Why did they do this to the tbMBP?

[MH01]

Back to topic, Apple is not in the dongle business. They could care less if you buy one from them. It's not even a line item in their reported financials. They sell dongles to try to make sure the dongles exist. I actually wish they sold more accessories during this new usb-c era. I would like an Apple offering for a tb3 hub and possibly a DP AV adapter like the hdmi one they offer. But they don't because this is not their core business and 100 companies are lining up to make these things. The fact that they killed their router business is indicative that they are not interested in selling commoditized accessories unless it helps their core businesses in some way.

Anger at Apple for dongle pricing is misdirected. You can be angry that they are pushing usb-c, but you do have a choice to wait on the sidelines until the standard matures and let the rest of us deal with any "pain". The accessory market will work itself out and the competition will bring these prices down. We are all early adopters and paid premiums for our MBP's. That may also mean we have to pay premiums in these early days for accessories. You can wait it out while we deal?

Apple prices will not drop. The are and will be making a massive profit from these. Is there any accessory that has a line item?

 

[thesaint024]

What the .............?>??>??>>>>??>?>?>?>?>?>>>>????????

If they are not interested in making a profit off them then why not include one USB C to USB A in the box and / or why not sell them at cost? C'Mon man....

Apple is making a TON of moola off the sale of their dongles, adapters and USB C cables...

Are they making a profit, of course. But you make it sound like it is a major objective. Accessories are a minuscule part of their profits.

Accessories are very high margin. Retailers like Best Buy always aggressively try to sell you cables or memory cards with major purchases. Every experience with Apple has been "do you need anything else to get you going?" They never push this stuff.

This is all about perspective. For you and I, the money spent and made on accessories is HUGE. Millions would make us happy. For a company selling $150+ billion a year, accessories are a rounding error. You can keep thinking that they are trying to gouge you and take it personal, but given numbers, it doesn't look realistic. Like I said, they don't push accessories and could care less if you bought dongles from them.

 

[SteveJUAE]

Are they making a profit, of course. But you make it sound like it is a major objective. Accessories are a minuscule part of their profits.

Accessories are very high margin. Retailers like Best Buy always aggressively try to sell you cables or memory cards with major purchases. Every experience with Apple has been "do you need anything else to get you going?" They never push this stuff.

This is all about perspective. For you and I, the money spent and made on accessories is HUGE. Millions would make us happy. For a company selling $150+ billion a year, accessories are a rounding error. You can keep thinking that they are trying to gouge you and take it personal, but given numbers, it doesn't look realistic. Like I said, they don't push accessories and could care less if you bought dongles from them.

Around ~4% is not a rounding error and Mac's are only ~11% of total sales

It's quite possible given margins on accessories are high that profits on accessories is close to Mac's

 

[raqball]

Are they making a profit, of course. But you make it sound like it is a major objective. Accessories are a minuscule part of their profits.

Accessories are very high margin. Retailers like Best Buy always aggressively try to sell you cables or memory cards with major purchases. Every experience with Apple has been "do you need anything else to get you going?" They never push this stuff.

This is all about perspective. For you and I, the money spent and made on accessories is HUGE. Millions would make us happy. For a company selling $150+ billion a year, accessories are a rounding error. You can keep thinking that they are trying to gouge you and take it personal, but given numbers, it doesn't look realistic. Like I said, they don't push accessories and could care less if you bought dongles from them.

So again, if this $150+ billion a year in sales company is not worried about accessory profits then why not sell them at cost?

They are most definitely interested in making every cent they can... Their stock holders demand it! You are making it sound like Apple is doing you a favor by having these over priced dongles in their stores and allowing you the opportunity to purchase them.. How nice of them! LOL

 

[Jaekae]

To save money on something not every user may use, its a company and the goal is profit. But imo at these prices they would make alot of profit even with them included..

 

[dyn]

Responses like this really do make me scratch my noodle and shrug.. If Apple is not interested in making a profit off their dongles then why do they not sell them at cost?? Ummmmm, because they are making hand over fist profits on every dongle sold that's why..

Ok, then where are Apple's docking station solutions? And how about their TB-3-ethernet or USB-C - ethernet adapter? What about their external batteries that use USB-C to charge your notebook? Multiport adapter with 4 USB-A ports? Multiport adapter with HDMI and ethernet as well as some other ports?

Exactly, Apple doesn't have any of those nor do they have any USB-C cables except for the USB-C to lightning and USB-C charging cable. All the other stuff is from 3rd party manufacturers. Or differently put: out of all the USB-C and Thunderbolt accessories available to market right now not even 10% is from Apple. Why on earth would Apple go for a connection (USB-C) where 90% of the market is in hands of other parties? Go scratch your noodle on that.

