Why Did Apple Do This?

[fischersd]

So in a few years when my device is completely obsolete? Got it.

No, I'm saying in all likelihood it would work on Verizon's network now (maybe Sprint's as well....but from what people say here, they don't quite have their act together, so maybe not).

Edit: You could easily test this....just borrow a friend's Verizon SIM and pop it into your iPhone and see if it works ok.

 

[ericlin0122]

Canada got rid of CDMA couple years ago. I’m surprised US is still CDMA.

 

[Septembersrain]

No, I'm saying in all likelihood it would work on Verizon's network now (maybe Sprint's as well....but from what people say here, they don't quite have their act together, so maybe not).

That's my biggest qualm right now.

The carriers, the limitations, the lack of options to get a device that will work with the big 4 and their subsidiaries unless you've got a Verizon iPhone (7 or newer).

I know they'll release a SIM free eventually but if I get it, my T-Mobile insurance won't cover it. It's not a device purchased from them. Applecare+ doesn't cover lost or theft. So I'm between rock and a hard place.

Edit: Tried this with a SIM free iPhone 5c and kept getting letters from Asurion saying my device cannot be covered. Maybe they've changed that but I still risk them denying claim anyways. Bah.

 

[fischersd]

That's my biggest qualm right now.

The carriers, the limitations, the lack of options to get a device that will work with the big 4 and their subsidiaries unless you've got a Verizon iPhone (7 or newer).

I know they'll release a SIM free eventually but if I get it, my T-Mobile insurance won't cover it. It's not a device purchased from them. Applecare+ doesn't cover lost or theft. So I'm between rock and a hard place.

I thought some of the US carriers didn't actually SIM lock after activation if you were on a postpaid plan? (could also be that you have to buy the device outright).

You'll need to find out the circumstances that you could activate a T-Mobile device and it not be SIM locked afterwards. Then you could try the Verizon and Sprint SIMs in the phone to see if they work or not. (if you get both data as well as voice).

 

[illmatic41]

Canada got rid of CDMA couple years ago. I’m surprised US is still CDMA.

I love our friendly neighbors to the north, but the entire population of Canada is less than the state of California. There are just too many customers for a company like Verizon to just drop support of in so little time. As much as I hate Verizon, they've done a good job of updating and migrating their LTE coverage to where it is now in the time frame they did it in.

 

[Septembersrain]

I thought some of the US carriers didn't actually SIM lock after activation if you were on a postpaid plan? (could also be that you have to buy the device outright).

You'll need to find out the circumstances that you could activate a T-Mobile device and it not be SIM locked afterwards. Then you could try the Verizon and Sprint SIMs in the phone to see if they work or not. (if you get both data as well as voice).

It didn't SIM lock the 5c I had bought from Apple outright. My concern was that if it was lost or stolen, because it was not bought from them, they could not ensure that I'd be approved a claim. I have no idea why this is or the reasoning. They sold that device through T-Mobile. Hopefully the policy changed.

I can get it if say it's a Umidigi or Oppo that they don't sell. They can't send a replacement they don't have!

If it's bought from T-Mobile outright, you can get it unlocked. However due to the limitations, Verizon nor Sprint will work on it. I'm sure others have already tried.

I'd be willing to try it once my 7 Plus is paid off and unlocked. Doubt it'll benefit though as even if the device worked, it probably wouldn't be to full capacity. Data only maybe?

 

[C DM]

Yeah, that's fine if it goes away. It's not fine when it's not gone yet but you still have two models priced the same but cannot function the same.

A lot of phones work and have worked like that even before the iPhone. Different models for CDMA and GSM sometimes if it a lot of times some phones wouldn't even be available at all for CDMA or GSM as they would just be for one or the other. This isn't some Apple specific thing or something new or different from how things have been in the industry in general for some time.

 

[fischersd]

It didn't SIM lock the 5c I had bought from Apple outright. My concern was that if it was lost or stolen, because it was not bought from them, they could not ensure that I'd be approved a claim. I have no idea why this is or the reasoning. They sold that device through T-Mobile. Hopefully the policy changed.

I can get it if say it's a Umidigi or Oppo that they don't sell. They can't send a replacement they don't have!

If it's bought from T-Mobile outright, you can get it unlocked. However due to the limitations, Verizon nor Sprint will work on it. I'm sure others have already tried.

I'd be willing to try it once my 7 Plus is paid off and unlocked. Doubt it'll benefit though as even if the device worked, it probably wouldn't be to full capacity. Data only maybe?

