Why Did Apple Do This?

Discussion in 'iPhone' started by Jimmy Guphanti, Nov 10, 2017.

  1. Jimmy Guphanti macrumors 6502

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    #1
    Why did Apple go back to making separate GSM and CDMA handsets? For the last many iterations, they sold models with all the LTE bands that you could use on both networks. Why the change?
     
  2. Lobwedgephil macrumors 68040

    Lobwedgephil

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    #2
    They went back last year. The reason, $$$$.
     
  3. dave006 Contributor

    dave006

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    #3
    Apple did not want to keep paying Qualcomm their outrageous license fees for technology that Qualcomm did not actually create.

    Apple is using Intel modems where ever possible. The Qualcomm modem is required for the CDMA versions of the latest iPhone models.

    Dave
     
  4. fischersd macrumors 601

    fischersd

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    #4
    Don't worry, you've only got one more revision. Verizon's shutting down their CDMA network by the end of 2019 - pretty sure Sprint will be by then as well (they should have done so already).
    Very little CDMA left around the world and most carriers are switching quickly.

    The LTE bands in both phones are the same - just the CDMA support necessitates a Qualcomm modem. Unless they mend their differences with Apple, they'll be out just as soon as Apple doesn't need CDMA any longer.
     
  5. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #5
    Great. So because Intel can't do it and Apple wants to remain a trillion dollar company, all the other CDMA carriers should bow down and lick their feet?

    Wonderful.
     
  6. fischersd macrumors 601

    fischersd

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    #6
    "all the other" - there's a handful left around the world and they're all changing over.

    The only remaining large scale deployment of CDMA is in the US.
     
  7. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #7
    Well according to you, even if they weren't, they should because it's just not feasible for Apple to have both modems in one device anymore?
     
  8. C DM macrumors Westmere

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    #8
    CDMA shutdown doesn't really have much to do with any of that as much as it's basically sunsetting of technology that has outlived itself and has been replaced by something newer and better. It's been planned and in the works for quite a while now outside of anything Apple-related.
     
  9. fischersd macrumors 601

    fischersd

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    #9
    Huh? It's ONE modem per phone. The reason that the phones for the CDMA carriers have modems made by Qualcomm is that Qualcomm OWNS the CDMA protocol - so it's cheaper to buy a modem from Qualcomm than it is to buy one made by one of their competitors (which has to pay licensing to Qualcomm). Also, the Qualcomm modems generally perform better.

    Apple has been putting Intel modems into their GSM-only phones as they're cheaper but also because they have a royalty pissing match going on with Qualcomm at the moment. If Qualcomm doesn't do something to mend their relations with Apple, they likely won't be in any of the iPhones produced in 2019.

    So, now that I've made that clear - what exactly are you trying to say?
     
  10. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #10
    I'm trying to say that Apple will force the hand in the demise of CDMA technology if they have their way won't they?

    Glad to know Intel is cheaper, great to know they charge the same for the Qualcomm version. Apple lottery, we're all playing it.

    Oh? No more Qualcomm but you need CDMA? Too bad.

    Qualcomm charging too high of fees from a company that uses tax haven countries to avoid taxes? Of course they don't want to pay Qualcomm. It's not a coincidence that they stopped paying Qualcomm AND sold their flagship for 1k or more. Trillion dollar company for the win.

    It should be ONE modem but my point was that Apple decided to fracture it into two models.

    Yes, I voted with my wallet to a V30.
     
  11. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #11
    Well even if it's not done yet, Apple will put the sunset on it if they can.
     
  12. illmatic41 macrumors member

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    #12
    The next generation of Intel modems will have CDMA support. Apple has been using kinda Intel modems from the beginning, as Infineon's wireless business division was sold to Intel in 2011. It's just when Verizon and Sprint got the iPhone, Apple had to use Qualcomm modems.
     
  13. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #13
    I hope they really focus well. I don't mind competition to Qualcomm but as a consumer, I'd like to know that Apple still wants the best for us. Not just padding their bottom line.

    I do wonder what will happen if Broadcom buys Qualcomm. There are many Broadcom components in the iPhones...
     
  14. ActionableMango macrumors G3

    ActionableMango

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    #14
    What? Lick Apple's feet? No, the CDMA carriers are dropping CDMA because it's an outdated technology.

    Just like the TDMA carriers (AT&T and T-Mobile) abandoned TDMA for GSM. And prior to that all the carriers abandoned AMPS (analog).

    Some day LTE will be abandoned.
     
  15. fischersd macrumors 601

    fischersd

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    #15
    Sorry to tell you that CDMA's demise was planned by wireless carriers around the world. How power hungry it is (both for cell phones as well as base stations), to say nothing of the licensing fees that Qualcomm charged not only handset makers but the wireless providers to run those base stations was ridiculous.
    Apple isn't putting the more expensive CDMA capable modem into most of the handsets sold around the world because no-one wants or needs them, as there's so few CDMA carriers left.
    LTE actually stands for "Long Term Evolution" - it was the end game for all carriers around the world to be using the same protocol.
    The CDMA carriers existing today? They've been sitting on their asses taking their time migrating off as many carriers completed their migrations away early last year.