Besides that, accessories aren't Apples primary product line. They only do that because that's how you sell more of the primary product line. It isn't new, it is something that every store does and have been doing for hundreds of years.

Apple is banking (pun intended) of the fact that most buyers will walk into the Apple Store to buy a MacBook and while there, they will also purchase adapters, cables and dongles that are needed...

Most countries do not even have an Apple Store so most users can't walk into the Apple Store and buy something. The other thing that you completely missed and apparently didn't understand is the fact that they don't even have to. Why bother buying off of Apple if you can buy it from a 3rd party for less money? They might even sell it in a local store because, hey, it is not an Apple specific port.

Ahh the penny drops at last for you, that's the added benefit, well done

It is not my penny that needs dropping, it is yours. What did you not understand about?:

Additionally, the connector with the 2 pins and metal strip can indeed be used for a tighter fit as the outlet comes with 2 metal strips (they make contact with the metal strip on the connector) that can function as a spring and hold the connector in more tightly. In some cases this is way too tight and thus the 2 pin ungrounded connector is a much better solution. If you're going to plug it into a wall outlet I can image the extension cable is useful as it can be used to take off the strain on the charger (or in other words: the 2 pin connector doesn't have to hold itself plus the "heavy" charger up). In real life that's not a problem though, most of the pins are angled towards each other so they go in pretty tight and stay put (friction fit).

TL;DR: the grounding is why it is there, the tighter fit is just a bonus. That's the 3rd time I'm saying this. If you want to reply then fine but do read posts before you reply to them first.

 

[raqball]

Ok, then where are Apple's docking station solutions? And how about their TB-3-ethernet or USB-C - ethernet adapter? What about their external batteries that use USB-C to charge your notebook? Multiport adapter with 4 USB-A ports? Multiport adapter with HDMI and ethernet as well as some other ports?

Exactly, Apple doesn't have any of those nor do they have any USB-C cables except for the USB-C to lightning and USB-C charging cable. All the other stuff is from 3rd party manufacturers. Or differently put: out of all the USB-C and Thunderbolt accessories available to market right now not even 10% is from Apple. Why on earth would Apple go for a connection (USB-C) where 90% of the market is in hands of other parties? Go scratch your noodle on that.

Besides that, accessories aren't Apples primary product line. They only do that because that's how you sell more of the primary product line. It isn't new, it is something that every store does and have been doing for hundreds of years.


Most countries do not even have an Apple Store so most users can't walk into the Apple Store and buy something. The other thing that you completely missed and apparently didn't understand is the fact that they don't even have to. Why bother buying off of Apple if you can buy it from a 3rd party for less money? They might even sell it in a local store because, hey, it is not an Apple specific port.

The thread, and what I've been basing my responses on was

Why does Apple not include the extension cord and a dongle in the box

Here is the original OP's post on the matter

I have my theories, but what are your theories on why Apple didn't include (1) the extension AC power cable and (2) at least an USB-C <> USB adapter?

The extension cable does make carrying the tbMBP around a bit more bulky, but it's not like the MBP line is a featherweight to begin with.

I think it's a large oversight to not even package a USB-C <> USB adapter if you're going to introduce a new port standard.

I can't imagine removing these two items from their non-competitively priced machines would really break their bank. Sure, they're out to make profit, but that's not the only dimension to consider.

The reasons can go either way depending on what side of the fence you are on

1. They are penny pinching
2. To sell more dongles
3. Nobody uses them anyways

1 and 2 are legit reasons to me.. 3 would be a legit reason IF Apple allowed people to pick up an extension power cable for free! As I stated previously, offer it at the time of sale OR allow users to bring in their receipt and pick one up free of charge if they want or need it..

If Apple did that then the only complaint you'd hear from me is the fact they should have included one USB C to USB A adapter in the box...

 

[dyn]

Why would that be legit if you can pick it up for free? We are talking about an ordinary company, not something like the Salvation Army. When you still stock an item that hardly anyone uses that means you have to compensate the cost of the thing with less items sold. The only way you can do that is to go up in price. Hence the higher pricing for modern day desktops and notebooks.

Apple isn't an accessory company, they only sell some to accompany their main products so that means that the cost of their accessories will always be higher than for a company where accessories are the main products.

The fact that there are many companies, especially from China, that have accessories as their main product is something that most here forget. Like I said, the accessory competition is fierce so it doesn't make any sense for Apple to join them. The only reason for them to manufacture the accessories is because their customers ask them to, even though this is a small portion. Apple would not be the first company I'd go to when buying an accessory.

