just do stills and audio, no video. That said, the Mac Pro still needs eight 3.5" bays, no doubt about it.

 

[nanofrog]

I'm not particularly surprised that a full tower would use thinner materials for the side panels and such. The price difference is usually on the order of $50 to $75 between mid and full in a particular series. I could definitely see them using less material to make an already expensive case less so.

This doesn't surprise me either. The sheet metal (aluminum in this case), can be folded into shapes that increase the structural strength, and make it more solid with less material than just heavier flat plates, and perhaps held together with some sort of fastener, such as a rivet or screw.

I've never sat on my Li, but you can use the Silvestone TJ07 for a chair. That's the case I'm definitely going to buy soon, it's already been around four years and I don't know how much longer it's going to be on the market. Perfect match for what I need for my gaming PC because of the huge amount of room for mounting radiators in the bottom chamber.

Though I've actually thought about it, I've no plans to use the case as chair.

If the Silverstone suits your needs, then get it. Lian Li is by no means the end-all-be-all of computer cases, and won't be the best for every single situation.

It was the right one for me, and is adaptable for future use. It's the least replaced component in a build for me.

I don't think that most users need 16 drive bays. I'm putting a 3U storage server together and I'm going to connect to it via iSCSI (two bonded 1Gb/s ports). It's not as fast as a local drive, but fine for storage. I just do stills and audio, no video. That said, the Mac Pro still needs eight 3.5" bays, no doubt about it.

No, 16 drive bays is a bit much for most uses, but is typical for servers, storage systems, and the like. In this case, it's as a workstation, built for a specific purpose. The parallelism was needed for throughput, not massive capacity.

The MP would be a nicer system with additional drive bays, but I don't expect they'll every happen with 3.5" drives. Perhaps with 2.5" units as the standard format, but in no way to really be expected IMO, despite the server grade parts. I think Apple only sees it as a workstation, and those do commonly only have 4 HDD bays.