    Apple's tax practices nor their market capitalization have absolutely nothing to do with making more efficient handsets that don't have useless legacy technology in them.

    Do you have family members that work at Qualcomm or own their stock? I can certainly understand your concern. They're going to need to be a lot more competitive once the royalties from CDMA are long gone.
     
  16. C DM macrumors Westmere

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    #16
    Apple doesn't have to do anything as it's already been planned out and being implemented. Things like that are years in the planning and then years in implementation.
     
  17. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #17
    Planning it and doing it are two different things.

    Sure they may eventually all be phased out but that won't happen overnight!

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_CDMA2000_networks
     
  18. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #18
    I don't have any affiliation with Apple or Qualcomm.

    I just find the irony of them complaining about Qualcomm while simultaneously doing all they can to rack in the dough.

    Apple has quite the influence, don't you think? They certainly get involved in politics, social issues, and I've even read... Healthcare?

    So I'm pretty sure that even if CDMA wasn't being abandoned yet by a carrier, if Intel (or other companies) can't provide it, it's going by the way of the Dodo bird.
     
  19. fischersd macrumors 601

    fischersd

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    #19
    That information also isn't all that up to date. Once you start going through the list and checking on the individual carrier, you find that most of them have already migrated off. (of the first listing, the ones that are suggested as active). Other discrepancies as well for the defunct networks...

    Even if Intel does provide CDMA capable modems for Apple, Intel will still be paying royalties to Qualcomm for those modems.

    CDMA going away is a good thing. It's an antiquated protocol. It's slow and bad for battery life.

    Qualcomm will still get a share of the royalties for LTE - they are a contributor for it, but they are by no means the lions share.

    Heh...me, I like Apple getting involved in healthcare and doing things with technology to improve our health. People have written testimonials over how the Apple Watch has made them healthier. Where's the downside in that?

    You sound a little like a friend of mine. He's paranoid about Google...feels that they're too powerful and is "all seeing". :)

    I don't see Apple's reach being all that far.
     
  20. C DM macrumors Westmere

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    #20
    And that's what I said, that planning it takes a while and implementing it (as in doing it) takes a while. All that has been in the works before any Apple-related stuff.
     
  21. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #21
    I can understand your friend. Most big companies would dip into everything and make you think it's for your benefit. Then just like the internet providers here in the USA, they'd leave you with little to no other options. They'd price things in a way that the only ones who benefit are the companies. I think a few pharmaceutical companies already do this as well.

    I don't care if CDMA goes away, I care that currently the device I buy from T-Mobile or AT&T cannot work with Sprint or Verizon. So I'm paying the same for a product that cannot do the same as it's equally priced equivalent.

    I also had the TSMC vs Samsung battery issue with two 6s I owned. Guess I just don't like seeing them cripple one component to save a few bucks with a different manufacturer.


    Yeah, that's fine if it goes away. It's not fine when it's not gone yet but you still have two models priced the same but cannot function the same.
     
  22. fischersd macrumors 601

    fischersd

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    #22
    I have news for you. Your T-Mobile or AT&T phone would work just fine on Verizon's or Sprint's LTE networks.

    Edit: You just need to get your phone unlocked.

    (you can thank the FCC for not doing away with Carrier SIM locking in the US yet - it's gone in Europe and Canada already).
     
  23. Septembersrain, Nov 10, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2017

    Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #23
    No. It won't.

    https://www.macrumors.com/2016/09/08/att-and-tmobile-iphone-7-models-lack-cdma/

    Edit: Why do you think there were so many threads on how to get the Verizon iPhone X? It comes with LTE unlocked and can be used on AT&T, T-Mobile and possibly Sprint (They can be jerks about what devices they allow, I used to work for Boost Mobile).

    They should just allow SIM unlocked, GSM/CDMA devices from the very beginning. It's a real hassle having to confirm carrier. I get that it's supposed to limit scalpers, etc but gee wiz.
     
  24. fischersd macrumors 601

    fischersd

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    #24
    You should try reading a little slower. I said LTE. Verizon and Sprint already have nationwide LTE networks. We've heard various reasons for why they haven't turned down their CDMA networks yet. That they don't have VoLTE (Voice over LTE) support yet, some say that they were asked by the government to keep the CDMA networks lit up for awhile.

    But, they already have the LTE data capability. As long as they could do the voice channel over UMTS or HSPA, then your phone would work just fine on either of those carriers.
     
  25. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #25
    So in a few years when my device is completely obsolete? Got it.
     

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