 

[flyinmac]

I have my theories, but what are your theories on why Apple didn't include (1) the extension AC power cable and (2) at least an USB-C <> USB adapter?

The extension cable does make carrying the tbMBP around a bit more bulky, but it's not like the MBP line is a featherweight to begin with.

I think it's a large oversight to not even package a USB-C <> USB adapter if you're going to introduce a new port standard.

I can't imagine removing these two items from their non-competitively priced machines would really break their bank. Sure, they're out to make profit, but that's not the only dimension to consider.

You have to remember that when Apple introduced the iMac in 1988 that they removed the Floppy Drive and provided absolutely no means of storing files and backup copies of data on any other media without purchasing a USB solution (the built-in CD-ROM drive was read only - not a writer).

Also keep in mind that USB was still a reasonably new, flunky, unreliable, and largely unsupported technology then.

It wasn't until 2001 that an iMac started shipping with a built-in means of storing data on external physical media again (a writable CD-ROM drive). A feature which was again removed from the iMac again in 2012.

Without built-in abilities to archive to physical media, you are left to use alternative options. Today we have flash drives, external USB hard drives, USB DVD or Blu Ray writers, etc.

But in 1998, the primary option we had was emailing the files to another machine to make a backup copy. That was a bit cumbersome. Granted other solutions quickly became available. But in the beginning, it wasn't pretty.

This is how Apple operates. Take a jump off a cliff, and hope that 3rd party companies build a solution before you hit the ground.

 

[thesaint024]

Around ~4% is not a rounding error and Mac's are only ~11% of total sales

It's quite possible given margins on accessories are high that profits on accessories is close to Mac's

I see where you got 4%. This is ALL Apple accessories. This includes iphone cases, ipad covers, watchbands recently, keyboards, mice, routers, monitors? and of course dongles and cables. If you thought this was dongles/cables, we would all be spending 35% of a Mac computer price on Mac accessories. If we spent on average $2500, we would be spending $800 EACH on cables and dongles. That 4% number is not relevant since it includes non-Mac accessories or even tech accessories like keyboards and mice. I heard @MH01 complain about $100 he spent on two dongles. That's a far cry from 35% of the cost of his MBP. I've personally spent zero on Apple accessories for the MBP, even with this "outrageous" lack of legacy port situation. Apple "pushes" certain accessories for iPhone and iPad, as those are money making divisions. "Push" as in they are actually designing and marketing cases as some cool, fashionable accessory for branding reasons. Cables and dongles? These don't enhance the brand and are there for utilitarian reasons.

Regardless, this line of thinking is not getting through to some of you. You are convinced a company like Apple whose brand and reputation are central to it's business model are operating like a flea market vendor and just trying to pocket the last cent at risk of future sales. This is why they have a generous return policy and better than average support, for their brand. Squeezing pennies is not logical to me or anyone who has basic marketing understanding. They are able to sell at premium prices because of their brand equity. They won't risk that for pennies. But hey, it's just an opinion that I think is informed, but you seem to think is fanboyish. I'll agree to disagree.
[doublepost=1483823129][/doublepost]

Why would that be legit if you can pick it up for free? We are talking about an ordinary company, not something like the Salvation Army. When you still stock an item that hardly anyone uses that means you have to compensate the cost of the thing with less items sold. The only way you can do that is to go up in price. Hence the higher pricing for modern day desktops and notebooks.

Apple isn't an accessory company, they only sell some to accompany their main products so that means that the cost of their accessories will always be higher than for a company where accessories are the main products.

The fact that there are many companies, especially from China, that have accessories as their main product is something that most here forget. Like I said, the accessory competition is fierce so it doesn't make any sense for Apple to join them. The only reason for them to product the accessories is because their customers ask them to, even though this is a small portion. Apple would not be the first company I'd go to when buying an accessory.

Preach. Most accessories are COMMODITIES. They have no intrinsic IP value and simply sell on lowest cost alone. Cables and dongles fall into this commoditized category. Apple designed cases and keyboards have either heavy marketing or some Apple tech that adds to their value that others cannot easily just undersell. They do, and there is a market, but brand still means something for some items. Cables and dongles are not part of Apple's brand reputation.
[doublepost=1483823794][/doublepost]

The reasons can go either way depending on what side of the fence you are on

1. They are penny pinching
2. To sell more dongles
3. Nobody uses them anyways

1 and 2 are legit reasons to me.. 3 would be a legit reason IF Apple allowed people to pick up an extension power cable for free! As I stated previously, offer it at the time of sale OR allow users to bring in their receipt and pick one up free of charge if they want or need it..