Yep, the 7 Plus should pretty much work the same way.

 

[Septembersrain]

A lot of phones work and have worked like that even before the iPhone. Different models for CDMA and GSM sometimes if it a lot of times some phones wouldn't even be available at all for CDMA or GSM as they would just be for one or the other. This isn't some Apple specific thing or something new or different from how things have been in the industry in general for some time.

Yeah but Apple has this whole simplicity theme going on. At least I thought they did. For the most part, more device manufacturers are starting to include all bands while Apple is moving away from it.

Like a lot of Chinese devices are starting to carry CDMA so they can infiltrate the market here.

I've seen it with Oppo, Umidigi, Xiaomi, etc. Even if it's limited capacity, it's still a thing.

 

[IndoX]

You can use unlocked T-Mobile and AT&T iPhones for Verizon’s LTE network. The moment you cross into CDMA territory your call will drop and you won’t have service (this happens anyway if you have VoLTE except you’ll revert to CDMA instead of losing service).

Sprint is an anomaly.

CDMA is in the past. Once Verizon and Sprint transition Apple will sell a single model for the US - while probably offering a CDMA model for other countries that still use it internationally.

 

[fischersd]

You can use unlocked T-Mobile and AT&T iPhones for Verizon’s LTE network. The moment you cross into CDMA territory your call will drop and you won’t have service (this happens anyway if you have VoLTE except you’ll revert to CDMA instead of losing service).

Sprint is an anomaly.

CDMA is in the past. Once Verizon and Sprint transition Apple will sell a single model for the US - while probably offering a CDMA model for other countries that still use it internationally.

By the time Verizon shuts it down at the end of 2019, I'm thinking the other CDMA carriers will also have done so (if there are a few left, I'm guessing they won't have enough subscribers to warrant Apple making an iPhone model for them).

 

[JPIndustrie]

Some people will argue just about anything amirite

Another plot twist: Didn’t CDMA force phones to drop data connections while on the phone until the call was done? Another reason why it should be dead and killed off. Apple is doing good here.

 

[Jimmy Guphanti]

OP here. This really got off topic. I guess the answer would be by carrying two SKUs where one (CDMA) is more expensive than the GSM modem model, Apple can lower their variable costs by only requisitioning CDMA modems upon request rather than putting them in all the handsets. That's pretty cheap.

Given how complicated the wireless industry is (SIM cards, LTE bands, frequencies, countries, carriers, locked/unlocked, subsidies, etc.) Apple, known for their simplicity, should be doing more. They should make one (1) handset that works in any country, any network, etc. A true global phone with all protocols/radios included in it. The variable cost goes up, but this is offset by having less SKUs to inventory (remember years ago when Apple had so few SKUs?) Also, charging $1149 a pop for the iPhone X, I don't think they're going broke any time soon.

Also, I wouldn't be surprised if the telecom lobby has a hand here. Verizon and AT&T (CDMA and GSM, respectively) have an incentive for there to be differentiation among the handsets to keep you from being able to easily switch networks.

Crony capitalism.

 

[fischersd]

OP here. This really got off topic. I guess the answer would be by carrying two SKUs where one (CDMA) is more expensive than the GSM modem model, Apple can lower their variable costs by only requisitioning CDMA modems upon request rather than putting them in all the handsets. That's pretty cheap.

Given how complicated the wireless industry is (SIM cards, LTE bands, frequencies, countries, carriers, locked/unlocked, subsidies, etc.) Apple, known for their simplicity, should be doing more. They should make one (1) handset that works in any country, any network, etc. A true global phone with all protocols/radios included in it. The variable cost goes up, but this is offset by having less SKUs to inventory (remember years ago when Apple had so few SKUs?) Also, charging $1149 a pop for the iPhone X, I don't think they're going broke any time soon.

Also, I wouldn't be surprised if the telecom lobby has a hand here. Verizon and AT&T (CDMA and GSM, respectively) have an incentive for there to be differentiation among the handsets to keep you from being able to easily switch networks.

Crony capitalism.

The only reason that there's lots of SKUs is that they continue to sell the old models. If they stopped doing that, they would have very few (but this is how they're filling the lower priced markets).

If you take colour and storage out of the equation, there's only 3 models of the X - GSM, GSM/CDMA and GSM for Japan (because they have different NFC over there). In a couple of years CDMA will finally breathe its last breath. Maybe by then there will be an NFC chip that supports the Japanese standards as well as those elsewhere. Then Apple could have one model for the world.