If Apple did that then the only complaint you'd hear from me is the fact they should have included one USB C to USB A adapter in the box...

I will go back to other luxury brands. Why do some of you insist that MBP's must suddenly come with a free accessory in the case of usb-c to a dongle. I am indifferent but starting to strongly agree that they shouldn't continue to include the extension. Apparently Mac owners have multiples of these lying around, meaning they don't really need a new one or any at all every time they buy a Mac. I myself have one that I haven't used in years. Just wasteful.

But again, a luxury brand doesn't equate to freebies. Sure they give over the top service and make sure the sales process is pleasant, but giving you stuff just because? I'm trying to recall a company that does this. Yet some of you insist that's what premium means. Porsche makes you pay for EVERY SINGLE upgrade to their cars. There is no package, almost EVERYTHING is some paid add-on. Luxury hotels make you pay for wifi. That great steak restaurant makes you pay for every side, nothing is included. This is the norm, not some crazy exception. I don't really want them sticking in accessories and raising the total price when I don't want these accessories. I don't understand how you are equating premium with freebies. All these companies are in it for the bottomline. I guess everyone is nickel and diming for that last cent, brand be damned.

 

[raqball]

Apparently Mac owners have multiples of these lying around, meaning they don't really need a new one or any at all every time they buy a Mac. I myself have one that I haven't used in years. Just wasteful.

Do they? I am a long time Mac owner and I have zero! When I sell or pass along the old MacBook, the box and accessories go with it....

Asside from that, if it's not needed by anyone then why do they continue to sell it for a profit? I guess it must still be needed by some eh?

 

[GCMD]

I am now dumber from having read this..Thanks

That may be true but that has nothing to do with the content of the post...you should have that checked out. Or just log out.
[doublepost=1483826399][/doublepost]

You sound like someone that would buy a Ferrari and state that $3000 official tyres are cheap compared to the cost of the car and therefore cheap. To further prove your point you will find a set of $500 tyres. Relative costs has nothing to do if something is expensive.

Cheers mate, logic, common sense and rational thought .

Have a good weekend.

If I bought a Ferrari, I'd not do it without research and enough money to not just BUY it but to also MAINTAIN it.

You meant to be facetious but you proved my point. If you don't want the best product, quality and build, buy something cheap. If you want the best, don't complain about the price of DONGLES.

$50 isn't that expensive for the one you wanted...

1 USB C port ($10-15 for adapter)
1 HDMI port ($15-25 for adapter)
1 USB 3.0 port ($10-15 for adapter)

At the low end, this adapter provides a value of at least $35 for cheap ones and around $55 for better ones all using 1 USB C port on your computer...so, what are you complaining about?

 

[thesaint024]

Do they? I am a long time Mac owner and I have zero! When I sell or pass along the old MacBook, the box and accessories go with it....

Asside from that, if it's not needed by anyone then why do they continue to sell it for a profit? I guess it must still be needed by some eh?

I hate to say it, but it sounds like you are bitching for the sake of bitching. Let's assume they include the extension at cost of say $4. They raise the price of all MBP's by $4 and now we all have one because some of you wanted the extensions and didn't have any handy. Now I have another extension I don't use and paid $4 more for my MBP. Yes it's a pittance but it's a waste of money and material nevertheless. There are also those that had to get different extensions for different country's outlets. They probably won't use the included one either that they paid $4 extra for. This sounds a lot like you wanting me to carry around the legacy ports that I don't use because some of you do. The way it is now, we all have choice. If I was one of the people that needed an extension, I would pay the $20 to get one. It's a profit for Apple, but why wouldn't they sell everything they make for a profit? They have yet another complexity in their supply chain, yet another product line to carry, and overhead to cover. Profit is fair. Again, it's $20, and they sell generics for $8 on Amazon if that's more palatable. I've spent too much time trying to convince you that $20/$8/$4 (for usb adapter) is no big deal. If it's too much of a slap in the face, buy a PC or a 2015, .... because of $8.

 

[GCMD]

Out of interest I checked your links and none of them ship internationally to UAE and I suspect many more countries

But that's not the point

Yes if your happy to hunt around you may find some cheaper alternatives but I certainly prefer to walk out the shop with all my add-ons in one go knowing that they are approved and will work when I get home

That does not mean I am happy with the price of many accessories, We are all use to so called "Apple Tax" on these and other options and upgrades but that does not mean I have to be mute about it or source alternatives.

We are all entitled to have a gripe when we feel we are being fleeced regardless of circumstances or monetary value

https://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=596204

If you check the last link, it was a search for the USB C adapter so that you wouldn't be stuck with the specific products I linked to...which was a reply to the guy from the UK.

Amazon (the company) ships worldwide. Individual vendors? Not so much. I was specific when I mentioned AMAZON ships everywhere...

Do the research. There are a LOT of cheaper alternatives sold by reputable companies that have tested and verified that their products DO work with Apple Products. If you have a question about it, a simple email query will clear it up and they will likely include their warranty details should your computer be damaged using their product.

It's not that hard to save a few bucks if that's what you NEED...a lot easier than constantly complaining about something that has an easy and quick solution.


You are correct. You have the right to complain. If you're here voicing your opinion, you either want an audience or you want help. I offered help. If you don't take it, I have the right to voice MY criticism of what I will perceive as WHINING.
[doublepost=1483827258][/doublepost]

I hate to say it, but it sounds like you are bitching for the sake of bitching. Let's assume they include the extension at cost of say $4. They raise the price of all MBP's by $4 and now we all have one because some of you wanted the extensions and didn't have any handy. Now I have another extension I don't use and paid $4 more for my MBP. Yes it's a pittance but it's a waste of money and material nevertheless. There are also those that had to get different extensions for different country's outlets. They probably won't use the included one either that they paid $4 extra for. This sounds a lot like you wanting me to carry around the legacy ports that I don't use because some of you do. The way it is now, we all have choice. If I was one of the people that needed an extension, I would pay the $20 to get one. It's a profit for Apple, but why wouldn't they sell everything they make for a profit? They have yet another complexity in their supply chain, yet another product line to carry, and overhead to cover. Profit is fair. Again, it's $20, and they sell generics for $8 on Amazon if that's more palatable. I've spent too much time trying to convince you that $20/$8/$4 (for usb adapter) is no big deal. If it's too much of a slap in the face, buy a PC or a 2015, .... because of $8.

WAYYYYY too much logic and common sense in this post. It will break MR. You should DEFINITELY delete it, ASAP.
[doublepost=1483827879][/doublepost]

Do they? I am a long time Mac owner and I have zero! When I sell or pass along the old MacBook, the box and accessories go with it....

Asside from that, if it's not needed by anyone then why do they continue to sell it for a profit? I guess it must still be needed by some eh?

Not everyone sells their old Macs when they buy a new one and MOST people who use their MBP professionally go through at LEAST one cord in 3 years...I had 2 extra extensions but that's because between my wife and I, we have about 6 laptops in the house (all MBPs) that we either repurpose or hand down to the kids. We have an iMac, a Mac Mini, 6 iPads Minis and an assortment of iPhones.

If this isn't their first Mac, the average person could have an old cord...if they don't, $20 bucks isn't a LOT to pay for an extension.

I think Apple SHOULD include the extension. It's best for the stand alone quality of the machine. But the exclusion is NOT a reason to skip this release...it's more of an annoyance if anything.

 

[MH01]

I see where you got 4%. This is ALL Apple accessories. This includes iphone cases, ipad covers, watchbands recently, keyboards, mice, routers, monitors? and of course dongles and cables. If you thought this was dongles/cables, we would all be spending 35% of a Mac computer price on Mac accessories. If we spent on average $2500, we would be spending $800 EACH on cables and dongles. That 4% number is not relevant since it includes non-Mac accessories or even tech accessories like keyboards and mice. I heard @MH01 complain about $100 he spent on two dongles. That's a far cry from 35% of the cost of his MBP. I've personally spent zero on Apple accessories for the MBP, even with this "outrageous" lack of legacy port situation. Apple "pushes" certain accessories for iPhone and iPad, as those are money making divisions. "Push" as in they are actually designing and marketing cases as some cool, fashionable accessory for branding reasons. Cables and dongles? These don't enhance the brand and are there for utilitarian reasons.

Regardless, this line of thinking is not getting through to some of you. You are convinced a company like Apple whose brand and reputation are central to it's business model are operating like a flea market vendor and just trying to pocket the last cent at risk of future sales. This is why they have a generous return policy and better than average support, for their brand. Squeezing pennies is not logical to me or anyone who has basic marketing understanding. They are able to sell at premium prices because of their brand equity. They won't risk that for pennies. But hey, it's just an opinion that I think is informed, but you seem to think is fanboyish. I'll agree to disagree.
[doublepost=1483823129][/doublepost]
Preach. Most accessories are COMMODITIES. They have no intrinsic IP value and simply sell on lowest cost alone. Cables and dongles fall into this commoditized category. Apple designed cases and keyboards have either heavy marketing or some Apple tech that adds to their value that others cannot easily just undersell. They do, and there is a market, but brand still means something for some items. Cables and dongles are not part of Apple's brand reputation.
[doublepost=1483823794][/doublepost]
I will go back to other luxury brands. Why do some of you insist that MBP's must suddenly come with a free accessory in the case of usb-c to a dongle. I am indifferent but starting to strongly agree that they shouldn't continue to include the extension. Apparently Mac owners have multiples of these lying around, meaning they don't really need a new one or any at all every time they buy a Mac. I myself have one that I haven't used in years. Just wasteful.