LTE (Long Term Evolution) is where the carriers were all to converge and everyone would be using the same protocols. This has been known by carriers around the world for a very long time (the iPhone 5 had LTE....not a lot of excuses for CDMA still being around heading into 2018).

 

[Jimmy Guphanti]

The only reason that there's lots of SKUs is that they continue to sell the old models. If they stopped doing that, they would have very few (but this is how they're filling the lower priced markets).

If you take colour and storage out of the equation, there's only 3 models of the X - GSM, GSM/CDMA and GSM for Japan (because they have different NFC over there). In a couple of years CDMA will finally breathe its last breath. Maybe by then there will be an NFC chip that supports the Japanese standards as well as those elsewhere. Then Apple could have one model for the world.

LTE (Long Term Evolution) is where the carriers were all to converge and everyone would be using the same protocols. This has been known by carriers around the world for a very long time (the iPhone 5 had LTE....not a lot of excuses for CDMA still being around heading into 2018).

Which one is the GSM/CDMA iPhone X? I only see a GSM and a CDMA.

 

[C DM]

Which one is the GSM/CDMA iPhone X? I only see a GSM and a CDMA.

The CDMA model also supports GSM.

 

[IndoX]

As C DM mentioned the Verizon/Sprint models support both CDMA/GSM. The ONLY reason for that is because parts of their network still use CDMA for voice calling while all of their LTE data (and VoLTE) is done through GSM.

Verizon is slated to turn off their entire CDMA network in 2019. Sprint is TBD.

Once that happens Apple will sell the singular GSM model in the United States - or maybe by that time they'll be a new network protocol.

 

[gavroche]

Well even if it's not done yet, Apple will put the sunset on it if they can.

You really dont seem to understand what is going on at all. Please re-read what some of the commentors said above... they are doing a good job of explaining. But you seem too stuck in searching for evil motivations...

 

[Septembersrain]

You really dont seem to understand what is going on at all. Please re-read what some of the commentors said above... they are doing a good job of explaining. But you seem too stuck in searching for evil motivations...

No, I'm stating an obvious trend. Apple decided we don't need a headphone jack, we don't need Touch ID, how hard is it to grasp the concept of "We don't need CDMA"?

Edit: As you'll see, they set market trends too. I bet if Verizon no longer has CDMA but Sprint does, Sprint would be told no more iPhone for you. We're sorry but we're "Being innovative" and you're holding us back. Evil? No. Limiting? Yes.

 

[C DM]

No, I'm stating an obvious trend. Apple decided we don't need a headphone jack, we don't need Touch ID, how hard is it to grasp the concept of "We don't need CDMA"?

Edit: As you'll see, they set market trends too. I bet if Verizon no longer has CDMA but Sprint does, Sprint would be told no more iPhone for you. We're sorry but we're "Being innovative" and you're holding us back. Evil? No. Limiting? Yes.

Except that Apple didn't really have anything to do with it in this case. Yes, despite Apple perhaps having something to do with things in some cases, it doesn't mean that they have anything to do with things in other cases.

 

[gavroche]

No, I'm stating an obvious trend. Apple decided we don't need a headphone jack, we don't need Touch ID, how hard is it to grasp the concept of "We don't need CDMA"?

Edit: As you'll see, they set market trends too. I bet if Verizon no longer has CDMA but Sprint does, Sprint would be told no more iPhone for you. We're sorry but we're "Being innovative" and you're holding us back. Evil? No. Limiting? Yes.

Because it isn't Apple that decided we don't need CDMA any more.

 

[Septembersrain]

Except that Apple didn't really have anything to do with it in this case. Yes, despite Apple perhaps having something to do with things in some cases, it doesn't mean that they have anything to do with things in other cases.

That doesn't definitively mean that they don't, right?

 

[Septembersrain]

Because it isn't Apple that decided we don't need CDMA any more.

Really? Tell that to Sprint who is TBD on the end date for CDMA.

 

[C DM]

That doesn't definitively mean that they don't, right?

I guess in the sense that there isn't something to definitively mean that the Lizard people live on the inside of the planet. Sure.

 

[Septembersrain]

I guess in the sense that there isn't something to definitively mean that the Lizard people live on the inside of the planet. Sure.

That is a conspiracy. A fact is that Apple influences the market.