But again, a luxury brand doesn't equate to freebies. Sure they give over the top service and make sure the sales process is pleasant, but giving you stuff just because? I'm trying to recall a company that does this. Yet some of you insist that's what premium means. Porsche makes you pay for EVERY SINGLE upgrade to their cars. There is no package, almost EVERYTHING is some paid add-on. Luxury hotels make you pay for wifi. That great steak restaurant makes you pay for every side, nothing is included. This is the norm, not some crazy exception. I don't really want them sticking in accessories and raising the total price when I don't want these accessories. I don't understand how you are equating premium with freebies. All these companies are in it for the bottomline. I guess everyone is nickel and diming for that last cent, brand be damned.

Just to be clear the Laptop cost me £800 at the time and the dongles were £100, so yeah, found it to be costly. Though I needed them and bought them.

 

[dyn]

The main thing some do not understand: nothing is for free. You are going to pay for it one way or the other. Things come at a cost. In this case we are talking about an accessory one can buy from various manufacturers so one can make a decision.

 

[thesaint024]

Just to be clear the Laptop cost me £800 at the time and the dongles were £100, so yeah, found it to be costly. Though I needed them and bought them.

This whole time I thought you were talking about the 2016 MBP. So you had to get £100 in dongles for a prior version that many have contended is superior because built in port functionality? I thought we were comparing the high cost of the MBP 16 with the gouging for "required" cables/dongles. You are right, £100 for dongles for a £800 MBP is a high percentage, but I don't think the situations are comparable for various reasons. I have no comment on prior MBP situation with cables/dongles.

 

[raqball]

I hate to say it, but it sounds like you are bitching for the sake of bitching. Let's assume they include the extension at cost of say $4. They raise the price of all MBP's by $4 and now we all have one because some of you wanted the extensions and didn't have any handy. Now I have another extension I don't use and paid $4 more for my MBP. Yes it's a pittance but it's a waste of money and material nevertheless. There are also those that had to get different extensions for different country's outlets. They probably won't use the included one either that they paid $4 extra for. This sounds a lot like you wanting me to carry around the legacy ports that I don't use because some of you do. The way it is now, we all have choice. If I was one of the people that needed an extension, I would pay the $20 to get one. It's a profit for Apple, but why wouldn't they sell everything they make for a profit? They have yet another complexity in their supply chain, yet another product line to carry, and overhead to cover. Profit is fair. Again, it's $20, and they sell generics for $8 on Amazon if that's more palatable. I've spent too much time trying to convince you that $20/$8/$4 (for usb adapter) is no big deal. If it's too much of a slap in the face, buy a PC or a 2015, .... because of $8.

Why do you staunch Apple defenders always have to twist posts and put words into posts that do not exist?

1st of all I did not create this thread and I couldn't care less if Apple includes the extension cable or not but some do and when you degrade them for it, that's overboard in my opinion.. If someone is upset it was taken away as a cost saving measure then so be it.. It's their $$$$ and not mine..

And for what reason do the staunch defenders put down everyone who may have a complaint? All to defend Apple who will NEVER have your best interest in mind? Apple is a company out to make money and nothing else.. If they can make a few extra bucks by removing something and charging for it later then they will.. The box itself might be next to get axed! And why not using your line of thought? It's not needed as they can just pack it in a ziplock bag.. LOL

 

[thesaint024]

Why do you staunch Apple defenders always have to twist posts and put words into posts that do not exist?

1st of all I did not create this thread and I couldn't care less if Apple includes the extension cable or not but some do and when you degrade them for it, that's overboard in my opinion.. If someone is upset it was taken away as a cost saving measure then so be it.. It's their $$$$ and not mine..

And for what reason do the staunch defenders put down everyone who may have a complaint? All to defend Apple who will NEVER have your best interest in mind? Apple is a company out to make money and nothing else.. If they can make a few extra bucks by removing something and charging for it later then they will.. The box itself might be next to get axed! LOL

What exactly did I twist and what words did I put in your mouth? Please don't make an accusation like that without backing it up. I have readily admitted when I was wrong or misinterpreted or poorly worded something. I'm not even sure what you're talking about in this case since you just made a blanket statement.

You are going to label me as a "staunch Apple defender" because I like my MBP 16? That's quite a conclusion. Is everyone who paid money and enjoys their purchase a "staunch Apple defender?" How do you get that from me stating why a sane, rational business decision has been made by Apple?

I exchanged money for a product. Apple made profit from me. That's a fair exchange, and I don't expect anyone to have MY best interests in mind. I don't expect charity nor am I entitled to a product exactly tailored for me. I need to go into the computer business if I felt that way. But sometimes the transaction is fair and there is nothing more to it. That's what business is. Why do you take Apple's business decisions as a personal affront to you? They are a for profit corporation.

Some of these complaints from people are just silly and hypothetical. They deserve to get called out as such. Especially since these are coming from non-owners. I recall you and a couple others that have complaints as owners. You make it seem like there is a gun to your head to own one. No one will care if you buy a PC or a 2015. You say you don't care about the extension cable or the adapter, but you continue to complain about it even though they have no effect on your usage? This is why I said you are bitching for the sake of bitching. I don't see a solution you are trying to get to. By all means, correct me where I'm wrong here or putting words in your mouth.

 

[raqball]

Some of these complaints from people are just silly and hypothetical. They deserve to get called out as such. Especially since these are coming from non-owners.

Statements like this! How do you know that someone complaining is a non owner and who then decides what's a reasonable complaint and what's not?

You say you don't care about the extension cable or the adapter, but you continue to complain about it even though they have no effect on your usage? This is why I said you are bitching for the sake of bitching.

Ummm.... Maybe even though it does not effect me personally I can still agree with the OP that it should be included? I dunno, maybe that's why?

 

[thesaint024]

Statements like this! How do you know that someone complaining is a non owner and who then decides what's a reasonable complaint and what's not?

Ummm.... Maybe even though it does not effect me personally I can still agree with the OP that it should be included? I dunno, maybe that's why?

Alright raqball, you win. I am not going to pursue this any longer. I presented possible reasons why this sense of entitlement to $9/$20 dongles is silly, but they are not good enough for you. Frankly, I don't care if anyone else is pleased with the MBP16 and/or Apple's decisions. Just tried to add some rationale to the discussion, take it for what it's worth, or not.

 

[Karnicopia]

I think people laugh this off but I do think environmental issues are a big part of it. Like Apple could easily just throw in the adapter and charge more money for the laptop if they wanted to I think their thinking is if not everyone is going to need to use it they don't want to ship it. Most people will be fine with the charger the way it is and don't need the extension cord also it looks to me like you could plug in almost any old power cord and it would work. Like it looks to me like I could take any of the ones I have laying around for old PC's if I really wanted to.

C to A I could see more because they did the headphone adapter for the iPhone and I'd imagine just about everyone will need to hook up a usb device at some point. At the same time though these things are like $4 on Amazon already and absolutely no third party is jumping up and down to make a lightning to audio adapter but there's a big market for usb A to C adapters so I mean I'm not going to flip out because I have to buy a $4 cable after buying a new laptop I mean that's pretty much par for the course. I really can't think of a single time that I bought a new computer that I didn't have to buy some new cables for something or other.

 

[SteveJUAE]

https://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=596204

If you check the last link, it was a search for the USB C adapter so that you wouldn't be stuck with the specific products I linked to...which was a reply to the guy from the UK.

Amazon (the company) ships worldwide. Individual vendors? Not so much. I was specific when I mentioned AMAZON ships everywhere...

Do the research. There are a LOT of cheaper alternatives sold by reputable companies that have tested and verified that their products DO work with Apple Products. If you have a question about it, a simple email query will clear it up and they will likely include their warranty details should your computer be damaged using their product.

It's not that hard to save a few bucks if that's what you NEED...a lot easier than constantly complaining about something that has an easy and quick solution.


You are correct. You have the right to complain. If you're here voicing your opinion, you either want an audience or you want help. I offered help. If you don't take it, I have the right to voice MY criticism of what I will perceive as WHINING.

FYI

You would be surprised how useless Amazon can be at times shipping internationally, simply many things they do not ship even using there international section additionally the freight costs make most little items ridiculous.

I simply pay the Apple price for convenience not for value, like many I started my USB-C dongle collection over a year back with the rMB

Whining about products or services is one thing whining about others is entirely different
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I see where you got 4%. This is ALL Apple accessories. This includes iphone cases, ipad covers, watchbands recently, keyboards, mice, routers, monitors? and of course dongles and cables. If you thought this was dongles/cables, we would all be spending 35% of a Mac computer price on Mac accessories. If we spent on average $2500, we would be spending $800 EACH on cables and dongles. That 4% number is not relevant since it includes non-Mac accessories or even tech accessories like keyboards and mice. I heard @MH01 complain about $100 he spent on two dongles. That's a far cry from 35% of the cost of his MBP. I've personally spent zero on Apple accessories for the MBP, even with this "outrageous" lack of legacy port situation. Apple "pushes" certain accessories for iPhone and iPad, as those are money making divisions. "Push" as in they are actually designing and marketing cases as some cool, fashionable accessory for branding reasons. Cables and dongles? These don't enhance the brand and are there for utilitarian reasons.

Regardless, this line of thinking is not getting through to some of you. You are convinced a company like Apple whose brand and reputation are central to it's business model are operating like a flea market vendor and just trying to pocket the last cent at risk of future sales. This is why they have a generous return policy and better than average support, for their brand. Squeezing pennies is not logical to me or anyone who has basic marketing understanding. They are able to sell at premium prices because of their brand equity. They won't risk that for pennies. But hey, it's just an opinion that I think is informed, but you seem to think is fanboyish. I'll agree to disagree.
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Preach. Most accessories are COMMODITIES. They have no intrinsic IP value and simply sell on lowest cost alone. Cables and dongles fall into this commoditized category. Apple designed cases and keyboards have either heavy marketing or some Apple tech that adds to their value that others cannot easily just undersell. They do, and there is a market, but brand still means something for some items. Cables and dongles are not part of Apple's brand reputation.

I think you will find I posted the annual reports data accurately and you have chosen to interpret them differently.

I was simply showing the accessories line of Apple is a significant amount where as you wished to paint it otherwise. None of us know what % relates to MAC's alone but even if we proportion it to the 4 main product lines they list it's still a reasonable amount.

Whilst I follow and understand your rational and opinion you miss understand my one

I simple believe Apple is far more acutely aware of all it's costs and pricing where as you seem to believe a somewhat softer view because of their reputation when it comes to accessories like dongles and what's in or out of the box

I agree we can agree to disagree as we are all second guessing

 

[Savor]

I understand what you are saying but this is the MacBook PRO we are speaking of, not the MacBook Air. The MacBook Pro doesn't have to be as thin as the air and have the same lack of ports... ACTUALLY the MacBook Air has USB 3.0 and the pro does not. Why make us pay more for adaptors and less battery life?

The latest MacBook Pro actually followed in the footsteps of the 2015 "12 MacBook. The Airs all have USB-A, MagSafe, glowing Apple logo, and the "13 has the SD slot and perhaps double the battery life of the tbMBP while being thin.

I just find it kinda funny and ironic that people complain about the Pro when they are usually sold out even with the lack of ports and higher price. It means Apple is still doing something right. And people shouldn't be too shocked with the lack of ports because the last two new MacBooks lacked it and offered the divisive butterfly keyboard.

The Pro is more of the higher-end and bigger version of the "12 MacBook.

 

[MH01]

This whole time I thought you were talking about the 2016 MBP. So you had to get £100 in dongles for a prior version that many have contended is superior because built in port functionality? I thought we were comparing the high cost of the MBP 16 with the gouging for "required" cables/dongles. You are right, £100 for dongles for a £800 MBP is a high percentage, but I don't think the situations are comparable for various reasons. I have no comment on prior MBP situation with cables/dongles.

Sorry should have been more clear, 12" MacBook retina. I give you credit on this forum for sticking to your beliefs and in a professional manner, good debating .
[doublepost=1483859187][/doublepost]

The latest MacBook Pro actually followed in the footsteps of the 2015 "12 MacBook. The Airs all have USB-A, MagSafe, glowing Apple logo, and the "13 has the SD slot and perhaps double the battery life of the tbMBP while being thin.

I just find it kinda funny and ironic that people complain about the Pro when they are usually sold out even with the lack of ports and higher price. It means Apple is still doing something right. And people shouldn't be too shocked with the lack of ports because the last two new MacBooks lacked it and offered the divisive butterfly keyboard.

The Pro is more of the higher-end and bigger version of the "12 MacBook.

I can pick up any new 2016 MacBook Pro from my local Apple Store today. I think supply is very good for the new machine. The worst place to order from apple these days is online, shipping estimates are silly, while you can just walk in store and get one, I do not know what game they are playing online pretending there is huge demand, 3rd party retailers have plenty of stick....though apple online will take a couple of weeks....